CERN To Expel Hundreds of Russian Scientists (semafor.com) 127
An anonymous reader shares a report: CERN, the European particle-physics collaboration that operates the Large Hadron Collider, will expel hundreds of Russian-affiliated scientists from its laboratories. The Geneva-based organization decided to cut ties with Moscow after Russia's 2022 invasion of Ukraine, ending nearly 60 years of collaboration, and the agreements are now lapsing.
I kind of feel for them (Score:3, Insightful)
Scientists just want to turn out science, but at the same time... Russia's really earned international pariah status.
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Re:I kind of feel for them (Score:4, Funny)
They might get killed, or worse, expelled...
...oh, wait.
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I don't think particle physicists are a dominant force in Russian politics.
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Does that mean threatening their research is the right move, so that they turn political and can change the public opinion in Russia?
If people from outside Russia threaten their research, if they turn political and try to change public opinion it would presumably be in favor of Russia, not against.
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It means more open spots in CERN for peace loving North Korean scientists!
Re:I kind of feel for them (Score:5, Insightful)
Scientists just want to turn out science
That is not always true. And, even if that is their personal feelings, since they and their loved ones are under the thumb of a dictator - they may be forced to do other things we might prefer they not be able to do. Spying, for instance... or even sabotage.
Re:I kind of feel for them (Score:4, Insightful)
There are a lot of issues to consider. Could any of the science at CERN help Russia in its illegal war against Ukraine? CERN does a lot more than just the LHC. It was where the World Wide Web was invented, for example. CERN is behind KiCad and other useful software.
Renewing the agreements would have been a legal minefield for CERN.
Re:I kind of feel for them (Score:5, Insightful)
Could any of the science at CERN help Russia in its illegal war against Ukraine?
Yes. Experience gained by working scientists with advanced electronics of the sort found at a CERN site (high performance DACs, ADCs, oscillators, lasers, world class instruments, etc.) that might not be available within Russia due to sanctions is extremely valuable in military applications. This would include access to proprietary development tools, documentation, specialized instruments, access to vendors, etc. All of these things are used in radar, guidance, communication and satellite systems.
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but high-energy particle physics doesn't have that much overlap with military tech
Sure. I'm not suggesting particle beams have immediate applicability to Russia's weapons development. That's not my point at all.
The basic components, however, are very portable. There are only a couple companies on Earth that make the components and instruments used for CERN HLC and similar work. Analog Devices, TI and a few others. Knowledge of and experience with this these devices applies everywhere, so basically you're training people on the use of the technology needed for advanced weapons, whe
No Military Science (Score:2)
Could any of the science at CERN help Russia in its illegal war against Ukraine?
No, it's clearly specified in Article II [web.cern.ch] of CERN's founding charter that CERN "shall have no concern with work for military requirements and the results of its experimental and theoretical work shall be published or otherwise made generally available.". Given this it is hard to see how anyone on either side could gain an advantage since both would be aware of any research since it is made public.
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Probably, kicking them out of CERN also means invalidating their visas, so they will be kicked out of the whole Schengen area.
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I feel bad for the Russian scientists. If they have to go back to Russia they will get thrown in the meat grinder (conscripted).
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There are a lot of issues to consider. Could any of the science at CERN help Russia in its illegal war against Ukraine?
During the first weeks of the war, a lot of Russian software developers, small-time business people, and other professionals tried to emigrate out of Russia into other countries. And quickly found that moving to Europe became pretty much impossible. In addition, the Russian government quickly rolled out incentives for professionals: protection against mobilization, lower tax rates, etc.
So professionals mostly stayed home or returned from visa-free countries to Russia. This has helped Putin _immensely_, li
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You don't think those Russians would have been able to do all that even easier if they were still embedded in Europe and the west?
Probably not. People who escape from oppression are not particularly keen on supporting it. And it's not like there are no Russians in Europe anyway.
Even with Europe just sending everything in via Kazakhstan etc. Still Russia has 20% interest rates and the economy is almost collapsing. Imagine how quickly it would have folded if the sanctions were done at least semi-properly.
The sanctions _were_ done properly if the intent was to help Putin. During the first year of the war, the Russian rubble was one of the world's strongest currencies in 2022 as a result. It took a while for the workarounds to be deployed.
And now Russia is basically back to the pre-war hydrocarbons export income level. The Russian economy does have structural
Re: I kind of feel for them (Score:4, Insightful)
So... The US has done the whole 'hearts and minds' crap which killed a lot of people and didn't change much otherwise in the long run... but in modern times it has yet to try and annex Canada on the pretext that Canada requires liberation from Nazis and genocidal war is the best way to achieve that.
Russia needs to be properly broken so it gives up imperial designs for the foreseeable future.
Re: I kind of feel for them (Score:4, Insightful)
"Ukraine was getting cozy with NATO".
Yes. An organization dedicated to protecting members against Russian aggression.
Only Putin's stooges and useful idiots present NATO as a threat to Russia. The only threat NATO presents to Russia is to its ability to invade and conquer other nations.
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I agree with this. You can point out the questionably aggressive things the US has done, no lie. But NATO? Name me one act of aggression NATO has participated in. (Bracing for incoming posts about how NATO defensively arming itself or accepting members that requested entry constitutes aggression.)
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Name me one act of aggression NATO has participated in.
I heard they once moved Taco Tuesday to Thursday w/o asking anyone first. :-)
Re: I kind of feel for them (Score:2)
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Name me one act of aggression NATO has participated in.
You have to be kidding. The invasion of Libya and deposing the Muammar Quadafi government.
Re: I kind of feel for them (Score:4, Insightful)
"Ukraine was getting cozy with NATO.'
So Russia found it necessary to demonstrate why that had been a really good idea.
Re: I kind of feel for them (Score:5, Insightful)
"Wrong. Russia demonstrated why it would have been a good idea for Ukraine to stay neutral. Thousands of dead Ukrainians agree with me"
If the rape victim hadn't yelled for the police, he wouldn't have had to stab her!
Re: I kind of feel for them (Score:4, Insightful)
Funny how you Russian trolls always bring that up. Why would a country want to get cozy with NATO? Hmmmm. Let me think. Could it be because Russia keeps saying they're going to invade that country and return it to the old Soviet Union?
Naw. That can't be it.
Re: I kind of feel for them (Score:2)
The Cuban missile crisis didn't involve any kind of invasion or anything resembling a hot war. And that was basically Kennedy's doing because he ordered the nuclear weapons deployments in Italy and Turkey that precipitated it. He even stated once that he almost caused WWIII. Russia didn't even care about the bay of pigs incident, they just used it as a justification for Cuba to host nukes there. The whole point was to get the US to dismantle nukes in Italy and Turkey, even though Russia already had 162 nucl
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The funny thing is that, had Kennedy followed through on supporting the Bay of Pigs invasion instead of forcing the Cuban expat forces to go in alone, they could have seized all those Soviet nuclear assets along with preventing the Cuban missile crisis.
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It is more like Canada though, practically speaking. Russia claims Ukraine really isn't a separate nation, and does not have a separate culture or language, that they're all just Russians anyway. So USA and Canada fits that mold better than USA and Cuba since Cubans don't speak a language similar at all to English, and don't have a culture that is similar to America and never had a common monarch a couple centuries ago.
Ukraine was improving its corruption, doing a great job at cleaning house and making pr
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All of NATO expansion has been done by countries aspiring to join, Vilnius Group, Adriatic Charter, there's valid reason countries want to join, obvious over the decades.
Estonia and Latvia share a border with Russia and they're feeling pretty smart and vindicated today to pursue membership.
Re: I kind of feel for them (Score:4, Insightful)
On one hand, NATO is basically the anti-Russia alliance.
On the other hand, Russia has a long history of aggression towards neighbors that have resources they want, and of claiming that they own those neighbors' land even when they were civilized hundreds of years before Russia. Europe needs an anti-Russia alliance, because Russia is so hostile.
Don't misrepresent the reality of things, it hurts you in the long run.
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Well said.
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Ummm, Afghanistan. I mean, their government organized an attack on the US on 2001-09-11. I don't see any reason why the US should have let that slide.
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Ummm, Afghanistan. I mean, their government organized an attack on the US on 2001-09-11.
You confuse the (back then and today again) Afghan Taliban government - which was the US' "best friend" while the Sowjets occupied Afghanistan - with Al Qaeda, which primarily consisted of non-Afghan members. After 9-11, the Taliban offered to take Al Qaeda leaders to court in Afghanistan, but the US preferred to start some years long war just "to have it their way".
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"there isn't a shred of evidence of any "imperial designs" of russia"
Dunno, OTTOMH I can think of Georgia, Crimea, E Ukraine. Add to that a despot for life running the place, and it screams "imperial".
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georgia was in the same pack with ukraine
Brilliant idea bundling Georgia with other countries in an attempt to ignore an obvious pattern of behavior. How long did it take to come up with that one?
If anyone is confused on the topic of Russian imperialism you can just let the Russian state explain it to you in their own words. https://www.youtube.com/@russi... [youtube.com]
you'd think that if anything that should have been an advice for nato not to press on
WTF does NATO even have to do with Ukraine? Ukraine is not in NATO and was at no point in any danger of it being in NATO. Russia started its war against Ukraine under the backdrop of Russi
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you correctly point out that crimea was not part of the budapest memorandum, but that doesn't diminish its condition as a critical security concern and the threat presented by a forced regime change. also, there was no "invasion" of crimea on 20/2/2014 because russia didn't technically invade at all ("in-vadere" : going into), they "annexed" crimea. they were already there, had been for decades. they took control and established barricades on 26/2, not 20/2 (yanukovich was ousted and fled the country 22/2).
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you correctly point out that crimea was not part of the budapest memorandum,
Budapest is completely irrelevant to the issue at hand. You made a specific claim " it was one of the conditions for ukraine to getting independence in the first place". That claim is completely unmoored from reality.
also, there was no "invasion" of crimea on 20/2/2014 because russia didn't technically invade at all ("in-vadere" : going into), they "annexed" crimea. they were already there, had been for decades.
On Feb 20th according to the Ukrainians:
"The Russian military, without identification marks, seized administrative buildings, blocked Ukrainian military units, and turned off Ukrainian television."
This behavior is clearly an act of war. If China waltz into the US and did that same thing nobo
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Budapest is completely irrelevant to the issue at hand. You made a specific claim " it was one of the conditions for ukraine to getting independence in the first place". That claim is completely unmoored from reality.
i don't think so. ukraine gave up the nuclear arsenal for a reason. that reason were security guarantees, for everyone involved. that was what made the existence of an independent ukraine viable: not being a threat to russia. even if crimea wasn't mentioned in those conditions it was a critical security condition. having its regime toppled and going in bed with nato was enough of a threat.
On Feb 20th according to the Ukrainians:
"The Russian military, without identification marks, seized administrative buildings, blocked Ukrainian military units, and turned off Ukrainian television."
20/2 people were already dying on the streets, it wouldn't be outlandish that russians started preventive measures or so
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i don't think so. ukraine gave up the nuclear arsenal for a reason. that reason were security guarantees, for everyone involved.
For like the third time now what you actually stated was "it was one of the conditions for ukraine to getting independence in the first place".
Ukraine in fact got its independence years before Budapest rendering your statement factually incorrect. In other words Budapest has nothing to do with "getting independence" because the attainment of independence predated Budapest.
The only reason Ukraine gave up their nukes is because they were fucking idiots. Budapest is a worthless document.
that was what made the existence of an independent ukraine viable: not being a threat to russia.
You've got it backwar
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Being in NATO means you don't get invaded by Russia.
let's just get over your semantics and petty arguments, this is the fundamental issue you are getting backwards: announcing they would get into nato and doubling down is what got them invaded by russia. and they (and their friends) have been doubling down at every turn ever since. now they're in really deep shit, and still keep digging.
of course that doesn't mesh well with your "russian imperialism" story, but that's just because that story is bullshit.
here, you might want to listen to another nutcase inste
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let's just get over your semantics and petty arguments
Let's not. You called the ouster Yanukovych a coup when in fact he was fired by the Ukrainian parliament by vote of 328 to 0. This is not merely a petty semantic argument it is being factually wrong about a matter of significant importance.
You indicated Russia "wasn't visibly involved" when in fact dozens of convoys and tens of thousands of people in military dress were observed crossing borders from Russia into Ukraine. Again factually incorrect about a matter of significant importance.
The difference 'b
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well, if he's a crackpot it should be fairly easy for you to dispute his argument with facts. many have tried an failed. i mean, rationally, instead of throwing insults.
At least he is honest when he says "there are not many people who agree with me"
indeed. his honesty is refreshing. he also is very open to challenge and does fairly well. ofc not in mainstream western media, he's not welcome there. alas, the world is larger than that.
i do understand this might rock your worldview, but then i've made my case and there's no point in reiteraing. good luck.
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well, if he's a crackpot it should be fairly easy for you to dispute his argument with facts. many have tried an failed.
WTF is this some kind of proxy war between myself and Mearsheimer? If YOU have something substantive to say then YOU say it. If YOU have affirmative evidence to support any of the bullshit YOU have been asserting then provide it otherwise fuck off.
do understand this might rock your worldview, but then i've made my case and there's no point in reiteraing. good luck.
I'm going to keep reiterating the fact you are factually wrong and have utterly failed to objectively support any of your claims.
You called the ouster Yanukovych a coup when in fact he was fired by the Ukrainian parliament by vote of 328 to 0.
You indicated Russi
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WTF is this some kind of proxy war between myself and Mearsheimer?
you tell me, you called him a crackpot ... why?
If YOU have affirmative evidence to support any of the bullshit YOU have been asserting then provide it
i did. you just seem impregnable to reason.
otherwise fuck off.
tsk, tsk. see? you loose it too easily.
You called the ouster Yanukovych a coup when in fact he was fired by the Ukrainian parliament by vote of 328 to 0.
yeah, that vote was coerced, and anyone against that ousting wasn't even there to vote. because it was a coup. :-)
You indicated Russia "wasn't visibly involved" when in fact OSCE observers recorded dozens of convoys and tens of thousands of people in military dress crossing borders
assuming that evidence is credible (i have no problem with that, there is probably some truth to it), that is still not oficial involvement. there is a difference. there are nato boots on the ground in ukraine but they are incognito, they also wear a fancy dress. does
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you tell me, you called him a crackpot ... why?
Mearsheimer is a cherry picker who stakes out inherently unfalsifiable positions. Effectively he is a noun, a verb and "the law of the jungle "is what it is" ". When he calls himself a 19th century thinker he really means it. To him the post WWII, post nuclear international order that everyone signed on to at the heart of the UN charter might as well have never happened.
i did. you just seem impregnable to reason.
If you have something to say then say it.
tsk, tsk. see? you loose it too easily.
It's lose not loose. Wouldn't hurt to learn basic English capitalization rules either.
yeah, that vote was coerced, and anyone against that ousting wasn't even there to vote. because it was a coup.
328 membe
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Mearsheimer is a cherry picker who stakes out inherently unfalsifiable positions. Effectively he is a noun, a verb and "the law of the jungle "is what it is" ". When he calls himself a 19th century thinker he really means it.
which of his positions are "inherently unfalsifiable"? realist political theory is centuries old. his basic distinctive contribution is the assertion that security concerns will trump any other concern at some point. maybe that's what you consider unfalsifiable? well, as it happens, that actually explains a lot of past human history. even ...
To him the post WWII, post nuclear international order that everyone signed on to at the heart of the UN charter might as well have never happened.
... present. mearsheimer doesn't dismiss the funcion and effect of international institutions. he just argues that it can only go so far. the un charter couldn't avoid
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which of his positions are "inherently unfalsifiable"?
The amoral "is what it is" style commentary.
actually, there is evidence to the contrary,
institutions and all we're in the midst of a dangerous escalation game, and there are clear signs and broad agreement that a security competition between the us and china is inevitable. i think mearsheimer is spot on. besides negating his thesis you actually haven't made any real counterargument
Following the 19th century states have collectively agreed not to behave like a bunch of lawless animals driven by mindless evolutionary pressures for the sake of everyone's collective interests. Plurality of states at the recent UN meeting approached unprovoked Russian invasion of Ukraine by affirming their desire to preserve the rules based order. One notably holding up a copy of the UN charter itself in his presentation.
Russia is clearly an outlier amongst na
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which of his positions are "inherently unfalsifiable"?
The amoral "is what it is" style commentary.
what have morals to do with theories being falsifiable or not? moving goalposts now? even if you had any moral high gorund here (which in my view you have not), reality still "is what it is", and it is what science is all about. analyzing and explaining human behavior doesn't imply any moral endorsement.
Do you have evidence she is in fact deciding what composition of the foreign government will be for that government? I listened to the conversation and must have just missed the part.
well, "yats is the guy" actually ended up being the president of that government.
victoria nuland even admitted financial support of the protests,
I'm very interested in this. Where can I listen, watch or read her admissions? Don't worry I won't hold my breath waiting for you to make more excuses for your failure to support the nonsense you are peddling.
knock yourself out: https://www.youtube.com/watch?... [youtube.com]
I'm not going to be nice to you.
me? lol, i'm nobody. what you don't seem to get is that all the shit you
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Do you have evidence she is in fact deciding what composition of the foreign government will be for that government? I listened to the conversation and must have just missed the part.
well, "yats is the guy" actually ended up being the president of that government.
Are you serious? You have no causative evidence with which to support your conspiracy bullshit? None at all? By the way "Yats" would become prime minister not president.
I'm very interested in this. Where can I listen, watch or read her admissions? Don't worry I won't hold my breath waiting for you to make more excuses for your failure to support the nonsense you are peddling.
knock yourself out
Nuland didn't say anything about financial support for protests in the video you sent. She talked about supporting the aspirations of Ukrainians before going on to talk about development assistance. She didn't link the two or in any way suggest the United States was financially supporting protests.
For those interested in actual details
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I'm well aware of this crackpot.
if he's a crackpot it should be fairly easy for you to dispute his argument
Mearsheimer is a cherry picker who stakes out inherently unfalsifiable positions.
which of his positions are "inherently unfalsifiable"?
The amoral "is what it is" style commentary.
what have morals to do with theories being falsifiable or not?
crickets ...
Are you serious? You have no causative evidence with which to support your conspiracy bullshit? None at all?
of course not! they surely were just placing bets on a horse race, killing time on a friday afternoon ... :O)
https://obamawhitehouse.archiv... [archives.gov]
of course a press release from the white house will dispell any possible implication of the u.s. in financing political unrest abroad. the u.s. has never done that, would never do that! they love democracy above all and swear on bibles, ffs!
actually funny. in a creepy way.
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of course not! they surely were just placing bets on a horse race, killing time on a friday afternoon ... :O)
You have nothing? No affirmative evidence to support the contention Nuland et el installed Yatz as prime minister whatsoever? What's the deal here? Do you just believe whatever "feels" right to you?
of course a press release from the white house will dispell any possible implication of the u.s. in financing political unrest abroad. the u.s. has never done that, would never do that! they love democracy above all and swear on bibles, ffs!
Nothing here either? Just a bunch of unfalsifiable conspiracy bullshit? Nuland didn't say what you said she did and apparently you have no evidence to support your claims.
actually funny. in a creepy way.
Actually this is just sad.
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there isn't a shred of evidence of any "imperial designs" of russia.
You are a fucking nutcase.
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brilliant argument.
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brilliant argument.
I wasn't making an argument. I was simply pointing out you are a fucking nutcase.
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indeed, mr obvious, that's what unresourceful people tend to do when they don't have arguments. it's ok.
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indeed, mr obvious, that's what unresourceful people tend to do when they don't have arguments. it's ok.
When someone says "there isn't a shred of evidence of any "imperial designs" of russia" I'm content to with those words "arguing" for themselves. Nutcase is simply the logical conclusion most would draw from the utterance of such drivel.
Re: I kind of feel for them (Score:4, Interesting)
Yeah but the US is in fact a democracy so things can and do change. After 9/11 we were really taking our stupid pills for sure but good or bad (mostly bad) the American public as a whole wanted some revanchism and we got it, to our regret. The international community responded in kind as well, we all remember "Freedom Fries" because we couldn't gather really any allies for Iraq because everyone else knew it was bullshit.
Over time though you can see today the American public, due to getting into those bad conflicts is in possibly in the most anti-war phase in it's history, people won't stand for getting involved in another Iraq. Obama ran on and won partly on the back of ending Iraq (sorta did) and Trump did the same with Afgahanistan (sorta did).
Russia has no such steadying effect on it's politics, if Putin wants a war what is in their political system is to stop him?
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if Putin wants a war what is in their political system is to stop him?
And, if someone tries, they'd better first make sure there aren't any large windows nearby. ... and stay off planes.
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As long as Russia has windows, political figures there will line up behind Putin and applaud.
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I'm not an American.
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Can you say that again, with a Nixon voice?
Re: I kind of feel for them (Score:2)
You've always struck me as being a refugee from an Islamic or perhaps far eastern state, and you resent living in whatever western democracy that provides you with safe harbor because in your view they're evil colonialists who don't accept your ideology, and so even though you hate your new place of residence, you justify your presence there as being necessary to induce the populace to be more like the state you had to escape from.
That or for whatever reason you've adopted some kind of eastern (or formerly
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Completely wrong.
You should try not to imagine things about people, it leads to errors in thinking.
Re: I kind of feel for them (Score:2)
The only error I need to avoid in this case is assuming simple naivete on your part. The shit you assert on regular basis is just way too dumb to be accidental. The question on my mind is: Why?
rsilvergun does it too, though in his case I already know why: He lives in a very isolated social bubble of his own making (doesn't get outside much, spends his days on fark) and makes frequent logical errors even when not trying to push ideology. In other words, poor reasoning skills and lack of education. Bad mix bu
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You are that Simpsons meme where Skinner reassures himself that it must be the kids who are wrong.
Re: I kind of feel for them (Score:2)
And yet you're the one facing this exact criticism from multiple other people
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Apparently, during the campaigns to put pressure on South Africa to end apartheid, one of the things that had the strongest effect were sports boycotts. The ruling class really didn't like being excluded from international sports competitions.
I say, rather than the kinds of sanctions that mostly affect the people who are least responsible & s
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You are right (Score:4, Interesting)
While you have several replies that disagree with you, you are correct.
I work with a lot of Russian immigrants, they all love the science. They are very good scientists, because they are always questioning why, and they work hard.
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I have no idea what happened within the bureaucracy, but I would imagine that CERN leadership fought this. We don't do national boundaries at CERN. The only division is by discipline. Physicists are physicists, engineers are engineers, etc...
I feel this decision is disgusting. CERN is about unity in a way that matters. If we were all at war, CERN is where we should have universal collaboration at all times.
We NEVER want CERN people involved in war. This is how we ended up
Alert to /. (Score:1)
This is off the main topic, but related.
I tried to mod up a comment as Insightful.
Upon doing so, the post was ranked as "Score 2, Troll".
This is not the first time I have seen this happen, and lately I have seen a number of comments marked "troll" when there was no rational reason for such.
I am posting this note primarily to undo my munged moderation, but also, I think there may be a behind-the-scenes error in how the mod points are handled depending on the starting level.
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That was probably because somebody else modded it troll and your preferences give the troll rating more weight.
What you actually did by posting was leave that troll point as the (currently) only point on the post.
Re: Alert to /. (Score:2)
If the person you modded is anything like me, they take pride in receiving score 2: Troll. It's only a shame that score 5: Troll isn't possible anymore. Those were the good ol' days. You see, being an informative troll is the best kind of trolling.
Possible explanation (Score:4, Funny)
This is off the main topic, but related.
I tried to mod up a comment as Insightful.
Upon doing so, the post was ranked as "Score 2, Troll".
This is not the first time I have seen this happen, and lately I have seen a number of comments marked "troll" when there was no rational reason for such.
I am posting this note primarily to undo my munged moderation, but also, I think there may be a behind-the-scenes error in how the mod points are handled depending on the starting level.
I mod a lot of comments one way that comes out another way. For example, I'll mod something "insightful" and have it come up "informative".
If I had to guess I'd say that the comment retains its first mod type. An original 2-level comment has no type, but once someone mods it then it keeps that mod.
I've also modded things up that became "funny", or that I thought were funny and came up as something else. I've also had my own comments modded *down* as insightful, and so on. I figure it's just trolls striking out against an insightful comment that they don't like, something that shows them in a bad light (easy enough to do in this political climate).
It's interesting to have comments that end up "-1 insightful" on slashdot. I don't know how to feel about those - is that a failure or a victory?
FWIW, I nearly always mod down posts with insults, regardless of political position. I generally mod down mindless comments, such as those that translate into "no it isn't". I generally mod comments up that have a different viewpoint, have links to outside references, or generally explain/have background info or expert knowledge in some field. In rare cases I'll skip a comment with insults if the insult is mild and there's significant other value (links, insight, expert knowledge) in the comment. I feel that stepping on insults makes the site more friendly to newer readers.
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With only 2 mods, The Algorithm(tm) is unable to give added weight to either mod, so it just sticks with the first mod given. Once a mod has 2 or more mods of the same type, more than other mods, it can then assign the new mod label.
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I haven't looked at Slashcode in a decade but the label used to be the plurality mod.
So two Insightfuls and an Interesting would get you an Insightful. And the number is just mathematical - but your preferences, the poster's preferences, your zoo relationship, your relationships' zoo relationship, etc. all modify what you see as the number.
"It's complicated."
I'm old enough to remember when Slashcode got updated and when Technocrat fixed all the bugs. :sigh:
Here's to 25-yr-old perl code that still hums alon
That headline tho (Score:1)
Sad Day for Science (Score:4, Interesting)
Dragging international scientific research into the political arena is not a good idea. Yes, the Russian government has behaved appallingly but that was equally true of the old Soviet government and yet somehow we managed to use Science as a common goal to help bring us together because understanding the universe is a common goal that all scientists have regardless of where they come from.
More worryingly is to wonder where will this stop. Are we now going to see Israeli and/or Palestinian scientists excluded too because of the actions of their governments? This would be particularly sad since, about a decade ago, two undergrad students at the CERN summer school, one from Israel and the other from Palestine, organized a barbeque together to show that scientists can get along regardless of what their politicians might be doing.
We shoudl certainly be implementing sanctions to damage or limit Russia's ability to wage war against Ukraine but going after international scientific cooperation is a dangerous and damaging road to take that does nothing to materially harm Russia but that does harm an international forum for peace and cooperation, even between sworn enemies, that has survived for decades.
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I never thought CERN would do something like this given that one of its founding goals (in Article II of its charter) was to promote "international co-operation in nuclear research". I've spent many years working at CERN both locally and remotely and remember the Soviet scientists working at CERN towards the end of the Cold War period.
Dragging international scientific research into the political arena is not a good idea. Yes, the Russian government has behaved appallingly but that was equally true of the old Soviet government and yet somehow we managed to use Science as a common goal to help bring us together because understanding the universe is a common goal that all scientists have regardless of where they come from.
I think it has more to do with the delta than the absolute value.
Soviet Russia was doing some nasty things, but it was liberalizing, so participation in things like CERN was a carrot meant to show everyone could get along.
Modern Russia is also doing nasty things, and it's getting worse, so taking away things like participation in things like CERN is a stick used to show that Russia is becoming a pariah state.
I don't know if it's a signal that will have much influence, but to the extent it does it should hel
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I don't know if it's a signal that will have much influence, but to the extent it does it should help build momentum for change in Russia.
I would have thought that having some of Russia's best minds working at CERN and learning first-hand that the west is not out to get Russia while also seeing world events without a Russian government filter would be a vastly more powerful agent for change than playing straight into Putin's narrative that the west has always been out to do Russia down.
Breaking bridges may achieve short term strategic goals and perhaps make a few people feel like the achieved something, but the free exchange of ideas and
Re: Sad Day for Science (Score:2)
Piss-poor title, as usual... (Score:2)
Tilte: CERN To Expel Hundreds of Russian Scientists
Summary: [...] will expel hundreds of Russian-affiliated scientists [...]
Being "Russian" and "Russian-affiliated" aren't the same thing. Get some freakin' editorial standards, Slashdot!
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They are not being expelled: it is just that their contracts are about to expire and will not be renewed.
True - I noticed that too and forgot to mention that other piss-poor aspect of the title.
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Not going to happen here at slashdot. Since it was bought it's been on a decidely pro-establishment bent.
Russia Russia Russia! (Score:2)
Just think what the Russian Military could do with gold nuclei accelerated to the speed of light!
They could create microscopic black holes, or cause Bosons to spill over the side of containers, even.
CERN to Expel American Scientists (Score:4, Insightful)
...was not a headline you saw when the United States carried out its unprovoked, unjustified, immoral war of conquest against Iraq in 2003.
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If Ukraine had invaded first Belarus, you might have had a point.
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...was not a headline you saw when the United States carried out its unprovoked, unjustified, immoral war of conquest against Iraq in 2003.
When did Iraq become the 51st state or at least the 6th territory? As dumb, evil and indefensible as preemptive war bullshit was US never perused the conquest of Iraq. Iraq last I checked is a sovereign state closely aligned with Iran. We don't even have a SOFA with Iraq anymore to cover the remnants of our military presence.
Expulsion... (Score:2)
Again no Funny? (Score:2)
Another story with dark humor potential...
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In any case it's meaningless, fusion power is as hopeless as peace in the Middle East ...
You apparently don't know what CERN actually is [wikipedia.org].