Cannabis Smoking Makes Students Less Likely To Pass University Courses 291
Bruce66423 writes: A large scale European study shows that students who were unable to buy cannabis legally were 5% more likely to pass their University courses. Below-average students with no legal access to pot were 7.6% more likely to pass their courses, and the effect was five times more pronounced when dealing with courses involving math. One of the study's authors said, "We think this newfound effect on productivity from a change in legal access to cannabis is not negligible and should be, at least in the short run, politically relevant for any societal drug legalization and prohibition decision-making. In the bigger picture, our findings also indicate that soft drug consumption behavior is affected by their legal accessibility, which has not been causally demonstrated before. ... Considering the massive impact on cognitive performance high levels of THC have, I think it is reasonable to at least inform young users much more on consequences of consuming such products as compared with that of having a beer or pure vodka."
Marijuana's capacity to REVEAL TRUTH (Score:5, Funny)
So, the 5% of people who smoked weed at university, and realized university is a RE-EDUCATION CAMP where special educational tools are used to break the most dangerous young minds and prepare them for a life of productivity in service to the Man. *bong smoke floats out of my stained beanbag nest.*
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Reminds me of a Bill Hicks bit:
"They tell you pot-smoking makes you unmotivated. Lie! When you're high, you can do everything you normally do, just as well. You just realize that it's not worth the fucking effort
Not exactly (Score:2)
Now, I think what we do is actually better. There are plenty of folks who can make it through college and will be better for it, and we give them opportunities they don't have in other countries. But it does sk
Re:Marijuana's capacity to REVEAL TRUTH (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Marijuana's capacity to REVEAL TRUTH (Score:5, Insightful)
Interesting that this part of the "social contract" only applies to bans and prohibitions in the minds of the right but they suddenly become very vocal on "self reliance" and "personal responsibilities" when it comes to funding for college educations for underprivileged students.
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Sure, just try and talk to them about a social contract to reduce the harm that comes from widespread ownership of firearms
Re:Marijuana's capacity to REVEAL TRUTH (Score:5, Insightful)
Sure, just try and talk to them about a social contract to reduce the harm that comes from widespread ownership of firearms
Widespread legal ownership of firearms isn't a problem. The problem come from illegal possession and misuse of firearms.
The spread of concealed carry laws shows that law abiding citizens aren't the issue. Incidents among citizens licensed for concealed carry of firearms are rare, contradicting the predictions of doom from some.
In your version of the social contract the strong can be predators while the old or infirm are defenseless. No thanks.
Re:Marijuana's capacity to REVEAL TRUTH (Score:5, Insightful)
Sure, just try and talk to them about a social contract to reduce the harm that comes from widespread ownership of firearms
You could replace 'firearms' with 'free speech' and find Great Powers (the PRC and Russia) that are sympathetic; somehow I doubt you'd be willing to emigrate there though. I also suspect that you'd be looking at a -1 mod right now, rather than +5, since your contribution to the discussion would be both offtopic and flamebait.
Even if I accepted your premise about the social cost of gun ownership (I don't, violent crime in the US has continued to drop for decades [chicagotribune.com], even as gun laws have been largely liberalized) it would not change my opinion about firearms ownership. Self-defense is an inherent human right, one that can not be exercised effectively without weaponry that negates disparities in physical strength, numbers, or size. The right of self-defense is recognized in the United States by the 2nd Amendment, as well as Article 3 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.
Re:Marijuana's capacity to REVEAL TRUTH (Score:4, Insightful)
It may surprise you, this coming from a "leftie" (aka European citizen), but I am actually in favor of private gun ownership.
I just wish people who want to own one can spend a week with my old drill sarge. he sure knew a few things about safe gun handling and I'm glad he shared them with us.
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Sure, just try and talk to them about a social contract to reduce the harm that comes from widespread ownership of firearms
According to PEW Research [pewresearch.org], there are approximately 300 million guns in the US. Almost 40% of Americans claim to own guns. According to the CDC [cdc.gov], there were 11,000 deaths by firearms in 2013. According to Wikipedia [wikipedia.org], there were 33,000 traffic fatalities in the US in 2011. It sounds to me like vehicles are far more dangerous than firearms are.
I'm not trying to say that firearms are more useful than vehicles, but I think you'll find that you can save more lives by making the roads safer than you can by repea
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I think you're kind of missing the point. It's all about perspective.
Yes, and the one above regarding firearms and vehicles was flawed. Deeply so. Did you miss that point? Did you not grasp it? Was it unclearly expressed? If so, let me emphasize it, the point I was making in regards to the above post by jittles was a deeply flawed and distorted perspective that served little purpose beyond confusing the issue.
Guns, which are designed to kill, do so much less often than accidental deaths from a tool people use every day.
Now you see the point being missed, right? That people use cars every day, far more so than the usage of guns, the exposure is far greater, but the only number you, and the above poster, seem to care about, is the raw number.
Do you not see why that's a flawed perspective?
No I'm afraid it's you who is still missing the point. But given the rest of your rant I'm not surprised.
Speaking of police shootings, I saw where several countries besides the US, had considerably lower rates of police shootings. Namely that the whole country had fewer shootings than some departments in the US have had, and no, I'm not talking countries like Andorra and San Marino, but Germany, Japan, the UK, and others, and no, I'm not talking about single incidents, but over a period of time.
Let's not factor them out, but seriously discuss the issue of police violence in the US.
Yes, we do have a problem with police shootings. But it's completely irrelevant to a discussion about allowing civilians to own guns. Just like how a police officer shooting someone trying to stab him with a knife being included with random school shootings creates misleading statistics about gun violence.
We could also discuss the gang violence if you wanted, and the countries where the homicide rate from such is far lower, but then we might as well discuss where gang violence comes from, but that's probably a verboten topic, as too many people would have to give up their sacred cows. And before you come back with any rejoinders, realize that may apply to any you offer.
Again, gang violence is also an issue. But it's a cultural issue and it is isolated to certain a
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Because "social contract" notions are always self serving. Forcing your choices on other people using threats (or implied threats) requires a justification. So "social contract" -- and do what you're told -- or give me the money I did not earn but I want to spend.
Generally, a "contract" is entered into voluntarily, with no force or coercion, or it's not binding.
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So since I never signed on the dotted line agreeing to obey the law, I am immune?
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People in power will still use threats (and violence if the threats don't work) to force you to accept their choices instead of your own. The point is:
a. It's not legitimate. Saying "social contract" doesn't make it legitimate.
b. Don't let people get away with pretending their choices are The Good Choices or they are The Good People. Every tyrant can offer justifications.
c. Don't do it yourself -- even if you know which choices are The Good Choices and you know which people are The Good People who can ma
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It's possible to achieve improvements, even though it's impossible to achieve perfection (and usually undesirable to try). The goal is less force, fewer threats, less government power over people, and more personal autonomy.
Saying "anarchy" is just like saying "social contract". Both are false, and neither legitimizes or justifies threatening people to impose your choices on them.
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These are old arguments. The problem is that the people making them usually start with "in 1926, [someone you've never heard of] said ..." and then everyone falls asleep.
Meanwhile, the other side says "you like free stuff, don't you?" and "you want to get back at those [insert slur here] people who aren't like you, right?" so "let's pass a law that will totally work great and won't backfire at all -- you'll get everything you want and those [insert slur here] people will pay".
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But since, in fact, I am expected to obey the law including laws that may limit my ability to provide for myself and my family, society does in fact owe me compensatory assistance in that regard.
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But they are not obligated by any legal contract to provide it. They can decide to provide it today and decide not to provide it tomorrow.
And you didn't get to negotiate the amount you're owed. They can say it's whatever number they want, or zero. You have no recourse to stop obeying the law.
Also, imposing a second involuntary action on person A to compensate for imposing the first involuntary action on person B is a poor process, leading to a never-ending cycle of wrongs. Stop using threats and force a
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But even by the rules of the people thrusting this upon me, it can only be a contract if I receive consideration. It creates in the society a duty to me. To deny that without also abolishing all law is simple thuggary.
Since paying you a consideration is entirely optional, while obeying the law is not optional, it's clearly not a contract.
But "all" law isn't thuggery. Laws against murder, for example, are inherently beneficial to all people who don't wish to be murdered (and if, for whatever reason, you do wish to be killed, it's easy to classify killing you as not murder in that circumstance). Even murderers don't wish to be murdered. The law benefits all.
"Laws exist, therefore let's use them to force people to live
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Likewise if you talk to them about availability of decent paying jobs needed to earn your living.
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This might surprise you, but us taxpayers also want entertainment. Such entertainment has a cost beyond mere monetary; for example, I might get a concussion while skiing, and that might permanently affect my cognitive functions, and in any case it requires energy to move to and from the resort location and it makes me unavailable for work for a long while.
A
Re: Marijuana's capacity to REVEAL TRUTH (Score:2)
"Social Contract" is just bullshit Rousseau made up to replace the Divine Right of Kings, which had gone out of favor.
State your preference and add "social contract" to the end - it's easy and profitable.
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"Social Contract" is just bullshit Rousseau made up to replace the Divine Right of Kings, which had gone out of favor.
State your preference and add "social contract" to the end - it's easy and profitable.
Ooooo, let me try...
1. Divine Right of Kings
2. Social Contract
3. ???????
4. Profit!!!!
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They didn't study the effects of the drug, they studied the effects of the LEGISLATION
Or perhaps not even that, as causality was not established.
I'm gonna go out on a limb. (Score:5, Insightful)
And say that availability of alcohol has a vastly higher effect than 5%.
Re:I'm gonna go out on a limb. (Score:5, Informative)
Well, had you read the article ...
“The effects we find are large, consistent and statistically very significant,” Marie told the Observer. “For example, we estimate that students who were no longer able to buy cannabis legally were 5% more likely to pass courses. The grade improvement this represents is about the same as having a qualified teacher and, more relevantly, similar to decreases in grades observed from reaching legal drinking age in the US.”
So, about the same.
I thought we already knew the academic impact of canibus use from the documentary Fast Times at Ridgemont High
Re:I'm gonna go out on a limb. (Score:5, Insightful)
Meanwhile, students who were incarcerated for possession of marijuana, or who lost their student loans for a marijuana arrest were 100% less likely to pass their university courses
Re:I'm gonna go out on a limb. (Score:5, Interesting)
I do not think that using marijuana and murder are remotely similar
The question raised in this study is the effect of legal marijuana, I am pointing out that criminalization of marijuana also has an impact on student performance
Why are prohibitionists so quick to resort to insults?
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What country are you from?
Here in America it is the cause of millions of arrests, up until very recently New York City used 'Stop and Frisk' as a way to target groups particularly for marijuana
In much of the rest of America, any time that a person is pulled over they and their car are searched 'to check for weapons'
Here is a piece of info from the ACLU:
"According to the ACLU’s original analysis, marijuana arrests now account for over half of all drug arrests in the United States. Of the 8.2 million ma
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I thought the characters drove their cars to school in that movie.
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And say that availability of alcohol has a vastly higher effect than 5%.
What is interesting is how alcohol is often seen as part of "college life" but that's exactly the period of your life when you shouldn't be drinking much at all to be able to think clearly.
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Re: I'm gonna go out on a limb. (Score:5, Insightful)
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Then why do universities bother teaching courses in specific topics like mathematics, computer science, and whatnot? Surely there is still some intent to actually increase the student's domain knowledge in these areas?
One can self-teach himself or take a MOOC here and there, but does that create a person with a well-rounded rich engineering base?
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A typical bachelor's degree in engineering involves no more than 5 courses per term for 8 terms. Discard the wasted 1 course per term of humanities or other irrelevant drivel, that leaves 32 courses total, each of which consists of little more than learning the contents of one book. Look at a college catalog and degree requirements, figure out what those 32 books are, buy them and learn the contents. Buy a computer and teach yourself enough programming to be able to handle some problems in your field, also
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About $4000 plus room and board for the time it takes to learn the material, some hands-on experience, done. As a bonus, no exposure to depraved fellow students.
Oh, you miss the point of going to university entirely.
You get the books, you learn the material, you skip the lectures, you get the qualification. The rest of the time is _for_ exposure to depraved fellow students.
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What is interesting is how alcohol is often seen as part of "college life" but that's exactly the period of your life when you shouldn't be drinking much at all to be able to think clearly.
You, like many others mistakenly believe that the point of college is to get an education. In my estimation (as someone who has been involved with hiring for many different positions) A College degree (even from prestigious schools) is a poor indicator of intelligence, or ability. People who are capable, will learn from whatever source is available (And google is a much better source than all but a handful of professors). People who are not capable of learning on their own *must* go to a university to get an education, but these people make lousy employees, as they can never handle anything outside of the ordinary, and consequently are no better than ditch-diggers. Even the best schools in the world cant teach independent thinking. By the time a person gets to college, they either have it or they never will.
You show me someone who graduated school while attending less than half their classes, and I'll show you someone who will be successful at whatever you give them to do. (This goes double for B.S. degrees).
College is 100% about networking and creating relationships (both personal and professional). To that end, college social activities (including drinking) are an invaluable part of the experience. After all, its not about what you know, its about who you know.
Social interaction is important as is the education aspect, but not even close to 100%, more like 25% (learning people skills), unless you are going to a really good college. One could argue that it's more important in Ivy league schools simply because the vast majority of people who get into Harvard, Yale, etc. are already smart enough and/or rich enough to get a job. The rest is just getting to know people who can help them with their ambitions. However, social interaction itself in other universities
Re:I'm gonna go out on a limb. (Score:5, Interesting)
However, when I decided to teach myself to code a few years later, I found the weed really got in the way, so bought some beer and found I could drink a fair amount of beer and still grok the info I needed and retain it. As such, I stopped smoking weed and started drinking for my recreational pleasure.
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Re:I'm gonna go out on a limb. (Score:5, Insightful)
That's because you were studying liberal arts. Switching my major from computer science to philosophy took me from a 2.4 GPA to a 3.9 GPA overnight while eliminating the need for me to study.
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They need to work out how many of the students chose that university BECAUSE it featured legal access to cannabis. There is little doubt that some of the students there are there exactly because they have a tendency to over-indulge.
This is a great argument! (Score:4, Insightful)
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Sometimes i wonder of the robots in the Matrix was "evolution" of corporate HR automation...
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From how they treat them humans it's more likely to be the evolutionary end point of helicopter parents.
unreal (Score:5, Informative)
i didn't start using cannabis regularly until after college, it's vastly superor to alcohol in the "how functional am i at work the next day if i overindulge" department.
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Re:unreal (Score:5, Funny)
I found out during high school that I couldn't do Calculus while stoned; it was something I had to work around back then. Eight hours of sleep would clear it right out... Not so much a problem anymore; and I still do Calculus daily. :)
Well, if you'd lay off the cannabis, maybe you'd finally pass calculus :)
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You can never pass calculus. By the time you get where it was when you started, the field has advanced.
Re:unreal (Score:5, Funny)
playing too much unreal took way more than 5% off of my grades.
playing with myself took way more than 5% off of my grades.
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playing too much unreal took way more than 5% off of my grades.
i didn't start using cannabis regularly until after college, it's vastly superor to alcohol in the "how functional am i at work the next day if i overindulge" department.
For me it was all night Super Smash Bros. Melee in the communal dorm living room :/
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Um...obvious? (Score:5, Insightful)
Ok, what am I missing? I mean, this seems obvious.
Being stoned, just like being drunk, has kind of an obvious affect on your current cognitive abilities. For both drugs, you are looking a a time-frame of hours where you cannot study or work effectively. TFA even notes that the magnitude of the effect on grades is similar.
If you drink alcohol or smoke pot on nights when you need to be studying, your grades are going to suffer. If you restrict yourself to times when you really don't have any obligations, then there won't be a problem. Young adults being, well, young adults, they may not always have the necessary self-awareness and self-discipline - hence, their grade may suffer while they are learning this life lesson.
Make sure people are aware of the effects of the drugs. Encourage self-control and self-discipline. Prohibition is, and has always been, a non-solution.
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You missed that they explicitly did not study people who smoked pot versus people who didn't. They measured people that had legal access versus those who did not.
Use, time of use, actual access, demographics, country, region, societal attitudes, and social support all were not accounted for.
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For this self-control and self-discipline, people would first and foremost have to know the effect it has on them. And that's the problem: They cannot know that.
College is for many people the first time they can get away from their parents. For the first time without constant supervision. And hence of course the first time they can actually get in touch with the things their parents don't approve of. Whether that's drugs, booze or other "bad" behaviour, one thing is certain: They will indulge. Often to exce
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For this self-control and self-discipline, people would first and foremost have to know the effect it has on them. And that's the problem: They cannot know that.
College is for many people the first time they can get away from their parents. For the first time without constant supervision. And hence of course the first time they can actually get in touch with the things their parents don't approve of. Whether that's drugs, booze or other "bad" behaviour, one thing is certain: They will indulge. Often to excess.
Ordinarily, I'd agree with you. That's what I always tell my American friends, too. But this study has been done in the Netherlands. The drinking age is 18 (used to be 16 like in Germany, IIRC) and Dutch teenagers, much like any European teenagers are much more independent and self-reliant than their American counterparts. Helicopter parenting, while it does exist, is not very prevalent in Western or Northern Europe.
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Yeah, I don't know. Maybe my case is unusual, but I was always a poor student, getting "D's", barely passing, up through grade school. Then I started getting high in the eighth grade. I went to school high, everyday of my high school years. Suddenly, school became interesting. I began reading books, lots of them, including the text books I was given. I began to enjoy the back and forth with the teachers. In short, I became an "A" student without even trying. People began to regard me as "smart." It changed
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Most likely what was really going on is that for people with the right passport it was a party school and for others, it was not. So naturally the people who chose a party school did worse than those who were there to study.
"This, they argue, is not that surprising." (Score:5, Insightful)
I find it quite surprising.
Sure being a pot head is going to have a detrimental effect on your grades.
But given my experiences with university in a place where marijuana was not legal I can't believe there are enough students who would not smoke when it is illegal but would when it is legal to swing the overall grade by 5%.
MORE pot perhaps. candy and soda aisle length ma (Score:2)
> who would not smoke when it is illegal but would when it is legal to swing the overall grade by 5%.
Grocery stores know that they sell a lot more candy of they put it at the checkout counter. People buy a lot more if it's within arms reach than if they have to walk down the aisle to get it. For pot we talking about much more than walking an extra 30 feet, you have to call and wait for a pot dealer, andbpot dealers are notoriously unreliable and rarely punctual. Vs stepping inside the store you're wal
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Candy is an impulse buy and something that children will whine and beg for in a checkout line. I don't think pot is really that similar. Plus if it isn't legal chances are you still only gave to walk 30 feet - we are talking about a location where it is available legally for some people. I recall cigarettes and alcohol being easily available in high school because there was always someone old enough to get it and resell it.
I also doubt that smoking 5% more is going to drop your grades by 5%. Smoking double
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I don't think the purpose of this article is to convince lawmakers to make marijuana illegal, but rather to convince university students to not smoke pot.
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Oh, wait. The article specifically said, " those who could no longer legally buy cannabis did better in their studies" (emphasis mine), so cancel my parent post..
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Gibberish (Score:2)
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"well, that's just - like - your opinion, man."
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below average? (Score:3)
I wonder if chewing bubble gum would also impact a below average student's exam scores. Seems like minimize the distractions from sex, alcohol, and cannabis would tend to help most below average students.
Also, if you can only smoke in these Dutch coffee shops, and spend all your time there instead of in your apartment or dorm, then less studying might explain away some of the exam scores.
But despite the above concerned, I think most of us all assumed that there is some cognitive impact while someone is using cannabis. The debate has always been if this is temporary or is the impact long term. I tend to find a lot of holes in research that shows the negative impact to be long term. I have a hunch that there could be some neutral impact that is long term (changes but not detrimental), but that has been rather tough to measure.
(researching comfortably from my armchair)
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(with a bong in my lap)
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Paging Afroman (Score:3)
This article needs a soundtrack [youtube.com].
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For more positive vibes, duuuuude [youtube.com].
Party Animals (Score:2)
In other news, party animals who spent their time on drugs, cannabis, or alcohol instead of studying were more likely to fail their courses.
The prohibitionists touted the study as a great victory for prohibition. The legalizers touted the study as proof that responsible use was necessary.
And the parents raged that their stupid kids were wasting all their time on parties instead of doing some actual work.
And nothing of value was lost (Score:2)
But but but but but....they get free tuition at Stanford et al.
Addiction (Score:2, Insightful)
Smoking dope makes you stupid (at least while you are high). Drinking makes you stupid (at least while you are drunk). Etc, etc. If you can admit this and 'get stupid' occasionally, no problem. But when people start to justify some drug's use as being beneficial, mind opening concious raising, etc. that's the addiction talking. Time to stop and check into NA or AA.
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that's the addiction talking. Time to stop and check into NA or AA.
Do you genuinely believe it necessary for someone who smokes pot on a regular basis to check into NA?
Many people use cannabis for various reasons. Sure, some people use it to "get stupid" as you so eloquently put it. Some people might use it because they think it's a form of enlightenment. Both of these types of users are the same and don't really represent the majority of users who smoke cannabis simply to make their bodies less uncomfortable. In this regard, its use is therapeutic.
Prohibitionists just w
So. (Score:2)
Later to the party (Score:2)
I guess this guy just found a way to get someone else to pay for his pot.
causation schmausation (Score:2)
I just realized it doesn't matter if weed "causes" lower grades or if students with lower abilities are attracted to smoking and so on. What matters is the pattern: if you find yourself being at a university and happen to be smoking weed regularly, you are a bit likelier to have lower grades. That is all.
That is, assuming the study is done properly, this one kind of looks so.
Recreational drugs that help grades? (Score:2)
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Perhaps we should view the study's results with 5% extra skepticism.
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Haven't you ever heard of a contact high or second hand smoke?
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If you include the fact that you never bought it, that's more information that affects the probabilities. It's just like in the Monty Hall problem [wikipedia.org] where revealing a goat behind one door changes the probabilities of what's behind the other doors.
Given the fact that cannabis was recently made legal where you live, you may be 5% less like to pass a class. Given the additional fact that you chose not to use cannabis, you may be 5% more likely to pass a class due to the curve being lowered by those who do smoke.
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Have you heard of the term "average?"
Re:"compared to beer or vodka" (Score:4, Interesting)
No, legalization of marijuana is less harmful than criminalization
In a long term study in Australia, comparing the effects of marijuana use in colonies that legalized and criminalized marijuana it was found that there was far worse long term outcomes int he colonies that criminalized marijuana
This is because they lost opportunities such as education, faced poor job prospects and turned to life as petty criminals to earn a living.
These effects were not seen in colonies that legalized marijuana, where users were able to gain education, jobs and go on to lead a normal life
Criminalization is more harmful than legalization
It is the prohibitionists that want to hold up the straw man argument of 'harmless' because it is easier to poke holes in
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From a medical point of view, sure. From a medical point of view a lot of things that can easily distract you and hence lower your test scores by keeping you from studying are much better.
Certainly not from an academic point of view.
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Harmless in a medical sense, sure. I don't think anybody is going to say that smoking all day isn't a potential huge distraction, just as getting drunk all day is.
When in VietNam you had two groups, the drinkers (ropers) and the stoners (those who smoked marijuana); there may of been those who did neither but I never ran into one.
I had a joint rolled so it was ready when I woke up the next morning, everyday was the same. Stoners never missed work, the drinkers did, when I left Nam I quit marijuana with no want or need for it, drinker were different. And I never saw marijuana as being a distraction, the ropers had a tendency of being drunk by the afternoon.
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Don't know about gonads...
But Michael Phelps was photographed smoking marijuana, and he holds the most records for Olympic swimming gold medals
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While they're stoned, no question 'bout that. But that's the thing with pastimes, you're not very productive while indulging in them. Be it weed, computer games, sports, ...
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"Loosers"
Speaking of people that didn't get much out of education...
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Dude, I'm far from being against weed, but if you're talking "illumination", smoking weed is like putting a frosted glass lamp on. Yeah, it doesn't glare anymore, but everything's getting fuzzy.
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Since it supports an agenda. Duh. Where've you been those past 15 years?
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Any % is relevant. 5% drop in economic output and a countries can sway from economically stable to chaos. 5% increase in mortality rate is a hell of a lot more dead babies. 5% more cases of cancer, 5% swing easily chooses the next American president, etc... Your lack of care to any statitistical measure is rather short-sighted. I hope you're not employed somewhere where your decisions matter.
Now the quesiton which you tossed away with your drivel: Does a 5% drop in student graduations cause material harm t
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Smoked pot in school?
5% was the magnitude of the effect. The statistical significance is determined (roughly) by taking the magnitude of the effect and dividing it by the standard error, then applying the appropriate scaling factor.
Re:Once again Correlation != Causation (Score:4, Informative)
Studies don't prove things. Studies fail to disprove things. Correlation doesn't imply causation, but it certainly is consistent with a theory of causation. It's also consistent with the theory that the purported effect is actually the cause, and the cause is the effect.
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But then there were the 10,000 or so people that are estimated to have been killed by poisoned liquor during prohibition [slate.com]...