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Moon

Russia's Space Chief Finally Admits US Landed on Moon (newsweek.com) 85

"Russia has finally admitted that American astronauts did, in fact, land on the moon," reports Newsweek: Head of Russian Space Corporation Roscosmos, Yuri Borisov, accepted the truth of the U.S. putting a man on the moon in an address to the State Duma, Intellinews has reported.

"As for whether the Americans were on the Moon or not, I have one fact to share," he was reported to have said. "I was personally interested in this matter. At one time, they provided us with a portion of the lunar soil that the astronauts brought back during their expedition." Previous polling revealed that just under half of Russians believe America's 1969 moon landing was a government hoax. However, Borisov said that tests performed on the samples by the Russian Academy of Scientists confirmed their authenticity.

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Russia's Space Chief Finally Admits US Landed on Moon

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  • by ihaveamo ( 989662 ) on Monday July 08, 2024 @02:46AM (#64608619)
    You can still bounce lasers off the mirror Neil and buzz left there..... I do like the story about how the mirror-bounce was once shown in a "Big Bang Theory" episode ...and caused shockwaves in the moon landing denier groups.. Pity you need a a B grade sit-com to teach anyone science these days. Probably the only prime-time science a lot of people get.
    • In fact the whole thing has been analysed in detail by Messrs.Mitchell and Webb [youtube.com]. tl;dr, the biggest problem was the massive rocket.
    • > You can still bounce lasers off the mirror Neil and buzz left there

      Unmanned probes put them there, and collected rocks and soil ;-)

      • If you are going to reference things that were unthinkable back then, at least make it original.

        I think it must have been a naked Terminator coming from the future planting it. He needed a mirror to mastirbate to himself, and left it behind.

    • Ditto... I also performed this experiment, (using the 31" Cassegrain), as an Undergraduate in the mid-80's.
      [Rosemary Hill Observatory, Bronson, FL, UF]

      So, I expect that this has been a relatively common experiment in many Departments for at least the past half-century+!

    • by ceoyoyo ( 59147 )

      Both the Russians and Indians have also left retroreflectors on the moon. There was a year and a half in 1969/70 when the Apollo 11 mirror was the only one, but it still could have been put there by a probe and not a man.

    • Sadly I think my wife learned more science from The Big Bang Theory than her years attending public school.
  • by Eunomion ( 8640039 ) on Monday July 08, 2024 @02:48AM (#64608621)
    Sometimes it's just staggering how small a person can be. A person like this probably puts on a little paper crown and reads out proclamations to his pets.
    • They've run out of News in Russia, probably because of all the journalists who fled the country or were arrested. So occasionally to fill in the gaps they pull out some very very old newspapers for some material they can present as new.

  • Khrushchev and the Politbureau officially congratulated the US on their successful moon-mission and the Apollo missions brought back a huge moon-rock to gift to the soviets. AFAIK that rock is actually on display in moscow for regular people to touch and examine. It may be that after Khrushchev officials had an interest in spreading the hoax-myth among regular citizens of the Soviet Union in a post-Khrushchev chilling of the cold war, but anyone around in the late 60ies paying attention never really doubted the moon landing. There even were somewhat public discussions on whether the Soviet Union should join the effort that was eventually deemed not that beneficial to the Soviet people.

  • by Jorgensen ( 313325 ) on Monday July 08, 2024 @03:05AM (#64608645) Homepage

    The "finally admitted" part is BS ...

    The USSR never questioned that the moon missions were real, since the Soviet (and German, by the way) space scientists closely observed the flights and received the telemetry data and other transmissions from the Apollo spacecraft.

    The authorities actually _congratulated_ the USA on the achievement at the time.

    It _is_ true that the footage was not shown live in the USSR - but it was 3am in Moscow at the time. It was shown the next day instead.

    They were quite graceful in defeat there. So much so that most Americans now believe that the USA got to the moon first. They didn't. The USA was the first to land *a human* on the moon. The USSR was the first to land a spacecraft on the moon - in 1959.

    • by 93 Escort Wagon ( 326346 ) on Monday July 08, 2024 @03:25AM (#64608667)

      The USA was the first to land *a human* on the moon.

      It was a pretty amazing accomplishment - and within Kennedy's declared time frame, which is another amazing accomplishment (especially since he had died years before).

      For what it's worth, Kennedy's "we choose to go to the moon" speech [youtu.be] also included a lot of points that Americans nowadays could stand to re-learn IMHO.

      • by skegg ( 666571 )

        A brilliant and inspiring speech, delivered beautifully.
        Well worth listening to if one hasn't heard it in a while.

        More so compared to the crap we hear these days ...

      • Indeed. Some days I wonder if America is still capable of such feats. I hope so, because I feel soon we will be called to be, but who knows?
        • I have a firm believe that American Scientists and Engineers are well up to the feat, whatever feat that may be, given sufficient time and funding (hell, any world class scientists and engineers really) it is just the political will and the American people that seem to be the stumbling block. I mean, someone said something like it would cost over $100 billion to go back to the moon... So, my response is, well, the Defense Department this year is budgeted at over $800 billion, maybe cancel some o that shit a
          • One other thing stands in the way: The SLS (Senate Launch System), which is pork for all 50 states, not to mention a bunch of bad engineering decisions.

            • Just get them all under the Capitol Dome. Which in reality is a part of a giant rocket system. This can lift the entire Senate and a large chunk of Congress up into a lunar orbit where facts and science cannot hurt them.

              • Are there mini ones for each state government too? Maybe county governments going to LEO? Please?
          • I wasn't actually thinking specifically about scientists and engineers as such but across the economy. Could we get people to work in defense plants? Grow victory gardens? Cut their consumption of stupid shit? Live with fuel shortages? Only time will tell.
            • regrettably, this generation doesn't seem like that. Plus, threats these days do not seem so existential to me as Naziism does/did.

              it would be easy for me to take a second job working night shift as a security guard or something (I already work for the DoD) to 'do my part'.

              • from comments on /. it seems many on here wouldn't give a rat's ass which people were in charge, and of course Trump praises Xi and Putin, so....
  • by ghoul ( 157158 ) on Monday July 08, 2024 @03:12AM (#64608649)
    The Soviets brought back lunar soil before the Apollo missions ever took off using robotic landers(Lunakhod) and now China has brought lunar soil back. That the Americans could share lunar samples is not really proof of a lunar manned mission just proof of a lunar mission. If all the other proof like videos of Armstrong on the surface did not convince someone, this isnt going to change things.
    • by Viol8 ( 599362 ) on Monday July 08, 2024 @03:48AM (#64608695) Homepage

      When some of the dribbling conspiracy theory clowns genuinely believe the earth is flat even when all they have to do is go stand on a sea cliff and watch ships descend over the horizon to prove otherwise , trying to convince these mental retards of a moon landing is a futile endeavour.

      • by chthon ( 580889 )

        That is why we should be able to bluntly say to them "Stop your drivel and go elsewhere, or you'll get a kick in the butt".

        But no, we even need to be polite to them, because they have their right to their own opinion.

        • I just tell them: oh, so you are actually one of those weirdos that believes in the moon...
        • by msk ( 6205 )

          "You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your informed opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant."
          - Harlan Ellison

      • When some of the dribbling conspiracy theory clowns genuinely believe the earth is flat even when all they have to do is go stand on a sea cliff and watch ships descend over the horizon to prove otherwise

        To be fair, that could be a refraction effect. Usually the refraction effect goes the opposite way (you can see things that are actually below the horizon), but with some contorted reasoning flat Earthers can make the argument.

        But all they really need to do is call somebody in a different time zone at sunset, and ask them to look outside and tell them where the sun is. On a flat Earth, the sun sets everywhere at the same time.

        • Ah, but they've all thought of that also. The sun appears to orbit a globe but it really just goes in a circle around the disk. There's so much hand waving by the flat earthers that it has potential uses as a renewable energy source.

          But then, flat earthers are absolutely sane compared to other nutters out there. Flat earthers are embarrassed to be in the same room as the Hollow Earthers. Then there's the "mud flood" dingbats (https://skeptoid.com/episodes/4765).

        • But all they really need to do is call somebody in a different time zone at sunset, and ask them to look outside and tell them where the sun is. On a flat Earth, the sun sets everywhere at the same time.

          Many flat-earthers think the sun is something like a spotlight. It doesn't illuminate the entire earth at once, but moves around in such a way that leads the unenlightened sheeple to think the earth is spherical.

          It's fun to watch the contortions they go through to try to reconcile actual observations with

          • But all they really need to do is call somebody in a different time zone at sunset, and ask them to look outside and tell them where the sun is. On a flat Earth, the sun sets everywhere at the same time.

            Many flat-earthers think the sun is something like a spotlight. It doesn't illuminate the entire earth at once, but moves around in such a way that leads the unenlightened sheeple to think the earth is spherical.

            But that makes no sense.

            Oh, wait. Of course it doesn't.

    • Re:Not really proof. (Score:5, Informative)

      by pahles ( 701275 ) on Monday July 08, 2024 @04:08AM (#64608723)

      The Soviets brought back lunar soil before the Apollo missions ever took off using robotic landers(Lunakhod)

      No they didn't. Apollo 11 (July 1969, 21.55 kilograms) and Apollo 12 (November 1969, 34.3 kilograms) where the first to bring lunar soil to Earth. Luna 16 (not Lunokhod) brought a measly 101 grams of lunar soil to Earth in September 1970.

    • uh, no, the Lunakhod did not bring back lunar soil prior to the 1969 mission that landed the first humans on the Moon.

      ref:https://www.popularmechanics.com/space/moon-mars/a36984208/soviet-luna-program-history/

      They did in 1976.

    • The Soviets brought back lunar soil before the Apollo missions ever took off using robotic landers(Lunakhod)

      Minor correction; you're indeed right that the Soviets brought back lunar soil-- three times-- but the first Soviets lunar sample returns were in 1970, a year and a half after Apollo 11.

      The missions were Luna-16, Luna-20, and Luna-24 (the Lunakhods were rovers, launched on Luna-17 and Luna-21).

      Good site: https://airandspace.si.edu/sto... [si.edu]

    • "The Soviets brought back lunar soil before the Apollo missions ever took off using robotic landers." Wrong. The Soviets *attempted* to do so a few days before Apollo 11's landing, but the probe (Luna 15) crashed into the Moon. Not until more than a year after Apollo 11 (and after Apollo 12) did the Soviets succeed in returning a sample from the Moon.

  • ... ever more mouth breathing tin foil hat wearers in the US think they were faked spouting the same few long disproved bits of "evidence" they believe proves their nonsense such as the flag flapping (rod supporting it along top, no air to slow inertial movement - a pre schooler could understand this) and other cretinous BS.

  • That whole thing about not knowing it was just neo-news propaganda.

    Does he believe in homeopathy though?

  • There is an upcoming show about how our best and brightest would have faked a lunar landing, and this piece is meant to create some excitement for that show on the streaming channel

  • Even 55 years after the fact.

  • I don't think they ever denied it. In fact footage of it was shown on Soviet TV and Apollo 13 was certainly followed by the population... and not in a mocking way.

    Of course you have a lot of people who think it's a hoax, but that is rarely state policy. Idiots are a phenomenon that is found all over the world. I mean even radio hams were able to receive the USB (Unified S-Band) uplink via moonbounce, and lots of people and institutions have experimented with the mirrors or gotten the signals from the sensor

    • I don't think they ever denied it. In fact footage of it was shown on Soviet TV and Apollo 13 was certainly followed by the population... and not in a mocking way.

      Of course you have a lot of people who think it's a hoax, but that is rarely state policy. Idiots are a phenomenon that is found all over the world. I mean even radio hams were able to receive the USB (Unified S-Band) uplink via moonbounce, and lots of people and institutions have experimented with the mirrors or gotten the signals from the sensors... or even studied the moon rocks.

      A surprising number of people have impact resistant proof shields.

      The irony is that one of the biggest factors in things like moon landing denialism is much of it is based on the concept of personal incredulity. Which automatically puts stupid and unimaginative people acting as the final arbiters of the truth.

      Kind of like how "Ancient Aliens" tries to assign large constructions to some mysterious alien entities because Humans obviously couldn't do that!

      Well, humans can do impressive things.

      And sen

      • "But back to the conspiracists, there is a psychological aberration that I'm fascinated with. There are some people who voluntarily choose to reject obvious truth. On the other hand, they will choose to believe outlandish ideas put forth as an alternative." FWIW (I have no training in psychology), I think this makes less intelligent people feel they're more intelligent than most people, because--in their view--those other people are fooled, while they--the conspiracists--aren't.

        But I haven't met such peopl

        • "But back to the conspiracists, there is a psychological aberration that I'm fascinated with. There are some people who voluntarily choose to reject obvious truth. On the other hand, they will choose to believe outlandish ideas put forth as an alternative." FWIW (I have no training in psychology), I think this makes less intelligent people feel they're more intelligent than most people, because--in their view--those other people are fooled, while they--the conspiracists--aren't.

          But I haven't met such people face-to-face, and as I say I'm not trained in psychology, so I freely admit I don't know why they do this.

          I'm not trained other than an interest in it, so I do a little research.

          I know a couple conspiracy "kooks". They function well, so they don't exactly fit the "needs help" category. But when the conspiracy BS comes out - and it seems that like vegans, they have a compulsion to tell people - they just sound like they are not quite in reality. And there is always that twinkle in the eyes when they spout their nonsense.

          I suppose the mechanism is that they have some quirk that causes them to always assume t

  • In a small column in newspaper and on TV.

  • That half of the Russian population that believes the moon landing is a hoax? They also believe that their czar’s Ukraine project is an honorable, just struggle against the evil, expansionist imperial west. That portion of the population will march willingly into the meat grinder, or happily send their sons into it, and the problem will fix itself. Sometimes, there are very direct consequences for stupidity.
    • They're not that stupid or delusional - they are happy to send mercenaries, prisoners, minorities, and the 'undesireable'.

      When Putin started needing more bodies than those groups could supply, regular Russians started fleeing the country to avoid conscription and there have been some protests despite the fact that can get you a jail sentence... And presumably possibly sent to the front lines.

      So they're good with killing innocent people, if someone else does it so they don't need to be personally at risk of

    • by hey! ( 33014 )

      I think we have to question exactly what "belief" means here. The thing that authoritarian regimes want from their populace, even more than obedience, is passivity. Hannah Arendt, the historian of totalitarianism once observed that 'The aim of totalitarian education has never been to instill convictions but to destroy the capacity to form any."

      Effectively cowed populaces under authoritarian leaders are characterized by a cheap and lazy cynicism. They disbelieve everything, but will go along with anythi

      • Right. The goal is not to make you believe what they say - it is to get you to pretend you believe it and be terrified of speaking the truth.

        Being forced to do that strongly reinforces passivity, and it makes speaking up an extreme act of defiance.

        • by hey! ( 33014 )

          In a way being terrified to speak the truth would be an improvement. They wear you down until you just can't bring yourself to care.

      • by ceoyoyo ( 59147 )

        At least in this particular context I'm not sure it's necessary to specify "authoritarian regimes". Russia's justrification for invading Ukraine is based on creative hyperbole. The US justification for the invasion of Iraq was also based on creative hyperbole. I expect both were going for enthusiastic endorsement from the people, but they only really required passivity.

        • First: you need to be more specific. Iraq 1 and 2 were quite different. Number 1 happened because Saddam Hussain decided to threaten countries that were important US oil suppliers. Number 2 was indeed a grudge match based on creative hyperbole

          Second, you seem to be implying an equivalence between our invasion of Iraq and Russia's invasion of Ukraine. I would like to note that we're no longer occupying Ukraine and made fairly significant efforts to rebuild it. Russia is planning on forcibly, permanently
          • by ceoyoyo ( 59147 )

            Other good propaganda techniques:

            - alleging statements of fact are an implied moral statement

            - attempting to use good behaviour to cancel bad

            - prognostication

            - justification of your own actions through comparison to someone elses'.

  • Yes, that's what conspiranoics will say: never underestimate their capacity to prevent reality from interfering with their fantasies.
  • by cmdr_klarg ( 629569 ) on Monday July 08, 2024 @09:26AM (#64609315)

    The moon landing was staged and it was shot by Stanley Kubrick; the reason it looks so real is because of Kubrick's obsession with filming on location.

  • There are four things that make me walk away from people: they believe the moon landings were hoaxed, they believe the Earth is flat, they believe in booming sky voices that control their lives, and they believe watching sports is somehow entertaining. These are the four "true believer" types I can do without.

  • How did the Russian or Soviet scientists ascertain the origin of the samples vs say JSC-1, the Lunar Regolith Simulant mined near the San Francisco peaks in Flagstaff?

  • Bart Sibrel inconsolable.

"I got everybody to pay up front...then I blew up their planet." "Now why didn't I think of that?" -- Post Bros. Comics

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