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The Almighty Buck Science

Poverty May Affect the Growth of Children's Brains 324

sciencehabit writes: Stark and rising inequality plagues many countries, including the United States, and politicians, economists, and — fortunately — scientists, are debating its causes and solutions. But inequality's effects may go beyond simple access to opportunity: a new study finds that family differences in income and education are directly correlated with brain size in developing children and adolescents. The findings could have important policy implications and provide new arguments for early antipoverty interventions, researchers say.
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Poverty May Affect the Growth of Children's Brains

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  • Cause, or effect? (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward

    They may have found a correlation, but that's not the same as determining the direction of causation.

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      Comment removed based on user account deletion
      • by MightyMartian ( 840721 ) on Monday March 30, 2015 @06:23PM (#49375489) Journal

        The link is between nutrition and brain development, and considering the odds of poor nutrition is higher in poorer families than in wealthier families, the conclusion does not seem bad at all. Nothing says that all families that live in poverty will have children with developmental problems, but it does argue you're much more likely to see the phenomenon in such families.

        I can't imagine why anyone would see this as controversial.

        • by ahodgson ( 74077 )

          Probably because there just aren't all that many people in the 1st world who are truly going hungry.

        • Re:Cause, or effect? (Score:4, Informative)

          by bobbied ( 2522392 ) on Monday March 30, 2015 @06:37PM (#49375601)

          The link is between nutrition and brain development, and considering the odds of poor nutrition is higher in poorer families than in wealthier families, the conclusion does not seem bad at all. Nothing says that all families that live in poverty will have children with developmental problems, but it does argue you're much more likely to see the phenomenon in such families.

          I can't imagine why anyone would see this as controversial.

          EXACTLY...

          For instance, there is a whole generation in North Korea where starvation was common during the second Kim's reign and they show marked problems with mental development if they where malnourished during specific phases of their development. They will NEVER recover, nor will they reach their potential but the real tragedy is that this will affect their children too. So you loose not one but two generations. (According to the documentary I remember watching once.)

          • by jblues ( 1703158 )
            Its common for poor folks to suffer from ill health, including being overweight as a result of eating calorie dense but nutritionally poor foods. In the country where I live there's a huge wealth gap, with a proportion of the population being malnourished and another being overweight, and possible to fall into both categories. Its not always the case of course. My wife had a very poor upbringing - they had a dirt-floor kitchen, no refrigerator, wood-fired stove, and no running water (only hand pumped). Inc
        • Re:Cause, or effect? (Score:5, Informative)

          by Lord Crc ( 151920 ) on Monday March 30, 2015 @06:48PM (#49375691)

          The link is between nutrition and brain development

          Could it also be related to poorer parents working more hours, thus having less time to be with the kids during their early years playing with them, reading for them and otherwise stimulating their brain development? Or has that been corrected for?

          • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 ) *

            Malnutrition has measurable, physical effects on brain development. If you measure the average amount of growth a child's brain does from birth to adulthood you will find it is less if the body is starved of nutrition. The effects are permanent and irreversible, and cannot be fully counteracted with education. The brain is simply less able to grow and to learn during those critical early years.

      • by s.petry ( 762400 )

        You must be a white male! *ducks*

        I agree, and come from a similar place. Not quite ghetto poor, but not being able to eat poor and we lived next to the ghetto. My dad was my example of what not to be when I grew up, since he was drunk and unemployed more often than sober and working. Mom did her best with what she had, a GED and two kids.

        Not to say I have not made mistakes, but my son is now in college which I'm able to pay cash for. I have a good job which I worked very hard for. I'm not rich, but I

  • by Archangel Michael ( 180766 ) on Monday March 30, 2015 @06:06PM (#49375335) Journal

    Poverty doesn't cause it, most likely has to do with poor Nutrition.

    Which is why, if I were in charge, Food Stamps would be for Fruits, Veggies, Meat, and Milk only. If you add anything else, it is abused. Cereal? FruitLoops is a cereal, and currently counts as "food".

    • Some people are allergic to milk, and living on a diet of meat and vegetables is still a new idea not supported by science (though the paleo guys come up with a lot of weird ideas like "that is how our ancestors lived ten-thousand years ago." Which is not true).
      • by Mashiki ( 184564 )

        Coprolite's seem to show that meat and vegetables though not together all the time was common "when our ancestors lived 10k years ago."

        • by phantomfive ( 622387 ) on Monday March 30, 2015 @07:00PM (#49375765) Journal
          I don't know why you think so.

          Here's an interview on PBS [pbs.org]: "I went to visit indigenous people and hunter-gatherers...they don’t get that much meat because hunting is hard work."

          Look at the chart half-way down [scientificamerican.com], of some of the hunter/gatherer tribes that still exist. There is huge variety in one they eat....some are mostly meat, some are mostly plants.
          The Paleo diet today [wku.edu] isn't good for your health.
          Unsurprisingly, here is a study in Nature [nih.gov] that points out copying Paleolithic diets would not be very useful anyway (not in the least because we've evolved since then, through the Neolithic era).

          The paleo diet is yet another fully trademarked fad diet.
          • by Mashiki ( 184564 )

            I don't know why you think so.

            Probably because the actual contents of coprolites show what the actual diet was? Then again, you quickly find out that "latest studies" are generally garbage. Much like the: Anti-milk, anti-meat, pro-meat, anti-butter, and so on crap is all garbage.

          • by mjwx ( 966435 )

            The Paleo diet today [wku.edu] isn't good for your health.
            Unsurprisingly, here is a study in Nature [nih.gov] that points out copying Paleolithic diets would not be very useful anyway (not in the least because we've evolved since then, through the Neolithic era).

            The paleo diet is yet another fully trademarked fad diet.

            The Paleo diet was originally known to most Australians as the CSIRO diet and it's meant for weight loss, not as a regular diet. Its the same with Paleo which has the same high protein, low carbohydrate principles. The CSIRO diet is coupled with exercise and other elements as a 12 week program. Like Paleo, it's designed to induce Ketosis which isn't a healthy state to be in for years, but is just fine for a few months whilst you drop a few kilos.

            Unlike fad diets, high protein, low carb diets are proven t

      • Well they certainly weren't eating a lot of cereal grains until pretty recently. Herding is probably about 40k years old, while agriculture is around 10k or so. (we could quibble over a few thousand years or so for each but that's the rough timeline) Depending on how you want to draw the line modern humans have been around for about 100k to 200k years in our current form. Arguably we've spent most of our existence not eating cereal grains.
        • This article [nih.gov] talks about why "what we were doing 100,000 years ago" is not particularly useful for understanding a healthy modern diet. (In brief: we as humans are omnivores, especially suited to eating many different things, and in any case humans evolve to match their diet....on a much smaller scale than 100,000 years, as the paper points out).
      • If you include fruits, it's pretty damn close to true. People didn't start eating grains in significant quantities until about 10000 years ago. Before that nearly 100% of their diet consisted of fruits, vegetables and meat (including fish). Humans became "behaviorally modern" about 40000 to 50000 years ago. So it's clear that a diet containing no grains can be nutritionally adequate for modern humans.

        The only net benefit of eating grains and processed foods is that they're a cheaper way of fulfilling yo

        • Before that nearly 100% of their diet consisted of fruits, vegetables and meat (including fish).

          What about roots?

          Humans became "behaviorally modern" about 40000 to 50000 years ago. So it's clear that a diet containing no grains can be nutritionally adequate for modern humans.

          This explains why it's not clear [slashdot.org]. Trying to understand how humans ate 50,000 years ago doesn't help much in understanding what is good for us today.

          • Roots are usually included in the term "vegetables."

            Yeah, it's true that modern people have some adaptations due to what they call "niche construction" which appears to be a fancy term for "agriculture" + "cooking" when it comes to diet.

            For example, most modern people can digest milk, whereas our paleolithic ancestors mostly couldn't, and some populations of humans have developed heightened tolerance for carbohydrate-heavy diets that probably would have given our paleolithic ancestors diabetes. They still

    • I would expect nutrition to be a big factor. But I also expect other environmental factors like intellectual stimulation, healthcare, etc. also play into it.
    • by Livius ( 318358 )

      It's very obviously not a matter of bank account balances having a direct effect on development. They can get back to us when they've found an actual useful correlation.

      • I was once in the poverty state, food choices between Manufactured "food" and fresh foods wasn't that much. It is a lifestyle choice. I've seen what poor people eat. And here, in America, you can be poor, and obese, and that is a choice.

        Bank accounts might matter if you're buying a lot of meat, but my guess is poor people shop once a month, for the whole month, and thus don't buy non-processed foods. It is a discipline to be able to keep money through the month, so you can buy fresh food. IMHO many (perhaps

    • My first thought was poor nutrition as well. It's the same sort of claim that dentists make, like how unhealthy teeth can lead to other health problems. I've always figured it's more likely that people who don't take care of their teeth also don't take care of their bodies in general.

      About your proposed food stamp rules... you're missing the "grains" food group (bread, flour, rice, etc) entirely, not to mention a few other fundamental things like eggs, butter, salt, and sugar. I'm going to take a wild gu

    • Should science be based on what is intuitive for Archangel Michael (180766), or peer reviewed step by step understanding?

      Alternatively, can you back up your statement with a peer reviewed study?

    • by pnutjam ( 523990 )
      That's partly because the USDA says you should get most of your calories from grains. Yeah, it's stupid, and it's slowly changing.
    • by jabuzz ( 182671 )

      It is more likely to be down to the input from the parents, or in the case of poverty lack of input. The basics are that poor parents are on average less well educated and don't have either the inclination or knowledge to give their children quality input especially in early years.

      The is also a growing problem with the children of wealthy/educated parents who are too busy with their jobs to give their children the quality input they need to thrive.

      Diet has very little or nothing to do with it. Any sensible

    • They've found a correlation between poverty and small brain size, but it's a complex issue that's not as simple as money or food or whatnot causing a small brain. You have a point about nutrition, and that's an important consideration going forward; it is unfortunate that we can't solve this readily, but it's a good consideration to make.

      Still, nutrition is only one small part of it. The brain isn't a muscle: you don't get stronger at math by flexing your math brain parts; you only get better at the p

  • by riverat1 ( 1048260 ) on Monday March 30, 2015 @06:10PM (#49375377)

    I'm not sure that brain size by itself is a particular indicator of intelligence but when it's combined with poor nutrition and stressful living it probably is correlated. If you're concerned about the welfare state then it's something that should concern you. People with low intelligence are much more likely to require welfare to get along in life.

    • I don't know what is surprising about this. We've known for decades that poor nutrition during the developmental years can lead to poor brain development and permanent cognitive problems.

    • The researchers chose to measure cortical surface area because previous research had shown that it increases throughout childhood and adolescence as the brain develops, thus making it a potentially sensitive indicator of intellectual abilities.

      I can read it to you, but I can't understand it for you. If you have questions, please read the article before wasting our goddam time.

  • Caution (Score:2, Insightful)

    This study may only be referenced by Liberals when promoting new ways to take from those who produce. If ever referenced by Conservatives, such as for explaining certain inequities and suggesting that some people might actually be smarter than others, it is racist.
    • Re:Caution (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Alomex ( 148003 ) on Monday March 30, 2015 @06:37PM (#49375603) Homepage

      This study may only be referenced by Liberals when promoting new ways to take from those who produce.

      You mean the workers on the production lines? because those are the only ones who do any producing.

      Rich people allocate capital and if they do it well this is a Good Thing (TM), but certainly on and itself does not produce anything.

  • So the Top 1% needs to give the bottom 99% all their money. Problem solved.
    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Obfuscant ( 592200 )

      So the Top 1% needs to give the bottom 99% all their money. Problem solved.

      Until next year, when the ones who suddenly find themselves in the new 1% have everything taken away from them and given to everyone else. As in, what do you do when the money you've just given away is gone and you need to do it again? Do you really imagine that those people who had no money will save whatever windfall they get by eating the rich for use over a long period of time? (And taking everything away from the 1% is as close to "eating the rich" as you can get without actually eating them.) The vac

      • by Shados ( 741919 )

        Don't forget that a lot of 1%er money never gets spent (and thus raise the price) to buy things you would. Unless you were in the market for a multi-billion dollar yacht, it doesn't really matter what Bill Gates, Buffet and Cook spend their money on.

        If everyone ends up with all their money and go to the grocery store with it instead....things won't stay rosy very long.

  • by Anonymice ( 1400397 ) on Monday March 30, 2015 @06:42PM (#49375639)

    But inequality's effects may go beyond simple access to opportunity

    I'm not sure what they're defining as "opportunity" here, but it clearly doesn't include access to a healthier diet, better educational tools, more experiences in life, quality time & attention from their guardians, etc, etc.

    In fact, I'd like to know exactly what they what they think opportunity is if it's *not* those things?!

  • by GoodNewsJimDotCom ( 2244874 ) on Monday March 30, 2015 @06:52PM (#49375711)
    Poor people have less nutrition for their body. Poor people have less access to toys and media which exercise the brains. Thankfully smart phone prices are coming down in price, and educational apps are popping up all the time. So in third world countries, people may be able to get education straight from a smart phone. We as app developers should have education in mind. Whether we're doing illustrated story books which the spoken word synched with highlighted words, or we're doing K-12-University lectures and workbook activities... We should focus more on education and helping out over directly our own pocketbooks to a degree.
  • In theory, anyone can scrimp and save and work hard and get ahead. I've done it .. without a college education and growing up in a from a family barely getting by, I've managed to improve my income starting as a minimum wage bike repair worker, working two years as an office clerk, and 35 years later clear over $130K/year. I did it because I'm smart, reasonably personable, and have a strong work ethic that makes it easy for me to do just about any job my company asks for, yet strong enough to go look elsewh

    • Nobody is lining up to give poor people professional baseball teams [publicintegrity.org], or choice executive positions at energy [foxnews.com] companies. [wikipedia.org] Nor does a poor working stiff who just finished a hard day of running pipes or installing drywall open his motel door in the middle of the night to see women looking to have sex with him [cnn.com].

      So is opportunity just getting what you want?? Or is it having a specific income level??

      It's not being willfully obtuse [washingtonpost.com] as to how this country, and capitalism in general, actually works.

    • by Bite The Pillow ( 3087109 ) on Monday March 30, 2015 @09:36PM (#49376623)

      Are you statistically the same as the studied subjects?

      I did it because I'm smart, reasonably personable, and have a strong work ethic that makes it easy for me to do just about any job my company asks for, yet strong enough to go look elsewhere when the time is right.

      Nope, you are an outlier. Thanks for your Republicanism, but try actually understanding things.

  • ... in 1960-th there was a toy - a metal constructor. It was a big box full of different plates, axes, wheels, nuts, bolts a.s.o. It was relatively cheap (since it was produced basically by the same plants where the nuclear bombs were made). It was needed to have some brains to model something with this toy. There were lots of cheap magazines publishing projects for this toy. Sometimes it was problematic to subscribe for these magazines (it's Russia!!!!1111) but they still were cheap.

    About 2010, I needed su

  • by Ada_Rules ( 260218 ) on Tuesday March 31, 2015 @06:21AM (#49378061) Homepage Journal
    While there are almost certainly multiple factors at play (nutrition, environment, etc) it would be nice if we could all stop pretending to not understand one of the root causes of negative impacts on brain development - specifically spanking.

    There are no studies that show spanking has any long term positive outcomes. There are plenty of studies that show negative correlation with long term negative outcomes. Just as is the case with this study, it is fair to call into question correlation and causation but if there were some food additive, fertilizer or herbicide that had even 1/10 of the correlative impact on children, the public would be freaking out and protesting around some multinational business but when it is parents damaging their own children we get relative silence.

    Studies have shown that poor parents are more likely to spank their children. Studies have shown a correlation in spanking with smaller brain sizes, lower IQs, lack of self control. Studies have shown a high correlation between lack of self control and poverty. Again we don't have great data on cause v.s. effect but there are good indications that the early violence is causative in this chain.

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