White Knight Testing X-37 86
mknewman writes "The innovative carrier plane used to air-launch SpaceShipOne has a new mission. At its inland spaceport in Mojave, Calif., the White Knight mothership has been involved in fit and high-speed taxi checks with a new passenger: the X-37, an unpiloted, reusable space plane. "
Private Space May Be The Only Game Left (Score:5, Interesting)
Fortunately there are newer, less expensive methods for delivering payloads into LEO and with this vehicle it will be possible to perform much of what NASA proposed doing with the ISS with a fraction of the cost.
Universities would be a good customer for this type of launch/service space company because the payloads launched by NASA come with significant strings attached to them and they do not get to control the vehicle once launched.
How much do you think a partnership between a university and a private company could save by doing their own space probes?
Re:Private Space May Be The Only Game Left (Score:2)
Re:Private Space May Be The Only Game Left (Score:3, Insightful)
I've got a FAN!!!
Goody!
There are NOT newer and less expensive methods..
Really?
Ask the folks over at DirecTV [directv.com].
If you read the press release it said nothing about using NASA for the launch.
Re:Private Space May Be The Only Game Left (Score:4, Funny)
So what? I've got several. One for my processor, one for my graphics card, one for my power supply, and one for me
Re:Private Space May Be The Only Game Left (Score:1)
I agree with you that the costs will be lowered. Additionally, we will not need to risk human lives as well.
I hope universities will get a part of that action as well. I know many universities do research for NASA; my university does. The MARS rovers, Spirit and Opportunity, were designed with collaboration with CMU and other universities.
I believe partnerships with private companies and universities will save
Re:Private Space May Be The Only Game Left (Score:2)
My advisor graduated from UofArizona and they did quite a bit of the hydrogeology research for the Mars landers.
I believe partnerships with private companies and universities will save a great deal of money and time. NASA has always subcontracted a lot of services to the pri
LEO should be left to private, NASA needs moon/mar (Score:3, Insightful)
NASA should be about advancing our capabilities many fold. This does not mean doing the same damn thing we have been doing for nearly 50 years which is playing around in orbit of our own planet.
NASA should be about goals outside the capabilites (read monetary concerns) of privates/corporations. This means setting up on the moon and eventually getting to Mars.
Scenario.
Re:LEO should be left to private, NASA needs moon/ (Score:1)
How would you ensure that companies from other countries than US get to use this plan too?
Re:Private Space May Be The Only Game Left (Score:3, Informative)
Exactly what newer methods? What is "this vehicle"? The White Knight? The White Knight is a conventional air craft that goes no where near LEO. Perhaps you are talking about the X-37? While it is testing new, cheaper space travel technologies, I don't see how it can do what the ISS can do,
Re:Private Space May Be The Only Game Left (Score:2)
This platform [sea-launch.com].
Get your facts straight.
Which facts?
Just because they weren't listed... (Score:2)
Re:Private Space May Be The Only Game Left (Score:2)
Ahh the irony of someone who doens't know what the X37 is telling someone who does to get their facts straight. One of the purposes of the X37 is long term space experimentation.
The X-37 is intended to be (initially) lifted to LEO by the shuttle. It has a 7'x4' bay for carrying up to 500 pounds of experiments for durations of up to 21 da
Re:How does this relate to the America's Space Pri (Score:5, Interesting)
Burt Rutan may be a superhero, but he needs to eat, just like everybody else. He is not a charity. It doesn't seem like White Knight or its pilots were doing much anyway. I can't imagine that renting out a plane to NASA is a huge distraction.
Rutan's current project, Virgin Galactic, has nothing to do with orbital flight. It is merely a souped-up version of Spaceship One. Rutan has himself said that scaling up to an orbital spacecraft would be many orders of magnitude more difficult and expensive, and it doesn't seem to be a priority for him right now.
And in what sense is this selling out? If taking Richard Branson's and Paul Allen's money was not selling out, then how does it follow that he is tainting his principles by helping NASA out with a test platform for reusable space technology?
Re:How does this relate to the America's Space Pri (Score:2)
Perhaps my post was poorly worded.
Is Rutan going to advance the cause of civilian orbital spaceflight or not? I was under the impression that he was. I thought he was onboard for the Bigalow orbital prize. Perhaps this is due to my confusion over the myriad prizes and programs out there today.
If he is, then I don't understand how helping DoD furthers that cause. If he isn't, then by all means go for the bucks. No troll intended.
Re:How does this relate to the America's Space Pri (Score:3, Insightful)
He's developed SS1. He has test pilots on his payroll that he probably has contractual obligations to pay whether they're doing something or not.
Both SS1 and its pilots are currently not doing anything, and operating them right now doesn't take ANY resources away from other projects. By renting out SS1, he's converting a possible money sink into a moneymaker, money he can use to further the development projects he wants to pursue.
Re:How does this relate to the America's Space Pri (Score:2)
And yes, my point was that it takes 0 resources from the design people, and minimal resources from other people (test pilots/maintenance) that were probably idle to begin with, and the money coming in from these rentals will fund the new designs.
Re:America's Space Prize (Score:2)
Re:America's Space Prize (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:he didn't use much of a TPS at all (Score:2)
What? Didn't he get that memo?
Re:How does this relate to the America's Space Pri (Score:4, Informative)
He has made an ultra-low cost ground attack fighter and an experimental flying scale model of a tactical transport airplane.
White Knights sister ship, Proteous, has been dropping various smart bombs as a "UAV Surrogate" for DoD testing for the last year.
Re:How does this relate to the America's Space Pri (Score:1)
From what I understand this is pretty much business as usual for him. You know, the sort of thing that is going to pay for that civilian orbital flight of yours?
this X37 design (Score:2, Interesting)
Real-life crash (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Real-life crash (Score:3, Informative)
And to the moderator who modded me down, WTF?! It does look similar
Ok, well maybe except for the big holes in the hull.
Re:Real-life crash (Score:2)
Re:Real-life crash (Score:1)
This is one of the reasons the space shuttle has a huge vertical tail.
Another point.. the B52- High and Mighty - NASA 008 was actually retired after the X-43A scramjet test last year. So now they have to find another plane to do the job. Scaled Composites is just another comp
Re:./ed (Score:1, Informative)
Why? (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Why? (Score:3, Insightful)
Just take a look at the two:
B52 - 8 big jet engines, combat crew of 5 (probably smaller for most NASA missions), 159 feet long.
White Knight - Not entirely familiar with the specs on this plane, but it looks like it has two engines, a crew of one or two, and is probably about 45 feet long or so (just guessing from photos and comparing it to length of X 37).
The White Knight is likely much cheaper to operate than a B-52, so that would proba
Re:Why? (Score:1)
Re:Why? (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Why? (Score:2)
It was modified to carry the X-15 but they have also carried Hounddog missiles, SRAMS, ALCMs,and Harpoon anti ship missiles.
You are correct that the White Knight is without a doubt cheaper to operate. Not to mention the B-52 NASA uses is the last flying B-52a in the world. Odds are NASA will want to save it for payloads that are too heavy or need to be dropped at a higher speed than the White Knight can handle. In sort it is in this case the White Knight is the best tool for
Re:Why? (Score:1)
Re:Why? (Score:2)
Re:Why? (Score:2)
Re:Why? (Score:2, Informative)
http://www.nasa.gov/missions/research/index.html [nasa.gov]
http://www.nasa.gov/centers/dryden/news/FactSheets
http://www.nasa.gov/news/special/747_Shuttle_Carri ers.html [nasa.gov]
http://www.dfrc.nasa.gov/Gallery/Photo/ [nasa.gov]
Re:Why? Answer: Cost (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Why? Answer: Cost (Score:2)
The last mission the old warhorse did was the Hyper-X mission and they had the devils' own time with the fuel transfer system. They finally managed to avoid aborting the mission by using the air refuelling management panel.
Re:Why? Answer: Cost (Score:3, Interesting)
I wonder too if Scaled isn't charging something closer to marginal cost rather than average costs (e.g. not accounting for sunk costs in the fee). I can think of several strategic reasons to do so, not the least of which this is a one time opportunity to demonstrate that this kind of thing co
Re:Why? Answer: Cost (Score:1)
Re:Why? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Why? (Score:2)
Re:Why? (Score:2)
Furthermore, you need to look at carry-launch styles: White Knight was custom designed for a belly launch method. While the launch method requires a custom plane (its downside), the upside is that it simply works better once you'v
Same Ol' Same Ol' (Score:2, Insightful)
They start down a promising path of cheaper, more efficient access to orbit, just ditch the research.
Personally, I think it's the middle managers that are screwing everything up. Administrations and directors come and go, but the morons in the middle are always around.
Re:Same Ol' Same Ol' (Score:2)
Government agencies are not equipped to commercialize basic scientific research. The shuttle was an attempt to make space flight more routine and cheap, but has instead become incredibly expensive and dangerous.
Bloated? (Score:2, Troll)
Cost of the X37 -- $173 million.
The article didn't say if this is $173 million is just for the X37 prototype or for one that can actually be used. My guess is the former.
Re:Bloated? (Score:5, Interesting)
Cost of the X37 -- $173 million.
Maximum speed of spaceship one - mach 3.5
Maximum speed of X37 - mach 25
Re:Bloated? (Score:2)
Space ship one, while not an orbital vehicle, actually travels under its own power.
Re:Bloated? - more info (Score:1)
Pilot of X-37: Software (not remote controlled)
Customer of SS1: Nobody
Customer of X-37: NASA, Air Force, and DARPA
X-planes are *not* prototypes (Score:1)
just the right size for atomic bombs (Score:1)
cheap (Score:1)
Re:cheap (Score:2)
Those 8 engines you see on the B-52 are old, very thirsty turbojets. Fuel costs for this plane are a mutha.
Re:cheap (Score:2)
Re:cheap (Score:2)
Re:Think they should change the name? (Score:2)
You mean like this [coasterforce.com]?
Reality can be scary...
Re:Think they should change the name? (Score:2)
It's you.
Re:Think they should change the name? (Score:2)
Zyklon is the German word for cyclone. Are they not allowed to use that word anymore?
Plagiarism (Score:1, Troll)
Re:Plagiarism (Score:1)
A Miracle! (Score:2)
Poor NASA, and Poor us. (Score:2, Insightful)
It seems like we want our species to end on this godforsaken rock.
White knight a Wunderwaffen? (Score:2)
Re:White knight a Wunderwaffen? (Score:2)