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It's funny. Laugh. Science

Australian High Court Hears Some Weird Science 59

Posted by timothy from the mud-rocks-lead-cherries dept.
mosch writes "In an extraordinarily unusual case, the Australian High Court listened to TJ Rout's arguments that he can make light travel faster than c, due to the properties of division and multiplication by zero. The transcript makes for excellent reading. Next up, the Supreme Court hears the testimony of Time Cube."
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Australian High Court Hears Some Weird Science More

Australian High Court Hears Some Weird Science

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  • Let's all laugh (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday April 07, 2003 @02:31PM (#5680297)
    Everyone laugh at the man who is obsessed with multiplying and dividing by zero. Everyone laugh at the poor man who obviously has a mental illness. The Australian justices no doubt wanted to laugh as well, but because they are stuffy old men they couldn't. Let's all laugh at them too.

    And while we're at it, let's all laugh at the prick who thinks the spectacle of a madman is funny.

    • Re:Let's all laugh (Score:2, Interesting)

      by Gord.ca ( 236984 )
      I don't think it's that bad.

      First, he sounds more deluded than mentally ill. There is a difference. If he's ill that would contribute to the delusion, but I couldn't diagnose from the website.

      Also, if he is ill, so what? I remember a time when I thought of stopping telling insane jokes from respect for the mentally ill. Then I was diagnosed as one, and I've been telling more insanity jokes ever since. Sulking about it doesn't help anything. At least laughing marginally increases the happiness of the world

    • Re:Let's all laugh (Score:1, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward
      and then let's all laugh at the fact that this guy somehow managed to get his "case" heard by the highest court in australia. perhaps there is something wrong with the australian legal system.

      Or perhaps his ideas are correct and you're cruel to insinuate that he has a mental illness.

      • and then let's all laugh at the fact that this guy somehow managed to get his "case" heard by the highest court in australia. perhaps there is something wrong with the australian legal system.

        From reading the transcript, I infer that he stood as a candidate for the seat of Fraser, and when he lost (because unlike the British, we don't elect nutters to parliament), he contested the results.

        Contested election results are a serious matter, and I'm not altogether surprised it ended up in the High Court.
      • and then let's all laugh at the fact that this guy somehow managed to get his "case" heard by the highest court in australia.

        No he didn't get his case heard, that's what that transcript was about, it was an appeal from a refusal to grant leave to have his case heard. The reason the High Court (as opposed to some lower court) heard this application, is that court has originial jurisdicition in regard to disputed returns in federal elections and the applicant stood as a candidate for the seat of Fraser, the

    • Re:Let's all laugh (Score:5, Insightful)

      by mosch ( 204 ) on Monday April 07, 2003 @03:48PM (#5680823) Homepage
      My goal wasn't simply to have everybody laugh at the guy, though he does make excellent joke fodder. The fact of the matter is that this man somehow managed to get Australia's highest court to hear a case where the plaintiff's goal was to legislate science.

      This hearing was, in my mind, as assinine as if the fellow who runs TimeCube managed to get a hearing with the Supreme Court, to try to legislate that there are 4 simultaneous days within each 24 hour earth rotation. How does this happen? Why does it happen? What would happen if the guy had been sane?

      It seemed to me to be a real-life version of the urban legend pi === 3 law, except with the judicial branch being abused.

      • The pi == 3 law is not an urban legend. It was an actual bill introduced into the Indiana House. The text of the bill is here [urbanlegends.com], a site dedicated to the debunking of rumours.

        Also on that site is a bill about public erections being illegal.

        nice.

      • It happened because everyone has the unqualified right to approach a court and at least have it entertain the case. After it's done that it can then chuck the case out for vexatiousness, absurdity, etc, but it at least must grant the right to approach. Just think of the alternative: if the court had a discretion in whether it would let you in the door, your right to access justice would be compromised.

        The Hight Court is slightly different because of the "special leave" filtering mechanism it uses. Essenti

    • Re:Let's all laugh (Score:2, Interesting)

      by RealErmine ( 621439 )
      Everyone laugh at the man who is obsessed with multiplying and dividing by zero. Everyone laugh at the poor man who obviously has a mental illness. The Australian justices no doubt wanted to laugh as well, but because they are stuffy old men they couldn't. Let's all laugh at them too.

      I felt that the justices did a good job of not laughing at this man who obviously has some severe issues dealing with the meaning of reality. The fact that they did not laugh and let Mr. Rout continue with his case shows t

    • Nobody's laughing (Score:3, Interesting)

      by fm6 ( 162816 )
      Why is it so obvious that Rout is mentally ill? Lots of people have silly theories. I've seen "proofs" that Pi is a rational number, that humans are all descended from Martians, that the international monetary system is a conspiracy of Jews, freemasons, Catholics, and the British Royal family... Perfectly "normal" people believe this crap. Hell, more than one popular TV show celebrates it! And some well meaning fools [csicop.org] waste a lot of time trying to debunk silly theories. Which is a lost cause -- this stuff co
    • "obviously has a mental illness."

      Isn't that what they said about Galileo and Einstein?
    • We must remember that throughout time those who make the most memorable contributions to science are usually laughed at right up until the moment they are vindicated (usually post-mortum). Genius walks this side of insanity after all. Now, I'm not saying that we can control time by altering the speed of light, nor am I an advocate of the timecube. However things we take for granted today were once ridiculed and derided by "wiser" and more "knowledgable" men. Who knows what the next great scientific breakt
      • We must remember that throughout time those who make the most memorable contributions to science are usually laughed at right up until the moment they are vindicated (usually post-mortum).

        And let us also remember those brave souls who were scorned for their theories, laughed at by the establishment, and died in poverty and obscurity, bitter at an ignorant and uncaring world. And yet, years later, through the application of modern science and learning, they were conclusively proved wrong on every count.
  • Summary of web site (both this guy's, and Alex Chiu's) :
    I have the ultimate theory of the universe! I can do amazing things like [create energy from nothing|live forever] with this knowledge! It involves [dividing by zero|the magnetic fields of the body]. I am one of the greatest scientific minds in history! I prove it by putting pictures of great scientists on my website! But the establishment surpresses my work, through ignorance or evil. But one day they will be forced to acknowledge me as one of the gre

  • He has a case... (Score:5, Funny)

    by Hard_Code ( 49548 ) on Monday April 07, 2003 @02:44PM (#5680357)
    Australian Bill of Rights


    Article IXIX:

    1. And the law is their set of dividing and multiplying by zero. As long as they maintain their incorrect dividing and multiplying by zero, then they enable me to cause things to cease to exist, and that is why I have the power to do so.

    Coauthor: Yahoo Serious

    I have to say, he has a pretty solid case. I cannot believe that Australia is denying this man's right to divide and multiply by zero because obviously he has shown time and the speed of light equal one another, such you alter one, you alter the other, and this in turn enables the altering of the speed of light within Einstein's relativity. I mean, that is fundamental to splitting the Beer Atom!
  • This concept is used in economics to indicate infinite inelasticity of demand at any price. In other words, units sold (traded, etc) does not change with price if there is no demand. While I still think of x/0 = undefined for mathmatics, the idea that x/0 = infinity is interesting.

    but IANAE

    NarratorDan

    • Re:Interesting, x/0 = infinity... (Score:4, Insightful)

      by j.e.hahn ( 1014 ) on Monday April 07, 2003 @03:06PM (#5680491)
      It's not a question of x/0 maybe being undefined. It *IS* undefined. A common exercise in undergrad math course is to have 2 functions f(x) and g(x) where g(0)=0 and then show that depending on how you choose f and g the limit of f(x)/g(x) as x tends to 0 can take on ANY value you desire.

      Division by zero is completely meaningless. Yes there are cases where division by zero creates a removable singularity, and for continuity's sake you can define a new curve/sequence/function/whatever with the convenient value. But that doesn't make the division meaningful...

      Oh well. At least he isn't trying to state a value for log(0) -- there's an essential singularity at that point. (The riemann surface for log is very cool...)

      • Division by zero is completely meaningless. Yes there are cases where division by zero creates a removable singularity, and for continuity's sake you can define a new curve/sequence/function/whatever with the convenient value. But that doesn't make the division meaningful...

        I should stay away from this issue: my math stinks, and we're getting into a weird area of philosophy [ex.ac.uk]. Oh well...

        You're assuming that the familiar logical system of Calculus 101 is the only way of defining concepts like "zero" and "i

        • I'll assume you are talking about the Riemann sphere. In this case infinity is not a number, it doesn't obey most of the field properties.

          While he is assuming the "101 Calculus" this is also the model that is repeatedly used throughout maths. If you are talking about the real numbers and fields in general then 0 is bad.

          It's quite likely those mathematicians who you talk about are the regular fruits trying to do this sort of stuff.
    • probably economists are just simplifing the mathmatical property that the limit of x divided by y as y approaches zero is infinity.
  • geeze, anyone tried to read his website [timecube.com]?
    [sarcasm]Mabye if he wrote a little BIGGER and used the word evil some more he'd have an argument. [/sarcasm]
    • My fave lines:

      There are 4 simultaneous 24 hour days
      within a single rotation of the Earth.
      You may be too damn evil to accept it.

      Heh, heh....

      -Sean

      • I think I'm too damn evil to understand anything on that page. Of course, maybe that's because I worship a monofaced evil integrated academic racist Word God.

        Huh?

      • I sort of like:
        Evil Ass Educators Suppress Time Cube,

        and dumb ass students condone such evil.
        Cubeless institutions are spreaders of evil,
        and students lack mentality to challenge it.

        Ah, a timeless axiom of the human condition. Or The Onion news headlines? YOU DECIDE! :)

  • kaaskoekies (Score:2, Funny)

    by chewy ( 38468 )
    " KIRBY J: It makes statements concerning the former Chief Justice and said that he is off with the late Mr Skase in Majorca in Spain, which is simply not the case. "


    a counter-attack with lawyer-humor? :)
  • The guy who authored this page reminds me of some people I've seen on OCTA's [octa.net] route 43 [octa.net](PDF WARNING) on a full moon.

  • I once thought I spoke fluent english... (Score:3, Funny)

    by mivok ( 621790 ) on Monday April 07, 2003 @03:25PM (#5680635) Homepage
    but this article is giving me severe doubts.

  • It's all a conspiracy! (Score:3, Insightful)

    by fm6 ( 162816 ) on Monday April 07, 2003 @03:37PM (#5680739) Homepage Journal
    The nice thing about conspiracy theories: they make it unnecessary for you to acknowledge any criticism of your beliefs. Can't patent your perpetual motion machine? It's a conspiracy of physicists. Can't get a permit to operate a chemical factory in a residential neighborhood? It's a conspiracy of environmentalists! Can't play your stereo loud as you would like? It's a conspiracy of classical music fanatics!

    My favorite satire of this attitude is Ed Subitsky's satire of Velikoskyism, "Worlds In Collusion". (Printed in the National Lampoon a long time ago. Don't know where else it's available.) Among other assertions, Subitsky asserts that refrigerators don't really need electricity -- it's all a conspiracy to make you pay your utility bill. If you look in the secret compartment, you'll find the real source of the coolness: ice cubes!

  • brothers (Score:1, Offtopic)

    by capoccia ( 312092 )
    I think TJ Rout and Iraq's information minister are brothers.

    Mohammed Saeed Sahhaf continues to make claims [washingtonpost.com] that are just as wacky:

    The enemy was wiped out. It retreated. When we pounded it, it went away farther. When we stop firing, they return and advance, maneuvering and establishing presence in places here and there. This aggression will end in failure. After its destruction, Iraq will remain and it will be led by President Saddam Hussein."

  • If I were on the Australian High Court I would I would say the following to him:

    Hmmm, yes. Very impressive. This clearly has global implications. You need to bring your case before WIPO - World Intellectual Property Organization. [wipo.org] Case dissmissed!

    -
  • MR ROUT: No, it does because the dividing and multiplying by zero, the set that they are adhering to, enables me - it causes things to cease to exist. Now, I have proven everything is on nothing so if everything is on nothing and you multiply it by zero, then the entire universe and the world does not exist. I have proven it conclusively. I am not hiding. . . . That is why this "white feather" letter, it has been sent to every one of these vice-chancellors of these universities and I am accusing them of con
  • He tried to insert some homosexual humor into the proceedings. This is rather distasteful:

    KIRBY J: Mr Rout, the document you have tendered to be filed in the Court is called an electoral petition.

    MR ROUT: Yes.

    KIRBY J: It appears to challenge the election to the Australian Capital Territory seat of Fraser.

    MR ROUT: Yes.

    KIRBY J: It makes statements concerning the former Chief Justice and said that he is off with the late Mr Skase in Majorca in Spain, which is simply not the case.

    MR ROUT: Yes, a

  • it turns out that, whatever the hell it is he's talking about, turns out to be true?

    Or any of the other seemingly wacky ideas people have these days?

    Highly unlikely, but what if?

    As a programmer, I would love to have the "law" repealed that makes divide by zero an error condition... :)
  • Reading the entire transcript will cause a massive migraine headache!

  • Rout's website (Score:2, Interesting)

    by isn't my name ( 514234 )
    A Google search turned up Rout's web site [pacific.net.au] which includes The White Feather Letter [pacific.net.au] mentioned in the High Court transcript, as well as many other interesting items. Though, I could not find any conplete explanation of his theories.

    There was this interesting piece:

    25th Jan 1994: I have proven, the 1st law of thermodynamics being, Newton's Law of conservation of energy is wrong. Using the famous Hubble red shift of 1929, that revealed light from distant galaxies was stretched into the red on a light spe

    • Re:Rout's website (Score:3, Insightful)

      by SuperBanana ( 662181 )

      This is far more telling:
      "A Dr Hall from the Nuclear Physics Faculty ANU, around 1994, wrote a very nasty letter to me warning me I'd be ostracized by the the Science Establishment if I didn't change my attitude. He meant I had to be subservient, pay homage and grovel to my intellectual and scientific inferiors. People like me are no good at all at being a follower of any religion."

      The answer to that one is "no, you shouldn't go calling the head of the Australian Royal Academy of Science a 'bitch' after

    • You also might simply have clicked on the links in the story...

    • NOTHING is of a higher and different state of energy.

      He's in good company. The ontological argument goes something like this:

      God is defined as a perfect being.

      Nonexistence is an imperfection.
      Therefore God exists.

      My favorite formulation goes like this:

      Nothing is better than life in Heaven.

      A Ham sandwich is better than nothing.
      Therefore, a Ham sandwich is better than life in heaven.

      At best, he's confusing energy and power. The red shift does not destroy energy, but it does reduce power.

  • Here's a link [austlii.edu.au] to a filing he made in 1996.
  • Teachers are hired evil word pedants who enslave childish minds to a lifetime stupidity.

    Don't word murder your children - don't take away their vocabulary to describe Nature's Harmonic Time Cube...
  • I'd never heard of TimeCube, and I'm not disapointed by his webpage... if there is a Nobel prize in stupidity and mediocrity, it should be awarded to that guy (or was this all generated by an Eliza engine ?).

    Which brings to mind, putting a link to such a website from Slashdot (or anywhere) actually enhances the guy's popularity with websites like Google. Isn't there a way to do an antilink: link to the page, but in a way that shows that you disaprove of the content and that the web search engines should lo

  • Although these are pretty damn funny, it's sad to see insane people struggle for vindication of their whacky ideas - obviously with considerable mental anguish. Perhaps this is a sign of the information age? Instead of witches, astrologers, numerologists, and occultists, we have modern-day 'psychoscientists'. I was given a sharp reminder of how unstable people's minds can be at an open-to-the-public lecture in Harvard uni's astronomy department last year. People sat through a great lecture on the life of G

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