Silicon Seduced From Silica 100
Roland Piquepaille writes "Making silicon is an expensive process, which conventionally involves carbothermal reduction, in which the oxygen is removed from silica by a heterogeneous-homogeneous reaction sequence at approximately 1,700 C. Now, Japanese researchers have developed a new technique which uses electricity to remove the oxygen from silica. Their technique is based on the immersion of silica in a bath of molten calcium chloride salt at 850 C, which should reduce the costs of making silicon -- and other elements, like zirconium. Check this column for a summary or read this article from Nature for additional details."
Hey now! (Score:3, Funny)
Mmmmm... Brine. Delicious brine.
Re:Hey now! (Score:2, Funny)
It would be like sleeping on a giant... ah nevermind.
Re:Hey now! (Score:5, Interesting)
Niggardly stole my tv! (Score:1)
Re:Hey now! (Score:2)
While AMD breast sizes are just an estimated number based on their equilivent intel sizes, it's been reported they go down far less often, making them the least popular choice in the workplace.
3rd post! (Score:1)
Re:3rd post! (Score:3, Informative)
Re:3rd post! (Score:5, Informative)
You could have (Score:1, Interesting)
My early estimates indicate that this new process (developed by Japanese researchers) will allow synthetic silicon to be cheaper and much more delicate.
Delicate silicon (Score:5, Informative)
Therefore the collected silicon mus be remelted, drawn, cleaned, sliced into tiny placks, etched, washed and polished. However this is also has to be done with silicon obtained in other ways. Nowadays there are machines who can perform most of these procedures in one run.
A short explanation of this can be found here [semimat.com]
well... (Score:1, Funny)
Silica defintion (Score:4, Informative)
Probably not (Score:5, Interesting)
Graphite and diamond are both pure carbon. You need those high temperatures and pressures to cause the atoms to rearrange into the crystal lattice of diamond.
Re:Probably not (Score:1)
did anyone else see the headline.. (Score:1)
Pr0n Industry Rejoices (Score:2, Funny)
Fake diamonds and fake racks drop in price, the pr0n wars begin! Scratching and clawing for territory, kicking for market share, it is an all girl-on-girl cage match!
zirconium! (Score:5, Informative)
not related to silicon, but i like to point that out. in case people are looking for uses for zirconium =).
for those that thought about it - no spectra is not good enough for space elevator. only 3GPa tensile strength (steel about .25 for cheap ones and 5 for REALLY good ones). space elevator needs ~62GPa. nanotubes ~150GPa theoretical.
okay. end rant.
more zirconium uses (Score:5, Informative)
btw - this kinda shows how bs was bush's little thing about saddam using ALUMINUM tubes for reactors.
Re:more zirconium uses (Score:3, Informative)
It's pretty neat stuff to look at, though if you didn't know you couldn't tell it from stainless steel or aluminium.
Also I believe the aluminum tubes Bush was talking about were to be used in fuel refinement, not in a reactor. Still probably mostly bogus but possible considering the tubes the Iraqis were using for their "rock
couldn't tell? (Score:1)
I'd figure that weight (specific. grav) would tell a great deal... Steel is at 7.8, Zirconium at 6.5, Aluminum at 3.2 or something. Besides that Aluminum has a tendency to oxidize in normal environments, giving it a hazy looking coat. Okay 7.8 and 6.5 is kinda hard, but I bet with enough practice it's doable. I mean, 20% difference.
All bets are off if they are alloyed, though...
Re:more zirconium uses (Score:2)
Actually the origin was one of Blair's scare stories to panic the British population into war that was then picked up by the American government.
Had Blair even bothered to look at the evidence he would have seen that the Iraqis had never managed to get centrifuge cascades up and running and had barely got a single centrifuge working in the lab. They could not have afforded the
Re:zirconium! (Score:5, Insightful)
As an engineer I get fed up with people claiming product X is stronger than steel, etc, etc. You almost always (as in the case of spectra) find that what they are talking about is specific strength, which measures mechanical strength per unit weight. It doesn't mean it's stronger than steel. The modulus of steel (el cheapo low carbon) is roughly 200GPa, spectra is 60-124 or less than half as strong.
the tensile strength of 3GPa is the UTS - ultimate tensile strength. UTS is where the material catastrophically, and unrecoverably, fails. The material will have yielded (and possibly weakened) well before this stress level is reached.
Steel will almost always be the basic material of choice, except when weight is important, for the simple reasons that it is strong, easy to work with, easy to manufacture into almost anything and, most importantly, cheap.
okay. end my own rant
steel, spectra, etc (Score:5, Informative)
impressive especially considering spectra has specific weight of
I mean, I can't imagine that if cost wasn't a consideration, any places where you wouldn't want a lighter material vs. the heavier one (except that polyethylene is not good with fire, so car engines are out).
but i digress. steel is cheap. but damn, as far as materials go, spectra is about the sexiest we got right now (that's mass-producable, anyway).
Re:steel, spectra, etc (Score:4, Informative)
I never said it wasn't impressive material; it certainly is, especially when you consider the basic material, UHMWPE, has a modulus of about 40MPa.
I mean, I can't imagine that if cost wasn't a consideration, any place where you wouldn't want a lighter material vs. the heavier one.
See that's just the problem. It's great in theory, but in a real-world problem there is almost never a point where cost is not a consideration. In fact, in many everyday, mundane design situations, it is the primary consideration.
There's some far sexier materials out there though (not really mass-produced) - some of the nano-stuff that's being played with is really interesting (but completely impractical!), metallic foams and some biological materials are turning out to have some pretty impressive (and unique) combinations of material properties. Shape-memory alloys are also pretty neat.
Re:steel, spectra, etc (Score:1)
Cheaper Encrusting? (Score:1)
Prices and Profits (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Prices and Profits (Score:5, Funny)
Right, that is how the semiconductor world typically works. This has kept computer prices at the same level since the seventies and ensured the current situation where there are only a few thousand computers in the world. Imagine if prices on IC's had been allowed to fall - there might have been a computer in front of me now. Or maybe someone would even have managed to create a digital watch!
Impact and Solar Cells (Score:5, Interesting)
As wafers have grown in size (and changed from inches to metrics), up to 300 mm production size today, it means there is effectively less cutoffs available to make cheap polycrystalline solar cells. Sure, mono crystalline solar cells are more efficient but also far more costly.
This new process then can mean a lot more cheap solar cells. Imagine like all available roof areas being covered, down to the top of all cars.
Not the semiconductor industry... (Score:5, Interesting)
Only a small fraction is actually turned into wafers, and the expense in that process has less to do with turning silica into silicon, but turning impure silicon into really, really pure, single crystal silicon. [It's actually a really cool process, I wish I could remember the details. It involves bonding the silicon to something, and distilling it.] And this cost is very small compared to the cost of turning a wafer into chips.
This discovery, if it actually saves money, will have some impact on the steel industry, but practically none on the semiconductor industry.
Re:Impact and Solar Cells (Score:5, Informative)
I'm more interested in the increase of performance of the solar cells and this means moving away from Silicon based technology.
If I have to have a 600sq ft array of Si cells to generate 1/5th the power needs of my home being able to buy them cheaper doesnt help me. I can't have 5 20X30 foot panels on my property because I live in the city.
The most interesting is this process might make the procesing of other materials used in the more efficient solar electric panels either cheaper or easier (thus making it cheaper)
Although with Si panels themselves... if everyone had 1 panel on their home in this northern midwest town tied to the grid it would make a significant difference in the electrical supply andthe amount of coal we burn every day to make that electricity...
Although not anywhere as much as simply changing every lamp in your home from Incandesant and regular Flourescent to Compact flourescent.
Re:Impact and Solar Cells (Score:1)
If I have to have a 600sq ft array of Si cells to generate 1/5th the power needs of my home being able to buy them cheaper doesnt help me.
Sure it does. It makes that array of Si cells cheaper.
Is there even enough energy coming from the sun and falling on your roof to power your whole house? I'm pretty sure solar power isn't a complete solution for a house in the city without producing it outside the city and piping it in on the grid.
Although with Si panels themselves... if everyone had 1 panel on th
Re:Impact and Solar Cells (Score:2)
Depends on where you live. Some places get lots of sun (ie, Phoenix, AZ), some places not so much (ie, Seattle, WA.) Depending on the size of your roof, and your power consumption, you could power 100% of your needs with a large enough solar array. Actually, a better (and easier) way of doing solar is to mount your panels on the ground - roof mounts are a pain in the ass to access for maintenance. Most
Re:Impact and Solar Cells (Score:1)
Well, I was talking about any location in the US, but considering an average city-sized roof, and average (or low average) power consumption. Let's even assume orientation is pretty much exactly where you want it, although that's a bad assumption, really.
I have no doubts that it can be done if you build a house from scratch. But that's not really a viable option for most people.
Re:Impact and Solar Cells (Score:1)
The article mentions that the current downturn in the microprocessor industry means that solar cell manufacturer's are able to source high grade silicon relatively cheaply, but that an expected upturn in the computer industry in 2004 or so will starve solar cell manufacturer's of their silicon supp
Re:Impact and Solar Cells (Score:1)
I don't know about that. Since solar cell raw materials come from silicon wafer scrap, I don't know how much they would save from the new process. Solar cells don't really have tight specifications that chip makers require. They do need it to be somewhat pure, but considering that they buy scrapped silicon wafers by the ton, it doesn't have to be very pure.
What does this mean? (Score:2, Redundant)
Great for Solar Energy (Score:5, Insightful)
The cost of the silicon wafers has an enormous impact on the cost of silicon solar cells. If this cost can be brought down with this new technology suddenly solar energy becomes competitive !
Markus
Re:Alchemy (Score:3, Funny)
Oxygen Destroyer (Score:4, Funny)
Seduced? (Score:3, Insightful)
Remember your chemistry? REG and LEO? Reduction is Electron Gain, Loss of Electrons is Oxidation
The fact that oxygen is being removed from the compound should have given you a clue.
Re:Seduced? (Score:2)
OILRIG is easier for most people to remember; Oxidation Is Loss, Reduction Is Gain (of electrons)
Jon.
Re:Seduced? (Score:1)
Re:Seduced? (Score:2)
Re:Seduced? (Score:1)
trolls are made of silica (Score:1, Funny)
you see trolls are made of silica and other elements found in igneous rocks(the stuff mountains are made of).
75% to 45% of the average igneous rock is silica http://www.geog.ouc.bc.ca/physgeog/contents/10e.h t ml.
therefore trolls are more than 45% (and maybe as much as 75%) silica.
turn the heat up on trolls, and create the raw materials for more computers.
sparkes
PS. or alternativly lets just contine to ignore them
Cost of silicon wafers (Score:5, Informative)
I don't know how much the raw silicon costs, but I suspect that most of the cost of the wafers comes from this month-long crystal growth and planarization. Good (ie, very flat) 200mm silicon wafers for semiconductor production can cost up to $1000 each, although they are probably much cheaper now due to lack of demand. Many processes also don't require the flattest wafers and so one can get by with wafers that cost a small fraction of that.
Re:Cost of silicon wafers (Score:3, Informative)
A billet (I forget their technical term for it) of silicon is grown off of a seed crystal in a furnace, in a process that takes about a month.
The time a billet or rod grows
Titanium is possible too? (Score:3, Interesting)
Cheaper Zirconium? (Score:2)
Yes, and get nagged even more after being married that it's not a real diamond.
Re:Cheaper Zirconium? (Score:2, Interesting)
Finally! (Score:1)
Now, I can buy my wife even more "diamonds".
Oh, boy! I'm gonna get lucky!
The Zircon Age?! (Score:4, Funny)
There's something ironic about that... ;)
Silicon (Score:1)
I usually bath my silicon babes in water and soap. Does this change the quality of the silicon at all?
Effect on space development (Score:4, Interesting)
Large-scale [space.com] space construction is coming, and will provide one of the major markets for lunar materials. Martin Rees [nytimes.com] has a new book out that is pretty clear on why we need to develop space resources. Here's another enabling technology - now let's go do it!
By the way, anybody in the SF bay area this coming weekend should check out the International Space Development Conference [nss.org] in San Jose, where we'll be discussing a lot of these ideas, and more! [scifitoday.com]
this is a new method? (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:this is a new method? (Score:3, Informative)
The first stage of silicon refinement takes silica and makes it silicon to about 75% pure. The second stage takes the silicon to 99% pure. But this stage involves making silicon into a gas. Electricity is used to charge a small, very pure seed crystal so that the gaseous silicon deposits on it.
I think why it took them so longer to do it with solid silicon is the fact that aluminum
Production of Semiconductor-Grade silicon (Score:4, Informative)
I work in the semiconductor industry. (actually, for one of he largest producers of semiconductor-grade silicon in the world,) and I'm intimately familiar with the process to turn silicon from sand into wafers for chip manufacture. At my work, we are the middle step. I'll explain:
Semiconductor-grade silicon is ultra-pure silicon metal (I mean parts-per-billion atomic purity.) All the semi-grade Si in the world is produced in approximately the same way.
Silica (sand) is reduced to "metallurgical grade" silicon (~99.5% pure) in an arc furnace process, the sand is melted with a reducing agent (often carbon), and the molten metal is poured off. (this is a very cool process. The smelter has a hole in the bottom that is allowed to freeze shut with Si, and when they're ready to pour, someone shoots out the Si plug with a shotgun. Cool job)
This metallurgical grade Si is sold to intermediate producers who grind it to a fine powder, and react it with gaseous HCl in fluid bed reactors to generate chlorosilanes (H3SiCl, H2SiCl2, HSiCl3, SiCl4.) These chlorosilanes are then distilled to very high purity ~99.999% or more.
The chlorosilanes (different ones for different manufacturers) are then used in the Siemens process to produce semiconductor-grade POLYCRYSTALLINE silicon. The process works by Chemical Vapor Deposition. Ultra-pure silicon rods are placed in a reactor in an inverted U shape, and each end of the U is connected to an electrical circuit. The atmosphere inside the reactor is purged of all gasses and then chlorosilane vapors are introduced. Huge amounts of electricity are used to heat the U circuits to incandescence (imagen a 600 megawatt lightbulb) and the ultra-pure chlorosilanes decompose into Si and HCl at the surface of the rods.
The problem with the silicon, at this point, is that it's polycrystalline, not single crystal. In order to produce proper IC's, the crystal structure of the silicon must be perfect 1,1,1 crystal. Polycrystalline silicon (a.k.a. poly) is a random oriented growth where the crystal structures of many crstals have grown together. The poly is reduced in size and sent to a crystal pulling facility (wafer fab) where it is used in the Czoralski process for making wafers.
The CZ process consists of melting a large amount of poly, then dipping in a "seed" crystal. This perfect single-crystal specimen is "dipped" into the molten silicon while being rotated. The seed is then carefully "pulled" upwards while rotating, and the resulting ingot grows in diameter based on the pull speed, and several other factors (300mm is current state of the art.)
Once the pull is completed, a ~1000+ kg log of single crystal silicon is made, and is ready for final processing to wafers. The tapered ends are removed (top and tail) and the "log" is shaved down perfectly round and to the proper diameter. Diamond impregnated wire saws are used to slice the log into wafers, the wafers are lapped and polished, and they are ready to have IC's printed on them. (some are further processed, but you get the gist.
HTH
GM
Re:Production of Semiconductor-Grade silicon (Score:1)
I think this is a bit more monumental than you think. This is the first time an expert has commented on ANY
Re:Production of Semiconductor-Grade silicon (Score:3, Informative)
Is the cost of silicon that important? (Score:2)
I am thinking that perhaps the cost of raw silicon is not the rate limiting factor in the manufactre of chips.
A new processor goes for several hundred dollars...the silicon in it can't be more than a few dollars, with the rest going to pay for the cost of R&D.
I could be wrong on this, though. Does anyone know for sure?
The economy is saved! (Score:2)
So it takes half the power to extract silicon from silica.
Big whoop.
It's one step in the thousand-step process from deciding to scoop sand to powering up an integrated circuit.
Stuff that matters. Says so right up there on the banner. Try to keep it that way.
incomplete description (Score:1)
"Their technique is based on the immersion of silica in a bath of molten calcium chloride salt at 850 C ..."
The secret step in this process involves gently applying a loofa [miriamwebster.com] to the silica while it is bathing. Molten calcium chloride salt sounds irritating, but throw in a naturally occuring sponge and you've got yourself a fiesta!
Imagine that... (Score:2)
Re:Imagine that... (Score:1)
Dirk
Re:Imagine that... (Score:1)
Cubic Zirconia (Score:2)
reduce the costs of making silicon -- and other elements, like zirconium
So you mean that crappy costume jewelry on the home shopping channel is getting even cheaper? Let the floodgates to the trailer park open.
lower price of breast implants? (Score:1)
-l