If Bird Flu Jumped to Humans, Could Past Flu Infections Offer Some Protection? (npr.org) 201
NPR reports on research "into whether our defenses built up from past flu seasons can offer any protection against H5N1 bird flu."
So far, the findings offer some reassurance. Antibodies and other players in the immune system may buffer the worst consequences of bird flu, at least to some degree. "There's certainly preexisting immunity," says Florian Krammer, a virologist at Mount Sinai's Icahn School of Medicine who is involved in some of the new studies. "That's very likely not going to protect us as a population from a new pandemic, but it might give us some protection against severe disease." This protection is based on shared traits between bird flu and types of seasonal flu that have circulated among us. Certain segments of the population, namely older people, may be particularly well-primed because of flu infections during early childhood.
Of course, there are caveats. "While this is a bit of a silver lining, it doesn't mean we should all feel safe," says Seema Lakdawala, a virologist at Emory University's School of Medicine whose lab is probing this question. For one thing, the studies can't be done on people. The conclusions are based on animal models and blood tests that measure the immune response. And how this holds up for an individual is expected to vary considerably, depending on their own immune history, underlying health conditions and other factors. But for now, influenza researchers speculate this may be one reason most people who've caught bird flu over the past year have not fallen severely ill....
Research published this month is encouraging. By analyzing blood samples from close to 160 people, a team at the University of Pennsylvania and the University of Chicago were able to show that people born roughly before 1965 had higher levels of antibodies — proteins that bind to parts of the virus — which cross-react to the current strain of bird flu.
This week U.S. federal officials also "announced funding for avian influenza research projects, including money for new vaccine projects and potential treatments," the Guardian report. The head of America's agriculture department said it would invest $100 million, as part of a larger $1 billion initiative to fight bird flu and stop rising egg prices, according to the nonprofit news site Iowa Capital Dispatch.
Of course, there are caveats. "While this is a bit of a silver lining, it doesn't mean we should all feel safe," says Seema Lakdawala, a virologist at Emory University's School of Medicine whose lab is probing this question. For one thing, the studies can't be done on people. The conclusions are based on animal models and blood tests that measure the immune response. And how this holds up for an individual is expected to vary considerably, depending on their own immune history, underlying health conditions and other factors. But for now, influenza researchers speculate this may be one reason most people who've caught bird flu over the past year have not fallen severely ill....
Research published this month is encouraging. By analyzing blood samples from close to 160 people, a team at the University of Pennsylvania and the University of Chicago were able to show that people born roughly before 1965 had higher levels of antibodies — proteins that bind to parts of the virus — which cross-react to the current strain of bird flu.
This week U.S. federal officials also "announced funding for avian influenza research projects, including money for new vaccine projects and potential treatments," the Guardian report. The head of America's agriculture department said it would invest $100 million, as part of a larger $1 billion initiative to fight bird flu and stop rising egg prices, according to the nonprofit news site Iowa Capital Dispatch.
I want to say just get vaccinated (Score:3, Interesting)
If we get hit with a serious case of bird flu it's going to be three to five times more lethal than COVID at a minimum and we are going to be in much much worse shape politically and scientifically.
I suspect we'll lose about 15 to 20% of the population. I guess the survivors will thank us...
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Look at the positives, unvaxxed Republicunts will suffer the most, increasing the average iq.
COVID-19 would go away tomorrow (Score:5, Informative)
If everyone understood the science of vaccines and got vaccinated its just that plain and simple but well here we are.
COVID was not started by a lab leak and vaccines are ultra safe and ultra effective. Only right wing nutbars doubt that.
Also, Abortion is a form of medical care. The American civil war was fought over slavery. I am tired of arguing these points with people who refuse to acknowledge reality. If you're a Republican vote or you're either somebody who is extremely low information, has stepped away from reality, is a psychopath, always just so bitter and angry that you want to burn the whole world down for the sake of it. They're digging up tons of minor side effects reports and claiming the vaccine should be pulled because of that, and not the real reason. There absolutely no known side effects to vaccines.
But sometimes you just don't want to do business with someone because they're kind of an asshole and Spotify is being more than a little bit of an asshole by allowing Rogan to spout off anti-science and anti vaccine propaganda that's going to get people killed.
A lot of your compatriots aren't getting vaccinated against COVID. Sure, it won't kill them thanks to anti-virials, but the hospital stay will end with permanent heart & lung damage. So a bad day turns into a stroke, a stroke a heart attack and a heart attack ends with, well. So we have large swaths of people who aren't going to get vaccinated.
Vaccines are safe and work. It's like arguing both sides on eating dog poop. It's no different than the gov't telling you not to eat tide pods.
Donald Trump deregulated food safety during his first term. Joe Biden tried to restore the regulations but the courts blocked him. Courts that were packed with Trump appointees. So yeah Donald Trump is directly responsible for the price of eggs being high. And they're going to get much more expensive. At least for a little while. When H1N9 finishes mutating and we have no vaccines and no preventative measures it's going to kill about 30% of the population at least. Possibly as much as 50%.
Biden did hand out 600 million to make vaccines though. We won't be caught completely off guard like we were last time. Probably that is. Again we're a simple mutation away from a disaster and we've got a 78-year-old man who couldn't get through a 1 hour town hall between us and that potential disaster. All Trump did with regards to the COVID vaccine was signed the checks and it wasn't even his money. It never is.
People do go looking for content creators and there's tons of them spreading misinformation especially about things like vaccines or wars or bits and pieces of national news.
So here we are 5 years or so later and there is unequivocable proof that these miracle cures were bullshit but I can tell you right now that's just like how when the link between autism and vaccines turned out to be made up by a guy who was hoping to sell separate vaccines for mumps, measles and rubella this will be ignored by the same people still pushing horse paste as a cure all.
I found out recently I wasn't vaccinated against Measles. My mom was an anti-trans nutter and I suspected so I got checked. Polio is harder. I haven't been able to find a lab that can test me. But I haven't heard that either. What I have generally heard is that Brazil is upset that Elon is refusing to take down actual misinformation like anti-vaccine misinformation or the kind of stuff that inflames riots. A whole bunch of factually incorrect lies about vaccines is publsihed.
But it is absolutely galling to have the word censorship used in regards to anti-vaccine misinformation being removed from websites. The word censorship has a very specific connotation in American English. And that does not fall under it. We learn that the hard way when one of his charities blocked one of the covid vaccines from going into the public domain (The moderna one I believe). If you're old enough to know the history of the polio vaccine that should be especially galling.
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www.fark.com/politics
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Is it? It's about as perplexing as to how he was a pretty bog standard liberal most of his life, then he ran for President under the Republicans because they embraced him when he kept accusing Obama of being a secret muslim born outside the US (remember back then, when he was a major pushing of that?)
Republicans would not support someone who wasn't pro-life in 2015 so he changed his tune. Oh you maybe thought Donald Trump has given the issue due consideration of the implications and political nuance and at
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> a pretty bog standard liberal most of his life
[citation needed]
Provide examples of liberal acts or causes he supported prior to his political career. Being registered as a Democrat for a few years doesn't count because he's changed his stated affiliation multiple times to associate himself with whomever he thought was popular at the time (also kinda laughable if you think Democrats are liberal in any meaningful sense). Donating to political candidates doesn't count for anything either; that's just the
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also kinda laughable if you think Democrats are liberal in any meaningful sense).
Well if we start with that premise then I can't really convince you of anything can I? Our definition of liberal would need to be established
DJT shared the same opinions for the most part as his wealthy contemporaries in the wealthy NYC area, that is pretty standard "liberal" in the american sense of a kinda moderate but voting democrats but also not totally politically engaged, hows that
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Well if we start with that premise then I can't really convince you of anything can I? Our definition of liberal would need to be established
You don't have access to a dictionary?
The bulk of Democrats are not really liberals in any meaningful sense of the word. They are authoritarians first and foremost, for example. They are corporatists before they are liberals. They care much more about the will of their corporate donors than that of The People. Now let's see, authoritarianism and corporatism, where have I heard that before? Democrats are center-right compared to actual liberals. They fit about 80% of the definition of facists, while Republic
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Oh if we are doing silly dictionary stuff then sure
Liberalism is a political and moral philosophy based on the rights of the individual, liberty, consent of the governed, political equality, the right to private property, and equality before the law.
Pretty broad and I think every Democrats would broadly align there, of course everything is a spectrum, even Bernie Sanders wouldn't map on perfectly to everything. I am sure we share the opinion that *every* politician no matter the party in America *should* l
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I do not find it perplexing. Rich white women can get abortions so they won't have rich white babies. He figures eventually that he will be able to deport or incarcerate anyone not demonstrably white (apparently he's had Twain's Puddn'head Wilson read to him). What he's doing now is gradually increasing the pool of "undesirables" so that people won't notice. And if his Christian supporters figure it out, it will only make them happy.
Christians: first they hated the Jews, then the "other"-Christians, then na
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I do not find it perplexing. Rich white women can get abortions so they won't have rich white babies.
It was a secret all over town. Every so often a wealthy woman had to go for a "D and C" - a dilation and curettage. Which almost disappeared once the population could get abortions. We had a few women in town that needed them pretty often. Oddly enough, they were Republicans too.
Look forward to an interesting outbreak of need for D and Cs in states where the A word is completely illegal.
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He did back when he was a New York democrat. He found a group that was easy to grift and here we are.
Re: COVID-19 would go away tomorrow (Score:2)
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Yes side effects happen. The fluey feeling the next day is both common and quite safe. Thats just the immune system doing a bit of inflamatory bullshit while building up its suite of antigens.
Actual dangerous side effects are astonishingly rare. It is, undoubtably, one of the safest medications we have with a death rate far lower than household asprin, so rare in fact your chance of dying in a car crash on the way to the pharmacist to get your shot (or however they do it where you live) is significantly hi
Re:COVID-19 would go away tomorrow (Score:4, Insightful)
As for effective, well its hit and miss. Its not one of the most effective vaccines, but its up there, being roughly on par with Polio and the Flu (actually its probably more effacious than Polio, and seems to require less boosters than the polio vax did.). However it DOES significantly reduce severity and significantly lowers your chances of getting or passing it on.
I know a few people who died of the plague. A couple others who have long covid with brain fog and lack of energy. A couple who are on continuous oxygen, pretty much homebound - the plague having wrecked their cardiopulmonary system. Not one was vaccinated against it.
Yeah, some will call that anecdotal, but shouldn't one or two have received the jab and still died or lived the rest of their lives a human wreck?
The closest I could see to a reaction was in my case, the second jab gave me a fever that I knocked down with acetaminophen. Maybe dry skin. Even if it made me sick in the manner of regular flu, a week of feeling crappy, I'll take that over the potential nasty alternative unvaxxed outcomes.
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I know a few people who died of the plague.
I was like, wow, really? Then I figured out you were... well, I still don't know what you were going for. Most people who call C19 "the plague" are anti-vaxxers, while people do still get the actual plague [go.com] occasionally. We can find it any time we want to. Just go into some of our wilder lands (you know, the stuff Don Whoreleon has recently promised to log, drill, and/or sell off) and test rodents, you will find it in pretty short order. Most people get it by cleaning up rodent feces with a broom or vacuum,
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I know a few people who died of the plague.
I was like, wow, really? Then I figured out you were... well, I still don't know what you were going for. Most people who call C19 "the plague" are anti-vaxxers,
Wow really? I fully believe in vaccination, and get all the one's I need. That you get pissed because I call it the plague is most undoubtedly a you problem.
I know you are a humorless git, but referring to SARS-CoV-2. the real name if you demand accuracy is a humorous name, perhaps to inject (pun intended) into the matter. But It is completely understandable that you would take offense.
while people do still get the actual plague [go.com] occasionally.
Plague, while many people believe it is one thing and on
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"52.05% had some form of a menstrual problem after vaccination"
Wow, with the percentage of women in the USA at 50.5% that is really impressive!
(I love to use numbers out of context!)
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Re:I want to say just get vaccinated (Score:5, Interesting)
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I don't know what you USdiots are harping on about. A quick web search tells me commodity prices for eggs
...are irrelevant.
Where people buy their eggs, eggs have gone up quite a bit [worldpopul...review.com]. We don't buy eggs on commodities markets. We buy them at supermarkets.
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I don't know what you USdiots are harping on about. A quick web search tells me commodity prices for eggs are now the lowest ever since you got the latest iteration [tradingeconomics.com] of whatever goes for a national leader in your corner of the world.
The cost of eggs was a major sticking point in last years election, the cost was rising due to a bird flu outbreak in the US. Which is why we haven't had the same issues here in the UK or pretty much in the rest of the world.
The tangerine thundercunt is currently mooching around Europe asking for cheap eggs and everyone, strangely enough, is telling him to get lost.
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Yup, the article and the science behind it are simple reminders to go get the jabs.
They're not 100% effective, some people still get sick, this has always been true. Some years lots of people get sick. But that's not what efficacy is about.
If you get the jab you are less likely to get sick, not guaranteed not to get sick. If you get the jab and also get sick, you are much less likely to have a severe illness or be hospitalized. Even if you get sick, you get some amount of protection because you've exerci
Re: I want to say just get vaccinated (Score:2)
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The flu shot didn't seem effective this year - those who got the shot, but got the flu were still knocked out for a week, and a month or two later, still had symptoms.
But it does beat getting it where apparently people can be knocked out for weeks to months and even at the end, still are feeling really bad.
I had the flu once, it knocked me out for a few days (I was so bad work actually sent me home). But then I never really recovered and was hospitalized a few months later for a week with a heart condition
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The flu shot didn't seem effective this year - those who got the shot, but got the flu were still knocked out for a week, and a month or two later, still had symptoms.
ObDisclaimer: I am not against vaccines in general or the flu shot in particular
BUT
They have to guess every year at which strains they have to worry most about and some years they fail, but there is almost no acknowledgement of this in reporting and of course there is none in advertising. But if you google around you can find info on which strains they targeted, and whether those strains are actually the problem, so you can determine whether or not it's actually worth getting the shot.
I've gotten it some ye
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You're probably overstating the case. I remember the bird flu of the 1970's, and it was BAD. But I didn't hear about lots of people dying. (OTOH, part of the time I was so sick I might not have noticed if someone died. Yuck! Well worth avoiding at considerable effort. I seem to recall going unconscious half-way to the bathroom after spewing my guts from both ends.)
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>"I remember the bird flu of the 1970's, and it was BAD. But I didn't hear about lots of people dying."
Different flus are different. But another huge factor is- how many grossly overweight people did you see in the 70's? How many people had diabetes? These are huge risk factors for dying from infections that would not normally be deadly. We saw a lot of that with COVID-19, as well. The super-majority of those who died had lots of pre-existing health complications and major risk factors.
There have pr
Re:I want to say just get vaccinated (Score:4, Interesting)
Im kind of hoping that being in a building with actual adult and sane virologists and epidemiologists , some with significant experience in science communication, might buffer some sense into RFK.
My impression of him is that he's not an unreasonable man , he's just dumb as a bag of hammers. And my experience with folks like that is you can usually reach them with patience (I had a bunch of elderly relatives refuse covid vaccines because the shouty man on fox news said it would hurt them. But I spent time with them, and my GP ex girlfriend (who they all adore) explaining carefully the whole picture, and they are now all vaccinated. The only one i couldn't reach was my teethgrinding idiot cousin whos deep deep in the thrall of QAnon and MAGA conspiracy theories and yeah, SOME of those folks are beyond reach.
But my take on RFK is he just seems like a friendly imbicile. I think he can be reached.
Re: I want to say just get vaccinated (Score:4, Insightful)
RFK clearly cannot be reached because he has gotten people killed with his anti vax bullshit before and now he is doing it again with exactly the same results. He's a killer.
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The actual insanity is the stuff you post like this.
You already forgot Trump said people weren't going to have to worry about voting by the next election? That's not a very good way to worship your beloved Fuhrer.
Too speculative to be meaningful (Score:3)
I am dismayed that a virologist would say such things, as I would expect them to know better. The truth is that we simply do not know. There is insufficient evidence to predict whether or not the current human population has any clinically significant immunity to this H5N1 subtype. We do not even know whether or not it will mutate to become more transmissible from human to human.
Yes, there are some basic principles at work that might suggest that preexisting infections and vaccinations for human influenza could confer some degree of protection. But that's such a broad and superficial notion--it doesn't convey any sense of the extent of protection, if any. The 1918 flu pandemic ("Spanish flu") that killed millions of people, of course did not occur in a totally immunologically naive population with respect to human influenza, so what justifies any assertion that our existing exposure to human influenza will confer protection against H5N1 in any meaningful way?
In any population there will be intrinsic variability in which some people will be more susceptible to worse clinical outcomes, and others who will be less susceptible. We do not yet know who these people are, because this disease is not yet pandemic or endemic. We still don't even know who these people are for COVID-19, which has become endemic. I would have thought that especially among the scientifically literate, people would have learned something from the COVID-19 pandemic with respect to making predictions or assertions about the behavior and impact of infectious diseases on a population. I've long since given up on the general population learning anything. But I am deeply disappointed that a virologist would speculate on such matters, as the message inevitably becomes further distorted by journalists and then politicized and warped beyond all recognition by a self-absorbed and uneducated public.
Re:Too speculative to be meaningful (Score:4, Interesting)
I have an uncle who has had covid five times, before and after vaccination.
Only good thing he's noticed about the vaccine is that the covid he catches after is a lot milder than if he hasn't had a recent shot.
Covid is hard to vaccinate against, and immunity seems to be temporary, whether it be a vaccine or infection.
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I have an uncle who has had covid five times, before and after vaccination.
Only good thing he's noticed about the vaccine is that the covid he catches after is a lot milder than if he hasn't had a recent shot.
Covid is hard to vaccinate against, and immunity seems to be temporary, whether it be a vaccine or infection.
That's how most vaccines work, they boost your immune system to make the illness both shorter and less severe. Very, very few vaccines give sterilising immunity (yellow fever is one, but I'm not entirely sure on that).
Being vaccinated will easily be the difference between being stuck in bed for a few days and a trip to the ICU.
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and immunity seems to be temporary
The problem isn't the immunity being temporary it was that COVID was a disease that was caused by a virus that rapidly changed countless times over the course of the pandemic. Hence the reason for the booster not targeting the same strain every time. Also the reason why it's hard to vaccinate against the flu (they sort of guess which strain will be prevailing the coming season).
I bet you he caught 5 different strains.
Errrm ... that's precisely how natural ... (Score:2)
... immunization works, is it not?
It's - btw. - the exact reason I avoid taking antibiotics for every little sniffle I catch.
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... immunization works, is it not?
It's - btw. - the exact reason I avoid taking antibiotics for every little sniffle I catch.
Especially since most sniffles are viral in nature, or allergies. No point in taking antibiotics for that.
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It's - btw. - the exact reason I avoid taking antibiotics for every little sniffle I catch.
As sibling said, antibiotics don't work on viruses, or have little effect.
Antibiotics also have adverse effects every single time you use them, unlike vaccines. They always cause unintended effects. Notably, they affect the balance of our internal biota. Then people exacerbate this by consuming sugars at their natural rates, which is well known to feed the undesirable bacteria more than others, so they are killing off the worst stuff while feeding the bad. And to add injury to injury, have you seen hospital
But experts said bird flu couldn't jump to humans (Score:2)
Only thing both sides agree on (Score:2)
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They do not want to get vaccinated. We do not want them to get vaccinated. Everybody wins.
Yup, any empathy has long vanished. Now if we can get a flat earther or moon landing flu epidemic.
Yes, some protection (Score:2)
At 2 I contracted the Hong Kong flu, the second wave of it. I was hospitalized, ICU. After a few other infections of flu throughout my childhood I dont get the flu anymore; or if I do I do not show any real symptoms of it. I havent tested positive for the flu in 25 years. As far as flu shots i would say im maybe 65% compliant. If I remember, I have no issue taking it. Sometimes I just get lazy and procrastinate. Feb 2020 my son came down with what was considered regular coronavirus (a type of cold) and he g
sounds like a question for SuperKendall (Score:2)
What this site really needs is the expert advice of amateur virologist SuperKendall who really nailed natural immunity of to COVID when all of us did know better. Say buddy, what does Trump tell you about bird flu? Who needs cheap eggs anyway?
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I'm convinced that is Elon's slashdot account.
In a word, no (Score:2)
NPR reports on research "into whether our defenses built up from past flu seasons can offer any protection against H5N1 bird flu."
Maybe some, but not a lot. It just doesn't work that way. Prior work will apply to some degree, but a new vaccine would need to be developed.
Meanwhile, the MAGAtard anti-vax crew will shit their pants drinking horse dewormer, millions will die, and the Cap'n CrazyPants 'president' will deny it's even happening.
well if it can survive bleech (Score:2)
Not if you get measles (Score:2)
Measles erases your immunities. Then you're truly fucked. Thanks antivax cunts.
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that vaccines are largely unnecessary and may actually do more harm than good. Thankfully, the adults are in charge now. Expect things to be handled much more intelligently the next time we have a pandemic.
Hopefully the under-educated follow that advice, and reduce their influence (based on dying in increasingly sad numbers) based on, well, simply, dying. And nothing of any value will have been lost.
Re:This is proof (Score:5, Interesting)
The problem is, if the under-educated refuse to be vaccinated in sufficient numbers, all of us will suffer due to losing herd immunity.
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"...all of us will suffer due to losing herd immunity."
How do "all of us ... suffer due to losing herd immunity"? "Herd immunity" isn't "immunity" it's a statistical concept, it protects those who are not immune by reducing exposure. Exposure doesn't affect people who are immune.
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"...all of us will suffer due to losing herd immunity."
How do "all of us ... suffer due to losing herd immunity"? "Herd immunity" isn't "immunity" it's a statistical concept, it protects those who are not immune by reducing exposure. Exposure doesn't affect people who are immune.
It's an interesting concept. I managed to catch whooping cough after the statistical concept.
It isn't a statistic when it's you leaning against a tree watching the world go brown. Problem was, my old vaccine had more or less worn off. Not doing that again.
All that said, given the politicalization of vaccines, herd immunity, where people don't catch a disease because almost no one has it to spread is gone.
That's the bad side. The good side is dead Anti-vaxxers. At one time, I had concerns for them.
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Immunity to a disease wears off over time, that's why we have boosters. Many of us were immunized as children. Boosters haven't been necessary because herd immunity keeps the disease from spreading in the first place. If we lose herd immunity and the disease starts spreading again, many of us who were immunized long ago, could be at risk again. The risk is likely lower, but not zero.
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"...all of us will suffer due to losing herd immunity."
How do "all of us ... suffer due to losing herd immunity"? "Herd immunity" isn't "immunity" it's a statistical concept, it protects those who are not immune by reducing exposure. Exposure doesn't affect people who are immune.
The more people that are able to catch the virus, the more opportunity the virus has to mutate and infect people that were previously immune.
Re:This is proof (Score:5, Informative)
if you're vaccinated that the disease can't infect you. That's the whole point of vaccination. If the disease can still infect you then there was no point to the vaccination.
Ignorant reasoning like that killed a whole lot of people only a few years ago. Let's not go there again.
Re:This is proof (Score:5, Insightful)
False. There. is no case where that could possibly be true, and why continue to vaccinate "high risk individuals" in that case? You are admitting that the vaccine is of benefit, but then are convinced it does more harm that good. What's worse, that Trumpers have such contempt for you, or that you're as stupid as they assume?
Re:This is proof (Score:4, Funny)
"why continue to vaccinate "high risk individuals" in that case?"
Because the virus kills them and virtually nobody else. Do you think at all before you reply?
"You are admitting that the vaccine is of benefit"
Sure, it was of benefit before the virus mutated around it.
We need to end all vaccines. If we were supposed to be immune from Polio, tetanus or diphtheria to any other disease, God would have made us immune to them.
We have to look at it differently. If a child dies from whooping cough, it is god's will they perish with breathing spasms, and indeed, the dead child is then cradled in his loving arms, free of the trials and tribulations of sinful earthly existence, and has been spared them.
Man interferes in God's plan and will be punished with eternal damnation, by trying to save people that God wants dead. They shall inherit God's righteous punishment.
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Goddamn, Poe's Law is just a bitch these days. You have to go look at a user's history to see because there's no stupidity too extreme.
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Like we do the flu? Thank god we've done that with the flu for the last few decades, that completely got rid of it! Nobody ever gets the flu any more!
I can't actually fathom the logic needed to think what you said was true, even ignoring issues like Long COVID. I know at one point an anti-vax FUD talking point was that nobody with COVID ever gets it again, but that was very obviously bullshit when people were saying it (when the talking point started I personally knew someone who'd gotten it three times.)
In
Re:This is proof (Score:5, Informative)
No vaccination is 100%. Take the measles vaccine, one of the more effective ones, 93% for one shot, 97% percent for 2 shots. This still leaves 3-7% of people who can catch measles with 100% vaccination. If those 93-97% can't catch measles, then they can't give it to the 3-7%.
Most vaccines aren't as effective but the same thing happens if enough are vaccinated that they don't spread it to those who the vaccine didn't work as well.
The flu generally kills the young and the old. The young often don't have any natural immunity when first exposed so get really sick and perhaps die.
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Vaccines wear off over time. That's why we have boosters. We haven't needed boosters for many childhood diseases because we were also protected through herd immunity. Other diseases mutate, like flu, requiring regular boosters.
Your "100%" immunity is only temporary.
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It is never 100%. And it depends heavily on the vaccination. There are several vaccinations that basically give you life long immunity and specifically are designed for instances where you can NOT rely on herd immunity: e.g. Yellow Fever. You get 99% immunity after your second booster, and after your 3rd booster you have that immunity for life.
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Re:This is proof (Score:5, Insightful)
"The problem is, if the under-educated refuse to be vaccinated in sufficient numbers, all of us will suffer due to losing herd immunity."
That doesn't follow. if you're vaccinated that the disease can't infect you. That's the whole point of vaccination. If the disease can still infect you then there was no point to the vaccination.
Nope. Doesn't work that way. The purpose of vaccination is to avoid dying of an illness. Flu vaccines never prevent anywhere near 100% of flu cases. In some cases, they're really pretty awful. But having been exposed to a similar strain of flu, even if it isn't enough of a match to prevent infection, can still be enough to keep you from dying from it.
And this is particularly true for influenza. There's a statistically significant difference in your risk of dying from any flu with the same subtype as the first flu strain that you catch in childhood, even after all of the mutations over several decades. So being exposed to either the disease or a vaccine can quite significantly reduce your risk of dying even if it is terribly matched to the currently circulating strain. But if it isn't a good match, there's a decent chance you're still gonna get sick if exposed.
More specific to this case, H5 and N1 variants of the flu have been around for ages. If you've had them or a shot that actually worked you will have some resistance to this one too. Note that they have found a decent number of dairy workers who were infected and not noticeably ill.
The type-1 neuraminidase has been spreading in humans for along time. The hemagglutinin type 5 has not. The N1 *may* buy you some protection, but how much could vary widely. I'd be surprised if a significant percentage people have meaningful titers of preexisting antibodies to H5.
And in fact, this paper [nih.gov] says as much — that the immune reaction to H5 seems to be mostly because of parts of the hemagglutinin (HA) stalk that are shared with other group 1 (H1N1, H2N2) strains of flu.
It also says that in most individuals, the antibodies were non-neutralizing, so again, see above, where it might keep you from dying, but for most folks, it probably won't keep you from getting sick.
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"if you're vaccinated that the disease can't infect you."
False. Vaccines teach your immune system how to fight infections, they do not prevent infections from happening. Did no one learn anything from COVID?
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"if you're vaccinated that the disease can't infect you."
False. Vaccines teach your immune system how to fight infections, they do not prevent infections from happening. Did no one learn anything from COVID?
I see this point made somewhat regularly but is it actually a meaningful distinction?
It feels like saying that my private security team doesn't actually prevent people from invading my property because they only shoot intruders once they've crossed the property line.
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I see this point made somewhat regularly but is it actually a meaningful distinction?
Yes! Each time you are exposed the virus gets a chance to mutate and get around the vaccine before it is cleared. More bozos who are unvaccinated around you getting infected mean more exposures. The virus could also mutate in one of the bozos as well, infecting you with a new strain unaffected by the vaccine.
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Vaccines are not 100% effective when it comes to preventing illness. If you are vaccinated against a disease, you are protected to a degree, but you can still become ill with the disease. Immunity wears off over time, that's why we have boosters. For common childhood diseases, we haven't needed boosters since childhood because we were also protected by herd immunity.
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You also do not understand "herd immunity".
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I'm going to be charitable and assume you're all serious but I must admit it's tough to tell who's trolling on the topic these days.
Herd immunity is about making it difficult for a virus to spread by ensuring that the chances of each member of the herd getting the virus (and thus spreading it) is low.
Vaccines and other inoculations are not perfect. They don't make it impossible to catch a virus, but they drastically reduce the chances. People with poorer immune systems (or compromised immune systems who are
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The existence of overwhelming counterevidence has never been a deterrent to those who believe conspiracy theories.
Re:This is proof (Score:5, Interesting)
They'll just spread it to my immunocompromised mother or sister.
Like most things in this world, responsible people have to clean up after the idiot ne'er-do-wells.
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They're both in nursing homes. It's out of my hands.
Re: This is proof (Score:5, Funny)
Re: This is proof (Score:5, Funny)
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Parents Whose Unvaccinated Child Died From Measles Say They Remain Anti-Vaccine
Please vaccinate those other children to prevent them from getting stupid.
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When (not if) other NRA members decide to suppress this technology using high velocity metal neural network disruptors, nobody is going to be surprised. Or, on a global average, upset.
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WOW! I guess using the letters "NRA" will trigger someone to completely miss the intended joke in the post.
Maybe you can see the intended joke in this one:
Waiting - fascinated - to see when someone from NASCAR designs a way of injecting someone with a vaccine at high speed - possibly at a hundred miles an hour; and since it's a NASCAR driver doing it, the system developed would be hard to distinguish from a normal modified stock car, or possibly a pickup truck.
Of course, this might trigger a different group of MAGA devotees.
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Does it have separate vehicle classes, races and classifications for the clockwise and counter-clockwise races?
Or do you run the races simultaneously, on the same track, with an intersection (or bridge/ tunnel) to make the races the same length in each direction.
Oh, sorry - I'm thinking wrongly. The Tangerine Shitgibbon will be having the teams, constructors and drivers for the counter-clockwise "ge
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Take your objection to the anonymous inventor around 50kyr BP of the spear. Or the armaments industry.
They're paying dues to an organisation that sanctifies murder-machines. I wouldn't put anything below them. You say yourself that you left them because of the lunatic majority. Well done.
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Please vaccinate those other children to prevent them from getting stupid
Doesn't work. Robert F. Kennedy Jr. was vaccinated when he was younger.
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Measles, polio, HPV, etc. Jeezes you are stupid.
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Re: This is proof (Score:2)
Re: This is proof (Score:2)
I would ask you to never get vaccinated, but that would risk harming the immunocompromised.
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Trump was running the show in 2020, the first full year of Covid. How do people forget this?
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Re:The CDC has admitted that (Score:4, Interesting)
Pepperidge farms remembers.
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Well, we have those in droves, but then we have a huge number of "Elon bad" and so on.
It overall seems like Slahsdot has become a "Battleground of left loones vs right loonies" instead of news for nerds..
Re: The CDC has admitted that (Score:2)
You don't think Nazis are bad?
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Everything else, you'd almost thing the people here were normal...
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Not being American ... "what?"
From Wiki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org] ... a processed food company ... During the 1970s and 80s, the company used the slogan "Pepperidge Farm remembers" for a long-running television commercial campaign that leaned heavily upon nostalgia, particularly of life in the early decades of the 20th century.
So, "Werthers Originals" for American biscuits, with a soundtrack of DvoÅ(TM)Ãk's No.9 (out of copyright) and a sit-up-and-beg bike.
Did
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The CDC has admitted no such thing. Further, the "childhood illnesses" that I grew up with in the 60s and 70s, have largely been wiped out thanks to vaccines. Smallpox, polio, measles, mumps were common diseases in past generations, but no more, thanks to vaccines. At least, they were wiped out, until people started refusing vaccines, allowing some of these long-dead diseases to return again.
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Proven correct by a "low confidence assessment" by the CIA in contrast to most other agencies then sure, "conspiracy proven", the bars are dropping everywhere around us, most of us can just skip over them nowadays they're so low.
I do appreciate how amongst the many conspiracies out there, how many involve the CIA but this one they are totally on the straight and narrow. I see no reason to ever distrust the CIA from here on out.
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Not even just that, even as a "conspiracy" believer now we just trust the word of the government if they agree with a position? How convenient! And this report was commissioned by the Biden admin but now but since it agrees with the position suddenly the Biden WH and the CIA are no longer "deep state"
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Eggs are in like a ton of things outside of just eatin' them eggs It's like 90 billion eggs a year for a $17B industry. .
Most baked desserts use eggs, most breaded dishes start with an egg bath, ice cream, fresh pasta, mayonnaise, my moms meatball recipe. Plus we are American's so while you are spot on that we could definitely cut back egg consumption but that's not how we do things, or at least, not how we usually do. Like sure I eat a decent amount of eggs, they're good and usually affordable but a singl
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Unless, as the saying goes, the Dane comes back for more. Which both Danes and biological agents tend to do. (This is nothing to do with Greenland, dating back to about the time that Greenland was the subject of a particularly optimistic advertising campaign.)
I d
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I remember that being the case in the '80s, not that I've indulged in such cookery for years. Not worth the effort, cooking for one.
Oh, people do reconsider. Eventually. The price per (pre-made) cigarette hovers around £0.75 each (for legal ones ; around 1/3 that for illegally imported ones)
Re:Vaccines and selection (Score:5, Informative)
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It wasn't a big deal for adults because most of them had been exposed as children. But depending on the strain, it killed around a quarter of those children infected. On the other hand, vaccines have eliminated the virus in the wild. (Could only be done because there is no animal reservoir of the virus) Unfortunately, it still exists in labs.