Researchers Say Dark Winters Led To Bigger Human Brains 167
Brad1138 writes "Humans living at high latitude have bigger eyes and bigger brains to cope with poor light during long winters and cloudy days, UK scientists have said. from the article: 'The scientists measured the eye sockets and brain volumes of 55 skulls from 12 populations across the world, and plotted the results against latitude. Lead author Eiluned Pearce told BBC News: "We found a positive relationship between absolute latitude and both eye socket size and cranial capacity."'"
Variations (Score:2)
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I'm tempe
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If you look at northern Europeans (like me), it's easy to see we are decended from Neanderthals [independent.co.uk]. Where do you think the white skin, blond hair, blue eyes, and huge noses came from? Duh. The stupid white Neanderthals mated with super-smart blacks from Africa, creating the modern race of whites.
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whats-likely-to-get-me-labeled-racist (Score:3)
Isn't the contorted facts that you drool; its that you drool them. Racist is a convenient short hand for stupid, ignorant and mainly afraid.
It may be no more your fault than if you were born blind. Like the blind, there is a lot you can do to overcome your disability. The blind can because they have motivation and courage. Courage is a very big part of overcoming your limitations.
Peer groups can help with motivation and support. That is what has made AA the success it is, and there are a wide range
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Go read Guns, Germs, and Steel [amazon.com]. Ideas like northern Europeans conquered the globe because we're smarter, or we're smarter because it's harder to live in cold climates are rubbish. This book is pretty long, and has big words. Don't hurt your brain.
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One has to consider, then, why "blacks" aren't as 'smart' as whites or Asians, now, then. (I'm basing the fact that, well, they never actually left Africa, they're in Africa, not many significant cultures have come from Africa, blacks typically test lower on IQ tests despite socioeconomic adjustment, etc.)
Hooooly shit, are you trolling or are you insanely racist?
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No, he's just insanely honest.
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You don't see any reason why leaving Africa would be difficult? Note: you must assume you don't have access to your first-world income.
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Hooooly shit, are you trolling or are you insanely racist?
Hate to tell you this, but your response is actually hyper, politically correct, racism. Just as scientific principals can be applied to observe differences between animal breeds, the same can be applied to humans.
Shocking that there literally are physiological difference between various races of humans. According to you, this FACT makes me and anyone knowledgeable, racists. Reality is, nothing is father from the truth. By extension, it is hardly unreasonable in the least that its possible those physiologic
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I'm not arguing over physiological differences at all, I don't deny that they exist. But this:
(I'm basing the fact that, well, they never actually left Africa, they're in Africa, not many significant cultures have come from Africa
has nothing to do with physiology and is either terribly ignorant or terribly racist.
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has nothing to do with physiology and is either terribly ignorant or terribly racist.
Is it? I honestly can not think of any significant culture which not only directly originated from Africa, but still exists today. I can think of some semi-modern, noteworthy African cultures, such as the Zulu, and a couple other footnotes from antiquity, but aside from that, I'm largely drawing a blank. Can you? If so, can you please provide some examples? Having said that, while I wouldn't have said that, perhaps out of my own ignorance (hopefully you'll validate that) I see it as nothing more than a prov
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Now, I think that the difference can tend to be explained by culture (and its consequences: economics, nutrition, wealth, education, etc.). "Correcting for socioeconomic factors" is not a straightforward process.
This is what I think as well. The results also stratify the races by the importance their culture places on education, so it makes sense. If you compare the IQs of middle-class blacks in the wealthier Caribbean countries vs. middle-class whites in the US south I expect you'd see the blacks coming out on top. If you choose asian families without the "dragon mother" culture you'd probably find them on par with average US whites. It's just that culture strongly correlates with race.
Not frivolous (Score:3)
...they have more time to spend on learning about frivolous stuff like numerical sequences and funny shapes.
This stuff is not frivolous - it is the next logical step. One you have shelter, dinner and warmth you want to make sure that you will continue to have these things. This means identifying the patterns of nature and coming up with strategies to cope with them or benefit from them in order to improve the quality of life. That is still what science is about today. Just because it is a little more abstract than designing a better spear to skewer a boar does not mean that the basic purpose of all this learnin
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If whales and dolphins are so intelligent, then why are they easily fished by the Japanese?
You'd think their advanced tactics would help them. At least to flee to the shores of a country where people don't eat them for breakfast.
If we could conclude they are intelligent, then it would mean they want to be eaten.
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Re:Variations (Score:4, Funny)
Global warming affects the temperature, not the length of night.
Do you by any chance live near the equator? ;)
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No No... This makes sense... Stay with me, but the climate is warming, right? Regardless what you think about why. And I've notices that people seems to be getting stupider and stupider...
Right, right, and successful high-seas piracy requires intelligence and so rising global stupid leads to a decline in global pirates, which we already know is what causes the rising global temperature. It's a big feedback loop.
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MMMMMM. BRAINSSSSS! (Score:1)
Re:MMMMMM. BRAINSSSSS! (Score:5, Informative)
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I don't need large brains to have a good time!
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How do they know a) that it's entirely vision processing that takes the extra space (the idea of there being specialized areas of the brain is coming into disrepute, I understand) and b) that that has no effect on intelligence?
Re:MMMMMM. BRAINSSSSS! (Score:5, Informative)
the idea of there being specialized areas of the brain is coming into disrepute,
No. There clearly are areas of specialized cortex, the visual cortex being one. That doesn't mean that other parts of the brain aren't involved in visual processing (for example). The trivial example of this is the homunculus [wikimedia.org]. If you damage a particular area in the motor or sensory cortex, you will see the effects of that damage in very specific regions of the body.
Size of a particular region isn't necessarily correlated with the level or degree of function and lots of other things happen in various regions of the brain.[Long complex discussion on how the brain works. Lots of handwaving.]
I'm not sure where you picked up that concept, but it's not correct, unless I'm not understanding what you meant to say.
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I think he may at least in part be referring to things like language processing. People used to point at Broca's area, draw some arrows to Wernicke's area and there ya go, here's yer language bits. Only now we know that's not really true and that language processing seems to involve, for instance, sensorimotor areas of the brain too.
So while you're certainly correct when it comes to sensor
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We're getting there in determining how the brain is wired. Whether any one human can actually understand it is certainly up for debate.
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You're pretty close to the target with that. I read this article earlier today, before it hit slashdot. In effect, they measured the skulls of people who have been dead for 200 years. They did NOT measure the brains, the lobes of the brain, or anything to do with the brain, other than skull capacity. Skull capacity may be an indicator of anything, or nothing.
Now, if they had evaluated brains, they may or may not have arrived at meaningful conclusions. Corpses aren't a rare commodity, after all. Fresh c
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It must be quite a trick, estimating how those larger brains must have been structured, considering they're ... entirely decayed by now. Their paper http://rsbl.royalsocietypublishing.org/content/early/2011/07/12/rsbl.2011.0570.full [royalsocie...ishing.org] doesn't appear to substantiate it either. Where exactly did the BBC get that quote?
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Best guess, they're likely taking existing brains (in today's humans) and scaling down to fir the skulls. Given that you can reconstruct *most* of the outer shape from the cranial cavity, it's not a bad initial assumption to make.
OTOH, while it's not too awful likely that a given 'duty' of a set of brain cells shifts all that radically, I do agree with you to an extent.
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This research would imply that the further south you live in the US the less intelligent you were. So I did a quick Google search for "dumb american southerners"... turns out there is strong anecdotal evidence! Where's my research grant.
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RTFA "The Oxford University team said bigger brains did not make people smarter. Larger vision processing areas fill the extra capacity, they write in the Royal Society's Biology Letters journal."
But just as computers with very fast GPUs can have those GPUs put to other uses, thereby increasing the computer's overall processing power, isn't it reasonable to assume the same is true with the visual processing areas of the brain?
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If this was an xkcd it would be obligatory, but it's smbc, so I don't think it counts...
http://smbc-comics.com/index.php?db=comics&id=001#comic [smbc-comics.com]
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displacing existing populations who are forced to move further from the equator and thus develop bigger brains
farther.
get packing.
Santa (Score:3, Funny)
So Santa Claus has the biggest brain of all ?
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How do you think he was able to brainwash all those elves?
Basements? (Score:2)
have bigger eyes and bigger brains to cope with poor light during long winters and cloudy days,
So the decedents of Slashdotters could develop larger eyes and brains? Hmm.
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Only if we start breeding via mitosis.
55 skulls?!?! (Score:3, Insightful)
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Depends on the variance of the measurements. If the variance is small, you can be certain that the probability that the assertion they're making is false is very small.
Re:55 skulls?!?! (Score:5, Informative)
Correlation is not causation (Score:2, Interesting)
This is why I always rooted for . . . (Score:3)
. . . the Morlocks. They may be ugly anthropophages, but I figured they'd have to be smarter than the Eloi, and got to play with ancient machinery to boot.
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Who said anything about "smarter"? There is not an established concrete relationship between brain size and intelligence in humans.
In fact, FTFA:
"The Oxford University team said bigger brains did not make people smarter."
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No, there is a relationship between cranial volume and intelligence. It can be confounded by several other factors, (e.g. hydrocephalus, white vs. gray matter, cortical area, body size) which weaken the correlation, but it is real.
Here's the first decent reference I could find: "In a meta-analysis McDaniel (2004) found an in vivo brain volume/IQ correlation of 0.33 based on 37 published studies (N= 1535)..."
http://abc102.wordpress.com/2011/02/17/brain-size-and-correlates-with-iq/ [wordpress.com]
Citing: http://www.govrel.vc [vcu.edu]
But they just said it was sports. (Score:3)
But they just said it was due to sports [wired.com].
So, which is it?
racist (Score:1, Troll)
Like to see corroboration... (Score:2)
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The conclusion isn't necessarily any less reliable than any other peer reviewed paper, in fact I'd wager that this one is likely more reliable as a paper like this could easily end careers if the science isn't there.
This isn't any more racist than the observation that people from closer to the equator handle sunburn more effectively than those of us from the higher latitudes.
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There is a reason Africa is in the state it's in...
Relatively good weather doesn't provide an environmental pressure to develop technologically earlier than colder climates?
So... (Score:2)
"Winter is coming" could really be a good news?
Doesn't necessarily mean Northern countries are... (Score:1)
I think they've got it slightly wrong (Score:2)
Probably the cold weather just led to a lot more cuddling. And, naturally the cuddling led to a lot more - you know - whoopee.
So, apparently sex is good for your brain.
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So, apparently sex is good for your brain.
That would explain a lot of what happens around here.
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It's miniaturization, man! (Score:3)
Haven't heard this one before... (Score:1)
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Would you rather that science with "racist" results never be published?
The next step... (Score:2)
...is to confirm the theory by searching for fossil chibis in Antarctica.
Hmm... (Score:1)
Eskimo overlords (Score:2)
I, for one, would like to welcome our super intelligent Eskimo overlords! (And troglodytes and blind people and habitual sunglass wearers and squinty eyed folk).
If brain size == intelligence (Score:2)
We'd have a lot of posters using flippers.
Eyes? OK. Brain? No. (Score:2)
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reproduction advantage (Score:2)
What if, like me, early men of northern latitudes were just attracted to doe-eyed girls with big brains?
Correlation does not mean causation (Score:2)
Its a Survival Advantage (Score:2)
It's standard textbook material (Score:2)
"We found a positive relationship between absolute latitude and both eye socket size and cranial capacity."
Pretty much every physical measurement of every land animal is positively correlated with absolute latitude. This is because the mean temperature is negatively correlated with distance from the equator, and larger body size is adaptive at colder temperatures. A larger body has relatively smaller heat losses, and thus a more stable temperature. This doesn't matter much in the tropics (except at high altitudes), but it can be important when you get to areas with serious cold seasons.
You can find this as
Maybe. But that has certainly been... (Score:2)
taking place a long time before humans living at high latitude finally learned how to produce - and consume - distilled liquor.
The latter of which being a completely different way to adapt to long, dark winter nights...
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Highest absolute latitudes. Meaning the farthest away from the equator in either direction.
Re:Racists (Score:4, Insightful)
Reality is not racist; it simply is.
Re:Racists (Score:5, Informative)
Your comment just suggests you didn't bother to RTFA.
"In the paper, we argue that having bigger brains doesn't mean that high-latitude humans are necessarily smarter. It's just they need bigger eyes and brains to be able to see well where they live."
They're saying that the extra cranial capacity is being used by the visual processing centres of the brain.
And to be honest, your comment isn't combating racism, it's reinforcing it.
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No, they are not saying what you say they are saying. As to bigger being smarter, "[not] necessarily" is not the same as "not".
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Hmm, I think it's accurate to say their position is that the brains are bigger, but this is explained by the larger vision processing centres (I didn't read the paper but I assume they checked that the increased volume was in these areas), and thus isn't evidence of increased intelligence overall.
I assume the original poster was thinking bigger -> smarter, therefore smarter -> racist scientists. Even if the scientists are incorrect in assuming this means no increase in intelligence it's certainly demo
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"I assume they checked that the increased volume was in these areas"
I didn't see discussion of that in the paper, FWIW. They filled empty skulls with plastic/wax pellets to measure this and that. No brains - no brain studies.
"it certainly demonstrates there was no racist motive on the part of the scientists."
Yeah; it'd be a politically-correct accusation, and it sounds like the BBC and/or the scientists are trying to preempt that.
"I know you in real life"
Heh, I don't even know myself in real life.
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It doesn't say smarter. In much the same way you need bigger muscles to lift a heavier object, you need a larger visual processing center in your brain to make sense of darker images, to extract detail from lower contrast situations, and low light conditions. I would assume, also, that it's an environmental adaptation; that is to say, anyone of any race, of any socioeconomic background, regardless of the intelligence or home-latitude of their most recent dozen ancestors, would experience the same boost in
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Not really, I remember a study out a while back dealing with sweat glands that found a sort of inverse relation ship that those from closer to the equator had more sweat glands than those from further up north.
It could be racist, but more likely it's either an honest mistake or a reflection of reality. Adding racism here without any real cause is in and of itself racist.
Re:Racists (Score:5, Insightful)
This discussion is so old, and it skews science. It's the same with genders -- are we allowed to say that men and women have different thought patterns yet, or do we have to whisper? This PC bullshit always pisses me off.
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Sound like I better get started
You know, I think we might have this all wrong. Maybe good eyesight and large brains causes mountains to sprout under our villages. I think we should try assembling a bunch of big-brained people with 20/20 vision and put them in a pit, as an experiment.
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Alcohol makes you fat.
[Citation needed]
IANA medical researcher, but most of the late stage alcoholics I've seen were not fat.