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Biotech It's funny. Laugh. Science

Doctors' Neckties Transmit Germs 100

Posted by timothy from the ties-are-a-disease-in-themselves dept.
bzipitidoo writes "Real geeks don't wear neckties, and maybe the rest of the world wishes they didn't have to. Ties had a minor comeback with the recent bad job market, but hopefully that's behind us. Apart from the obvious that neckties are uncomfortable, useless, in-the-way, and therefore a waste of time and money, too-tight ties constrict blood vessels and raise eye fluid pressure which increases the risk of blindness. Now there's a new study showing that doctors' neckties transmit germs. One suggested remedy from the article is tie condoms."
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Doctors' Neckties Transmit Germs More

Doctors' Neckties Transmit Germs

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  • how unfortunate (Score:3, Insightful)

    by trs9000 ( 73898 ) <trs9000NO@SPAMgmail.com> on Tuesday May 25, 2004 @12:49AM (#9244625)
    i for one rather enjoy wearing ties -- especially when its for no real reason. i feel it gives my day a sense of importance or note; you know it just spices things up. im fond of the formality which i feel (fear even) is rapidly declining in our culture. what to substitute this with? any ideas?

    • Re:how unfortunate (Score:5, Interesting)

      by globalar ( 669767 ) on Tuesday May 25, 2004 @01:12AM (#9244717) Homepage
      Seriously, it's one of the few formal pieces of fashion for men that is widely acceptable. Different shades of suit are nice, but a tie can actually have some character. Even how you make the knot can be a little flavored (knot vs bow-like). Plus, it's a lot cheaper than a whole new outfit. And now that I think about it, I never wash, iron, or fold my ties either (like the doctors in the article, I'm sure). Simplest part of my formal wardrobe.

      I never understood why people associate ties only with the stress of their work (the tying/binding part), their PHB (the requirement to wear a tie), or the rigors of formality (again, required). The tie is one of the few personalized, professional pieces of formal attire a man is allowed. Embrace it!

      • Re:how unfortunate (Score:5, Insightful)

        by obeythefist ( 719316 ) on Tuesday May 25, 2004 @01:25AM (#9244759) Journal
        I almost always wear a tie. Obviously the poster of this article is profoundly against the wearing of formal clothing, and from the sound of it doesn't know how to tie one without choking himself. A properly tied tie should be comfortable, not constricting.

        Here are some reasons to wear a tie:
        -You'll appear more professional than your workmates who don't wear one
        -You'll appeal more to management types
        -You gain the appearance of having status and importance
        -It's the only safe place in formal workwear for a man to express himself.
        -Ties are a "success indicator", which essentially means that you will be viewed more favourably by persons of the female persuasion (unless your tie has flashing boobies on it).

        If none of those reasons has any appeal to you, then don't wear a tie, dress down. The people climbing upwards on the ladder of success will thank you for getting out of their way.
        • While this probably is the case in most of corporate America it isn't everywhere. In fact I seemed to have accidentally landed the new summer intern who apparently goes for the mostly confused scientist look. And I Know the CEO could care less what anyone in my department wears so long as it meets lab safety requirements. The only variation is when I give presentations or when I go to conferences (And I must admit I find the person in the whole company to ask for fashion advise is his administrative assi

        • Dodgy. (Score:5, Insightful)

          by sbszine ( 633428 ) on Tuesday May 25, 2004 @02:29AM (#9244940) Journal
          I was going to mod you down, but a lot of people seem to be on your wavelength so I'm going to reply instead. Perhaps someone will enjoy the alternate viewpoint.

          Your reasons to wear a tie seem to be based around a dubious ethic of climbing the corporate ladder based on appearance rather than merit, then picking up the sort of classy lady who is mesmerised by business neckwear. Since I lost the tie I am doing way better in both departments.

          Wouldn't it be better for everyone if success was earned on the basis of merit / quality rather than their shiny veneer? Think of (for example) successful software versus its less successful, higher quality alternatives. Or politicians. Or people in your workplace. Or whatever.
          • The problem with the measurement of success being based on merit, is that many geeks work away in a back room doing jobs that nobody else understands. The merit doesn't project because nobody undetstands it.

            People outside the geek world understand ties. They don't understand the subtleties of RFC3056.

          • Re:Dodgy. (Score:2, Interesting)

            by eunos94 ( 254614 )
            While I agree with the idea that merit should be where we derive success from. The fact of the matter is that there are a lot of very qualified, highly skilled individuals out there competing for a much smaller pool of jobs and promotions. Doing quality work should be your first priority. But after that, anything you can do to get an edge on all the other people doing quality work is fair game.

            I say wear a tie. It makes a nice personal statement and shows your coworkers some respect. No one likes to

            • Re:Dodgy. (Score:2, Insightful)

              by 10101001 10101001 ( 732688 )
              And what makes you think one can't wear a necktie with a ratty t-shirt or pit-stained polo? While it's nice that ties are a common and simple means of adorning rank upon people, they are still useless. Maybe it'd be appropriate to have wristbands instead which are equally useless? Or maybe everyone in the company should wear ties, even the factory workers. It's most silly because ties only mean a vague "I think I'm important" or "the job demands it". So people will assume the job demands it which it ma

              • Re:Dodgy. (Score:4, Insightful)

                by VendingMenace ( 613279 ) on Tuesday May 25, 2004 @11:49AM (#9248602)
                crap. I posted this in the wrong place, just a minute ago. I really ment it to be here. I am terribly sorry for the double post (how embarassing). But now on with the real post...

                Ok so now you are just being silly. Of couse safty takes precedence over appearence (but not everyone works in a machine shop, do they?) Of course you can wear a tie with a ratty t-shirt or a pit stained polo. THat is not really the point is it? The tie just symbolizes formality, as far as this discussion goes. Now obviously someone who belives in the importance of formality in the work place would not wear a tie with ratty clothes. So we can ingore arguments of this nature.

                The REAL question is whether formality is a good thing to have in the workplace or (secondly) whether it is a valid grounds for promotion.

                So, let me try to adress this question.

                Consider this, if you are having a dinner party. Do you clean up the house some first? (Most people do.) Why? It is not nessesarily functional to have the floor vacumed. Having the bathrooms clean does not make the food taste better. But cleaning the house shows RESPECT for your company. It shows then that you care about them enough to go a little beyond what is absolutely nessesary. IN effect you are saying that "I know you may not really care about athetics while you eat, but this is a way of showing you that i don't mind going a little out of my way for you."

                Formality has the same function in the workplace. It shows those whom you work with that you respect your job and that you don't mind trying to look nice while you are working. It shows your boss that think enough of your work to present what is considered a "professional" appearence. Dressing formally at work is a way to make a constant, passive, outward showing of your attitude about your work. It is so wrong for a boss to take into considerations his employee's attitudes as well as performance when giving a promotion? Esp between two equally (or near equally) skilled people.

                Again, looking at the dinner party example. Lets say that you are invited to two dinner parties on the same night. For the sake of argument, they are both to be catered by the same company. NOw you know that at person A's house you will find a clean house, sparkling bathroons, vacumed carpets, and all that stuff (the suit and tie, if you will). At person B's house, you will find a house that is in disaray. Magzines and newspapers scaattered across the floor. A bathroom that is in disaray stained walls, ect. (ratty t-shirt and stained polo).

                NOw since the dinner is catered, there is no reason to worry about quality or sanitation of food (quality of work is the same). SO which house do you go to? House A or house B? I think most of us would rather go to house A. Even though the presentation has no effect on the taste of the food. WE just feel that that person appreciates us more, cares more about the party, ect. and it is that attitude that we like.

                Similarely, in the workplace, if the quality of work done is nearly the same, it is quite reasonable to take into account the attitude that people chose to present while at work. SOme of the attitude that we have towards our work is the way in which we choose to cloth ourselves.

                I hope that makes at least some sense. Everything you do reflects your view of the world. This includes the idea that the way your dress reflects your view of your job. At least to some extent.
                • > Consider this, if you are having a dinner party. Do you clean up the house some first? (Most people do.) Why? It is not nessesarily functional to have the floor vacumed. Having the bathrooms clean does not make the food taste better.

                  If there's enough beer, wine, and whisky being served at the dinner party, I can guaran-damn-tee you that having the bathrooms clean most assuredly does make the food taste better. The second time around.

                • Re:Dodgy. (Score:3, Insightful)

                  by selderrr ( 523988 )
                  this is pretty difficult to explain in an online forum, but my guess is that a significant percentage of the population (and expecially of the slashdot public) would choose the other house.

                  I don't like clean, vacuumed, neat, disinfected, chilling houses. I prefer to go to places where there's still doritos left in the bowl from a previous occasion, where the hall has a bunch of coats and shoes thrown on top of eachother, where the host wears 2 different socks and pants with holes in the pockets. Where th
                  • I understand exactly what you are talking about. And it is a perfect example of how every analogy breaks down at some point. In this case the analogy is broken becuase i failed to mention anything about the preferences of the guests.

                    So to fix this lets assume that you are throwing a dinner party (you are a worker) and you know that your guests are rather neat people and would prefer to attend a party at a clean house (your boss likes it when people dress formally). Then it would be reasonalble to expect
                    • I got your point, and agree 100%. The whole discussion of wearing a tie or not basically boils down to "do what suits your needs and your taste".

                      which, coincidentally, applies to all things in life :-)

                      The problems begin only when you bump into someone who considers HIS needs and taste to be universal or superior. Foruntately, your post proved you not to be one of those.

                      Cheers !
                • But cleaning the house shows RESPECT for your company

                  The problem with your argument is that real respect for others is not a very typical trait of people who attach great importance to ties. Besides being self-evident (if they did repsect people, as opposed to eppearences, they would respect whatever the person chose to wear), it also fits well with my experience.

                  Nothing wrong with wearing them, but requiring others to really does reveal priorities in a not very flattering way.

              • Re:Dodgy. (Score:2, Insightful)

                by eunos94 ( 254614 )
                Well, if you're thinking of wearing a tie with a ratty t-shirt, I think that speaks for itself. As for your other points, a tie is as useless as tattoos, piercings, colors and patterns, snaps, rivets, buttons, cuffs and almost anything else that adorns your clothing. One could argue we should all wear bleached canvas so that the we can all be equal. Then we wake up from our 1984 style dream and realize that people wear cloths in a context. A tie is the current way for men in a professional setting to ex
                • Maybe you don't see the humor in wearing a tie with a ratty t-shirt, but then I guess you don't realize that while it my be "appropriate" to wear a tie, it's because you associate a rank (aka position) with needing or requiring a tie. Yet a tie has virtually no practical use.

                  That doesn't mean not wanting to wear a tie means wanting to wear canvas clothes to be utterly practical. So, maybe you want to wear a wristband or armband instead. The fact is, the tie is an archaic fashion statement, and I'd be mo
                  • actually, i never said that i associate a tie with rank or privalage or any of that. And i do actually see the humor in wearing a tie with a ratty t-shirt (being a punk and having done it myself). HOwever, i do not fool myself and pretend i don't understand why people wear ties. NOr do i put on blinders and dismiss the whole afair as rediculous. Rather, i try to really eximine WHY ties are considered important. And i do truly belive that is it associated with showing respect to one's job/coworks/boss.
                    • First off, I didn't say you said ties were a sign of rank/position. I was the one saying it. Anyone who is likely to get dirty on a daily basis or for which it would be a safety hazard for the person probably won't wear a tie. And then everyone else (male, wise) is at least expected to frequently enough to show respect to a boss or clients. To me, there's a clear rift between those two groups. Only in service businesses or the like where no one gets physically dirty or is daily in chance of physical ha
                  • Sure, I see the humor in wearing a tie with a ratty t-shirt. Ha, ha. Good laugh for all. I however don't see someone wearing a tie and a ratty t-shirt during the mortgage closing for the 100,000 sq. ft. office building being very successful. I don't see Presidents, Vice-Presidents, foreign dignitaries, the local manager of CompUSA, middle managers at IBM, or bank tellers wearing that. Hell, I don't see lackies at the local furniture store wearing that.

                    A tie is random. Sure, I agree. But guess what,

                  • Yet a tie has virtually no practical use.

                    It is my understanding that the canonical use of a tie was to clean eye-glasses. I can think of several other uses that are ... interesting ... if not wholly practical. Ties can be used in sex play and as weapons, for instance, but I don't think that's what the boss has in mind when he tells you to wear one to work ... or maybe it is. Hard to say unless you are part of that culture, which I am not.

                    Who was is said "I have never seen a programmer doing actu

            • Ok, now you are just being silly. Of couse safty takes precedence over appearence (but not everyone works in a machine shop, do they?) Of course you can wear a tie with a ratty t-shirt or a pit stained polo. THat is not really the point is it? The tie just symbolizes formality, as far as this discussion goes. Now obviously someone who belives in the importance of formality in the work place would not wear a tie with ratty clothes. So we can ingore arguments of this nature.

              The REAL question is whether
          • I think the quality of your shiney veneer is often indicative of your merit. If someone doesn't take pride in their appearance, it stands to reason that they might not take pride in their work either. Not always, but often enough.

        • My mental keyword extraction from the parent post goes like this:

          -"appear"
          -"appeal"
          -"appearance"
          -"safe place"
          -"indicator"

          Words to live by, I guess.

        • Here are some reasons to wear a tie: -You'll appear more professional than your workmates who don't wear one

          And if you work in an environment where the rest of the professionals don't wear a tie, they'll think you have a need to appear this way, you apparently need to mask incompetence.

          -You'll appeal more to management types

          Where I work, management types do not wear a tie except when visiting clients. You'll look ridiculous.

          -You gain the appearance of having status and importance
          -It's the only saf

          • Hey, I'm not saying that people should have to wear a tie. It's completely optional where I work, too, unless we're expected at a customer meeting (when discussing million dollar contracts one must dress appropriately). Lots of guys don't.

            But what I am saying is that there are these distinct advantages to wearing a tie over not wearing one. It's not just about wearing a tie, it's about grooming and dress sense in general. When you look neat and professional, you tend to garner more respect.

            Let's prete

        • Re:how unfortunate (Score:5, Funny)

          by Bazzargh ( 39195 ) on Tuesday May 25, 2004 @05:33AM (#9245507)
          I almost always wear a jewelled codpiece. Obviously the poster of this article is profoundly against the wearing of formal underclothing, and from the sound of it doesn't know how to strap one on without castrating himself. A codpeice should be exaggerating, not constricting.

          Here are some reasons to wear a jewelled codpiece:
          -You'll appear more medieval than your workmates who don't wear one
          -You'll appeal more to codpiece-wearing types
          -You gain the appearance of having status and importance
          -It's the only safe place in formal underwear for a man to express himself.
          -Codpieces are a "success indicator", which essentially means that you will be viewed more favourably by persons of either persuasion (unless your codpiece is extremely small).

          If any of those reasons has any bearing on the job you actually do, you're probably a codpiece salesman or Henry VIII. The people climbing upwards on the ladder of success will wonder why you pay more attention to what you wear than who you are, or how well you did your job.

        • You'll appear more professional than your workmates who don't wear one

          That's circular logic. Professional people wear ties because it looks more professional to wear a tie. Times change.

          You'll appeal more to management types

          Tool.

          You gain the appearance of having status and importance

          "appearance" being the key work here.

          It's the only safe place in formal workwear for a man to express himself.

          Other than, watches a nice shirt, a good haircut

          Ties are a "success indicator", which essentially means that

      • When I was working in the Northern Territory (you know Croc Dundee, Alice Springs, Darwin, lotsa beer) in what was considered a professional environment, we used to see how long it would take the newbies to lose the tie. Three days maximum. And these were guys who had worn ties all their adult professional life.

        Now that I'm living in Queensland (Croc Hunter, Surfers Paradise, beer) I have given up wearing ties for good. While they do give a professional feel in the colder climes where you wear suit jackets
      • In other news, blue jeans, swim trunks, and hawaiian shirts are found to be naturally hostile to nasty microbes.

        The study was performed by the highly respected Doctors Who Don't Like to Dress Up Especially In the Summer Association of America.

      • "The tie is one of the few personalized, professional pieces of formal attire a man is allowed. Embrace it!"

        From now on, a tie will represent the puke running down the front of my shirt caused by your statement.
    • When wearing ties in parties, specially with people you don't know, be sure to ALWAYS use a safe tie.
  • ...make sure you always use protection when seeking the advice of a medical professional.

  • I like ties (Score:2, Interesting)

    by ScriptGuru ( 574838 )
    The artical aside, I love neck ties, I have 17, ranging from Star Trek to the molecular structure of Scotch to a maroon one with a flower embroidered to a portrait of Einstein. Unlike starched shirts and ironed pants, a tie is a chance for self expression in the otherwise bland world of corprate attire. They're especillay cool if they're stolen, as you're then you're flaunting your rebellion through conformity.

  • Well (Score:4, Funny)

    by daeley ( 126313 ) * on Tuesday May 25, 2004 @01:05AM (#9244681) Homepage
    One suggested remedy from the article is tie condoms.

    And would those be "ribbed for her pleasure"? My suggested remedy from the article is to close the browser window and try to forget the whole thing. ;)
  • (Repost in non-anonymous mode -- oops!)

    Ties had a minor comeback with the recent bad job market, but hopefully that's behind us.

    Clearly, you must be living in India.

    Apart from the obvious that neckties are uncomfortable, useless, in-the-way

    Useless? And what exactly do you plan to cover your shirt buttons with if not a tie? I don't wear ties and I never will. Period. I'll wear a dress shirt on occasion but unless I'm an executive, a tie is really overboard and hints at a tendancy to ass-kiss.

  • How about stethoscopes? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by idiot900 ( 166952 ) * on Tuesday May 25, 2004 @01:26AM (#9244762)
    Ties? Come on.

    If you're going to needlessly worry about something, worry about the doctor's stethoscope. I'm a medical student, and I've never heard of people cleaning their stethoscopes unless the patient was on contact isolation. I have yet to sterilize mine. Why? It's just not terribly conducive to crap growing on it, and you never put it on open wounds or the like. Skin is a pretty damn good barrier to pathogens.

    Also, if you want to worry about more stuff, worry about doctors washing their hands. It's unprofessional and a health risk not to, but it doesn't happen as much as it should with certain people. (I've shadowed GPs who washed their hands less than once per patient.) Many physicians trust Purell hand sanitizer, but some don't. There's a reason no surgeon would scrub in with Purell - they instead use iodine-based scrubbers, with plenty of mechanical scrubbing. Then two layers of gloves on top.

    There are worse things than ties...
    • Unless they are applying the stethoscope to a gaping wound on your body, you have nil chance of infection.
      • Unless they are applying the stethoscope to a gaping wound on your body, you have nil chance of infection.

        Well - I could imagine a situation in which spores of some aspirated fungus get transferred to the chest of a immunosuppressed patient. Then the patient touches his/her chest, then wipes his/her nose. Not something to go nuts worrying about, but not "nil" either.

    • Re:How about stethoscopes? (Score:3, Interesting)

      by Tiro ( 19535 )
      You're missing the point. Stethoscopes aren't likely to spead disease because metal doesn't foster pathogens.

      Ties on the other hand aren't made of cold metal. They carry around germs and reinfect the doctor's hands when he adjusts his tie.

      So your argument is a little incoherent in that you first say that stethoscopes are more worrisome than ties, then explain that stethoscopes don't carry disease, while never addressing the point of the article--that ties come in contact with patients and bedding all the

      • So your argument is a little incoherent in that you first say that stethoscopes are more worrisome than ties, then explain that stethoscopes don't carry disease, while never addressing the point of the article--that ties come in contact with patients and bedding all the time, and carry lots of nasty shit around.

        Yeah, I was a bit unclear. My point was - there are higher-yield things we can do to reduce the incidence of nosocomial infection. I think getting physicians to do a better job washing their hand
        • okay.. yeah, that's kind of what I though you meant.

          it is late at night, at least where I am.

        • Re:How about stethoscopes? (Score:5, Insightful)

          by Vellmont ( 569020 ) on Tuesday May 25, 2004 @10:15AM (#9247245) Homepage

          I'm sure ties can carry nasty bugs, but there are worse things in the wards.

          I guess, but that's hardly the point. Not wearing a necktie is a one time change that's very easy to implement and easy to verify. Getting doctors to wash their hands more is something that requires constant vigilance and is very hard to verify. The fact that there are other things that will reduce hospital disease spreading more effectively is beside the point. It's not as if you can't do both.

          Also everyone knows that hands spread disease, so more education is going to have minimal impact. The necktie disease vector is far less known I'm sure, so educating doctors about this would go a long way.

    • Re:How about pens? (Score:4, Insightful)

      by skinfitz ( 564041 ) on Tuesday May 25, 2004 @02:25AM (#9244925) Journal
      I can imagine a lot of pen swapping goes on in hospitals between hospital staff who are actively interacting with patients. This must spread germs!

      Pen condoms??!

      • Re:How about pens? (Score:5, Interesting)

        by E10Reads ( 732984 ) on Tuesday May 25, 2004 @03:49AM (#9245223)
        They do. I took a microbio class in college and one assignment was to take a swab of some object in everyday use and see what grows on a petri dish. Well, I chose the pen at the sign-in clipboard to the infermery. When we were looking at the slides we prepared from our cultures, my prof asked me what I had sampled. When I told her she became very upset, especially when she looked at my slide and saw many gram-negative cocci, of which she was afraid that I had grown meningitis. My culture was promptly destroyed.

      • Re:How about pens? (Score:3, Interesting)

        by fcw ( 17221 ) *
        In a discussion I had recently with a medical researcher, he claimed that there is solid research that pens are the number one vehicle for spreading germs around in hospitals.
      • My wife is a nurse in a local burn and trauma unit. When she first started nursing, she read an article where the researchers swabbed the wedding rings of nurses and found several kinds of nasties present on the inside of the ring (where it contacts the finger). I don't know if they did any sort of non-nurse ring testing to quantify if this was an issue only in medical environments or not, but ffter she read that, she started leaving her rings at home on workdays.
    • A GP who scrubbed as much for each patient as a surgeon would be wasting quite a bit of time. And considering the difference in patient load, I bet the GP would have worn his hands literally to the bone within a week:)

      I hope the study mentioned in the Reuter's article was a bit better than the blurb made it appear. The 'control' was a security guard. I can think of at least a dozen differences between the guard and the medical staff that could account for this. What's more interesting is that ~50% of the d

    • Re:How about stethoscopes? (Score:5, Insightful)

      by martinX ( 672498 ) on Tuesday May 25, 2004 @08:15AM (#9246158)
      You should be a politician: "Don't worry about this thing, worry about this other thing over here! Scary scary!"

      While handwashing is indeed numero uno for reducing cross-contamination (and did you point out to these GPs that they didn't wash their hands?), don't dismiss the humble stethosope as a fomite.

      Not everyone has wonderfully intact skin. Though it may not be a gaping wound, there are indeed skin disorders that leave people open to infection. People also have lines in that are always getting damned infected - place a grungy steth near the point of entry and you could be creating the next bacteraemia.

      Pop over to PubMed and search on "stethoscope nosocomial infection".

      Even though stethoscopes may not be as bad as unwashed hands*, it still doesn't mean we can't take simple precautions to protect patients. And take the opportunity to lose the ties as well.

      *note: there hasn't been a double-blind study done of hand-washing versus no handwashing. but you try and get that one past the ethics committee.
  • 1) Dress clothes suck.
    2) No matter how many times I am taught or teach myself, I cannot remember for the life of me how to tie a damn tie.

    However, if you're going to wear a tie, I would recommend Lee Allison [leeallison.com]. They have several ties that would interest geeks. And, of course, every tie they make AFAIK has on the inside the words "remove before sex"; what's more geek that that?

  • Absolutely Useless (Score:3, Funny)

    by wjwlsn ( 94460 ) on Tuesday May 25, 2004 @02:21AM (#9244914) Journal
    Neckties are an absolutely useless piece of frippery for men who wish they could dress with the elegance and style of a woman, but are afraid to wear pretty dresses in public. Well, I say to all you hidden cross-dressers out there, give up your ties and dress as you truly wish! Just remember to shave your legs.

  • A recent survey of IT shops ... (Score:5, Funny)

    by bigsteve@dstc ( 140392 ) on Tuesday May 25, 2004 @03:01AM (#9245068)
    ... provides startling evidence that developers who wears a ties are 10 times more likely to spreads bugs from one program to another. A sample of ties from a large IT organisation tested positive to a number of potentially dangerous bugs including Bufferium Overflowiae, Memorensis Leakii and Pointeria Danglensis. PC developers were also infected by an insidious Redmondia meme which cause fatal code-bloat in many projects. In contrast, a survey of secretarial staff in the same organisation showed a complete absence of ties ...

    Yet another good reason not to wear a tie to the office :-)

  • Ah Geek fashion so important.

    You aren't asked to know about colour co-ordination all you are asked to do is figure out what a suit means and choose a tie for a simple purpose but geeks neglect this simple thing. Sad really.

    Look at a peacock and think about how much worse things could have gone for you, now spend twenty minutes looking at ties and analysing your emotions, you're done for life andif you know what you are doing you just gained a little power.

  • Washing machine? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by acceber ( 777067 ) on Tuesday May 25, 2004 @03:55AM (#9245249)
    In Australia, all schools require a uniform. I go to an all girls school and the winter uniform requires a necktie. I personally don't have a problem with wearing it, not only because the school makes me, but it makes you look more sensible (even if you're not) and purposeful.

    It's interesting that the neckties were the cause for concern, but not the shirts or the belts. I'm assuming that's because the neckties are not washed as regularly as another other item of clothing. Why not just throw the necktie into the washing machine along with the rest of the clothes?

    • It's interesting that the neckties were the cause for concern, but not the shirts or the belts. I'm assuming that's because the neckties are not washed as regularly as another other item of clothing.

      It might also have to do with the fact that a tie may dangle, and therefore may have more contact with or get closer to patients than a shirt would. Tie tacks to the rescue?

    • Many of the "nicer" ties -- the ones that are higher priced, higher quality, "more professional" -- are dry-clean only. All but the cheapest ties I've seen/bought have been dry-clean only! Also, frequent cleaning can cause the ties to lose their vibrancy.

      I'd wager that most professionals don't think ties get dirty unless something is dropped/spilled on them -- it's not actually in contact with your skin except when being adjusted.
    • Female, left handed, tie-wearing geek on Slashdot?

      I got off at the wrong bus stop.

      Sorry about the offtopic comment.
    • OT, but all schools in Australia definately do not require uniforms! Some do, indeed most private ones do, but at least here in Melbourne they would be in the minoritory.

      I went to a public school, never had to wear a uniform, and subsequently never learned to tie a tie.

      I'm now nearly 30, have worked for several companies including a very large, very well known European telco and now am a director of a small IT company that I co-founded. I have worn a tie exactly four times in my life. Two times were funer
    • In Australia, all schools require a uniform.

      I'm pretty sure public schools, while they can have "rules" that require uniforms, can't actually enforce them from a legal perspective. So, if you don't want to wear the uniform, they can't kick you out or suspend you.

      Private schools, of course, can pretty much do whatever the hell they want.

      I went to a public school and always wore the "casual" uniform. Personally, I don't see why people kick up such a fuss about it. It saves parents money and often makes

  • Ahh, I don't know about other people who wear ties but when I wore them daily some years ago, any given tie was only for a day or two and off to the cleaners it goes. Not cleaning your ties regularly is like not washing your clothes or your hanky regularly - just nasty. With normal hygiene it would seem that this wouldn't be any worse a bacteria problem than a clothe hanky.

    I don't mind ties much. Despite what anyone might wish for or delude themselves about; people make shallow, subjective judgements a

  • ties not often washed/cleaned (Score:4, Informative)

    by waterbear ( 190559 ) on Tuesday May 25, 2004 @05:05AM (#9245408)
    From an almost-ex-tie-wearer (don't often do it these days): Many of the 'best' ties are/were in silk, and were both non-washable and even hard to dryclean without losing shape. So most of them probably didn't/don't get washed or cleaned often, or maybe not at all.

    Many hospital germs, including the most dangerous antibiotic-resistant MRSA, have been found transmitted in/on noses and hands of medical staff.

    Some hospitals now have dispensers for alcohol hand-rub in each ward/department, for everybody to use on their hands when entering and leaving, and some tests seem to have shown these alcohol rubs to be the most effective thing yet against contagion.

    Maybe tie-bags for medics are not such a bad idea to add to that.....

    -wb-
    • Or how about really good looking disposable ties?
      You could make them from Tyvek or Mylar or some other neat, inexpensive material.

      You could even make them out of treated litmus-type paper stuff, so that they would show any liquids that might have contaminated them.

      Better yet, you could make ties from agar, and then culture the tie itself to see what sort of baddies the doctor was exposed to all day. It would be a nice information gathering tool for epidemiologists.

      And for the non-medical geeks, ties c

  • Just ties? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Paul Neubauer ( 86753 ) on Tuesday May 25, 2004 @12:26PM (#9249114)

    While an earlier post mentions that ties are perhaps the least washed article of clothing, the unanswered, and maybe unasked, question is: What about the rest of the suit or whatever else might be worn? Did they swab shirts and jackets to see what those held as well?

    If it's just ties with high levels of pathogens, then ditching them makes medical sense. If it's any cloth the physician wears, then just getting rid of ties won't really have any effect. The 'tie condom' sounds silly, but really something like that goes on now with what surgeons wear for each procedure. Would it be that farfetched to have a physician change what would be pretty much an apron between examinations if it meant healthier patients?

  • It's called a "bow tie." Solves all those problems except the slow strangulation thingy.
  • If you're being strangled by your tie, it's on too tight.
  • BioChips, Bioelectronics cures cancer, AIDS. http://www.geocities.com/mathematician99/ Biological computer kills cancer cells http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=15602
  • The air in doctors' offices can carry air vectored germs. All medical treatment should therefore be carried out in a vaccuum, preferably in orbit to prevent contamination of uncontaminated atmosphere.

    Except that might infect space. Those germs might be able to survive in a vaccuum, and we'd be infecting the entire universe.

    We are dirty dirty dirty and our planet should be sterilized so we don't kill the universe. Nuke us from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.

  • Tie Tacks (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Syriloth ( 525273 )
    Some doctors, at least, are already aware of this pitfall and have taken steps against it. My father, for instance, always wears a tie tack in order to keep his tie from dangling down onto (or into) his patients. I had always sort of assumed that this was a basic part of medical hygiene. Apparently not. Given the extremely simple solution (assuming that wearing a tie tack is effective) this could easily become something of a non-issue.

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