Vaccine Patch Removes Needle Pain 250
wog777 writes "Researchers led by Mark Prausnitz of Georgia Institute of Technology reported their research on microneedles in Sunday's edition of Nature Medicine. A microneedle contains needles so small you don't even feel them. Attached to a patch like a Band-Aid, the little needles barely penetrate the skin before they dissolve and release their vaccine."
There's other uses too (Score:2, Funny)
A citizen needs some calibration? Don't worry, he wont even feel the needle shot!
Paranoid Much (Score:2, Offtopic)
Re:There's other uses too (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:There's other uses too (Score:5, Funny)
has anybody else ever wondered what would happen if one were to crop-dust a heavily populated area with a suitably light-stabilized LSD solution? Or distributed a genetically engineered virus through the ventilation system of the DEA headquarters that spliced in the necessary DNA sequences to make those exposed capable of synthesizing endogenous THC?
You, sir, have just posted your way in a very exclusive database somewhere deep in the basement of the Department of Homeland security.
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I have actually, yes. Not that I have access to LSD, and the virus thing sounds somewhat fanciful, but yes.
I also wondered what might happen if you spread a whole lot of cannabis seed over a large area and just let it grow. Unfortunately I'm told the results would be pretty useless due to the female plants only really producing when there are no males around to fertilise them.
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"capable of synthesizing endogenous THC?"
Evolution is way ahead of you: endocannabinoids [wikipedia.org]
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for instance, has anybody else ever wondered what would happen if one were to crop-dust a heavily populated area with a suitably light-stabilized LSD solution?
Things would get very groovy very quickly. George Clinton would be elected President. Your funk of choice would be the P-Funk.
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That has basically happened in France [telegraph.co.uk], thanks to the CIA.
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BRAIN STAPLES for everyone!
Does it work in reverse? (Score:3, Interesting)
Can a blood sample be taken this way?
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Paranoia strikes deep.
Re:Does it work in reverse? (Score:5, Funny)
Unless it's administered by microneedle.
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Re:Does it work in reverse? (Score:5, Informative)
Your average red blood cell is around 10 micrometers thick. White blood cells are even bigger. This would probably make the "needles" big enough to hurt like hell - so no, it would defeat the purpose. Besides, kids are the only ones who cry when getting a blood sample taken. But they'll cry when they see a stranger coming up to them in a white lab coat anyway, needle or not.
Re:Does it work in reverse? (Score:4, Informative)
I can assure you sir, that it is not just kids who cry at the thought of needles piercing their skin. As one with such a phobia I hope this technology makes it into practice ASAP.
Re:Does it work in reverse? (Score:5, Interesting)
It's never nice to have someone not take your phobia seriously.
I have absolutely no problem with needles - in fact I have locally anesthetized myself and performed minor surgery on myself (yes I am a doctor) on more than one occasion. But then again I cannot bear the sight of spiders... To each their own!
The good side is that if you can deliver a virus (or virus fragments) this way, you can deliver pretty much anything else, too. The down side is how much will it cost versus current methods. Hypodermics are very cheap. And of course there will always be practical limits - nothing will ever replace two short large bore catheters, or a central line for that matter, in certain situations...
Comment removed (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Does it work in reverse? (Score:5, Informative)
Well if needles are a problem and you just need routine blood work, you could probably negotiate capillary puncture [google.co.cr] with your doctor, instead of a needle. That's done with a lancet - like a mini knife - that cuts you with a spring mechanism. It happens so fast you really don't feel any pain at all. It's usually used on small children but there's no reason why it won't work on an adult. No needles involved.
For injections, however, you're out of luck - sorry!
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For injections, however, you're out of luck - sorry!
Perhaps use one of those air-forced-through-the-skin injection methods (Name escapes me). Hurts just as much if not more than the traditional way, but meets his no-needle requirement.
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Re:Does it work in reverse? (Score:4, Informative)
Jet Injector
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jet_injector [wikipedia.org]
Interestingly enough most people insist that it's based off the star trek hypospray machine, yet its actually the reverse, the hypospray is based off the jet injector.
It's been half a century and they're still not popular. Mainly because of cleaning issues, you still have cleaning/sterilization tasks but instead of cheap mass produced hypos you have a complicated machine. But secondarily, yes indeed they do hurt like unholy hell for a couple days. I got several vaccinations from jet injectors at reception station immediately before army basic training in the early 90s. "Tough Army Dudes" will put up with the pain but I can see how children would not tolerate it.
Also, from experience, its pretty brutal and a couple drops of "stuff" leaks back out the entrance hole. Admittedly its not a .45 caliber entrance wound here, its like the hole from a lancet. But I wonder what percentage injected leaks back out again.
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Keep telling yourself that; you might fool yourself into believing it. I'm diabetic. Right now, I use those lancets twice a day to test my blood glucose. I also give myself insulin every morning. Guess which one hurts more. One hint: it's not the hypo.
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Keep telling yourself that; you might fool yourself into believing it.
The perception of pain is subjective. Your mileage may vary. I've had open heart surgery, among other things, so I've been poked and prodded quite a few times too. Frankly I have no problem injecting myself, gluteus (a bit difficult to do on myself but I have managed), abdomen or deltoid. Try a chest tube because you have a tension pneumothorax due to Dressler's syndrome [wikipedia.org] one day, and drain 3L in 5 minutes. Then you w
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No thanks, I've already had enough experience with it. Two broken bones and several kidney stones were enough. I've been testing my bg for eight years, finally went on insulin back in May. If you do it just right, you literally don't feel the hypo; if not, there's a little sting. About the only way to handle the lancets and blood test is to learn not to mind the fact that it's going to hurt, every time.
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About the only way to handle the lancets and blood test is to learn not to mind the fact that it's going to hurt, every time.
Get an alternate site meter. Yes, fingertips hurt like hell, but I can barely feel it if I test on my arm.
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I was able to keep the unit set to 3.5 from the time I started using it in March '02, right up until I started insulin. Now, for some reason, it's up to 4. It always hurt, just not quite as much as it does now. As Lawrence said, "The trick is not minding that it hurts."
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Not a perfect solution; but they use those against anxiety and panic disorders for a reason...
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That's strange, for me a lancet (that of a glucose meter) hurted more than a needle pushed into the vein.
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No pain? hell... why isn't its use standard and in preference to needles, then?
Because it draws only so much blood. Some blood tests require more blood to run their tests. I know off hand that clotting tests require the blood to be extracted into a vacuum.
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I don't have a phobia but I still hate needles to the point of having dental work done without an anaesthetic. Actually in that case it was my hatred of having a numb mouth for 6 hours as much as my issues with needles.
How about using something similar to what animals that suck blood use to anaesthetise their victims? Mosquitoes manage to draw blood while you are asleep without waking you.
Re:Does it work in reverse? (Score:5, Funny)
I've removed splinters as well. Of course, I didn't use an anesthetic because I'm not a doctor.
Re:Does it work in reverse? (Score:5, Funny)
I've put splinters in. Without anesthetic, because I am a warrior.
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in fact I have locally anesthetized myself and performed minor surgery on myself (yes I am a doctor) on more than one occasion.
Appendectomy?
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=unkIVvjZc9Y [youtube.com]
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I don't cry but I've been known to faint. Does that count? Really sick as a kid with a _lot_ of shots and blood taken over about 6 years. Trust me, the needles they already have for shots designed for the comfort of diabetes are tiny compared to the pig stabbers of decades ago. You could probably fit two or three of them through the bore of a reusable old autoclave needle.
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People who suffer from vasovagal trypanophobia fear the sight, thought, or feeling of needles or needle-like objects. The primary symptom of vasovagal trypanophobia is vasovagal syncope, or fainting due to a decrease of blood pressure.
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Hypospray. (Score:2)
Another idea seemingly ripped straight from Star Trek and made into reality. As someone who just recently ordered their custom tailored Star Trek uniform (grey shoulders/coloured neck style), I heartily approve of this trend! Let's have replicators next, please.
*Disclaimer: Yes, I know that lots of tiny needs are not how hyposprays work, but please. The end result is close enough.
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*needles.
Re:Hypospray. (Score:5, Informative)
We already have hyposprays. They're called jet injectors. They actually predate star trek (they were invented in 1960) and have been used for decades for vaccinations, particularly polio vaccinations in Africa. A diabetic friend of mine also uses one for his insulin.
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They are also incredibly bad-ass, but they still make kids cry [wikimedia.org].
Re:Hypospray. (Score:5, Informative)
Because there is no needle(which is either an expensive FRU or a temptation to ill-equipped medical staff in the ass-end of nowhere to wash out and re-use until it is blunt), you can skip all the fancy western hospital one-time-use assemblies that would be impractical in the field; but avoid the cross-contamination that occurs if you share needles. Depending on the design, there might be a simple pneumatic tip that gets replaced each use; but it makes lining up an entire village somewhere and pumping them full of vaccine much more logistically feasible.
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I remember seeing one that had a foot pedal attached for repressurizing the reservoir in the field... I imagine getting shots from *that* was a treat!
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They are also incredibly bad-ass, but they still make kids cry.
Because they hurt like hell for a couple days. After all, you're being shot, admittedly with a small caliber liquid bullet.
The kid is crying because the kid saw other kids crying the day after their vaccination.
Its interesting that for me, needles only hurt while they're stabbing you, afterwards its unnoticeable, whereas my experience with jet injectors is that the injection itself hurts less than a playful punch, but a few minutes later the pain from tissue damage starts and it continues for about a day.
M
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As someone who just recently ordered their custom tailored Star Trek uniform...
Uh oh.
We already have hyposprays. They're called jet injectors. They actually predate star trek (they were invented in 1960) and have been used for decades for vaccinations...
The US used to have mass inoculation campaigns using those things. The U.S. Army used them for decades. Worked fine. The latest generation of the technology [dantonioconsultants.com] is small, battery-powered, and uses reusable cartridges. The problem is that either the whol
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Yeah, I went to boot camp in 1975. We spent uncounted hours in line to get inoculations. A number of them were done with those jet injectors, but many were done with needles. That "A" shot was the killer. It had to go into a buttock, it had to go in deep, and they used a HUGE frigging needle. And, after they injected the stuff, you had to work out, to get the gob of stuff to circulate, or it would just stay right there, and make your lower body stiffen up.
At least that's the story they told us. I thin
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It reminds me more of the fast-acting transdermal patches that Babylon 5 was fond of. [youtube.com]
Oh, and: SPOILER ALERT. Sorta. [penny-arcade.com]
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Another idea seemingly ripped straight from Star Trek
It's "derms" from Neuromancer [google.com], you philistine.
Derm [wikipedia.org]
An adhesive patch applied to the skin in order to transmit a drug transdermally.
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Though that sounds much more like an amusing weapon than a means of healing someone.
A gun that shoots healing? Genius!
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Now we just need it to fire in blue or red rays for observational purposes..
Hmmmm (Score:2, Informative)
I remember seeing an article about this idea in a popular science magazine years and years ago. Glad to see it's still around for those who hate needles.
glad? (Score:2)
A needle sortof awares you if some foreign agent is introduced in your body.
Imagine this scenario: you create patches of some sort, or bandaids or somehow "inject" people unknowingly to themselves and repeat a the story at Pont-Saint-Esprit [dailymail.co.uk], but very subtle?
I'm not a "oh noes the mercury in vaccins"-nut, but I sortof like the fact that there's a bit of a barriere before introducing chemicals or organic compounds directly into my bloodstream of which I
...and pediatricians and family docs rejoice! (Score:5, Insightful)
Immunizations are certainly the number one reason why children between the ages of about 9 months and six years hate going to the doctor and will kick and scream and flail as soon as they see anybody come into the exam room with a stethoscope. Vaccine patches would be great, particularly if they made it look like a sticker (which are second only to popsicles in the ability to placate an irritated youngster). Now if they'd only figure out a way to make looking in the ears and mouth easier, we'd be set!
Re:...and pediatricians and family docs rejoice! (Score:5, Funny)
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I think you'll get the same response in both cases: "There he is, Officers! Don't let him get away!"
Re:...and pediatricians and family docs rejoice! (Score:5, Funny)
Putting the "sensual" back in "non-consensual" :)
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You give the kid a pretty patch, he admires the picture, slaps it on his arm, falls asleep, and you can spend the next 10, 20, or 30 minutes poking and prodding. Problem solved, right?
Errr - maybe not. The little brat will tell all his friends at daycare about the patch that made him sleepy, and the next batch of brats will cry when you offer them a patch.
Why do people keep having kids, anyway? They are such great pains! *
* Disclaimer - I have three little brats of my own, and I STILL want to know why pe
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Vaccine patches would be great, particularly if they made it look like a sticker
I hope it adsorbs quickly. If the sticker is generic or not their favorite character, they immediately peel it off their skin/clothes and throw it away, or if it is their favorite character they immediately peel it off and admire it.
which are second only to popsicles in the ability to placate an irritated youngster
So, put the medication inside the freaking popsicle. Hmm, thats a good idea, medicated popsicles. Wonder why those aren't commercially available? Oh yes, that was patented in 1995. Maybe in a few decades we'll be able to benefit from that idea, but not until then.
http://www [patentstorm.us]
Genius (Score:5, Insightful)
It is often said that true genius is coming up with the idea that makes everyone say "I could have thought of that".
One of the problems with transdermal patches has always been one of controlling dosage. This is because the skin is only permeable to lipids, thanks to layers of keratin on the outside and the basement membrane lying inconveniently just before you get to any blood vessels. So anything that you needed to give your patient via the skin had to be fat-soluble, or it just wouldn't work. And then you have the problems of concentration gradients, skin thickness, how long you leave the patch on, and how "greasy" that person's natural skin is anyway. That makes for a lot of variables in delivery. Which means you can never be exactly sure of the dose.
By piercing through the skin's outer layers into the dermis with a "microneedle", suddenly you've eliminated a few things: 1) You can deliver hydrophyllic substances (like certain viruses or their components, for example) and 2) you can control dosage much much more accurately because you can be sure that what you're delivering is going to make it to the bloodstream versus lying around in the epidermis and or never getting off the patch in the first place.
I foresee that this technology will soon be used for much more than pediatric vaccine delivery and the creators will become very rich indeed. This doctor thinks it's a great idea. In fact the only problem is going to be for those allergic people - with previous patches all they would get is red skin, an itch, and maybe a localized rash. Now they risk a full blown type I allergic reaction.
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So, basically, someone needs to make sure that both types of patches will co-exist.
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> In fact the only problem is going to be for those allergic people
> - with previous patches all they would get is red skin, an itch, and maybe a localized rash.
> Now they risk a full blown type I allergic reaction.
Just curious - does the immune system react to foreign stuff entering the body via the skin surface differently from entering via the digestive system or intramuscular or straight into the bloodstream?
Re:Genius (Score:5, Informative)
What's the point of a single-use patch?
You have obviously never had to approach a screaming 2 year old with a needle in your hand. Besides the red face, the 120 decibels, and the snot everywhere, there's that look on the parents' faces that says "you only get one go".
No but seriously, there are all sorts of applications outside of pediatrics. For example palliative care - terminal patients who need regular medication can just use a patch instead of trying to find someone to inject them every 6 hours or so (ever tried injecting yourself? It can be done but it's not fun - especially when you're weak and/or dying and you can't really remember if you just did it or not). Senior citizens. Diabetics. The sky is the limit. This is something new, and the full implications of this technology haven't been explored yet.
Re:Genius (Score:5, Interesting)
Yeah... that and a 6'3 415lb body builder with wild eyes being held down by 6 people to have blood drawn with a needle. What I have to tell people is:
1) Don't let me see the needle. Otherwise it's over and you might have some structural problems with the building when I "leave".
2) Somebody needs to put their whole body weight down on my arm when you do it.
Even then it takes every single ounce of will I have to not lose it. It's a real problem. I have to have full anesthesia to get any kind of dental work done. One time a dentist thought I was kidding and surprised me with a needle in the face. My reaction was so severe I cracked his chair backwards trying to get away from it. Damn things are expensive.
I have a family history of diabetes on both sides. So far I have lucked out. I have a legitimate concern about the day I might be forced to use a needle. It would be hell on Earth.
This patch could be life changing, albeit for a very small part of the population, but still life changing.
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Yeah... that and a 6'3 415lb body builder with wild eyes being held down by 6 people to have blood drawn with a needle.
Ha! I call B.S. Any real bodybuilder would already be injecting steroids in his ass on a weekly basis!
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I'm going to guess that you've tried therapy to get over it, but in case you haven't, there are some treatments that can be quite effective in countering phobias. A few people I know who would have full-blown panic attacks in certain situations (driving, flying, seeing certain animals, and in one case a needle phobia) have been successfully treated and it does seem to be life changing for them. If it's as bad as you say - and it sounds like it's pretty bad for you - it might be worth checking out if you hav
Re:Genius (Score:5, Insightful)
That's pathetic. Suck it up and act like an adult.
Now, does that work for all phobias, or just the ones you don't have?
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Well... I don't know about any of that. Been told I scare children and bruise fruit, but I think they were talking about my whole face.
Re:Genius (Score:4, Informative)
Thats an oversimplification
Well yes, this is a slashdot post and not a doctoral thesis.
Meh... (Score:4, Insightful)
Now get off my lawn.
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Minor surgery without anesthesia also builds character. But I'd prefer local anesthesia -- to each their own.
Gee, thanks. (Score:5, Funny)
So now when the kids misbehave I won't be able to threaten them with shots from the doctor. Takes the fun right out of parenting...
Re:Gee, thanks. (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Gee, thanks. (Score:5, Insightful)
And here I thought this story was about patients having thin skin...
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And here I thought this story was about patients having thin skin...
If the patients had thin skin, it wouldn't really be an issue, would it? It's the thick skin that's harder to pierce.
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On behalf of people with a sense of humor, I'd like to advise you, ah nevermind, it's not even worth the trouble.
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Try it sometime. The mental pain lasts longer than the physical.
lulz (Score:3, Funny)
THINK OF THE CHILDREN!
press releases from universities are worth what? (Score:4, Informative)
odd how this story about good ole american know-how resembles this press release from an australian university from April?
http://www.uq.edu.au/news/index.html?article=21034
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could never completely replace the needle (Score:2, Interesting)
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On with the discussion folks. Nothing more to see here.
The Horror! (Score:5, Funny)
"Wait, what is this, why did you have a band aid in your hand?" *passes out*
"The pwning has just begun, Billy Lumpkins. I'll teach you to troll the warlock forum."
Some details from the article... (Score:4, Informative)
The needles are conical, about 200m diameter by 650m long, with 10m radius of curvature at the tip. They are made from a biocompatible polymer, polyvinylpyrrolidone, and mostly dissolve after about five minutes (they are highly water-soluble). The manufacturing process can be done at 23C (using a mold), avoiding damage to sensitive biological molecules. Each patch held 3 g of vaccine.
For comparison purposes, human hair ranges in diameter from 20-200m.
Here's the article [nature.com], with some low-res pictures even for non-subscribers.
Re:Some details from the article... (Score:4, Funny)
Slashdot has eaten my unicode. All those "m"s should be micrometers.
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I guess this is what happens when Americans attempt to use the metric system...
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I kid you not, I was in a in Germany store about 2 months ago, there was a bunch of tourists, a couple came to a meat counter and the guy said: "I would like 100 kilograms" of some sausage. The woman at the counter looked funny at him and I intervened knowing how punctual the Germans sometimes are.
This is dangerous. (Stealth injections) (Score:2, Insightful)
Now people will be able to inject others with toxins and it will be impossible to detect it.
What you have is a stealth needle, this idea in my opinion is incredibly dangerous, but I guess it will be good for mercenaries because it will reduce the costs.
There is a reason why we can feel needles.
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More generally, the reason that this 'biocompatible microneedle array' stuff is considered medically interesting is because it lets you get the vaccine you want past the skin, rather than being forced to choose from agents that already pass through skin properly, or re-developing a vaccine from the drawing board to make sure that it is capable o
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There is a reason why we can feel needles.
Yes, because they puncture nerves that proceed to yell "invasion! our outer barrier has been breached! potentially fatal wound! need help here, right now!" and the only reason we only feel a prick and not excruciating pain is that it is only a few nerves screaming.
Your point being? Anything that could potentially be abused should be outlawed? I guess we as a species decided to leave that road when we choose to use fire instead of abandoning the concept as potentially dangerous.
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There is a reason why we can feel needles.
Yes, because they puncture nerves that proceed to yell "invasion! our outer barrier has been breached! potentially fatal wound! need help here, right now!" and the only reason we only feel a prick and not excruciating pain is that it is only a few nerves screaming.
Your point being? Anything that could potentially be abused should be outlawed? I guess we as a species decided to leave that road when we choose to use fire instead of abandoning the concept as potentially dangerous.
When did I say it should be outlawed?
What I said is we need to be realistic and stop pretending like we are safe, or pretending like some authority can keep us safe. Nobody is safe and nothing can keep anybody safe.
Wakefield (not Rick) (Score:2)
So will Andrew Wakefield be using his copious free time in forced retirement to mount a pseudo-religious campaign against these patches, too?
Is this new?? (Score:2)
I remember reading about microneedle patches all the time in the 1990s. It was vaporware.
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So, you see, that "in ten to twenty years" prediction may actually be pretty close!
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Seems a very useful tool (Score:2)
For vaccine delivery.
I wonder how difficult it would to make something similar in a very small, low-cost lab.
This could be really good thing in places where a lot of people who don't have a lot of money need a vaccine.
Re:Is this available with caffeine!? (Score:5, Funny)
There's nothing a double hit, if you know what I mean.
You mean you accidentally the decaf?
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The autism/vaccine correlation does not exist, however kids that don't get vaccines prove with 100% accuracy that their parents are fucking retarded.