Chemical-Releasing Bike Lock Causes Vomiting To Deter Thieves (bbc.com) 285
An anonymous reader quotes a report from BBC: The "Skunklock" is a U-shaped steel bicycle lock with a pressurized, stinking gas inside. The gas escapes in a cloud if someone attempts to cut the lock. The company claims its "noxious chemical" is so disgusting it "induces vomit in the majority of cases." Even better, it claims, the gas causes "shortness of breathing" and impaired eyesight. The idea, which tries to make stealing a bike as unpleasant as possible, is raising money for production on crowdfunding site Indiegogo. "Our formula irreversibly ruins the clothes worn by the thief or any of the protection they may be wearing," the company claims on its crowdfunding page. Since stolen bikes sell for a fraction of their true cost, replacing clothing or equipment could make the theft more trouble than it's worth. Skunklock says it has tested its foul gas, and it even penetrates high-end gas masks -- though most thieves are unlikely to go to such lengths. But the company said that the compressed gas is perfectly safe -- and can only be released "by trying to cut through it with an angle grinder." If the chemical countermeasure is released, it is a one-time only use, and the lock, which costs over $100, will have to be replaced. But the hope is that the unpleasant experience will cause them to abandon the attempted theft, leaving the bicycle behind.
available soon in your High School (Score:2)
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Legal? (Score:5, Insightful)
Is it even legal to use this in any developed country? Any sort of problem (a delay in the mechanism, failure or bystanders) and you got a terrorism charge.
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Is it even legal to use this in any developed country? Any sort of problem (a delay in the mechanism, failure or bystanders) and you got a terrorism charge.
I don't see why it would be illegal. If you don't want to get sprayed, don't steal bikes! And I don't see what you mean by "delay in the mechanism". It's a compressed gas that is released when you cut into the lock. There's really no mechanism involved here. And if bystanders are standing by watching while someone attempts to steal a bike, they deserve to get sprayed. And where exactly does terrorism come into this?
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From what it reads, it only works when someone cuts the lock with an angle grinder, meaning it may be something that is ignited by heat in order to work, plenty of circumstances where such ignition could be severely delayed (eg. in cold climates). If it's just compressed gas, any sort of metal issues (fatigue, bad welds or rust) or impact could release it (eg. if the biker gets hit by a car).
Terrorism charge is the first thing that springs to mind what you'd get charged with if this gas either intentionally
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Pepper spray and vigilance are better (Score:2)
Just keep pepper spray and be always be prepared to use it if you see someone tampering with your or anyone else's locked bicycle.
There's no substitute for people being vigilant. Not long ago in San Francisco a guy went up and cut through a bicycle lock with a circular saw in broad daylight, as people walked by. I think there are other more serious problems to worry about.
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Pepper spray is classified as an offensive weapon in the UK. You can't carry it.
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it only works when someone cuts the lock
Why do you want to cut the lock if you wanna steal a bicycle?
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Airbag inflators.
airgun CO2 cartridges
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For making someone puke?
Explosive dye packs in robbed bank money.
Anti-Shoplifting devices with dye and broken glass.
Hedging your best with AC, I see. Smart move.
nobody uses angle grinder (Score:2)
nobody will be using an angle grinder to steal a bike.
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'U locks' are best popped with small hydraulic jacks. The gas would never be released.
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Terrorism charge is the first thing that springs to mind what you'd get charged with if this gas either intentionally or accidentally gets released in a public area (such as a bike stand).
Do you work for the TSA by chance? By the above logic we better ban mace now because of terrorism.
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either intentionally or accidentally gets released in a public area
You can't be criminally liable for an accidental release, unless you actually committed some act deemed gross negligence.
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If a police official cut off a lock and got sprayed by that, I wouldn't be surprised to see a DA pressing booby-trap charges, as well as civil charges being files. If a kid is around and sprayed, that would be injury to a child, not to mention some parent suing the living shit out of the buyer of the lock and the lock maker.
Hell with booby traps. My bike isn't cheap, but paying for a criminal defense lawyer who had to deal with the word of a cop (and mind you, almost anywhere in the US, if a cop gives tes
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I agree. Plus a booby trap isn't half as fun as catching some scumbag in the act and getting the satisfaction of spraying the shit out of their eyes with pepper spray and maybe getting in a few really good kicks to the balls for good measure. The idea that they went home after only vomiting doesn't satisfy me. The idea that they're at home at least still partially writhing from stung eyes and aching balls is much better.
Re: Legal? (Score:2, Insightful)
Lol. I can picture you internet tough guy with your dorito-encrusted dribbling chin. I bet you shit your pants at the GTA loading screen.
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Watch out - he's a 2nd Dan in keyboardarate!
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Search youtube for Taser, trap, bike theft.
Taser in the seat, Burner phone to trigger. Leave it near dirtbags, backoff and wait for the fun to start.
Most of the scumbags piss themselves when the taser triggers. Taser to the boys has to hurt. Labia wouldn't be better.
I'd likely add a boot to the face while recovering the bike, but that's me.
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Because the level of effort the police will put into finding the person who 'assaulted' a bike thief will be epic?
Even if the cops saw you do it, they wouldn't do a thing. If it's just the dirtbags word, they will fill out a report for him, just like they do for you if your bike is stolen. No effort will be made.
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What color is the sky in your world?
Re: Legal? (Score:3)
Surely it is very clearly marked "will release noxious gas if cut" and is therefore not a boobytrap? As far as I'm aware you can, e.g., electrify a fence, you just have to put up appropriate signage. It is cheaper and more effective to deter thieves from trying the lock in the first place than to actually release the gas.
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What, anywhere?
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The electric fence you can have with proper signage is limited in amperage to about 100 mA, AND more importantly; it's not a continuous current like line power, but a small pulse of current lasting 1/300th of a second, and another pulse every second..
Therefore..... it's not even something that can kill somebody. It's not the sign that makes electric fences legal or not a boobytrap...... It's the fact that these devices have to be designed in a certain way, and they are safe.
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Mmm. And you can just put one of those up alongside a busy city sidewalk or next to a primary school can you?
Must be why I keep seeing them all the time. Twice a day, at least.
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If it's clearly marked, 10 cent stickers saying "will release noxious gas if cut" are going to be much better sellers than the $100 lock.
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A sign warning of an electric fence if not enough in most cases. If it's right next to a public space where a kid might accidentally touch it, you are going to be held liable if negligence.
An inner fence on farm land, or protected by a normal fence is usually okay. It's all about how likely someone of limited ability (e.g. a child) is to see and understand the sign, or accidentally touch the fence when they fall off their bike or fall over drunk.
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Most electric fences only 'hurt like hell'. They are common on pasture boundaries.
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If it's right next to a public space where a kid might accidentally touch it, you are going to be held liable if negligence.
Assuming the fence is installed correctly with a proper fence charger; coming into contact with it is just going to sting --- not capable of causing al electric shock or serious injury even to a squirrel, let-alone a kid.
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If a police official cut off a lock and got sprayed by that, I wouldn't be surprised to see a DA pressing booby-trap charges, as well as civil charges being files.
Why the heck would a police officer be cutting your bike lock unless you are illegally parked? And if you are illegally parked, then yeah, that would be on you. So don't park illegally.
If a kid is around and sprayed, that would be injury to a child,
An "injury" to a child who is stealing a bike! I doubt they'd find a jury who'd convict on those grounds!
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Why the heck would a police officer be cutting your bike lock unless you are illegally parked?
Destruction of the offender's property is not a legal remedy for illegal parking, anyways.
If they need to forcibly remove your bicycle, then they can get a Locksmith to make a key for the lock without
destroying your property, impound your bike AND your $100 lock, and bill you for the costs, or auction off the assets.
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" If you don't want to get sprayed, don't steal bikes!"
It could be used to lock up somebody elses bike
or something else, like a gate
ISIS would be interested for sure
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The inventors also clearly don't know how to break a U-Lock. No cutting involved. Put a small hydraulic jack inside the U and pump. Pops open having only broken the lock.
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No, of course it is not legal to set a trap to intentionally hurt someone, even if you expect that the trap could only be activated by the person committing property theft or vandalism. Otherwise, you'd see shotguns built into burglar alarms.
Fire alarm stations sometimes shoot a blue dye which is difficult to remove or one which only shows under UV. Never stand in front of one when pulling the lever! But they are not supposed to hurt you.
And of course these booby traps generally are not as reliable as the
Re:Legal? (Score:5, Insightful)
To explain why it should be illegal. Hey dude, what are you doing with that bike. Crook cuts lock just as the person attempting to stop them gets close. Now that person trying to uphold the law and protect someone's bike, gets the dose, retching and disorientated stumbles back onto the road and gets run over by a bus. Congratulations the crook that actually cut the lock, took off and received a minimal dose and you just killed someone.
If that is not bad enough for you, kids will be kids and the temptation to wear away at the lock so that it will fail just as you the owner try to unlock it, will be irresistible quite a few naughty children. Speaking of wear and tear, why is it, that you think it would be suitable to sell someone and wear and tear time bomb (you could imagine, bringing your bike in, greeting your family and accidentally dropping an old lock hard enough that the seal breaks and wow, will you family not be happy to see you).
Want to ride your bike to places and not have it stolen, start demanding bike lockers in addition to car parks. So open locker, hook up front wheel to raise the bike in a more compact vertical position, shut locker and insert $1 coin, set combination, timer starts, get back in time or locker opens and advertises bike for sale ;). You could squeeze quite a few lockers in two carparks. Counting numbers of customers, 2 inconvenienced to provide for 30 customers and not that expensive, say $250 a locker, last pretty much a life time, apart from the lock :(. What to accelerate installations, demand legislation to require bike lockers at all retail locations (number of bike lockers required per number of car parks, for planning requirements those lockers spaces should still count as car parks, car parks are really expensive to put in, far and away more expensive than most people think). The do really need to be vertical though, so push front wheel onto hook and rotate large counter weighted lever, to raise and rotate bike into vertical position.
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This. For the cost of this project on the crowdfunding site, maybe that money should go towards a fund to get bike lockers placed in useful places. The biggest pushback I see about bike lockers, next to the implementation cost, is concern about people putting stuff they shouldn't in them. However, between having lockers like the ProPark View-Thru (which allow visual inspections) or registering people before handing them a key, this becomes a non-issue, about the same risk of people bringing the same stuf
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To explain why it should be illegal. Hey dude, what are you doing with that bike. Crook cuts lock just as the person attempting to stop them gets close. Now that person trying to uphold the law and protect someone's bike, gets the dose, retching and disorientated stumbles back onto the road and gets run over by a bus. Congratulations the crook that actually cut the lock, took off and received a minimal dose and you just killed someone.
With that contrived example I'm sure we could make everything illegal! That shopping you just did? A bag snatcher comes past and rips the bag out of your hand. You drop all the apples which roll a few meters and someone steps on one, slips backwards, stumbles into to traffic, and this entire concept that someone is held liable for this death is entirely retarded.
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A less-contrived example would be when the person cutting the lock is legally authorized to do so. For example, someone leaves the lock (with or without a bicycle) locked to the rail of a handicap-access ramp, or some other place that it isn't allowed to be, and at some point a city employee is tasked to remove the lock. When (s)he does so, (s)he gets gassed. I don't think that would play well from a legal standpoint.
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Nobody cuts off u-locks. You break them open with a hydraulic jack. Cutting them is a real bitch, while popping them open is quick and easy.
This is just a stupid idea from someone who doesn't understand shit.
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No. Just wrong. The jack takes about 20 seconds and makes very little noise.
Have you ever used an angle grinder on hardened steel? Ever used on at all?
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One vote in favor the the Euphemism dance.
Moron, Idiot, Retarded, Challenged. What do they have in common? Euphemisms, initially meant to protect 'tards feelings, that turned into insults.
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Re:Legal? (Score:4, Funny)
Your not wrong per se, but that is about the dumbest contrived example of why I can imagine. Now.... lets stop stroking the marketing pricks ego and admit the real scenario.
Nobody is angle grinding your fucking bike lock. There will almost always be an easier bike to steal and the majority of bike thieves are not walking around with power tools. Look right at the statements of the company: "and can only be released "by trying to cut through it with an angle grinder.
Its "completely safe" because....that is almost never going to happen.
More realistic... you lock up your bike somewhere its not supposed to be, and go inside some place. You get drunk and end up in the hospital with alcohol poisoning....now the city comes by to cut your lock and guess who gets gassed?
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Congratulations the crook that actually cut the lock, took off and received a minimal dose and you just killed someone.
You had no control of the actions that resulted in that person's death, and put a lock containing a clear warning.... the bike thief set those events into motion.
Next you'll say the shiny sports car had too much bling on it which distracted a pedestrian into kicking a dog, who then ran across the street, snatched a woman's baby, and dropped the kid down an open sewer vent where the c
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I don't see why landmines would be illegal. If you don't want to get your leg blown off, don't walk on other people's lawns!
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If you don't want to get sprayed, don't try to rape women!
And yet pepper sprays are illegal in Denmark.
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If you are really that blind, try replacing this with "poison gas" (which it legally likely is, as "shortness of breath" may well kill somebody) or "explosives". The idea is driven by an entirely understandable hatred of the utter scum that bicycle thieves are, but it is not viable.
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I don't see why it would be illegal. If you don't want to get sprayed, don't steal bikes! And I don't see what you mean by "delay in the mechanism". It's a compressed gas that is released when you cut into the lock. There's really no mechanism involved here. And if bystanders are standing by watching while someone attempts to steal a bike, they deserve to get sprayed.
Because a person is not allowed to introduce bodily harm or destroy another persons property unless they themselves are in immanent danger.
E.G. you can't light a person on fire for trying to steal your bike. If said person was to stop stealing your bike and try to attack you, you could then light them on fire ( assuming you had a flame thrower or something ), but only if you were, or had a real fear that you were, in danger of losing your life from the aggressor. The same principles apply to intentionally
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re. And if bystanders are standing by watching while someone attempts to steal a bike, they deserve to get sprayed.
That's not the law. If bystanders are harmed or killed, etc, they can potentially file charges against both the manufacturer, the bike owner, and the criminal.
And sue the manufacturer and bike owner for a large sum of $$$.
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Or an allergic reaction, perm. damage to vision, etc. This is most likely illegal in USA. There have been several cases of booby-trapping in the USA and it has always been grounds for arrest and conviction.
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Is it even legal to use this in any developed country? Any sort of problem (a delay in the mechanism, failure or bystanders) and you got a terrorism charge.
Good question. IANAL, but my guess would be that the manufacturers are at fault if the mechanism fails and injures unintended victims.
As far as a would-be thief's injuries are concerned, a quick google search suggests that a booby-trap may be legal as long as it is not lethal.
https://www.google.com/search?... [google.com]
That being said, there may be a liability problem for someone who uses such a device. A would-be thief may be able to sue, depending on the circumstances and local laws. A jurisdiction that follows the
Ruined bike? (Score:2, Insightful)
Won't the bike itself be equally tainted by this chemical?
Re:Ruined bike? (Score:5, Insightful)
No, because it's a crowd funding project. It won't ever see the light of day in any working form.
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I was more thinking that if they booby trap the lock, the thieves will resort to freezing and breaking the chain instead...
Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)
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What about the bike? Doesn't this ruin the bike?
I'm sure it will be perfectly operational for the owner to enjoy after the lock is triggered... just like an automobile runs fine after a skunk sprays the interior.
Re:what? (Score:4, Funny)
Our formula irreversibly ruins the clothes worn by the thief or any of the protection they may be wearing
What about the bike? Doesn't this ruin the bike?
We had to destroy the bike in order to save it.
I love the smell of Skunklock in the morning. It's the smell of.....victory.
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Our formula irreversibly ruins the clothes worn by the thief or any of the protection they may be wearing
What about the bike? Doesn't this ruin the bike?
If it doesn't ruin the bike, the vomit most certainly will.
I bet (Score:5, Insightful)
I can defeat this with a roll of duct tape.
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Reminds me of a spring gun... (Score:2)
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katko_v._Briney
Yeah, that's one of the funny things about law (Score:2)
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Use of force gets complicated, fast.
In Minnesota, you can use deadly force to stop the commission of a felony in your home.
The felony doesn't have to represent a risk of physical harm, although I think it would help -- shooting a 16 year old kid with your iPad, about the climb out the broken window he came in might be something the DA would consider charging, if only for the DAs own personal PR.
The adult with any kind of a weapon, especially a firearm? They've met the definition of a felony right there, pl
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illegal? (Score:2)
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In war yes... not as much as you'd think in civilian or police hands: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
Often true... though depending on the sort of injury inflicted I would imagine.
While I'm no fan of capsaicin... is it really a substance which causes injury? The dirty little secret of it is that it doesn't actually cause chemical burns or the physical damage the pers
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If your eyes only read those places where they are illegal... then yes. I was simply pointing out that they are also legal in a lot of places.
And in a lot of countries, mace is legal as a defensive device... again, which was my point.
Most? Care to substantiate that with a survey of the
what about the chain? (Score:2)
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You could still in theory cut the locking bar... though that may take a bit longer.
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I am so disappointed with /.
You don't cut U-locks. You break them open with a hydraulic jack.
Bunch of god damn pussy law abiders around here, babes in the woods thinking this lock will do anything.
Gas Chamber ruins integrity of lock (Score:4, Interesting)
By putting in a chamber to hold the gas, you then ruin the integrity of the lock by make the metal weaker and easier to cut thru.
If I am stealing bikes, like I did when I was a junkie, puking isn't going to stop me from finishing the job and grabbing the bike. By putting in the gas, you made it easier to cut thru the lock, so I'm guessing it won't stop as many people as you think.
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If I am stealing bikes, like I did when I was a junkie, puking isn't going to stop me from finishing the job and grabbing the bike.
Sure it will, especially if there's a perfectly skunklock free bike right next to it, and doubly so if you just vomited all over the thing you're trying to steal.
That said it's still a retarded idea.
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If it is anything like a pepper spray I wouldn't agree with you. I got sprayed once with a very slight amount in a theatre (don't ask) and I thought that I was going to die. It provokes terrible body reactions and you have a feeling that your lungs, throat, eyes and mouth are on fire. Absolutely terrible feeling and you stop what ever you are doing just coughing, crying and gasping for air which burns even more. It is vile through and through.
So if this gas released by the lock is similar, I do see a point
Sounds familiar (Score:5, Funny)
Perhaps this invention will win the IgNobel prize for Peace, like the flame-throwing car alarm did in 1999. [improbable.com]
How long... (Score:5, Insightful)
Illegal. (Score:2)
Bolt Cutters (Score:2)
Aren't bolt cutters faster and quieter than an electric grinder ?
Plus they will pinch off the cut ends, keeping the stink in.
They should take it one step further (Score:2)
They should take it a step further and include an anesthetic that will knock out the thief for a couple hours, since time is a thief's worst enemy.
It's fine until someone has an allergic reaction (Score:2)
and goes into shock and maybe dies from exposure to the chemical. It might be the thief or an innocent bystander. Or maybe someone reacts to the chemical and backs away into oncoming traffic and gets hit by a truck. This is no different than booby-trapping your house with a shotgun pointed at the door. It won't stand up in court. The company making the lock, the principals of the company, and the person who put the lock on their bike will all be sued and probably jailed.
Only bicycles? (Score:2)
Other People (Score:2)
I feel sorry for other people that have to unlock bicycles such as the police, fire department, and city workers when bicycles are locked up in the wrong places or look like they've been abandoned.
Yeah. That's a lawsuit waiting to happen. (Score:2)
Or, if parked in the "wrong" place, a national security threat.
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No, because chilli sauce, onion juice etc. can have the same effects.
Yes, but people consume those willingly and deliberately.
If you go around spraying people in the face with chili sauce or onion juice, expect to be arrested for assault and battery.
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but is anyone else noticing that the lock is $100, for $100 i'd want a lock to protect my lock
Indeed. I bought my bike for $50 on Craigslist. No way am I buying a $100 lock for it.
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Which makes sense for a $50 bike perhaps.
A friend had ~$600 worth of bike & stuff stolen last month after his $25 lock was cut.
He since purchased a replacement bike (similar price) but has upgraded to a $50 lock this time around... and claims that it is easier for the thief to simply cut whatever the bike is locked to than the lock... which still suggests some vulnerabilities, even with the lock in TFA.
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It's easier to cut the bike. It's not that uncommon to simply cut through the frame of a high end bike, pinch the whole thing then sell off the parts.
Bike thieves are scum.
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It's not that uncommon to simply cut through the frame of a high end bike, pinch the whole thing then sell off the parts.
Bike thieves are scum.
True and true.
In Seattle they'll sometimes cut away part of the bike stand (the part you lock the bike to) and then cover the cut out part with some decorative metal tape. You lock your bike up, they come along later and slit the tape, then slide the bike and the lock right off the stand through the cut. They're clever little scumbags, I'll give them that.
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With that kind of a bicycle I'd rather walk. A more or less decent bike starts at $700.
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With that kind of a bicycle I'd rather walk. A more or less decent bike starts at $700.
... and 5 years later, it is sold on Craigslist for $50.
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... and 5 years later, it is sold on Craigslist for $50.
... by a guy who smells suspiciously like skunk.
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Nope, it won't unless it's a total and probably not even then. Even a stolen one would rather be disassembled for parts - the wheelset alone would be worth more than $50 on eBay.
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It is not about extra speed, it is about knees, wrists and spine that won't hurt after even a short ride, it is about functioning brakes derailers, about straight wheels with hubs not full of rust and last but not least about being light enough to carry if needed.
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Nice! I guess this would cut down on these locks being used pretty fast.