Israel Says Fourth Vaccine Dose Brings 2X Protection Against Omicron Infection, 3X Against Serious Illness - For Those Over 60 (timesofisrael.com) 311
Friday the results of several large studies showed that getting a third Covid vaccine "booster shot" dramatically decreased infections from the Omicron variant.
And now the Times of Israel reports that the country's Health Ministry "said on Sunday that the fourth vaccine dose for those aged 60 and up offers a threefold protection against serious illness and twofold protection against infection in the current wave driven by the Omicron variant." The ministry said the figures are the result of initial analysis by experts from various leading academic and health institutions, and compares the fourth vaccine with those who received three doses at least four months ago.
The figures are based on 400,000 Israelis who received the fourth vaccine and 600,000 who received three doses, with the ministry stressing that the methodology is similar to previous papers the experts have published in the peer-reviewed New England Journal of Medicine.
And now the Times of Israel reports that the country's Health Ministry "said on Sunday that the fourth vaccine dose for those aged 60 and up offers a threefold protection against serious illness and twofold protection against infection in the current wave driven by the Omicron variant." The ministry said the figures are the result of initial analysis by experts from various leading academic and health institutions, and compares the fourth vaccine with those who received three doses at least four months ago.
The figures are based on 400,000 Israelis who received the fourth vaccine and 600,000 who received three doses, with the ministry stressing that the methodology is similar to previous papers the experts have published in the peer-reviewed New England Journal of Medicine.
Pwn the libs by dying of covid. (Score:5, Funny)
Nothing pwns the libs like dying of a preventable illness while repeating right wing misinformation which in turn kills your friends, family and neighbors.
Anti-Vaxxer self-genocide is the best thing Fox News has ever done.
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Takes some effort to die of an illness with well below 1% mortality. You have to walk in front of the train while having it to be sure.
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IFR has never been 2%.
Mortality usually means CFR, not IFR. IFR is always a guess.
Masking, vaccines and boosters had no effect on IFR. Omicron finally did though.
Masking, vaccines, and boosters delayed the overwhelming majority of cases long enough that most people will get omicron instead of an earlier, deadlier variant. That alone would be a HUGE reduction in IFR when averaged over the course of the pandemic, even before you count all of the people who were exposed to COVID in spite of the mitigations, but survived the exposure because of the mitigations.
Re:Pwn the libs by dying of covid. (Score:4, Interesting)
We've taken to calling them "Superspreader rallies" in australia.
Because unfortunately they where largely responsible for the failure of the last major lockdown in Victoria. The levels where lowish, and starting to get under control, when suddenly there was a series of 5000-10,000 person anti mask and anti vaccine rallies, which ended up leading to thousands of cases and seeding Delta across the state.
For a state that had already been through so much, its almost a surprise that there wasn't serious violence directed at the antivaxers for their shitful actions that triggered an ultimately failed (because on an almost weekly basis after that unmasked psychos gathered and basically attacked people , fought with cops and trashed things all state causing a rolling superspreader event that continued to thwart mitigation attempts.
For most australians we have been bamboozled as to why police where so light with these people. They kept breaking the laws, engaged in violence, even attempted to burn down parliment house. They where constantly violating health orders and directly caused tens of thousands of cases. And yet largely the police stood by and let it happen.
Probably the salt in the wound was a disinformation campaign started in the US that spread all sorts of mad lies about how police where going door to door, painted arrests of violent extremists as oppression, and for the most part just made shit up about us. It brought back painful memories of the disinformation campaign about australia in the 1990s when american gun lobbyists concocted fabricated data and invented stories about how the gun buyback had somehow led to an increase in crimes and "Civil violence". You can defame a person it seems, but you cant defame a country. At least not in the eyes of the courts. Oh well.
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Was it? Are you a fool, too? Do you think the vaccine is unsafe? Is it going to give you 5G reception?
What is your story, my friend?
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Was it? Are you a fool, too? Do you think the vaccine is unsafe? Is it going to give you 5G reception?
What is your story, my friend?
That's a new one for the list:
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If the government or Bill Gates or Dr Fauci or Joe Biden or Rachel Maddow or Hillary Clinton or Jeffrey Epstein say it is safe, it is safe.
This is the problem you have. Do you think those people are the only ones you can get information from? Why would you think that? Have you ever heard of doing your own research?
Maybe you have heard of that, but you don't know how to do it. That's unfortunate. If you don't understand statistics, the world is a confusing place. Maybe that is what happened to you.
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Have you ever heard of doing your own research?
Don't tell them that! They think "research" involves looking at facebook memes and scouring mommy blogs for horse paste recipes.
The people chanting "do your own research" are the same ones drinking their own urine between bouts of industrial bleach while waiting for dead politicians to rise from the grave. Their "research" lead them to believe that the military executed the Clintons, Bill Gates, and Obama on TFG's orders and the only reason we see them alive is because the "deep state" replaced therm with
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They need to learn how to do proper research. I will never discourage someone who wants to put effort in.
Re: Pwn the libs by dying of covid. (Score:4, Interesting)
I didn't know how to do proper research until grad school. I thought I did though, and that's pretty dangerous when you're making life-and-death decisions.
The trouble with autodidacts is that they can't know what it is that they don't know and they have no way to evaluate their understanding of the things they do know about.
Even for the educated, it's completely unreasonable to expect people to become experts in everything that affects their lives. That's why we have experts and specialists, after all. It's not even that we need to trust experts, it's that we must as a practical matter.
I told a story here once about a woman who was taking a drivers safety course online. She was a high school graduate of ordinary intelligence in her late 50's. She wasn't a reader, and it became clear almost immediately that she wasn't reading at even a 6th grade level. The course was designed to take 4-5 hours, but it took her about six weeks, spending 1-3 hours a day on it ~2 days a week.
It would be unreasonable and unfair to ask her to do her own research.
No, the best thing to encourage people to do is to put their faith in properly credentialed expects.
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You'll be stone dead in a moment.
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They are out there... (Score:5, Funny)
A co-worker who is anti-vax to the max finally got covid. He claimed that he is glad he caught the virus because now he is immune and he doesn't have to worry about the negative long-term effects of the vaccine. A little later in the conversation he admitted he still has Covid fog from his infection of several months ago. No kidding
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Re: They are out there... (Score:2)
What happens to cells infected/invaded by viral carrier and mRNA vaccines? Slightly different magnitude of course compared to actual illness, but the mere fact it kills cells is a poor argument.
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Hugely different magnitude because neither replicates.
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>You don't know.
If you don't understand how mRNA works. But if you paid attention in school, you will know.
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Man. Something like that could cost you a trip to the NFC Championship game.
Re:They are out there... (Score:5, Informative)
According to my MD, natural immunity lasts about three months while vaccine immunity lasts eight months. She has unvaccinated patients who have caught Covid three times while still believing that natural immunity alone woul protect them.
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Sure, he's immune... for around 18 months!
Then he'll need a "booster" infection.
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Sounds a bit like the anti-vaxxer wife of my cousin. She got covid and from accounts I heard, despite being young and healthy, did not exactly have an easy time. Now, 2 months later she says it was "like a strong cold". Then she adds the "only" issue is that she still has no sense of smell... :facepalm:
Yeah, remember those bad colds that left you without one of your senses for months? It's like that.
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Re:They are out there... (Score:5, Informative)
"Chicken pox would like a word with you on that."
If you had chicken pox as a kid, you still have chicken pox. Its just that the immune system has managed to herd it away from the usual places it causes damage. Well usually, sometimes, particualrly when the immune system is suppressed it can reemerge and cause shingles.
Thats why you don't get it again, because you already have it.
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It is a different virus. Being "immune" varies from virus to virus. And also greatly by the method of vaccination - or gab between two to four shots
Re:They are out there... (Score:5, Informative)
> for the exact same reason vaccine resistance wanes over time
No, one is about anitgen mutations vs. conserved regions while the other is about general senescence of memory B cells, which seems to respond weakly for all betacorona viruses and standard mB hyperdifferentiation isn't all that helpful with this class.
T-cell immunity from SARS-1 nucleocapsid proteins has shown cross-reactivity with sc2 more than twelve years on.
There is some evidence that only N and E reactive T-cells from Delta infections will attack Omicron but there is contradictory information on that as well.
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Just so we're clear here. Science doesn't judge expertise on how many likes or subscriptions a youtuber gets. You. cant scream facts into existance.
And just to be further clear, we are not "experimenting with mRNA vaccines", those "experiments" where done almost two years ago in some of the largest stage 3 trials in history.
And
Re: They are out there... (Score:2)
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And just to be further clear, we are not "experimenting with mRNA vaccines", those "experiments" where done almost two years ago in some of the largest stage 3 trials in history.
Rotarix had 80k people in its phase 3 trial
Prevnar 49k
Both far more than Pfizer's 37k and Moderna's 30k
The experiment never ends in much the same way there is never a release quality build of Windows. Case in point myocarditis signals were found separately after the trials had concluded. Safety and effectiveness data is constantly being evaluated.
Re: They are out there... (Score:4, Interesting)
>Case in point myocarditis signals were found separately after the trials had concluded.
And they are now known to be due to medical practitioners hitting a blood vessel when injecting the rona shot. If they bothered to aspirate the incidence of myocarditis would be largely eliminated - yes, that study was done. This is standard practice in some places, but certainly not where I live. Sophistry and flawed reasoning was used to justify not doing it when the data says otherwise. That is how the medical practitioner in my family explained it to me.
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How often are these vaccines being administered improperly?
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The same long term effects can be found in those taking the vaccines for this.
Liar Liar, Pants On Fire, Hanging From a Telephone Wire!
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There is absolutely no evidence of any brain anything associated with covid vaccination.
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Well for a start, you can't get that from the vaccine.
We know that because we have data from literally billions of vaccinations, and the largest 3rd stage trials we've ever done.
And the good news is as follows ;-
1) The vaccine does not cause long term (In vaccine terms this means "a few months") side effects. Whatever could go wrong, in the few-in-a-million chance something does, is immediate and it goes away.
and
2) If your vaccinated you have a. *much* lower chance of contracting it, passing it to others, a
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We know that because we have data from literally billions of vaccinations, and the largest 3rd stage trials we've ever done.
Not even close. Other trials have had more than twice the number of phase three participants.
Screw that (Score:3, Insightful)
It also means the west, but when you have so many idiots that refuse to take it, well....
Re:Screw that (Score:5, Informative)
Neither did the smallpox vaccine or the Polio vaccine, both of which had significantly lower efficacy (And in the case of polio required up to 5 booster shots).
And yet they eventually wiped out the disease. Polio still has a small population of cases, but its entirely a case of certain populations (notably in the more war torn parts of afghanistan and pakistan) unable to access the vaccine.
And it succeeded despite the low efficacy. We have no good reason to believe covid will be any different. Well other than the fact we have a huge population of people who refuse to get vaccinated.
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The data says that clean water and sanitation were wiping out polio long before the vaccine was introduced.
https://archive.is/gsW3b [archive.is]
Similar success stories of other vaccines appear to be overblown as well. Here is measles in Australia:
https://archive.is/wip/UoOxT [archive.is]
And yes, I do know that the first chart is showing deaths instead of cases, and that deaths and cases had largely become uncoupled even before 1923. The polio story is actually pretty complicated, and well worth leaning more about. The running deb
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Or perhaps you're reading the charts wrong. The first chart was specifically polio causing paralysis. The second showed polio infections (including those that did not cause paralysis) and deaths.
Both charts show a sharp decline after the introduction of the vaccine.
Note that (lack of) sanitation wasn't a big issue in the first world, but polio was.
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On the contrary, clean water and sanitation may have contributed to the polio epidemic in the first place. As fewer infants were being exposed to the virus at a young age, the population as a whole became more susceptible. [nih.gov]
Before the twentieth century, poor hygiene and sanitation meant that almost all children were exposed to poliovirus during infancy, which enabled natural immunity to build up in populations.
Over 90% of people infected with poliovirus have either no or very mild symptoms, which can easily go unrecognized
That is not to say that exposing infants to polio is a good idea, even though they're generally less vulnerable [nih.gov] to the worst effects, infant mortality at the time was not very good
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Killing smallpox took the combined effort of the USSR and the USA to vaccinate the whole world.
Sands of one week of time (Score:3)
Just last week...
"We see an increase in antibodies, higher than after the third dose,â Regev-Yochay said. âoeHowever, we see many infected with Omicron who received the fourth dose. Granted, a bit less than in the control group, but still a lot of infections,â she added."
https://www.timesofisrael.com/... [timesofisrael.com]
Has now become:
"The Health Ministry said on Sunday that the fourth vaccine dose for those aged 60 and up offers a threefold protection against serious illness and twofold protection against infection in the current wave driven by the Omicron variant."
https://www.timesofisrael.com/... [timesofisrael.com]
When there is a peer reviewed study let me know.
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"The ministry also said the fourth dose, or second booster, made people over 60 twice as resistant to infection than those in the age group who received three shots of the vaccine."
https://www.reuters.com/world/... [reuters.com]
Vax little to no help against Omricon (Score:2, Informative)
Queensland Australia had a zero covid policy until the beginning of this year.
This means no community immunity, only vaccination for prevention. About 88% of 12+ double vaccinated reasonably recently + boosters underway.
The ultimate test is death rate, so what are the results.
Of the 73% of the total population at least double vaccinated, 2,3 times vaccinated individuals were involved in 74% of deaths.
With 300,000 reported cases (estimates put actual infections at up to 3 times that), 11 people under 60 hav
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Well, of course. Older and unhealthy people are more likely to get vaccinated because they recognize the virus is more dangerous for them. If there are roughly equal percentages of deaths in the vaccinated and unvaccinated populations (73% vs 74%), that goes to show that the downside of being old has been offset by the upside of getting the vaccine. Which is of course a point in favor of the vaccine.
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I don't really see any point in vaccination
You don't see any point in vaccination when quoting numbers of hospitalisation from a region that is 89.2% fully vaccinated? https://www.qld.gov.au/health/... [qld.gov.au] I think you don't understand how this works.
But no the ultimate test is not death rate. The ultimate test is impact on society. That involves not cancelling elective surgeries because hospitals are overwhelmed. That involves not cancelling flights because your flight crew is at home sick. It involves no having to close your restaurants because your st
100 doses (Score:4, Funny)
Just imagine what 100 doses will do!!
That's some bs (Score:4, Insightful)
We all got Omicron in the family, identical symptoms regardless of number and timing of shots - basically like a cold, lots of congestion and fatigue but no fever. Everyone in schools also got it, same deal. This is a heavily vaccinated county. Severity reduction - quite possible, impossible to tell what each individual case would have been like without vaccination. But nothing really stops this bug. Maybe the trials completed just a few weeks after booster was administered or participants were super cautious, staying home and wearing N95s everywhere? Not going to hold up in a real world where we can't keep getting boosters every two weeks or living in bubblewrap.
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Maybe the trials completed just a few weeks after booster was administered or participants were super cautious, staying home and wearing N95s everywhere?
In phase-123 trials they compare infection rates between the vaccinated group and a control group. The control group typically gets a non-covid vaccine that will also produce some side effects so that it is hard for the participant to guess to which group they belong.
In studies (not trials) there is indeed a risk of confounding variables, although they can control for that to some extent, for example by comparing in-household transmissions. I didn't read the Israel study though. But generally I'd expect peo
Where is the data? (Score:2)
From what I can tell, here's what they seem to be saying in this article.
1) If you haven't had a shot in 4 months, the high level of anti-bodies in your body is about 1/2 to 1/3 the level of someone whose body recently produced high levels of antibodies. This means that rather than concluding that the vaccine is only effective for less than four months.
2) The trials are being run with a VERY large sample set across many age groups du
Where do I sign up? (Score:2)
OAZ jabs in January and march 2021, Pfizer booster in October 2021. It's probably not time for me to get the next one but, not being stupid, I will take whatever people who actually know about this stuff advise.
If immunologists, doctors and other scientists advise me to have another booster in a few months, and conservatives and pretend newspapers advise me not to, I will get the booster. This will lower my chances of...
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That's nice. None of that's particularly relevant, though.
The real question is: what are you prepared to force someone else to do?
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Yet you're looking at it in a vacuum.
You're only looking at "fixes COVID".
You're not looking at "what can the jab do to me BESIDES help me fight COVID"?
You're just fluffing off clotting, pericarditis, etc.
All for an increasingly infinitesimal bump in resistance.
If someone offered you something that made you immune to every disease on the planet, but you stood a 33% chance of developing a cerebral aneurysm at some point in the near future, would you REALLY just plonk your arm down and go "GIMME GIMME GIMME"?
Duration and absolute value. (Score:2)
Do they know how long this protection supposedly lasts?
And X is 50% better than Y is utterly meaningless.
Because they're talking about a relative calculation. Where tiny improvements are expressed as large numbers.
You need to know what the absolute values are first.
Because if your chances are 99.999%, and the improvement kicks you to 99.9999% AND comes with its own medical risks?
Now is when SENSIBLE people sit back and perform a value calculation.
Only idiots try to "better deal" themselves in such an ignor
Re: For how long? (Score:2)
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Negative efficiency was a problem specific to AZ's Vaxzevria. Israel vaccinates with Pfizer's Comirnaty. So that doesn't apply at least as far as we know.
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There are two well documented mechanisms. One is misdirection/canalization of the immune system of the kind we observed during mass polio vaccinations of 1960s, where in at least one documented case vaccine made infections worse when another polio variant popped up in the same area. Hypothesis as to why as far as I know is that vaccine generated antibodies were not very well suitable for fighting the new variant, but immune system mischaracterised the infection as the old variant it was inoculated against i
Re:A very short time (Score:5, Interesting)
https://penntoday.upenn.edu/ne... [upenn.edu]
“Our findings suggest that once T cells become exhausted, they remain fundamentally ‘wired’ to be exhausted—thus it may be hard to get them to become effective virus- and cancer-fighters again,”
Does this mean chronic exposure to the vaccine (and real exposure) will result in T-Cell exhaustion. At some point won't these people's immune system be so overworked that a common cold will take them out?
Re: A very short time (Score:2)
It seems to me it's simple antibody load which offers protection at this point and immune system recognition is becoming almost irrelevant.
Ignoring the cost it would seem better to just inject antibodies at that point than trying to hack the immune system every three months as an antibody factory in the absence of disease. Google tells me half life of antibodies is a month.
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Does this mean chronic exposure to the vaccine (and real exposure) will result in T-Cell exhaustion. At some point won't these people's immune system be so overworked that a common cold will take them out?
Seems pretty unlikely, since this doesn't happen for endemic diseases for which people receive regular inoculations, like influenza. That article seems to be for continual, long-term conditions, like a Hepatitis C infection, or cancer.
Re:They only talk about relative risk reduction (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:They only talk about relative risk reduction (Score:5, Informative)
REAL SCENARIO:
Unvaxinated rate of hospitalisation for >= 18 50-100 in 100,000
Vaxinated rate of hospitalisation >= 18 2-4 in 100,000
But, it gets better.
Lets look at the covid deaths in terms of vaccinated vs not. [cdc.gov]
Unvaxinated rate of covid dead for >= 18 9 in 100,000
Vaxinated rate of covid dead >= 18
Now, how many have died from taking the vaccine???? NONE.
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Okay, I'll bite: what are these numbers for ages 0 to 50 years old?
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I know I'll draw ire for this but 9 in 100k doesn't sounbd all that high.
I realize that the distribution leans heavily towards patients sixty or older but still... Kinda hard to explain to anti vaxxers why EVERYONE should be as scared as the media wants them to be over covid.
The goal posts have been moved a lot in this discussion. I certainly can't blame anyone for being wary of what media and governments tell them...
Personally I'm glad I have the capacity to understand a bit beyond the most basic biology a
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I have a better solution than playing a numbers game. Instead of running hypothetical numbers, why don't we just look at the number of times in the past 3 weeks reports have surfaced of elective surgery being cancelled due to lack of hospital resources, or flights being cancelled due to lack of staff who failed their COVID test, or hospitality staff being unavailable due to illness.
We don't need to play a numbers game to question if society is functioning correctly. It's evidentially not.
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You were doing so well until you decided to lie.
He's not entirely wrong. There are no deaths attributed to Pfizer/Moderna vaccines and 1 death attributed to J&J.
Re: They only talk about relative risk reduction (Score:2)
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There has been more then 1 death due to blood clotting, but the vaccines are generally very safe.
That being said, there is an inherent risk associated with burdening your immune system. As such, there is risk associated with all vaccines. It is just that the risk tends to be very minor and always significantly less then the disease. So when you have a virus that is very rare, taking a vaccine for it might not be worth it. But when you have something like the Omicron strain, where there is a very high
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There has been more then 1 death due to blood clotting, but the vaccines are generally very safe.
The deaths "due to" blood clotting "caused by" vaccination are literally less than the number of deaths due to blood clotting that you would expect in the given cohort without vaccination. If the anti-vaxxers aren't willing to count people who died from covid because they had confounding factors, I'm not willing to count people who died from blood clotting when there's as much evidence that a vaccine reduces clotting deaths as that it causes them.
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And a few hundred to AZ.
Re: They only talk about relative risk reduction (Score:2)
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>Demanding accurate statistics and data does not make someone an "anti-vaxxer" as the "vaccine bullies" want you to believe.
It actually does, because under public pressure, several english language dictionaries redefined the meaning of former to also include anyone who is arguing against forced mass vaccinations. And definitionally, if you ask for more information, you're arguing against forced mass vaccinations, because you're arguing that there may be something questionable about vaccines.
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I have not heard this discussion in any mainstream media releases or press releases from any heads of state.
Because the more important absolute risk is the risk of reducing primary care due to overloaded hospitals. I get it, with your UID you're probably a millennial with a 2 minute attention span and thus can't remember a time when COVID was causing hospitals to turn away elective surgery due to lack of beds.
https://www.reuters.com/world/... [reuters.com] Or a time when the airline industry was cancelling flights due to their staff all being sick. https://edition.cnn.com/2022/0... [cnn.com]. Or a time when it is hard to get staff in
Re:Nope (Score:5, Informative)
Got two shots, one unofficial booster, and one official booster. Sounds stupid, but the only downside is a bit of aches the next day. Definitely far less of a price to pay than getting C-19 and risking being put on a ventilator.
I date a county coroner. During the Delta spike, and the current Omicron spike, she had no vaccinated people die from COVID, in her morgue. The people who were filling up the fridge trailers (yes... trailers had to be brought in to handle the sheer number of stiffs) were all unvaccinated people. In general, vaccinated people hit a hospital due to dehydration, get an IV, and get sent home. Unvaxxed are the ones on the ventilators, or taking up fridge space.
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What is an "unofficial booster"?
Is it some kind of black market thing, or maybe you received a dose in a foreign country.
I never heard about such a thing in developed countries. I have heard of people who "cut in line" for an official shot, or on the opposite, get a fake vaccine, but no "unofficial shot".
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It's the same kind of a meme as people dying in the morgue.
Re:Nope (Score:5, Funny)
Sorry, STILL not getting it. Had the rona in February of 2020.
Exactly! When making important decisions I too like to consider all possible outcomes, weigh them carefully, and then makes the worst choice.
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Sorry, STILL not getting it. Had the rona in February of 2020.
Yep, long COVID unfortunately affects people's mental capacity.
Re:Natural immunity (Score:5, Insightful)
They also had a massive study showing natural immunity was better than the vaccines. It is time to grow up and let go of this stupidity.
All immunity is natural. The vaccine simply gives your body a chance to study for the test.
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If the goal is to avoid catching COVID, then vaccines have 70%-90% effectiveness, and natural immunity has 0% effectiveness.
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Grow up, it's over.
Nah. You've exposed yourself as a moron. That's not going to change, just with the virus going away.
Re: Natural immunity (Score:5, Insightful)
You keep being scared for as long as you like, I have been
You're scared of a fucking vaccine with the best safety record of any vaccine in history.
You can't whine about how scared you are of needles and also be a Macho Man at the same time, dipshit.
You're a scared child, who is projecting your fear onto others.
You know who is less scared than you? People who got vaccinated and boosted and are wearing masks.
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You know who is less scared than you? People who got vaccinated and boosted and are wearing masks.
Childish quibbles aside, is there no tolerance for people who did get vaccinated (and boosted) and are *not* wearing masks? The "-1 Troll" may or may not be anti-vax, but his stance of "it's over, move on with life" could still be valid. At this point people can choose to protect themselves or not with the highly effective and entirely safe vaccine.
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Wow, you're a fucking moron, where do you get your news, Facebook posts?
Do you have a source for your statement that Covid vaccines have "the best safety record of any vaccine in history" or not?
Mods please respect the rules of this site and read the FAQ prior to moderating. There is no -1 I hate this person or dislike their ideology or question. The moderation system is NOT analogous to social media "likes" and "dislikes". If you are unable to respect the rules please refrain from moderating.
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Do you have a brain cell?
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LOL learn how to read. I'll say it again:
If the goal is to avoid catching COVID, then vaccines have 70%-90% effectiveness, and natural immunity has 0% effectiveness.
If you don't figure it out this time, I'll show you the flaw in your logic.
Re:Natural immunity (Score:5, Insightful)
The advantage of vaccines over natural immunity is that you don't get the disease you want to prevent in the first place.
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No, you just get a outdated S protein for your immune system to see.
If you are naturally infected your immune system sees all 29 proteins.
Current mrna vaccines are next to useless at preventing infection and death with Omricon.
https://docs.google.com/spread... [google.com]
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They also had a massive study showing natural immunity was better than the vaccines. It is time to grow up and let go of this stupidity.
Obligatory XKCD [xkcd.com]
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>They also had a massive study showing natural immunity was better than the vaccines.
Define 'better'.
I'll have a go..
There are about 15 features the human immune system recognizes from a coronavirus infection since it sees the whole body of the virus.
The mRNA vaccines only trains the immune system on the spike protein.
So 'natural immunity' gave some better protection against a later Omicron infection and did the mRNA vaccines.
However the 'catch covid' plan comes with significant downsides, like death or
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Typical violent conservative.
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Works for flu shots!
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The flu shot does change from year to year.
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Appropriate, since it takes fire (or acid) to truly kill a troll.