Psychologists Pinpoint Average Age Children Become Santa Sceptics (theguardian.com) 242
An anonymous reader quotes a report from The Guardian: From empty glasses of sherry on the mantelpiece to sooty footprints leading to the bedroom door, evidence of Santa's existence is clearly irrefutable. Yet most children will begin to question it at some point -- and many parents anticipate this moment with dread. Now psychologists have identified the average age when Santa skepticism creeps in, and which children are at greatest risk of harboring negative feelings when it does.
While most adults have fallen for the myth that Santa doesn't exist, many children still believe -- even if the idea of a single individual visiting the homes of billions of children in a single night is at odds with their wider reasoning skills. Dr Candice Mills, a psychologist at the University of Texas in Dallas, US, and a Santa sceptic, said: "Children typically begin to distinguish fantasy from reality during the preschool years, but their belief in the existence of a singular magical Santa Claus often continues into middle childhood." [...] To better understand this shift from belief to disbelief and children's experiences of it, Mills and her colleagues interviewed 48 six- to 15-year-olds who had stopped believing in Santa and 44 of their parents, plus a further 383 adults.
The research, which has not yet been peer reviewed, found that for most children, disbelief crept in gradually about the age of eight -- although some three- or four-year-olds had convinced themselves that Santa wasn't real, while other children believed in him until they were 15 or 16. In many cases, it was testimony from other disbelievers that finally crushed their faith. Mills said: "They may have had some skepticism based on logical reasoning -- like how can Santa Claus really get around the world in one night? -- but what pushes them over the edge is a classmate at school saying he's not real."
While most adults have fallen for the myth that Santa doesn't exist, many children still believe -- even if the idea of a single individual visiting the homes of billions of children in a single night is at odds with their wider reasoning skills. Dr Candice Mills, a psychologist at the University of Texas in Dallas, US, and a Santa sceptic, said: "Children typically begin to distinguish fantasy from reality during the preschool years, but their belief in the existence of a singular magical Santa Claus often continues into middle childhood." [...] To better understand this shift from belief to disbelief and children's experiences of it, Mills and her colleagues interviewed 48 six- to 15-year-olds who had stopped believing in Santa and 44 of their parents, plus a further 383 adults.
The research, which has not yet been peer reviewed, found that for most children, disbelief crept in gradually about the age of eight -- although some three- or four-year-olds had convinced themselves that Santa wasn't real, while other children believed in him until they were 15 or 16. In many cases, it was testimony from other disbelievers that finally crushed their faith. Mills said: "They may have had some skepticism based on logical reasoning -- like how can Santa Claus really get around the world in one night? -- but what pushes them over the edge is a classmate at school saying he's not real."
Santa wouldn't cheap out on off brand (Score:3)
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Don't you remember, Santa doesn't buy gifts in stores, his elves make them all!
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Re:Santa wouldn't cheap out on off brand (Score:4, Funny)
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Except in some parts of Europe, where the presents are brought by Christkind, or "christ-child". Despite the name, this is a (female) fairy kind of affair in a white dress, and was introduced by the churches in the 16th-19th century to make people think of Jesus rather than the traditional St.Nicholas on December 6.
I for one think it's very progressive of the different churches to promote a trans fairy as their symbol of Christmas.
At what age do they become atheists? (Score:5, Interesting)
I've always wondered why children eventually stop believing in (spoiler alert!) Santa Claus, the tooth fairly, and the Easter bunny, but continue to believe in gods, angels, and devils throughout their adult life.
If the article is correct, it's because they weren't teased about their beliefs at school! Which implies that societies might hit a tipping point where they flip to atheism once enough school kids become non-religious.
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Whilst I can pinpoint the exact moment I realised I didn't believe in the supernatural*, I stopped functionally believing many years before that - it just took a long time for the penny to drop.
When the fantastical started conflicting with observable reality, I started to understand that all of the stories were just that - harmless, fun, stories.
There was no profound realisation where one moment I believed in magic & the next I didn't. It was a gradual process where the stories simply became less litera
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I've always wondered why children eventually stop believing in (spoiler alert!) Santa Claus, the tooth fairly[sic], and the Easter bunny, but continue to believe in gods, angels, and devils throughout their adult life.
They don't. Ever.
Once they are adults, they are no longer children.
Also, the devils are reserved for Christians and Muslims.
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There are a number of Tv. shows (Eg. The nanny, School of Rock) where a child is ridiculed for childhood habits, such as sleeping with a plush toy.
There's a number of reasons:
Because the message changes from strangers break-in and give you presents to strangers break-in and hurt you.
God is mentioned every week, while Santa Claus and Easter Bunny happen one week a year.
God (actually religion) has rules about everything while SC, EB and TF have less rules and no power to punish.
Our perception of reali
Re:At what age do they become atheists? (Score:5, Insightful)
We seem to have gone against the mainstream in our family in the sense that we have *never* told our child that Santa is real.
Essentially, I've donned on the red suit and fake beard...in full visibility of the child. Then we have gathered around the tree and handed out the presents, I've gotten my milk and cookies and it's all been fun. Even though the kid knows that I'm not real Santa riding on a flying sled pulled by reindeer, they are pretty much into it. I mean, this same kid can imagine that a cardboard box is a car or a house or a teleporter, why would dad being a Santa suddenly be something beyond imagination capability?
Same for the others. Yes, coin exchanged for baby tooth...or chocolate eggs around the house - of course it's set up by mom&dad! We tell them that yeah, parents are now going to play Easter Bunny and you can then go for a bit of a egg hunt! Kids have amazing capability of make-believe.
This has now gone on for 7 years. This time around the kid is going to dress up as an elf and be Santa's little helper when we have some extended family gathering. We've said that some of the other kids in attendance may not be aware of Santa's true nature, so don't go around telling that.
Here's to *hoping* that when the kid reaches the angsty teenager phase, we'd at least have some additional trust points as parents because we have never lied even on such trivial matters as what's the deal with Santa. We'll know in about 10 years.
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I was about to post something like "OK, god(s) turn now" !
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But who created that sky fairy, pray tell? Even within the understanding of Joe Sixpack, where there's a Big Bang without an explanation, you have one less fantastical entity. Entity whose there's exactly 0 evidence for.
Re:At what age do they become atheists? (Score:4, Informative)
But who created that sky fairy, pray tell? Even within the understanding of Joe Sixpack, where there's a Big Bang without an explanation, you have one less fantastical entity. Entity whose there's exactly 0 evidence for.
Creationist logic:
1 - Everything requires a cause
2 - Therefore God is the cause of everything
3 - God doesn't require a cause
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Up front note: this post (at least the first part) is from a Christian perspective, which I am most familiar with. Other perspectives would probably use different terminology.
For someone who believes that God created everything, including the universe itself, why would that person have to believe that God is subject to the same rules as we experience? Let me put it another way: if God created the universe and everything in it, it stands to reason that He created space itself, the 3 spatial dimensions we p
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The problem, as I see it, is that humans created the motion of gods in the first place because they had no concept of science and needed a well-ordered universe in order to function. If everything is random, very little is possible.
As societies evolved and developed deeper understanding, that sort of god was no longer so useful. Rather, they needed a god to justify the system they had and to justify depriving others of theirs. Gods became shields and swords, in effect, because the powers that were needed a
Re:At what age do they become atheists? (Score:5, Informative)
Even if you ignore any physics knowledge past high school, you have:
* a theory there's copious evidence for vs a theory supported by no evidence at all
* one of these theories includes an extraneous fantastical entity
As for explanations wrt the cause/origin of the Big Bang, science refuses to make statements that can't be verified. We do have multiple plausible theories that are consistent with our current knowledge of physics, but to go forward we'd need to know more about physics of extremely high energies -- you can't extrapolate into unknown grounds. The knowledge about those grounds is progressing, though.
But then, some unknowns we can only speculate about don't invalidate the theory. Comparing it with creationism is like comparing Copernicus' model of the world with that of Aristoteles: today we know about galaxies, and that the point the planets are orbiting is not the Sun itself but 1.5 solar radii outside it (dominated by Jupiter), but Copernician model still beats crystal spheres by quite a bit.
Physicists Extrapolate all the Time (Score:2)
but to go forward we'd need to know more about physics of extremely high energies -- you can't extrapolate into unknown grounds
Sure you can - theorists do that all the time extrapolating how things could work at higher energies in a way that does not break all the lower energy physics that we already know. I've spent most of my life testing such extrapolations and not finding any that work but that does not mean that you cannot do it. However, explaining the Big Bang is not just about high-energy physics: we first need to understand how anything can happen when there is no space and possibly even no time. At the moment we do not e
Re:At what age do they become atheists? (Score:4, Insightful)
It's not so hard to see, from a scientific perspective, that Creation requires a Creator.
That is incredibly hard to see from a scientific perspective, as science has no such bias. Science says, "this is what we have observed and what we have deduced from those observations. Everything beyond that is speculation."
That everything requires a creator is speculation based on bizarre wishful thinking, and has only ignorance to support the supposition.
Science seeks answers for missing information by using powers of observation and reason. Religion seeks to reinforce speculation by means of fear and intimidation.
The religious have yet to learn to distinguish fantasy/fiction from reality.
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You are expressing your own religious views, and you have that right. Atheism teaches that there is no God. This isn't science, this is religion.
Forensic science is in every way a true science. It is focused on determining human (or other) causes of crime. The presence of fingerprints, blood spatter, gunshot residue, and so on, can tell a story about what happened.
Similarly, if you find a computer sitting in the middle of a forest, you can use scientific analysis to determine that the computer didn't spring
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God is not something but rather a unified label for for all that people are ignorant of.
And that is YOUR religious belief, not based on science.
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Re:At what age do they become atheists? (Score:5, Insightful)
Calling atheism a religious view is like calling "off" a TV channel.
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Atheism definition: https://www.google.com/search?... [google.com]
disbelief or lack of belief in the existence of God or gods.
You might have a different definition, but this is the definition most of us understand.
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I would argue that the alternative to believing in a Creator, is believing that everything just "suddenly appeared" out of nothing in a great big explosion. Both options are pretty fantastical.
The latter cuts out a middle man.
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Then who created the creator?
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Christians believe that God has always existed.
While that belief is unprovable, it's no more preposterous than supposing that the Big Bang started from nothing at all, and had no cause. That supposition violates scientific principles which require a cause for literally everything.
Bursting the cosmic bubble (Score:2)
No, the Big Bang is an explanation that (somewhat) fits the observed evidence.
It's also the best explanation we currently have, inasmuch as there actually is some decent evidence for it — unlike the numerous theistic attempts at explanations.
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The big bang doesn't say that. It's a theory where time as we know it begins. It doesn't explain what came before it. Having a god fill this gap just creates something more complex than the gap you're trying to fill.
I do not have mod points, but why the F is the parent sitting at 1?
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You're right, no one has an explanation of what came "before" time began (whatever that means) or what caused time to begin. To assert that there was no cause, is just as religious as to say there was a Creator.
It's not that a "god filling the gap." Everything we scientifically observe, tells us that every action has a cause, everything that is created has a creator. It's not unscientific to postulate that the universe itself has a Creator.
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The same goes for your position that there is no creator. It's just as recursive.
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Oh, so you're just going to say "science doesn't cover what came before the Big Bang"? That sounds like a copout to me. "We don't know how it happened, but we know there was no Creator." Got it.
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Sure, deity for creation... but the direct intervention in day-to-day affairs aspect of religion? The "watching a list and checking it twice aspect"? What separates the writing a wish list to Santa from prayer to God? I agree with OP: it's a good research question.
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Your point of view has a name, it's called Deism. The idea that God created everything and then stepped back and let the universe wind down like a watch.
IF God created everything, in such intricate and amazing detail, why would He step aside and ignore it? As creators ourselves, we humans rarely do this. If we are invested in our creations, we continue to improve them, care for them.
And if God created everything, you don't get to tell Him what he can and can't do with, or demand of, His creation. He's the C
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I wasn't trying to dictate to God anything. I'm just saying that although there is room in the scientific data for a creator deity, the evidence against Santa as an active entity is the same evidence against a day-to-day interventionist deity, and yet people grow out of a belief in one but not out of a belief in the other. Investigating "what makes one belief more sustainable than the other" would be an interesting area of study. Even adjusting for "God only responds to faith", deities of global religions a
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believing that everything just "suddenly appeared" out of nothing in a great big explosion.
A bit of a mischaracterisation there. Given the observable evidence, there's a fair probability that there was once a big "explosion". We've currently got no way of knowing how that event came about or what came before it, and new evidence could turn could turn those probabilities upside down.
Was there a start to the universe, or has it always been? No one knows.
But that's not an argument to baselessly shoehorn a deity into it. That invariably creates more questions than it answers. Was the deity created, o
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But that's not an argument to baselessly shoehorn a deity into it.
Believing in a Creator, is not the same as "shoehorning a deity into" creation. Literally everything we observe scientifically--the basis of all of science--is that every action, every thing, has a cause. Every creation has a creator. If you observe a work of art, you know, scientifically, that that art has a creator. We have observed NO exceptions to this rule. It's not such a stretch to postulate that literally *everything* has a Creator.
Re:At what age do they become atheists? (Score:4, Interesting)
I would argue that the alternative to believing in a Creator, is believing that everything just "suddenly appeared" out of nothing in a great big explosion. Both options are pretty fantastical.
Most atheists and anyone who believes in science believes neither.
But most creationists think they believe in one or the other . . . and they won't STFU about it.
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Most atheists and anyone who believes in science believes neither.
First, you're right about one thing. The religion (atheism vs. theism) comes first, and one's persuasion about religion leads to one's persuasion about the origin of the universe.
You're not right about "anyone who believes in science." There have been many notable, prominent scientists who do believed in God as the Creator. Isaac Newton, Robert Boyle, Blaise Pascal, Galileo, and many others. https://www.famousscientists.o... [famousscientists.org] And of those who are currently living, Francis Bacon, Francis Collins, Daniel Hasti
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And of those who are currently living, Francis Bacon,
Wow, he's still alive. How is he doing these days?
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Traditional bibles say "void" or "emptiness": Making the point there was suddenly something visible and measurable. (Eg. time, gravity, electro-weak force)
The Big Bang Theory does not start from a position of nothing: Just a lack of matter, space and time.
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The Big Bang Theory does not start from a position of nothing: Just a lack of matter, space and time.
Is that true? As I understand it, the Big Bang Theory starts with matter at a density so high that light cannot travel through it, preventing us from observing what was happening. The cosmic background radiation comes from the point when the density became low enough for light to keep traveling, and that's the first point in time that we can observe.
And I'm a little shakier on this part, but as I understand it from various back-and-forth discussions on Physics Forum, the equations for the most well-supp
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And if this is true, where did that high-density matter come from?
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And if this is true, where did that high-density matter come from?
We don't know. And that's a better answer than pretending you know and making up some BS to paper over our gaps in knowledge.
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We don't know.
And that's where your science ends and your faith (atheism) begins.
The idea of a Creator isn't just there to "fill in the gap." Everything we observe scientifically tells us that every action has a cause, and every creation has a creator. If you see a piece of art, you can be scientifically sure that someone created it, even if all you have is the end result. It's not unscientific to postulate that the universe itself has a Creator.
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Everything we observe scientifically tells us that... every creation has a creator.
That is an incorrect statement. There's overwhelming scientific evidence that evolution happened, and we have a solid scientific understanding of the details of many of the molecular mechanisms which allowed evolution to happen as it did. No creator was necessary for all the creatures of the world to come into existence.
I remained an agnostic until I studied that evidence in detail. I still remain philosophically agnostic - there's always the chance that a god or gods exist and that the universe was cr
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I never said evolution didn't happen. Evolution and creation are not mutually exclusive. Many prominent scientists who are Christians, also believe that evolution is the mechanism by which humans originated from "lower" species. https://medium.com/@strengthfr... [medium.com]
To state that "no creator was necessary" is a statement of faith, not science.
Your scientific evidence may explain how humans evolved from Neandertals and beyond. But it doesn't explain the origin of life itself, or the origin of the Big Bang itself.
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I'll make my statement more precise, then: For all of the processes which we have enough evidence to understand with reasonable scientific confidence, no creator was necessary. Perhaps a creator was involved, but they left no evidence for their involvement or for a necessity for their involvement.
Beyond the evidence that's available, you can make up whatever hypotheses you like, and try to come up with experiments which will support or undermine your hypothesis. Do you have any experiments to propose to
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For all of the processes which we have enough evidence to understand with reasonable scientific confidence, no creator was necessary.
This is a supposition, not a proven fact. For example, has science explained why physical constants are what they are? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org] These constants must be precisely what they are, for the universe and life to exist. Science doesn't know why they are such, they just "are." Is this evidence of a Creator? Perhaps. But it's certainly true that science hasn't found an explanation.
To argue that because science hasn't found evidence of a Creator, is presumptuous.
And you haven't addressed the
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For example, has science explained why physical constants are what they are?
You are correct, science has not explained that. Which makes it not a process for which we have enough evidence to understand with reasonable scientific confidence. If you have experiments to propose to help us understand more about the process which made the physical constants what they are, you will be making a valuable contribution.
And you haven't addressed the scientific evidence that we DO have, that every action has a cause. The Big Bang had to have a cause, the first instance of mitosis had to have a cause. You can't just shrug your shoulders and say "well, we don't know yet how these things happened all by themselves, but we have faith that they did, and that no creator was involved." That's not science, that's religion.
Sure I've addressed it. I've said that we don't know what the cause is. I've said that a creator may or may not have been involved, but so far we have no evidence that the
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Just a lack of matter, space and time
That sounds pretty much like "nothing" to me!
Re: At what age do they become atheists? (Score:2)
That 'creator' myth is totally superfluous to the Big Bang theory. As it is to anything, just an extra complication that needs explaining really.
Also, you might want to revise that Big Bang theory with some reading on Eternal Inflation, which is the predominant current model. We call it the Inflationary Hot Big Bang model. It made, amongst others, predictions for the 1/100.000 density fluctuations in the CMB even before the CMB was detected.
So, what predictions does that deity fairy myth make that we can go
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That 'creator' myth is totally superfluous to the Big Bang theory
This is your belief, your faith. You have no scientific basis for this belief.
There *is* scientific evidence that every thing has a cause, and that every creation has a creator. If you see a work of art, you can be scientifically certain that there was a creator somewhere, even if all you saw was the finished artwork.
"Eternal inflation" is not widely accepted by physicists. One major problem is entropy. If inflation has been occurring since eternity past, entropy would have caused all matter to devolve into
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There's several problems with that. The first is the assumption that anything exists at all.
We can readily imagine a set of virtual particle pairs. These pairs exist only mathematically. If you separate those pairs, say in Hawking Radiation, then the particles are regarded as real. However, if you recombined them, since the particles haven't been altered, they must still collide and produce nothing.
Physicists seem confident that there was a period of FTL expansion of space. This would separate any virtual p
Re: At what age do they become atheists? (Score:4, Interesting)
Freshman year in high school there was a classmate of mine who still believed in Santa. The other boys found out and just literally ruined his entire worldview in the span of a few minutes in a brutal fashion. He literally ran crying out of the classroom. So yeah, it happens.
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I feel like at that point the kids parents are just setting them up for social failure.
Re:At what age do they become atheists? (Score:5, Interesting)
I saw this and thought it was a great way to bridge the Santa gap.
Son: "Dad, I think I'm old enough now. Is there a Santa Claus?."
Dad: "Ok, I agree that your old enough. But before I tell you, I have a question for you. You see, the "truth" is a dangerous gift. Once you know something, you can't unknow it. Once you know the truth about Santa Claus, you will never again understand and relate to him as you do now. So my question is: Are you sure you want to know?"
Brief pause...
Son: "Yes, I want to know"
Dad: "Ok, I'll tell you: Yes there is a Santa Claus"
Son: "Really?"
Dad: Yes, really, but he's not an old man with a beard in a red suit. That's just what we tell kids. You see, kids are too young to understand the true nature of Santa Claus, so we explain it to them in a way that they can understand. The truth about Santa Claus is that he's not a person at all; he's an idea. Think of all those presents Santa gave you over the years. I actually bought those myself. I watched you open them. And did it bother me that you didn't thank me? Of course not! In fact it gave me great pleasure. You see, Santa Claus is THE IDEA OF GIVING FOR THE SAKE OF GIVING, without thought of thanks or acknowledgement.
When I saw that woman collapse on the subway last week and called for help, I knew that she'd never know that it was me that summoned the ambulance. I was being Santa Claus when I did that."
Son: "Oh."
Dad: "So now that you know, you're part of it. You have to be Santa Claus too now. That means you can never tell a young kid the secret, and you have to help us select Santa presents for them, and most important, you have to look for opportunities to help people. Got it?"
Son: "Yeah, I understand."
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Just. Fucking. Brilliant! Thanks for sharing that.
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Interesting. Not true in any way, but a neat bit of writing.
Truth is people love lying to kids, for some reason it makes them happy. Santa Claus is the least of it, and it breaks little kids brains, making them think they live in a world where things don't make sense and invisible spirits wander about doing things. Nasty business.
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Re: At what age do they become atheists? (Score:3, Interesting)
Even though my parents were believers, I can recall as early as 5 saying that god was fake (along with Santa) and having the other kids doing the ol "ummmm...I'm telling on you!" I always wonder how the conversation with the teacher went, because I never got so much as a talking to, but the other kids seemed absolutely certain that I would be punished for it.
Still to this day I hear from derps, even here on slashdot, who say shit like "well Jesus was a socialist and a vegetarian you know" as if I gave a fly
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Re: At what age do they become atheists? (Score:3)
Except that wasnâ(TM)t about communal living. They were temporarily in a place together, SOLD and PURCHASED (implying participating in open markets) property both amongst each other and others in order to donate towards the poor.
The text implies they only sold extra property, that it was voluntary and not compulsory and it was temporary for the duration of the event, like a mission in modern churches often you get together with other people, live and sleep together, maybe sell some stuff to participate
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FTFY
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Based on the information we have it's unhealthy to be an atheist.
According to some interesting recent research, this is most true if you're poor: National religiosity eases the psychological burden of poverty [pnas.org]
Oh, strength (Score:2)
Oh, yes. As evidenced by the (8 major) crusades, witch burnings, the Scopes trial, blood libel, pograms, jihads, blue laws, censorship, the organized subjugation of women, 9/11, financial parasitism, general scientific repression, inquisitions...
But yeah, sure. Religion "strengthens our minds." [sigh]
Fools! (Score:3)
Santa still fills my stocking every Christmas, and my kid still believes, too. People ask how he can visit so may homes? It's because so many people don't believe in him, he only has to visit a few.
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Wise adults know the truth (Score:2)
Back in the days between the invention of the telegraph and the invention of the airplane, when news was still printed in newspapers, at least one child began to doubt the truth about Santa Claus.
On her father's advise, she wrote a letter to the editor of local newspaper.
The wise editor responded [wikisource.org]:
Is There a Santa Claus?
We take pleasure in answering at once and thus prominently the communication below, expressing at the same time our great gratification that its faithful author is numbered among the friends of The Sun:
"Dear Editor: I am 8 years old.
"Some of my little friends say there is no Santa Claus.
"Papa says 'If you see it in The Sun it's so.'
"Please tell me the truth: is there a Santa Claus?
"Virginia O'Hanlon.
"115 West Ninety-fifth street."
Virginia, your little friends are wrong. They have been affected by the skepticism of a skeptical age. They do not believe except they see. They think that nothing can be which is not comprehensible by their little minds. All minds, Virginia, whether they be men's or children's, are little. In this great universe of ours man is a mere insect, an ant, in his intellect, as compared with the boundless world about him, as measured by the intelligence capable of grasping the whole of truth and knowledge.
Yes, Virginia, there is a Santa Claus. He exists as certainly as love and generosity and devotion exist, and you know that they abound and give to your life its highest beauty and joy. Alas! how dreary would be the world if there were no Santa Claus. It would be as dreary as if there were no Virginias. There would be no childlike faith then, no poetry, no romance to make tolerable this existence. We should have no enjoyment, except in sense and sight. The eternal light with which childhood fills the world would be extinguished.
Not believe in Santa Claus! You might as well not believe in fairies! You might get your papa to hire men to watch in all the chimneys on Christmas Eve to catch Santa Claus, but even if they did not see Santa Claus coming down, what would that prove? Nobody sees Santa Claus, but that is no sign that there is no Santa Claus. The most real things in the world are those that neither children nor men can see. Did you ever see fairies dancing on the lawn? Of course not, but that's no proof that they are not there. Nobody can conceive or imagine all the wonders there are unseen and unseeable in the world.
You may tear apart the baby's rattle and see what makes the noise inside, but there is a veil covering the unseen world which not the strongest man, nor even the united strength of all the strongest men that ever lived, could tear apart. Only faith, fancy, poetry, love, romance, can push aside that curtain and view and picture the supernal beauty and glory beyond. Is it all real? Ah, Virginia, in all this world there is nothing else real and abiding.
No Santa Claus! Thank God! he lives, and he lives forever. A thousand years from now, Virginia, nay, ten times ten thousand years from now, he will continue to make glad the heart of childhood.
Wise men and women still know the truth. Yes, Virginia, there is a Santa Claus.
I don't remember any figurehead (Score:2)
from my childhood. I do remember the costumes but don't remember it being any sort of reality beyond dress-up.
It seems to me it's all about how the parents play it.
Same as I don't remember ever thinking the story of Christ was ever anything other than just another fairy-tail.
All just a bit of fun at the end of the year. Summer time = seven weeks off school.
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On the other hand, maybe I've just forgotten.
interviewed 48 six- to 15-year-olds? (Score:2)
interviewed 48 six- to 15-year-olds
How exactly is just 5 kids in each age group (6 age categories) even statistically significant?
Some children will figure it out before the age 6, so not even all the age groups are represented. I can remember as far back as being in my crib, but I can't ever remember a time where I was ever believing in Santa. Yes, I received toys, but they never appeared by magic. They appeared when my parents were around but I was for some reason intentionally made to be absent at the time.
Meh (Score:3)
A friend lost her partner to overdose when her son was 5 and yes, it was around the holiday period. Our school years commence in January, so he started primary school a few weeks later for the first time. And he went around the school proclaiming to his new classmates how he had lost his dad and he was the only child of a single mother.
The lesson is that that's pretty mature for a 5 year old turning 6 - they are perfectly capable of accepting reality without mythology of flying reindeer.
That and here it's summer - carols about sleigh bells and snow when it's 35 degree C heat, for Rudolph's sake.
Some people believe there are billions of children (Score:3)
Reasoning is clearly overrated. To quote Dr. Lexus: "Don't worry scro'! There are plenty of 'tards out there living really kick ass lives. My first wife was 'tarded. She's a pilot now."
Fun game to pretend (Score:2)
Santa and Hus reindeer - it's a fun game to pretend with your kids.
Actually lying to them about it, and making them feel bad when they start to question the lies? Gaslighting your kids? That's psychological abuse.
Another brilliant .... (Score:3)
No doubt the results will be easily reproduced and the conclusions strictly falsifiable.
Be honest with children. (Score:2)
I don't understand the idea about lying to children about Santa. So as soon as "he" came up we told our two boys that modern Santa was made up and mum and dad buy your presents. So be good!
However, I did explain the origin of the Saint Nicholas story and the idea of giving as important.
Wait what? (Score:2)
He isn’t real?
Careful What You Say... (Score:2)
I was watching Harry Potter with my 7 year old, and he became scared of Dobbie the House Elf(?)
Don't worry, I said, elves don't exist. They're just in this film.
But what about Santa's elves, he replied.
I had to row back pretty quickly on that one!
In general, I think that children stop believing in Santa sooner than we think, but they play along with us, because they think that if they stop believing in Santa then the presents might stop too!
Re: (Score:3)
I think that children stop believing in Santa sooner than we think, but they play along with us, because they think that if they stop believing in Santa then the presents might stop too!
This is certainly true in my family and I think in general as well . We let the kids in on it and let one of the younger play Santa to "fool" the adults and it's always worked a treat.
The day you learn Santa doesn't exist (Score:4, Insightful)
is also the day you learn your parents have lied to you.
I don't remember this day fondly. That's why I always told my children the truth about Christmas: it's a cute, made-up tradition.
Conspiracy theory (Score:2)
There is this secret organization at the north pole with ultra-fast invisible stealth aircraft capable of distributing a million tons of packages without annoying the neighbors or blocking the sideways. This organization invites children to secretly communicate with them to bribe them into obedience by chocolate and gifts.
While most adults... (Score:2)
While most adults have fallen for the myth that Santa doesn't exist
Is it just me or is this saying that most adults believe, incorrectly, that Santa does not exist?
Hmm. (Score:2)
screw the other data or lower outliers (Score:2)
15? I want more indepth studies about how those individuals think that the world works, like how mcdonalds sources their food, does it matter if you have nike's or adidas, is pinky and the brain a documentary etc.
We need a followup study (Score:2)
I'm genuinely curious if "long-Santa-believing" kids grow up to be more susceptible to frauds, phishing and scams than their skeptical counterparts.
A Dictionary for Christmas Did It (Score:2)
at what age (Score:3)
But at what age do children become climate skeptics? Seems to be well above 50.
Only interesting if you want to brainwash children (Score:2)
The cold heart fact is if your kid is the last one in the school to believe in Santa Claus, then you have totally, utterly failed as a parent, While the first kid in your kids class to not believe in Santa has parents that have been the most successful.
The cold, hard fact is only parents that want to brainwash their kids or keep them easily manipulated, only really care about this data. And so from a parent's perspective, you should be trying to train your kid to not believe in Santa Claus as early of an ag
Re: Trump was right (Score:2)
Re: (Score:3)
It's not a lie. Children of a certain age are unable to distinguish between reality and make-believe. You can see this by playing peek-a-boo. When they cover their eyes you no longer exist. When they uncover them you have reappeared. That is magic! At a certain age they learn that when you walk out of the room you have not ceased to exist. With enough trust they believe you will return. At another age they learn that the cartoon characters on TV are not "alive" and that their stuffed animals are diff
Re: Trump was right (Score:3, Insightful)
"Children of a certain age are unable to distinguish between reality and make-believe."
Even many adults have that problem! They believe in a god that has no proof of existence.
Re: (Score:3)
Believing in Santa is a prerequisite for believing in a god. Gotta mold those minds early. I look forward to the day when believing in sky beings becomes something skeptical at a certain age too (the earlier the better).
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
So they start to disbelieve around eight years old, eh?
Looks like Trump was right:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?... [youtube.com]
Ah yes, TDS strikes again [imgur.com].