Stem Cell Brain Implants Could 'Slow Aging and Extend Life,' Study Shows (theguardian.com) 116
An anonymous reader quotes a report from The Guardian: Scientists have slowed down the aging process by implanting stem cells into the brains of animals, raising hopes for new strategies to combat age-related diseases and extend the human lifespan. Implants of stem cells that make fresh neurons in the brain were found to put the brakes on aging in older mice, keeping them more physically and mentally fit for months, and extending their lives by 10-15% compared to untreated animals. The work, described as a tour de force and a breakthrough by one leading expert, suggests that aging across the body is controlled by stem cells that are found in the hypothalamus region of the brain in youth, but which steadily die off until they are almost completely absent in middle age. Researchers at Albert Einstein College of Medicine in New York hope to launch clinical trials of the procedure soon, but must first produce supplies of human neural stem cells in the lab which can be implanted into volunteers. The study has been published in the journal Nature.
I'm glad they're doing the research. (Score:5, Insightful)
But, given the population and the cost of geriatric medicine to the economy, is extending human life that much of a good idea?
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Forgot to add: when it's paid for by someone else (aka "insurance").
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Maybe....just maybe.... you don't know WTF you're blathering on about.
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By the time this can be applied to the general population, such issues will be resolved.
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Since the issues of cost in medicine will *never* be solved in a manner which is currently deemed "fair", "equitable" and "moral" while still being fiscally prudent, I'm going to presume that you're being sarcastic.
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Never? The AC is right, we are in the economic endgame because of mass automation. However, consider the following:
* The current medical pricing trend is unsustainable.
* Patents on medicine don't last forever and when they expire you get "generics" made by any certified manufacturer at which point they are cheap.
* We've getting to the point technologically where they are soon going to be made on site by a automated chemistry machine that can make any medicine.
* Most importantly: Men and nations will do th
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What I do know is that all roads lead to a resolution of your concerns.
You've failed to note that one of those resolutions is mandatory euthanasia at a specific age for people who don't have their own money to pay for geriatric care.
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Yeah... because I live in reality. You should try it.
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By the time this can be applied to the general population, I am hopefully dead. I don't want to see that epic fight when 20 billion people battle over resources that would be enough to carry maybe 5.
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Operation A: A 20 year old with a life threatening disease that can be cured in 6 months that lets him be productive another 40 years.
Operation B: A 80 year old with a life threatening disease that can be cured in 6 months that lets him be ... alive (ok, more or less) another 10 years.
You might be able to see the difference here?
abortion market (Score:2)
abortion market can pay out
http://southpark.cc.com/clips/... [cc.com]
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Where's the big deal about this, I ask you. What the fuck is the problem?
Re:I'm glad they're doing the research. (Score:5, Insightful)
Same with the physically fit part. If this implant lets your parent walk up and down the stairs, that's much better than if they can't.
Cancer, osteoporosis, diabetes and a lot of other medical conditions are still going to be expensive, sure, but solving for assisted or total care would still dramatically reduce costs.
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Four predictions:
1) This is just going to add more years to the years in which they can get cancer (multiple times) and diabetes.
2) Robotics is already reducing the amount of work that's going to be needed.
3) This will continue to reduce the birth rate in developed countries.
4) Third World countries will continue to grow their populations.
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Four predictions:
1) This is just going to add more years to the years in which they can get cancer (multiple times) and diabetes.
2) Robotics is already reducing the amount of work that's going to be needed.
3) This will continue to reduce the birth rate in developed countries.
4) Third World countries will continue to grow their populations.
You've nailed it pretty well. The problem with age extension is that all of the years are added on the wrong end. Who wants to spend 30 years in their 80's?
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Nailed it in one. If I was in my 70s, I'd go for it for sure. I'll extend my life as long as I can.
Well good for you. Tell me, would you still say that if you were paralyzed and incontinent, demented and fed through a tube? And on a practical level, blowing through your entire estate in a short time, leaving your family broke?
Fuck that, and the obsession to eke out every last second of a no longer valid life.
If I knew I was going to end up that way, I would without hesitation or regret, happily die at this very moment.
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Nailed it in one. If I was in my 70s, I'd go for it for sure. I'll extend my life as long as I can.
Well good for you. Tell me, would you still say that if you were paralyzed and incontinent, demented and fed through a tube?.
The article is about a technology to prevent precisely that. I doubt, as the baby boomers age ahead of me, it will be the last of the type.
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Nailed it in one. If I was in my 70s, I'd go for it for sure. I'll extend my life as long as I can.
Well good for you. Tell me, would you still say that if you were paralyzed and incontinent, demented and fed through a tube?.
The article is about a technology to prevent precisely that. I doubt, as the baby boomers age ahead of me, it will be the last of the type.
We have increased the average age at death. However, this involves a lot of drugs, and there is a reason that nursing homes are a booming industry.
Some folks might think this is an adequate quality of life, certainly the drug companies and the geriaric car industry are all gaga about the situation.
I don't trust them personally, and don't see much reason to trust this very similar thing. Certainly we live in a country where if people's personal wealth could be extracted by havine them spend more time in
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I've seen two grandmothers, a grandfather and a great-grandmother get old.
No.
I won't.
I've seen the end.
People who want to "get old" usually never see what it really means. In the end, if you're lucky you get dementia so you don't notice the total loss of any semblance of dignity anymore.
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Re:I'm glad they're doing the research. (Score:5, Insightful)
And it's not exactly an unsolvable problem anyway. Have the government send birth control over there. Women will use it. Want to decrease it further? Have the government work to fund schools for women over there.
Lotta dudes online seem to think the people they don't care much for are just bound and determined to reproduce like bunnies no matter what and are totally befuddled as to why people they do care for are reproducing slightly slower. It's really not hard, nor does it require horrors like raising their standard of living up to ours in all other ways.
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If that means that we improve from today's "Live to 60, ail to 80 when you finally die" to "live to 80 and die", sign me up.
If it just means "live to 65, ail to 100 when you beg for a mercy killing", please don't do that to me. What have I done to you to deserve this?
Re:I'm glad they're doing the research. (Score:5, Interesting)
This isn't just life extension it is quality of life extension. And yes it is a great idea. Might even reduce costs by increasing the odds that people will get hit by a truck before they need expensive care.
Then you will never see it (Score:2)
At least not in the US. Nothing can stand in the way of profits. This includes coming up with "cures" for age related illnesses.
Big pharma and medical are salivating already since the boomers are all starting to get age related issues now.
Call me a cynic if you like, but I really believe those who pull the strings will do everything in their power to ensure treatments like this never make it to the plebs.
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Kind of think there needs to be a science fiction book about where people figure out eternal life (or extensions enough to dramatically extend it), and what effect that has on the global economy. Jobs where no one ever really retires, or wealth being hoarded by those longest lived, or the effects to interest rates, etc... could be an interesting premise. If you know if one exists, suggest it to me... Not so much population issues, making the assumption that the birth rate falls as a result to an equilibrium
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Birth rates of rich people would grind to a halt, why would I want to raise a heir if I don't plan to die and have to hand my fortune down to someone? I wouldn't raise a heir, I would raise a potential rival, not to mention someone who has a reason to kill me.
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No. Unless of course it’s mine.
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If they extend life so it reflects an age between say 25 and 45, than simply only those with a permit can breed and those without get snipped if they want their life extended out, dependent upon them never having had children. You get to live longer, if your ego does not demand infinite breeding. Now if they extending life but you remain that invalid age, well, why the fuck bother, who wants to be 150 if your body actually behaves like it is 150 instead of say 35(note the reference).
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than simply only those with a permit can breed and those without get snipped if they want their life extended out,
If you can't already hear the cries of racism, clear the wax out of your ears.
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Re:I'm glad they're doing the research. (Score:5, Insightful)
But, given the population and the cost of geriatric medicine to the economy, is extending human life that much of a good idea?
The point is not to extend the time you hang around being in poor health, but to give people a longer, healthy (and productive) life. There are reasons to believe that one of the key reasons for our species' success was the fact that we started having grandparents about 30K years ago: https://www.theguardian.com/sc... [theguardian.com] - grandparents not only give those of childbearing age more freedom to gather food etc, they were probably crucial in establishing bonds with other tribes, thus providing an important precondition for a larger society and eventually civilisation. Now-a-days, I think living healthy lives for longer has obvious bebefits - caring for a frail, elderly population is expensive for any society, but taking the frailty out of the equation not only means a great cost saving, it also adds years in which people contribute to society.
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but to give people a longer, healthy (and productive) life.
Like to be given the injections in your 30s (when people are already slowing down)?
But who thinks about this in their 30s?
taking the frailty out of the equation not only means a great cost saving
This assumes that we'll die as soon as our bodies fall apart, as opposed to being frail and repeatedly breaking down for longer.
it also adds years in which people contribute to society.
Not when there's no need for 1/2 the population, because of AI robots.
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The point is not to extend the time you hang around being in poor health, but to give people a longer, healthy (and productive) life.
That might not be the point, but it might be the effect. There are certain issues that are difficult to get around, such as the wear and tear on joints that goes beyond typical body repair processes. If we say increase average lifespan to say 200 years, we are going to need some serious work on our skeletons to replace the calcium phosphate and calcium hydroxylapatite they are composed of along with collagen. It just isn't up to the task of human type activity for that long.
grandparents not only give those of childbearing age more freedom to gather food etc, they were probably crucial in establishing bonds with other tribes, thus providing an important precondition for a larger society and eventually civilisation. Now-a-days, I think living healthy lives for longer has obvious bebefits - caring for a frail, elderly population is expensive for any society, but taking the frailty out of the equation not only means a great cost saving, it also adds years in which people contribute to society.
Oh, good heavens. Assuming that
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First, thank you for your well reasoned response - there are too few people on /. who even try.
But the most likely scenario is that if we double the lifespan of humans, we'll be spending a lot of time at the elderly end of our life phase.
I think you are too pessimistic. If we compare with some of the few large animals that live longer than us, I think what we see is that they have a longer "middle-age", so they live as healthy adults for a long time. In nature you don't survive long if you are frail and decrepit. And I agree with your sentiment - I don't think anybody would want to endure many decades of doddering senility, but from what I read, t
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First, thank you for your well reasoned response - there are too few people on /. who even try.
The scary part is they might be trying! But you're welcome
I but from what I read, there is a lot of research into things like organ replacement (by growing new organs from a person's own stemcells)
The business of reducing an organ to it's connective tissue "scaffolding" and regrowing healthy organ tissue on it is pretty compelling. http://www.popsci.com/scientis... [popsci.com] This is nothing short of amazing. Imagine if they could take a heart attack victim and using their own cells, grow a new heart. The same with other organs.
The interesting thing is that if it becomes easy and or quick, the process might be expanded to very early stage heart or othe
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Joints, ligaments and bone tissue is living biologically avtive tissue so they can adopt to wear and tear just like skin and muscle.
Perhaps you are young. It doesn't work that way.
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But, given the population and the cost of geriatric medicine to the economy, is extending human life that much of a good idea?
If some innovation comes along that extends life, you are perfectly free not to take it. In your case, please take advantage of this option.
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But, given the population and the cost of geriatric medicine to the economy, is extending human life that much of a good idea?
Exactly what I came to say. There's a point where eternal rest is more enjoyable than continued existence, as many inform older people exclaim. If we legalised euthanasia, and allowed people to choose to die peacefully rather than go through another round of chemotherapy or whatever, there'd be a shit ton of money freed up to spend on people whose quality of life is worth investing in.
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Exactly what I came to say. There's a point where eternal rest is more enjoyable than continued existence, as many inform older people exclaim. If we legalised euthanasia, and allowed people to choose to die peacefully rather than go through another round of chemotherapy or whatever, there'd be a shit ton of money freed up to spend on people whose quality of life is worth investing in.
In the last year of her life, my Mother-in Law's medical bills were approaching a million dollars.
Here's a woman who never smoked, didn't drink, and kept pretty fit, only to fall to dementia. Spent the last 10 years of her life in a nursing home, and she wasn't a happy demented.
What a loving and caring society, that would spend millions on keeping a person alive who doesn't even know who she is most of the time.
As a friend noted, "If we did this to a dog, we'd be arrested for cruelty."
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is extending human life that much of a good idea?
It is, if extending the average lifespan of humans will cause them to have children later in life.
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Of course, the male sperm count has dropped 50% in the last 40 years, and the existing population is breeding at below sustainment levels.
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Modern western culture has a problem with death.
We see respecting the process of death being antithetical to respecting life. As a culture we have a hard time realizing that everyone will die, including yourself. And the process of death is part of the overall process. So we try to find ways to prolong life, except for way to improve the quality of life, and offer a respectful death.
This isn't going towards an pro-euthanasia debate, but towards work to make life better.
So this research that may slow the a
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I think part of it is our distance to death. People don't die at home anymore. They die in the hospital, or in a retirement home. Or alone. They don't die at home, in the circle of friends and family as it used to be. It may sound odd and creepy, but it isn't. People die. That's part of life. We try to pretend it isn't, but face it: The only thing certain in your life is that you will die.
Everything else is optional.
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Especially for small things like life and death decisions.
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Since I never asserted that my way is the only way, much less whether or not I actually have a way, as opposed to questions without strongly formed opinions, it's patently obvious that your assertion that I've decided what everyone should have access to is a steaming pile of zealot crap.
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I own the question, not the answers, because I'm some dude on /., not a PhD candidate writing a thesis.
Does it help with eye sight also? (Score:4, Funny)
I don't mind getting older, but what I don't like is my eyesight is going to shit.
But it doesn't matter, because by the time this stuff hits the market, I'll either be dead or too poor to afford it anyways.
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Well, I do mind getting older, because it's not just the eyesight. It's everything. Our twenties is our peak, and to deny this is insanity.
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If your twenties were your peak you live a very unhealthy life.
The peak is somewhere between 35 and 50, not 20. Perhaps a 25 year old sprinter can sprint faster than a 35 year old, but a 35 year old marathon runner runs faster than a 25 year old. And don't let me get into martial arts or sex or other things that take time to develop, e.g. music and other arts.
I'm 50 and don't feel any different then when I was 16.
Re: Does it help with eye sight also? (Score:2)
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Neither do I.
But then again, I was already in really bad shape when I was 16...
Great and all but (Score:4, Interesting)
It is still a risky implant.
One error implant, it could become something pressing on the brain like a tumor, killing the host. On the other hand, it could potentially recover neurons from paralyzed victims and improve elder brain function.
They better conduct more research before doing it on humans. Also they should have life/death agreement for the volunteers as it is still very risky.
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They better conduct more research before doing it on humans.
Using... what? They just did mice. Primate studies for medicine are being ended, and chimps live about 60 years, so that would be way too long to study aging in them. Organisms lower than mice are useless for studies of high brain function.
They're hoping to start clinical trials. The early phases start out small and cautious and build up in terms of risk. [wikipedia.org] Phase zero will test "doses" too small to do anything helpful in 10 people. I don't know what that would be with a biologic like stem cells, maybe just
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They better conduct more research before doing it on humans.
Hey, that's a good idea. You should run the FDA.
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And a billion more people will be impersonating hi... I mean me.
No one wants to impersonate you, an anonymous 14-year-old wanker.
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Hopefully it won't require an implant (Score:4, Insightful)
Yeah, while I'd willingly try a (deep!) neural implant of (somebody else's) stem cells that might require a lifetime of anti-rejection drugs in order to live substantially longer, maybe there's a better simpler cheaper faster way.
In the fine article (I know I know, who reads the articles?), they mention that at least some of the effects are due to miRNAs released by the stem cells. These circulate in the brain fluid and control gene expression throughout the brain. (For those who aren't thoroughly steeped in genetic expression; miRNA stands for micro-interfering RNA, these are short ~20bp sequences of RNA that by precisely complementing a particular DNA sequence them, can "silence" or interfere with them).
So perhaps a simple cranial injection (ouch!) of miRNAs would be all it takes. In fact, if you make the RNA sequences at home (what, you don't have a DNA/RNA synthesizer?) and a hand drill you could do it yourself! (If you don't have a DNA synthesizer yet, hopefully every school will have one within a decade).
Re:Hopefully it won't require an implant (Score:4, Interesting)
I imagine eventually these will be clones of your own stem cells. Also ISTR studies saying stem cells can migrate from the blood stream to brain, so maybe it would evolve into an injection into an artery feeding the brain.
Assuming it works at all, and it isn't some X-files plot to turn us into alien chimeras.
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X-files plot to turn us into alien chimeras.
Sign me up!
Extending Life? (Score:1)
Could? (Score:3)
Sounds like non-scientific marketing piece of news!
Immortal by 2025 (Score:1)
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Immortal within reason. Or just living such a long life that everything just becomes completly fuckiing boring that you want to die... like being trapped in a cage.
Full blown immortality would be torture. Can you imagine being alive still when and after the universe goes to heat death or the Big Rip? Even the trillions of years before the end of the universe would be hell when you can't die.
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"Full blown immortality would be torture. Can you imagine being alive still when and after the universe goes to heat death or the Big Rip? Even the trillions of years before the end of the universe would be hell when you can't die."
But at least you'd be able to catch up with your netflix series.
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Now you understand why God is so pissed.
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GUILTY !
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Maybe by 3025, but I wouldn't count on it.
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Unfortunately part of the Aging process is the urge to gravitate towards people who are more like you. Where groups of people who you never gave a second thought about, begin to seem like like they are trouble, and should be afraid of.
The Boomers who were part of the biggest changes in Civil Rights are now becoming key in the reinsurance of racism, is partially because their natural instinct to gravitate towards people like them, makes the other groups seems dangerous.
For the most part this is a positive
Mixing unborn babies into bread? (Score:4, Interesting)
Now imagine new edition of The Protocols of the Elders of Zion crap, this time challenging rich of the world of injecting unborn babies blood into their brains to extend their geriatric rule over the world....
Don't get me wrong, I'm mostly transhumanist myself, but I shudder to think what religious fanatics, right-wing prolifers and other luddites will make out of such developments in their propaganda.
Pension age is already 67 in the UK (Score:2)
I was told that it will become 70 by the time I retire. If the life expectancy increases more, the retirement age will increase accordingly.
Increased life expectancy does not necessarily increase the quality of life. It would be better to pay attention to the quality of life for those in their prime, rather than offering them more years of suffering in old age.
Why not skip to the end result? (Score:2)
Call me thrilled when they can extend it by a 50% (Score:2)