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Medicine

WHO Blasts 'Vaccine Nationalism' in Last-Ditch Push Against Hoarding (reuters.com) 100

Posted by msmash from the tussle-continues dept.
Nations that hoard possible COVID-19 vaccines while excluding others will deepen the pandemic, World Health Organization (WHO) chief Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus said on Tuesday, issuing a last-ditch call for countries to join a global vaccine pact. From a report: The WHO has an Aug. 31 deadline for wealthier nations to join the "COVAX Global Vaccines Facility" for sharing vaccine hopefuls with developing countries. Tedros said he sent a letter to the WHO's 194 member states, urging participation. The global health agency also raised concerns that the pandemic's spread was being driven now by younger people, many of whom were unaware they were infected, posing a danger to vulnerable groups. Tedros' push for nations to join COVAX comes as the European Union, Britain, Switzerland and the United States strike deals with companies testing prospective vaccines. Russia and China are also working on vaccines, and the WHO fears national interests could impede global efforts.
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WHO Blasts 'Vaccine Nationalism' in Last-Ditch Push Against Hoarding More

WHO Blasts 'Vaccine Nationalism' in Last-Ditch Push Against Hoarding

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  • At this point the US is depending on getting a sufficiently effective vaccine or we're in for long term economic doom. Militaries have been mobilized for less.

    • At this point the US is depending on getting a sufficiently effective vaccine or we're in for long term economic doom.

      Unfortunately, a whole hell of a lot of folks in the US won't voluntarily take the vaccine, even if it was free.

      . . . and some won't take it, even if it is mandatory.

  • needs to be patent free and sold at cost (US only)

    • Re: (Score:1, Insightful)

      by ShanghaiBill ( 739463 )

      needs to be patent free and sold at cost (US only)

      So the best way to get a vaccine quickly is to remove all the incentives for producing one?

      • Re:needs to be patent free and sold at cost (US on (Score:5, Insightful)

        by mustafap ( 452510 ) on Tuesday August 18, 2020 @02:44PM (#60415679) Homepage

        >So the best way to get a vaccine quickly is to remove all the incentives for producing one?

        I know nothing about you but I bet my guess that you live in america is spot on.

      • You can't think of ANY other possible motives except profit? Not one?

        • Re: (Score:3)

          by DogDude ( 805747 )
          Some people literally live their entire lives for money, and cannot even imagine another motivator for anything in life.

        • Re: (Score:1, Insightful)

          by guruevi ( 827432 )

          A gun to your head is a motivator, but the Soviets still needed to steal the research from the US in order not to get shot or end up in the Gulag.

          I wonder what motivator drives you, profit and the freedom to pursue your own happiness, or a gun to your head in some form or another (taxes, government mandates, ...)

          • Re: (Score:2, Flamebait)

            by spun ( 1352 )

            Profit is not the same as the freedom to pursue your own happiness, you know. In fact, it is not even the same as getting paid. Profit is what is left over after you pay expenses, including pay. Thought a capitalist fanatic like you would know that.

          • Re: (Score:3)

            by dryeo ( 100693 )

            You should see what Jonas Salk did, after the largest field trial in history, which I'd imagine cost money, he released his polio vaccine for free, no patents, no profit. To quote https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]

            News of the vaccine's success was first made public on April 12, 1955.[6] Salk was immediately hailed as a "miracle worker", and chose to not patent the vaccine or seek any profit from it in order to maximize its global distribution.[1] An immediate rush to vaccinate began in both the United State

            • You left part of it out

              "Who owns this patent?", Salk replied, "Well, the people I would say. There is no patent. Could you patent the sun?" The vaccine is calculated to be worth $7 billion had it been patented. However, lawyers from the National Foundation for Infantile Paralysis did look into the possibility of a patent, but ultimately determined that the vaccine was not a patentable invention because of prior art.

          • Didn't you both steal it from Germany?

        • You can't think of ANY other possible motives except profit? Not one?

          There are other motives, but money is the most effective and most reliable.

          Money is what keeps me from hitting the snooze button in the morning.

          The pandemic costs the world trillions of dollars every month. Trying to skimp on the cost of the vaccine is idiotic.

        • You can't think of ANY other possible motives except profit? Not one?

          For a for-profit company? Not really. I guess some companies live off brand value, but then when was the last time you judged a drug based on who produced it rather than if it can fix you or not.

          So no. I actually can't think of a single motive for a for-profit pharmaceutical to invest R&D without the possibility of profit at the end, and I'm guessing the OP can't either. But I'm open to your opinion on the matter. Can you think of some benefit here?

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by spun ( 1352 )

            Who said anything about vaccine development being exclusively done by for profit businesses? Thres this amazing kind of corporation, maybe you've heard of it? Called a non profit. Guess what they don't do?

            Now, guess how many vaccines under development around the world are being developed by non profits like universities and government funded research labs. And guess which vaccines are closer to being released. Now, try to imagine what happens to those for profit companies when all those non profit vaccines

            • Guess what they don't do?

              Ooooh I know this one: Invest millions of their own money in R&D to develop vaccines.

              universities and government funded research labs

              So you're saying they are funded by a 3rd party, as in they get outside cash which needs to come from somewhere. Gotchya!

              • Re: (Score:2)

                by spun ( 1352 )

                Most research is done by non-profits. Most for-profit companies, including pharmaceutical companies, don't really invest that much in R&D. They prefer to let others take the risk, while reaping the rewards. That's how capitalism works.

                You don't get to yell "gotcha" if you misunderstand a major term, it just makes you look like a complete fool. "getting outside cash" does not make anything "for profit." Profits are what is left over when salary and other expenses are paid. Almost all real research unive

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

        That's now how this will work.

        For a start a lot of the research and trials are being funded by governments anyway. When one pans out there are already orders for hundreds of millions of doses on the books. There will be a scramble to licence it so production can ramp up as fast as possible.

        Meanwhile more than half the world won't be able to afford it anyway and will be reliant on generic versions or the goodwill of richer nations subsidising it, or both. It's in the interests of developed nations to help be

    • needs to be patent free and sold at cost (US only)

      At the very least the licensing cost should be defined as fair and reasonable.

      If we estimate that a drug cost about $2.6 billion [policymed.com], then with the number of cases they should probably make their money back very quickly, if they charged $10 licensing per prescription. At the same time, I am suspecting that given the turn around time and government subsidies, it would probably have cost less that $2.6 billion to the pharmaceutical?

      • There are many potential vaccines in development, should 'the system' (however defined) reward only the winner? 'Yes!' is not a crazy answer, but then only companies with $2.6B to gamble with can play.

      • A vaccine is not really a drug in that sense.

        The basic work hardly costs more than $5 million. Yes million. Costs get piled up because of the usually long testing phase. Producing it in quantity costs next to nothing. The glass vial, the packaging information, the package, the storage and shipping and finally administering it: that is the main cost.

        I doubt vaccinating whole USA costs more than a billion.

        • A vaccine is not really a drug in that sense.

          The basic work hardly costs more than $5 million. Yes million. Costs get piled up because of the usually long testing phase. Producing it in quantity costs next to nothing. The glass vial, the packaging information, the package, the storage and shipping and finally administering it: that is the main cost.

          I doubt vaccinating whole USA costs more than a billion.

          Good point. So any licensing fees should probably be under a dollar and regulated to be so. Sometimes the good of the nation (or world) is more important than doing business as usual.

    • Our existing pharmaceutical system is currently based mostly on capitalism. It's hard to change that on a dime. Thus, some kind of compromise will probably have to be struck so that we don't have to revamp the industry to get results soon. The gov't will probably have to negotiate and select a "reasonable" profit margin. Similar has been done in war.

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by guruevi ( 827432 )

        Approximately 80% of the existing research in the world is funded by governments (NIH, NSF and NHS), capitalism doesn't have much incentive for research. Once the research is done and the unknowns are figured out, then industry can come in and do things faster and cheaper and more quickly through capitalism than any government ever could.

        That's why we'll have various vaccines in 6 months-1 year because we know how to develop a vaccine, but the billions of dollars sunk into this type of research between 1950

    • There's a much greater chance of recouping the investment if you also sell *outside* of 5% of the world's population.

    • Re: (Score:1)

      by guruevi ( 827432 )

      Cost thus far is ~$5B. Production and distribution costs are somewhere in the area of another $1B, administration probably in the area of $25/visit - so that is at least $26/person in the world, or about 1% of yearly income.

      And that is without any profits attached, without the initial investments of billions every year the NIH and NSF has already invested in Coronavirus and SARS research. and without the enormous infrastructure that simply isn't in place yet to administer in many places (add the cost of bui

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by mspohr ( 589790 )

        I got my flu shot last year outside of Costco. I can't imaging that cost $25. (I'm sure the US healthcare system can easily charge that amount but it certainly doesn't cost that much.)

        • Re: (Score:1)

          by guruevi ( 827432 )

          How much do nurses and doctors make in your mind? How long does the procedure take? How long for documentation to be filled out post-visit? Follow-up calls and questions?

    • If the government makes it then they can give it away for free or at cost. Sky high profits are only a problem if you let private enterprise have free rein on the matter.

  • The reality of all shared resource pools for "developing nations" is they act primarily as a tool for the rich across many nations to skim from.

    This would be no different, the proposed pool is to make sure wealthy people all over the globe have access to any vaccine they like no matter where the yacht(s) is/are parked.

    It seems like the thing to do would be to fund factories specifically for developing whatever vaccine seems like the best idea for whatever developing nations you chose, in those nations thems

    • Those factories already exist.
      Or what do you think from where all those vaccines are coming?

      • Those factories already exist.

        Name one third-world country that contains a vaccine factory currently.

        Oh, what's that? You didn't read my post?

        • Re: (Score:1)

          by djb ( 19374 )

          Name one third-world country that contains a vaccine factory currently.

          India is the worlds largest producer of vaccines

          • Ok, I admit that India is technically a third world country... And it looks like they have even started manufacturing promising candidates [npr.org] like other countries. In my defense, I don't really consider India third world but fair point, they really are.

            So I really should have been more clear that I was thinking more of places like Africa. Basically what I am saying is, we should be funding factories to produce vaccines in every country that does not already have them. They should be produced locally to el

        • We do not have third world countries on this planet anymore since ... uh ... roughly ... 30 year or so?
          We have dysfunctional countries like Somalia ... perhaps you want to call it third world, would make sense.
          How many countries of that kind do we have?

  • ...I guess this is a way to correct it.

  • I am not sure why we need a global vaccine pact if Russia has already shared their technology. Unless of course, the so called global project is to prevent Russia from getting any credit. Or perhaps there is something more sinister they wish to deliver as the global vaccines. This is not the era of the smallpox anymore. International agencies have proven untrustworthy.

  • Nationalism is basically a form of racism, no doubt the same part of the brain that generates racism generates nationalism. We are stuck on the same planet, if we start not caring about each other we're going to have wars and of course war is the fantasy of all nationalists since they think they are superior. Nationalism has no end-game besides war. It's inherently unstable. And when the nationalist has finished war with other nations, they will turn on their own nation to designate pariah groups.

    • You should fo on a forum, e.g. a Facebook group, about so called expats - or let's say "refugees who want to play rich in a poor country". As basically every country has it borders locked (exception inside of the EU for other EU countries) all those "nationalists" are whining that they can not go to their preferred leisure place, e.g. Thailand or Vietnam: because of lockdown and strict travel restrictions.

      Seriously, their country comes first, but that another country has the audacity to say: "our country co

  • ...Every government's primary obligations will always be to their own citizens (or in the case of less benign rulership, themselves).

  • Why would a nation even bother to hoard a vaccine at all? If you've got a population of 300,000,000 people, you need 300,000,000 doses, minus a small number to allow for people who have legitimate medical conditions such that they can't be vaccinated. But dose # 300,000,001 is useless to that same nation. And once it's available, it's not a fixed quantity that will never increase. More will continue to be produced... probably for years... so it's not like you can stash it in Ft. Knox with the notion tha

  • This is the dick that said NOTHING about China withholding all of the interesting data on sar-cov. They only released it once Australia (or was it New Zea) got a working sample.
    This asshole said NOTHING the hole time. And NOW, he is carping about this?

    I guess China paid him to speak up now.

  • As a Swede it's easy to see how this could go wrong.

    Of course they should focus on getting it to us. Also the others are plenty enough already. Many tens of millions of Europeans have died in wars.

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