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Titania Nanotubes for Hydrogen Sensors? 161

Posted by Hemos from the strong-and-stiff dept.
Roland Piquepaille writes "Everybody is talking about carbon nanotubes these days. But what about titania nanotubes? Penn State researchers think they have a great potential for sensing hydrogen . According to this news release, "titania nanotubes are 1500 times better than the next best material for sensing hydrogen and may be one of the first examples of materials properties changing dramatically when crossing the border between real world sizes and nanoscopic dimensions, according to a Penn State materials scientist." And now, the very good news: titania nanotubes are cheap. So they'll be used in industrial quality control in food plants and as weapons against terrorism. My summary contains some more details."
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Titania Nanotubes for Hydrogen Sensors? More

Titania Nanotubes for Hydrogen Sensors?

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  • Terrorist detection (Score:5, Funny)

    by macragge ( 413964 ) on Wednesday July 30, 2003 @06:23PM (#6575534)
    Now we will be able to detect the terrorists at they attempt to crash Zeplins into our buildings!

  • wha? (Score:2, Funny)

    by jafac ( 1449 )
    Weapons Against Terrorism! Oh goody! We're saved!

    Where to I invest?

  • Terrorism (Score:1, Interesting)

    by Casisiempre ( 691255 )
    Use against terrorism: Set up enough of the tubes and you can detect when a hydrogen bomb goes off there (assuming they survive).

    • Re:Terrorism (Score:1, Interesting)

      by y77 ( 692293 )
      Its interesting to note that hydrogens qualities make it much safer should there be, say, an accident with a film of white powder if its parked within 600 miles of a processing plant. Nevertheless, iron and steel are much cheaper (by weight) than aluminum. These things practically make themselves. I know there are some more creative ways to make all of the paint etc is very quantifiable. It is also why older explosives became unstable over time. The loss of hydrogen molecules over time caused decay sepa
      • Did the person who modded this 'interesting' mean;
        a)"Interesting aplication of a text processing script on a slashdot story, possibly a Markov algorithim"
        or...
        b)"Dude, like, cool!"

        If b, you might find this [nyu.edu] interesting also.

  • Better tools (Score:5, Funny)

    by Stonent1 ( 594886 ) <stonent@ston3.14 ... ark.net minus pi> on Wednesday July 30, 2003 @06:28PM (#6575570) Journal
    A lit match works for hydrogen detection as well as many gas hydrocarbons. It is very versatile.

    • Annoying learn-about-hydrogen comment (Score:5, Informative)

      by SuperBanana ( 662181 ) on Wednesday July 30, 2003 @07:31PM (#6575973)
      And now for your entertainment tonight, the obnoxious nitpicking Slashdot comment reply!

      A lit match works for hydrogen detection as well as many gas hydrocarbons.

      Actually, Hydrogen requires a higher fuel to air ratio than gasoline. It also disperses nearly instantly(well, except in confined/sealed areas of course)- whereas gasoline etc sink and pool(which is why your natural gas/propane water heater has that nice little picture of a gasoline can etc).

      Oh, and since it's still not known enough- the Hindenburg burned because it was painted with the chemical equivalent of rocket fuel(the chemical composition of the paint etc is very close to solid rocket fuel)- not because it was full of Hydrogen, which, by itself, doesn't burn.

      When it DOES burn, it burns a)instantly b)practically invisibly, c)with no smoke. Watch those films of the hindenburg, and note the a)slow b)bright yellow c)sooty fire.

      It's interesting to note that hydrogen's qualities make it much safer should there be, say, an accident with a truck carrying it. It dissipates as it leaks, versus the major fire hazard/toxic waste problem created by a gasoline spill.

      • No, the Hindenburg exploded in a hydrogen fire, and the skin caught fire in a side reaction. This was settled by both the German and American investigations in the months following the disaster, and was in line with the many other zeppelin/dirigible hydrogen fires preceeding the Hindenburg, including a rather nasty one involving the Goodyear dirigible in Chicago a year or two earlier that killed a bunch of people on the ground and pretty much torched a building.

        The report you're referencing is from some ko
      • It's interesting to note that hydrogen's qualities make it much safer should there be, say, an accident with a truck carrying it. It dissipates as it leaks, versus the major fire hazard/toxic waste problem created by a gasoline spill.

        Assuming that it's NOT in it's liquid state. If it does become very popuar, transportation companies might traffic it in it's cryogenic form since it is a more effecient use of space and less prone to leaking. Also, I'm also sure that filling the blimp with hydrogen didn't h
      • Oh, and since it's still not known enough- the Hindenburg burned because it was painted with the chemical equivalent of rocket fuel(the chemical composition of the paint etc is very close to solid rocket fuel)- not because it was full of Hydrogen, which, by itself, doesn't burn.

        Nothing, "by itself" burns. There is always a fuel and some kind of oxidiser. The hindenburg burned very fuel rich, but if the hydrogen in it had been mixed with enough oxygen, it would have flattened everything in sight when it w

  • Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)

    by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Wednesday July 30, 2003 @06:29PM (#6575579)
    Comment removed based on user account deletion

    • Re:cheap? (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 30, 2003 @07:02PM (#6575810)
      First of all, the article sounds like a hoax to me.

      But regarding the price of titanium:

      Titanium metal is expensive. Titanium oxide is not.

      Most elements do not like to be turned into metallic form. So although aluminum is the most abundant element in the Earth's crust, nevertheless, iron and steel are much cheaper (by weight) than aluminum.
      • Metals *would* want to be metallic, if it weren't for that g.d. oxygen trying to react with everything in sight. Gold doesn't have much of an affinity to compound with anything, hence it's usually found in pure form... if you can find it.
      • So although aluminum is the most abundant element in the Earth's crust...

        Bzzzt! Oxygen is the most abundant element in the Earth's crust, followed by silicon, then followed by aluminum. Aluminum is the most abundant metal, but is dwarfed in abundance by the various silicate rocks. However, everything else you said was correct.

    • Re:cheap? (Score:4, Informative)

      by hcetSJ ( 672210 ) on Wednesday July 30, 2003 @07:05PM (#6575835)
      Although I don't know what the process is, the fact that titania is a ceramic means that there is probably some creative chemical conditions in which these things practically make themselves (sol-gel process, maybe). Ceramics are generally covalent networks--each atom is connected to the next with a bond like those which hold hydrogens to oxygens in water--and so by changing the conditions under which the titanium oxidizes, you probably have fairly good control over the size/shape of the final result. Not so with carbon nanotubes, which were originally manufactured pretty much by sifting through ashes...with an electron microscope. I know there are some more creative ways to make carbon nanotubes now, but most of them are still based on chance.

      Maybe someone who has actually received a BS in Materials Science wants to back me up, or correct me?

      • Re:cheap? (Score:5, Interesting)

        by Goldsmith ( 561202 ) on Thursday July 31, 2003 @03:25AM (#6578067)
        Well, I don't have a BS in Materials Science, but I'm working on a PhD in... well, lets call it nanoscience.

        I personally don't know how to make titanium oxide nanotubes, but I imagine it would be similar to making carbon nanotubes... which I do have experiance with.

        Allow me to show you...

        The way you make carbon nanotubes is simple. You start with a catalyst (everything from rust to specially tailored alloys has been used), place this catalyst on a clean substrate where you want the tube to start growing. Next, flow some carbon rich gas through a furnace (i.e. methane), add a little hydrogen. When hot, place your substrate in the furnace. Nanotubes will grow from the catalyst in the direction of the flow (mostly).

        That same method is used to grow many types of tubes and nanowires. The only hard thing is dealing with flammable and explosive gases at high temperature (I havn't blown anything up yet, but I'm trying), and keeping everything clean.

        When dealing with nanotubes, you have to remember that you want to get a specific shape out, and not amorphous material, and that can be very hard. In most cases, you tailor your catalyst to provide the general shape you want, and grow off of that. So you could very easily control the growth of a ceramic, but the shape?

        Now obviously, there are other ways to grow these things... but I'm going to stop now before this turns into a lecture.

    • Re:cheap? (Score:1, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Titanium dioxide (sometimes called "titania") is one of the most common pigments for white paint (now that lead in paint is a Bad Thing). It costs maybe a dollar per pound, bulk.

    • Re:cheap? (Score:3, Informative)

      by RevRigel ( 90335 )
      The price of raw titanium usually hovers around 40 cents US/pound, actually. Because it melts at 3000 degrees F, however, it's difficult to work into usable pieces, hence raising the price. Titanium shavings/scrap are much cheaper than finished bar/plate stock. It also has a reputation for being difficult to machine, which it's not; merely counterintuitive.

    • Re:cheap? (Score:3, Informative)

      by NanoProf ( 245372 )
      Titanium is expensive because it is very difficult to extract from the oxide form. The oxide form itself is very cheap. It is the main ingredient in house paint.

  • Terrorism? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by roman_mir ( 125474 ) on Wednesday July 30, 2003 @06:34PM (#6575616) Homepage Journal
    Why everything has to be about terrorism?
    1. Throw around a buzzword, like nanotubes.
    2. Mention fighting the terrorism.
    3. Well, we all know what comes at step 3, don't we?

    This is why everything has to be about terrorism.

    Allah Akbar = Profit?

    ---------
    (I used Allah Akbar not because I think it is in itself pro-terrorist, but because it is the most recognized token for the situation, so please.)

    • Where's the time that every new discovery was a possible way to cure cancer? One does get tired of this throwing around of buzzwords, that's for sure
    • Allah Akbar?

      So now the Mon Calamari is the Muslim god? Intriguing.

      (Like I'm the *only* Star Wars buff who thought it)

      Could cause some theological concerns when your 'god' is served up at the local seafood restaurant.
    • We scientists know that any proposal with the word "nano" in it will give us a 40% boost in getting grants.
    • Sounds suspiciously like the Underpants Gnomes' business model.

    • Nit Picking (Score:4, Interesting)

      by Nazmun ( 590998 ) on Thursday July 31, 2003 @12:57AM (#6577624) Homepage
      As a muslim I must correct you. A more correct transliteration would sound like this. Allah-huu-akhbar. (key part you missed being the huu which sounds like who).

      If anyone wants to know what that means... it's simply god is great or allah is great. Technically allah isn't a god as there is no sex associated with allah (god implies a masculine deity).

  • WTF is Titania? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by SiliconEntity ( 448450 ) on Wednesday July 30, 2003 @06:39PM (#6575649)
    Titania, it turns out, is Titanium Dioxide, used commonly as a white pigment. Read more about it at the Wikipedia [wikipedia.org].

  • Wonder what's the next best material? (Score:4, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 30, 2003 @06:40PM (#6575652)
    titania nanotubes are 1500 times better than the next best material for sensing hydrogen

    Oxygen?

  • Hmm.... (Score:4, Funny)

    by lukew ( 528994 ) <woodzy@gmail.com> on Wednesday July 30, 2003 @06:40PM (#6575659)
    My daughter's name is Titania, sounds like she's been getting up to some serious mischief.

  • yeah (Score:5, Funny)

    by nomadic ( 141991 ) <nomadicworld@gma ... inus threevowels> on Wednesday July 30, 2003 @06:48PM (#6575716) Homepage
    Everybody is talking about carbon nanotubes these days.

    Yeah, can't walk down the street or ride a subway without hearing that incessant chatter about carbon nanotubes.

    • Re:yeah and Please forgive the lengthness of my re (Score:5, Funny)

      by agrippa_cash ( 590103 ) on Wednesday July 30, 2003 @07:08PM (#6575849) Homepage
      Well, sir, there's nothing on earth Like a genuine,Bona fide,Electrified, Titaniafied, Nanotube! What'd I say? Ned Flanders: Nanotube! Lyle Lanley: What's it called? Patty+Selma: Nanotube! Lyle Lanley: That's right! Nanotube! Miss Hoover: I hear those things are awfully loud... Lyle Lanley: But tt detects hydrogen clouds. Apu: Is there a chance the tube could bend? Lyle Lanley: Not on your life, my Hindu friend. Barney: What about us brain-dead slobs? Lyle Lanley: You'll be given cushy jobs. Abe: Were you sent here by the devil? Lyle Lanley: No, good sir, I'm on the level. Wiggum: The ring came off my pudding can. Lyle Lanley: Take my pen knife, my good man. I swear it's Springfield's only choice... Throw up your hands and raise your voice! All: Nanotube! Lyle Lanley: What's it called? All: Nanotube! Lyle Lanley: Once again... All: Nanotube! Marge: But Main Street's still all cracked and broken... Bart: Sorry, Mom, the mob has spoken! All: Nanotube! Nanotube! Nanotube! [big finish] Nanotube! Homer: Nano... D'oh!

  • Titania in the war against terrorism (Score:4, Interesting)

    by 56ker ( 566853 ) on Wednesday July 30, 2003 @06:57PM (#6575772) Homepage Journal
    I'm still at a loss as to how detecting hydrogen helps combat terrorism. Would someone care to enlighten me?
    • In case they get hold of an H-Bomb!

    • Re:Titania in the war against terrorism (Score:5, Informative)

      by ratfynk ( 456467 ) on Wednesday July 30, 2003 @07:18PM (#6575905) Journal
      Simple, hydrogen molecules in explosives give off distinct hydrogen emmision signatures, hydrogen concentration loss has a very specific profile when used in combination with nitrogen in explosives. This is very quantifiable. It is also why older explosives became unstable over time. The loss of hydrogen molecules over time caused decay separation of the explosive component and the buffer. Some explosives even give off amonia, and some are made with it, Amex for example, the stuff used by Timothy McVie. If better explosive detection devices can come from this tech great! Then there is one more hurdle for social disfunctional maniacs to overcome.
    • As pointed out in the replies - Hydrogen is a usefull element to detect in that it is often "emitted" by high energy chemical explosives.

      The reason this is actually usefull as a detection device is actually a function of it's minimal molecular weight/size. It is basically very difficult to completely contain the Hydrogen to avoid detection.

      Also, leakage has been a traditional problem for H2 storage and distribution and cheap reliable detectors will help detect problems before they become catastrophic.

  • Roland Piquepaille (Score:4, Insightful)

    by DeepDarkSky ( 111382 ) on Wednesday July 30, 2003 @07:13PM (#6575876)
    Why is Slashdot posting these news release stories that are summarized and submitted by Roland Piquepaille? And for that matter, where are these details on his web site that he purports to have? All I see are direct quotes and linked pictures. This is the second one I see now. Is this a trend? Is this how one can get stories posted here? I'll go and read news release sites like Eureka Alert and quote generously from it, add a couple of picture links, and submit it here.

  • Size and electron affinity (Score:4, Informative)

    by fven ( 688358 ) on Wednesday July 30, 2003 @07:31PM (#6575974)
    There are two things that are of help here. Firstly is the size of the tubes, when you are in the nano- or pico- regimes, there are a lot more surface features (corners, edges) per atom than there are in the bulk metal. As most reactions (catalytic or non catalytic) occur on surface features, having as many small particles as possible makes sense.
    The other factor that is a help here is that the oxide is used. Introducing impurities into metal (consider the oxygen an impurity) does two things, changes the electron affinity of the metal so it can bind ligands better (or worse - also useful) and introduces point 'defects' - places where the crystal lattice is interrupted. These 'defect' sites actually provide reaction points for in this case, hydrogen.
    Nice piece of chemistry!
  • Did anyone else read the book based on Douglas Adams' computer game, Titania? More importantly, did anyone else immediately think of that?

  • Fuel-cell (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Jotham ( 89116 ) on Wednesday July 30, 2003 @07:44PM (#6576040)
    Hydrogen entering an array of titania nanotubes flows around all the surfaces, but it also splits into individually charged atoms and permeates the surface of the nanotubes. These hydrogen ions provide electrons for conductivity. The change in conductance signals that hydrogen, above the background level, is present.

    Sounds very similiar to how a fuel-cell works, but instead of pumping through lots of hydrogen to produce as much electricity as possible they're just using a little bit of hydrogen to generate a tiny current (or does it just change the conductivity?).

    I want to know what this material does when feed pure hydrogen.

    • Re:Fuel-cell (Score:3, Interesting)

      by reezle ( 239894 )
      I read it a little differently.

      It ssems to act more like a transitor, whic is switched by the Hydrogen Ions. (So, yes... it just changes the conductivity)
    • Hydrogen entering an array of titania nanotubes flows around all the surfaces, but it also splits into individually charged atoms and permeates the surface of the nanotubes. These hydrogen ions provide electrons for conductivity. The change in conductance signals that hydrogen, above the background level, is present.

      Sounds very similiar to how a fuel-cell works, but instead of pumping through lots of hydrogen to produce as much electricity as possible they're just using a little bit of hydrogen to genera

  • Ill met by twilight,... (Score:4, Funny)

    by bigattichouse ( 527527 ) on Wednesday July 30, 2003 @07:48PM (#6576066) Homepage
    they are fair.. but I prefer to wait for Oberon nanotubes.

  • That's so rude... (Score:1, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward
    "nanotube", "microsoft", how many more euphemisms will people design to describe a limp dick?
  • "Everybody is talking about carbon nanotubes these days."

    I have such boring conversations with people. We never get on to good topics like this. Maybe I need to get out more?

  • Sources (Score:2, Informative)

    by wordisms ( 624668 )
    I didn't see any links to the sources yet on the blog or the article so here is the homepage [psu.edu] for Dr. Craig A. Grimes. There are two recent pdfs about the titania nanotubes on his publications [psu.edu] page.
  • Wasn't she in a movie with Trixie Microslot and Dirk Harddrive?
  • Titania hands you a nanotube....err....crystal.

    For those of you who don't know what that's from, I suggest you look for the mp3 of the second D&D spoof that was made.

  • Particle collider cheap, or hamburger and chips cheap?

  • The Amazingly New Atmosphere Detector (Score:3, Funny)

    by moby ( 96858 ) on Wednesday July 30, 2003 @10:12PM (#6576879) Homepage

    It's simply amazing and can detect hydrogen from 1 ppm to 4%. Luckily there is just enough floating around to guarantee success every time. Amaze your friends, take it outside, show-off as you brilliantly hold the detector in hand and proclaim, "Yes, we are not in a vacuum."

    Did I mention that your friends would be amazed?
  • and as weapons against terrorism.

    are you sure you didnt really mean (insert-suspensfull-"Duh-Dunnnn"-sound-from-movies -here) weapons against Communism!

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