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Space

Cosmos Solar Sail Getting Close To Launch 182

Posted by simoniker from the shimmering dept.
digitalcaffeine writes "The Guardian is reporting that US and Russian scientists are planning to launch a spacecraft that will use solar sails to move about in space. This venture, called Cosmos 1, is backed by the Planetary Society and Cosmos Studios. The spacecraft, finally due for launch in late 2004 or early 2005, will use a converted SS-N-18 submarine launched ballistic missile fired from beneath the Barents Sea to get it into a 800 x 1000 km elliptical orbit. It will then unfurl its 15m sails and start moving about. So, for all the governments that have been working on a similar project, the first solar-sailed spacecraft is going to be from a private venture." An update on the official site notes that "The world's first solar sail craft is nearing completion. All electronic systems are now flight qualified and were delivered to the spacecraft for final assembly and testing" - we previously reported on the Cosmos Project and the efficacy of solar sails.
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Cosmos Solar Sail Getting Close To Launch More

Cosmos Solar Sail Getting Close To Launch

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  • Who retasked the Guidance System? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by aelbric ( 145391 ) on Monday August 16, 2004 @06:46PM (#9985809)
    I hope they were reliable. Somehow I don't think NORAD will care for excuses if an SS-N-18 starts dropping towards Chicago.

  • But... (Score:5, Funny)

    by fiannaFailMan ( 702447 ) on Monday August 16, 2004 @06:46PM (#9985810) Journal
    will it be ready in time to get Count Dooku back to Coruscant?

  • SS-N-18? (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward
    A private venture has had access to an intercontinental missile??
  • ... most people expect it sail off the edge of the world.

  • Cold War Rockets Better? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by cephyn ( 461066 ) on Monday August 16, 2004 @06:50PM (#9985854) Homepage
    I think its great that former weapons are being used for constructive science. Continues a long tradition. Plus, I bet those missiles are the most reliable chemical launch vehicles around -- the military does not mess around when trying to kill people, and frowns heavily on equipment failure. (as a rule)

    And was all that talk (Sagan's wife) about it being visible to the world true? Or was it metaphorical? I can't imagine it being THAT big at this point...

  • Space debris (Score:4, Insightful)

    by tao_of_biology ( 666898 ) <(moc.liamg) (ta) (ygoloib.fo.oat)> on Monday August 16, 2004 @06:50PM (#9985857)

    That sail makes a nice big, easy to penetrate target (no BBW jokes, please).

    The article describes the sail as thinner than a garbage back. Even the tiniest speck of space junk would would easily blow a hole in this. And, if that happens enough times, and especially with bigger pieces of space junk, won't it be filled with thousands of various sized holes?

    It doesn't seem like it's being put into orbit high enough to avoid this kind of damage. Obviously they thought of this... are the holes inconsequential?

    • Re:Space debris (Score:5, Informative)

      by Carnildo ( 712617 ) on Monday August 16, 2004 @07:04PM (#9985977) Homepage Journal
      It doesn't seem like it's being put into orbit high enough to avoid this kind of damage. Obviously they thought of this... are the holes inconsequential?

      Pretty much. The material is so thin, holes made by space debris won't be larger than the debris itself, and most of the stuff up there is sandgrain size or smaller. Given the size of the sail, a bajillion pinholes won't reduce the effective area much.

  • Japanese solar sail (Score:5, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday August 16, 2004 @06:51PM (#9985863)
    Earlier this month the Japanesesuccessfully deployed two solar sails [isas.jaxa.jp].

    • Re:Japanese solar sail (Score:4, Insightful)

      by PaulBu ( 473180 ) on Monday August 16, 2004 @07:04PM (#9985978) Homepage
      From the official site:

      The mission goal - to fly the first controlled solar sail flight - remains the same.

      I guess the "controlled" part is important. The sail itself is actually a set of blades which can be tilted to steer the craft.

      Paul B.

    • Re:Japanese solar sail (Score:2, Insightful)

      by Celt ( 125318 )
      America had nothing to do with it so it did'ent happen :)
      Actually has anyone been to the space museum beside the meteor crater in Arizona? It lists everything about space except in leaves out one minor detail Russia never went to space apparently

  • Solar Sails... (Score:5, Funny)

    by Icarus1919 ( 802533 ) on Monday August 16, 2004 @06:53PM (#9985889)
    Now that we have solar sails, it's only a matter of time before we need to start worrying about space pirates.

    Where's Samus when you need her?

  • Why use the sub? (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward
    Geez, talk about adding needless complexity and risk. Too many Russian subs submerge more times than they surface.

    So why the sub? Extra publicity?

    • Re:Why use the sub? (Score:3, Interesting)

      by Kesha ( 5861 )
      I agree, but I think it's because it's the cheapest rocket they can ride on. A commercial launch of SS-N-18 from a submarine is a double win for the Russian NAVY - they essentially get paid for a "live" battle drill. It helps them evaluate their battle readiness and get paid in the process. It would make sense for them to make this launch affordable, but with a few strings attached, such as launching from a submerged sub.

      Of course, this is what I think is happening, I can't be sure exactly...

      Paul.
      • with a few strings attached, such as launching from a submerged sub.

        Actually, IIRC modern missiles are designed to be cold-launched from a submerged submarine. Compressed air forces the missiles from the silo and the engine is not ignited until the missile breaks the surface of the water. The earliest generation missiles were hot-launched with the engine ignited within the silo, but tended to cause a lot of damage making for expensive repairs. I'm assuming the same goes for Russian submarines.
    • CHEAP!

      that's right. CHEAP. of course it's not cheap if you would first build the sub from scratch for it.

      but when you can buy services from a sub or the whole damn sub for el cheapo then why not, especially if you get a ballistic missile to use as the rocket base thrown into the deal as well?

    • Re:Why use the sub? (Score:5, Informative)

      by harborpirate ( 267124 ) on Monday August 16, 2004 @09:18PM (#9986785)
      For the sub launch, another poster helpfully posted the following information:

      Near Earth, Solar Sails are particularly suited for high orbital inclination satellite missions. Weather forecasting and global positioning systems would directly benefit from satellites orbiting the poles. Most satellites take advantage of the natural speed of Earth's rotation to boost them into an orbit relatively close to the equatorial plane. Changing the plane requires a large fuel burn for a conventional rocket and greatly increases launch costs. With its small but continuous thrust, a solar sail can reach polar orbits without a massive fuel payload, making them more accessible to scientific research.
      It would appear that the scientists want to insert the satellite into a polar orbit, which is confirmed by the fact that the launch point will be the Barents Sea, part of the Arctic Ocean. Since this location is a rather inhospitable region for a conventional launch, the scientists have rather ingeniously selected a submarine launch. The Russian military is highly likely to be the provider making this available for a "reasonable" price, since the mission is scientific in nature. Thus it poses no threat to them, while providing profit where it is much needed.

      The reason for using a ballistic missle is that Russia is brimming with extra ballistic missles. They've been decommisioning hundreds, if not thousands of former nuclear missles over the last couple decades. This does not mean they've destroyed the entire missle, merely that the nuclear warheads have been removed, and they're no longer housed in silos or subs for launch against other countries. Since the rockets were designed to carry nuclear payloads, they are both powerful and highly reliable. This obviously makes them an ideal platform for carrying anything into orbit which they can be fitted to carry.

      This situation is really a win-win propostion. The scientists get a powerful, highly reliable launch platform and rocket in an inhospitable launch location for likely a rather sweet price. The Russian military gets rid of a decommisoned rocket they just had laying around anyway, and gets to run one of their subs through a launch test complete with the actual launching of a rocket, plus they make a profit on the deal.

  • 15m Solar Sails a bit small? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Kotukunui ( 410332 ) on Monday August 16, 2004 @06:58PM (#9985931)
    IANASSE (Solar Sail Expert), but 15m sounds a little small. I mean we are talking about pushing a satellite around with *photons*. I guess the amount of energy required to move a spacecraft in orbit is miniscule. I remember reading an article about early space efforts that said something like "the smallest rocket motors are little more than cap-gun ammunition but, they are sufficient to nudge a spacecraft in orbit"
    • I've also heard it said that contemplated solar sail designs will have roughly the same force of acceleration as dropping a piece of notebook paper from one inch here on Earth. That's nothing by itself, but you have free fuel and time to kill.
    • 15m may be small for human+support payloads. But its still pretty big -- imagine you're standing in a slight, steady breeze. Run into the wind. Not too hard. Now open a "small" umbrella, maybe 1-2m across. Put it behind you. Now try running into the wind. That breeze, caught by the umbrella, is now a pretty formidible Force.
    • Yes it is a small area but remember that in space there's no air resistance and friction of any kind to sap your speed so even a small acceleration can build up to an enormous speed over time.

      The key question is the weight of the craft. On the Planetary Society website they state that the mass of their craft is 100kg. Sunlight in Earth orbit is able to exert about 9.12 microNewtons of force per square metre. So a sail 15m^2 will be pushed by up to 137 microNewtons. This tiny force applied to the weight of

  • Using this technology (Score:3, Interesting)

    by thephotoman ( 791574 ) on Monday August 16, 2004 @07:01PM (#9985949) Journal
    What would this technology be used for in the short-term, though? It seems to me that without an immediate way to utilize this solar sail, there cannot be a profitable business application. It belongs more in the realm of the government at this time, as the government doesn't need to turn a profit.
    • Not all privately funded research is focussed on immediate short-term profits. Some people / businesses do look much further. First of all, it would validate the feasibility of the process. Second, it would help show up any issues that could be serious problems in a "real" application. Third, in the longer term it is clear that travel outside our solar system would require some energy source beside packing that much more fuel (which adds weight increasing the amount of fuel needed ...)

    • That's why the Planetary Society is involved. Not only does it not need to turn a profit, it isn't allowed to :-)

      • "The Long Range Foundation found itself making an embarassing amount of profit for a non-profit organization, so it began happily wasting money on ideas that wouldn't even begin show promise for at least a generation." --Paraphrasing Robert A. Heinlein, "Time for the Stars"
    • Not a whole lot in the short term but it's very important in the long term.

      Thin film reflective objects in space aren't only potentially useful as a means of propulsion but also as just plain old mirrors.

      The Russians tried to deploy a mirror back in 1999. It didn't work but part of the intention was to put a bright "star" in the sky for Siberia so they would have more daylight. Not too bad of an idea if you ask me.

      Don't forget the idea of space based solar power generation. You can buy a lot more Myla

  • Solar sail mechanics? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by delibes ( 303485 ) on Monday August 16, 2004 @07:01PM (#9985952)
    Can anyone shed light (sorry, bad pun) on the following:

    1) The 5 year solar sail propelled mission to Pluto - is there a way to decelerate as you reach Pluto? Actually, is it really 5 years constant thrust or does the solar sail's thrust decrease as an inverse square law as you get more distant from the sun?

    2) Can you sail "upstream" into the solar wind? Is it possible to tack and jibe in a solar sail propelled craft?!

    • 2) if Yes, it answers 1) -- you could tack around into a matching orbit. Is 2) possible? I don't know for sure, but I bet with sophisticated enough engineering and dynamic shaping of the sail, yes.
    • Comment removed based on user account deletion

    • Re:Solar sail mechanics? (Score:4, Informative)

      by MyHair ( 589485 ) on Monday August 16, 2004 @07:16PM (#9986060) Journal
      1: Rocket propelled probes so far don't decelerate (much?); they just enter orbit with careful aiming.

      2: Tacking in a water-based sailboat uses the water to prevent lateral motion. Try sailing without any sort of keel/centerboard or asymmetric hulls or rudder--you can't go towards the wind this way. Hmmm...I wonder if chemical or ion propulsion could be used as lateral resistance with solar sails in an analog to hybrid gas/electric cars...would there be any economy or advantage to that?
      • I know only basic physics, so I am probably just talking out of my ass here, but...

        I have heard it commented elsewhere that it may be possible to use gravity as the countering force for tacking with a solar sail. Does anyone know if this is possible, or is it just a bad sci-fi element?

        • I have heard it commented elsewhere that it may be possible to use gravity as the countering force for tacking with a solar sail. Does anyone know if this is possible, or is it just a bad sci-fi element?

          Sounds reasonable to me, but I'm too tired to imagine all the vectors. However with water this is lateral resistance for any direction when the keel/centerboard is deployed or if an asymmetrical hull is under way, but with a solar sail gravity won't be as convenient as water.

          By the way, in another thread
    • 1) The 5 year solar sail propelled mission to Pluto - is there a way to decelerate as you reach Pluto?

      Well you could arrange to arrive with enough velocity to enter orbit around Pluto. That's not slowing down, you just start going in circles.

      As for coming back, I don't know how. I don't think you can tack back, as doing so in a boat relies upon the force of the water against your boat. There's no water in space so I don't think that will work.

  • Interesting Uses for Solar Sails (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Zentakz ( 618981 ) on Monday August 16, 2004 @07:01PM (#9985955)
    Posted before under the Japanese Solar Sail Deployment:
    Though Solar Sails are often associated with interstellar travel they have many extremely useful applications in Earth orbit and local solar system exploration. Most potential applications take advantage of the continuous thrust and zero fuel payload of a solar sail.

    Near Earth, Solar Sails are particularly suited for high orbital inclination satellite missions. Weather forecasting and global positioning systems would directly benefit from satellites orbiting the poles. Most satellites take advantage of the natural speed of Earth's rotation to boost them into an orbit relatively close to the equatorial plane. Changing the plane requires a large fuel burn for a conventional rocket and greatly increases launch costs. With its small but continuous thrust, a solar sail can reach polar orbits without a massive fuel payload, making them more accessible to scientific research.

    Away from Earth, Solar Sails offer a number of other interesting options. Missions have been proposed for asteroid rendezvous, travel to the inner planets (yes, solar sails can travel toward the sun), and an interesting idea using Lagrange points. More advanced solar sails could use their continuous thrust to enlarge the regions where they are able to "hover" well away from Earth. This allows much better observation of solar activity. Solar sails not only have an appealing sci-fi flair, but appear to be quite practical as well. I hope to see the technology develop rapidly.
    • (yes, solar sails can travel toward the sun)

      Um, how? I just got done posting that you couldn't sail into the "wind" without some form of lateral resistance. Inquiring minds want to know...

      Or is it just a matter of using solar energy to slow down solar orbiting speed to 'fall' towards the sun?
      • using the sail to slow down is one way. the other way would be the same way a sailboat sails into the wind, no?

        • Re:Interesting Uses for Solar Sails (Score:4, Informative)

          by Moofie ( 22272 ) <lee@ringofsat u r n.com> on Monday August 16, 2004 @07:45PM (#9986267) Homepage
          Tacking into the wind requires a keel, and there's no corollary with a solar sail. You can use the sail to slow down, though, decreasing your orbital energy and bringing you towards the sun.

        • well. yes, no.. (Score:3, Informative)

          by Fuzzums ( 250400 )
          My first thought was the same.

          My second thought said 'no'. This had something to do with the way the sails work.
          The wind blows against the sail and behind the sail a lower air-pressure (wing effect) pulls the boat forward. But there is also a pushing effect against the sail... So this was BS.

          But why does a sailboat sail into the wind? Resistance of the water. It's the shape of the boat, combined with the rudder combined with the resistance of the water that resolves in a forward force. This only works is

          • Re:well. yes, no.. (Score:3, Informative)

            by cephyn ( 461066 )
            right, but with a solar sail you can change the angle the sun hits, thereby changing the angle of direction of force. That means you can use it to turn, maybe even up to 90 degrees from the source. So you can do lateral movement.

            Now, you can also use a solar sail to slow down your orbital speed, meaning you will fall into the sun. So with combined left-right movement, alternately slowing down and speeding up orbital momentum, falling and then accelerating out, you could conceivably traverse the whole spect
            • It might just be possible, but it isn't simple. If you use the sail o break, you need to turn then whole thing 180 degrees or otherwise the satellite would crach into the sail.

              An other question is how to ajust the position of the sail. but thide things can be worked out ;)

      • There are three forces on a solar sail: gravity, pulling it towards the sun, the solar wind (protons) pushing it away from the sun, and light, which can be vectored by tilting the sail. To move away from the sun, you turn the sail in the direction of orbit to accelerate it into a higher orbit. To move towards the sun you turn the sail to decelerate into a lower orbit.

        It's just like rockets, really. They don't accelerate directly towards the sun either, they just adjust their orbit.
      • Yes, the lateral resistance is called "gravity".

    • Power (Score:2)

      by xant ( 99438 )
      What about simply tethering one to the earth and using its continuous, fuel-less thrust to generate the force needed to turn a turbine? Sounds like free energy to me.

  • Private company? (Score:4, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday August 16, 2004 @07:31PM (#9986169)
    How does a private company get ahold of a submarine-launched ballistic missle? We could sure use one of these for our current... uh... project. Where can I get one?

    Osama Bin Laden

  • Helpful (Score:4, Funny)

    by dg41 ( 743918 ) on Monday August 16, 2004 @07:36PM (#9986204)
    Helpful if we ever have a whale-seeking probe come to our planet and we need to generate some quick power.
  • Meanwhile, Japan has deployed two sails from a rocket, and NAS has deployed two sails... in vacuum chambers on earth.

  • Good layman's discussion... (Score:2, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward
    ...on the feasibility of solar sails can be found in one of Robert A. Heinlein's collections: "Expanded Universe."

    Solar sails delivering a 0.001G acceleration are feasible - and yes, you *want* constant acceleration, not kick and coast. At that lousy 1/1000G you get a round trip to Pluto in about 3.5 years. Of course that puts the asteroid belt much, much closer...

    3 1/2 years is the same time scale wind-powered ships were on in the 1600-1800's. It made the whole Earth accessible then. The solar sails can
  • "Holy shit! We have a launch, repeat, we have a launch! Looks like an SS-N-18 coming out of the Barents Sea!"
    "Take us to Defcon 1! Alert the President! Get Major Kong airborne! Bring the WOPR online! Activate the Stargate!"
  • The http://solarsails.jpl.nasa.gov/introduction/how-sa ils-work.html article nicely explains the concept of solar sails to "dummies".

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