Great North Air Ambulance Trials Paramedic Jet Suit (bbc.com) 53
A jet suit for paramedics which would see patients reached in minutes by a "flying" medic has been tested by the Great North Air Ambulance Service. The BBC reports: After a year of talks between GNAAS and Gravity Industries, a first test flight was carried out in the Lake District. Andy Mawson, director of operations at GNAAS, came up with the idea and described seeing it as "awesome." He said it meant a paramedic could "fly" to a fell top in 90 seconds rather than taking 30 minutes on foot.
The test flight was carried out by Richard Browning, founder of Gravity Industries. He said the suits had two mini engines on each arm and one on the back allowing the paramedic to control their movement just by moving their hands. "The biggest advantage is its speed," Mr Mawson said. "If the idea takes off, the flying paramedic will be armed with a medical kit, with strong pain relief for walkers who may have suffered fractures, and a defibrillator for those who may have suffered a heart attack. In a jet pack, what might have taken up to an hour to reach the patient may only take a few minutes, and that could mean the difference between life and death."
The test flight was carried out by Richard Browning, founder of Gravity Industries. He said the suits had two mini engines on each arm and one on the back allowing the paramedic to control their movement just by moving their hands. "The biggest advantage is its speed," Mr Mawson said. "If the idea takes off, the flying paramedic will be armed with a medical kit, with strong pain relief for walkers who may have suffered fractures, and a defibrillator for those who may have suffered a heart attack. In a jet pack, what might have taken up to an hour to reach the patient may only take a few minutes, and that could mean the difference between life and death."
Finally! (Score:5, Funny)
We've had a flying nun [imdb.com] for over 50 years, it's about time we had a flying paramedic!
Save me! (Score:2)
I can already hear the Jackson Hole and Aspen Paramedics ramping up with this device.
--
Never assume the obvious is true. - William Safire
Re: (Score:2)
And exactly how much in the way of supplies are they going to be able to carry? An O2 bottle? IV? defibrillator? Anything more than bandaids and a tourniquet?
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They carry pain killers, basic first aid, a few essential medications and a defibrillator. The purpose isn't complete treatment, it's evaluating and stabilizing the patient long enough for a more complete (air)ambulance to get on the scene. Also to determine just how serious the situation actually is.
Seems like a good idea but... (Score:5, Insightful)
... its a rather risky method of travel for its user. Sure, it'll get to a casualty fast but there's a far bigger risk than with conventional travel methods of the paramedic becoming a casualty himself if he makes a slight error or one of the jets fails even if flying low. I suspect if they do go ahead with it it'll only be used in the most time critical situations., ie the patient is on the verge of death, not if they just have a broken leg or similar.
Re:Seems like a good idea but... (Score:5, Insightful)
That's certainly a concern.
GNAAS clearly do a lot of mountain rescue work and have a very clear idea of the risks of operating helicopters in hill country. The mountain rescue teams they operate with will have a really good understanding of the problems of walking in these hills in poor weather. I'm sure that between them they'll make a very good risk assessment. I think that if GNAAS go ahead with this it will tell us that they've found a way to operate the suit in a safe fashion.
Re:Seems like a good idea but... (Score:4, Informative)
TFA shows that they stay at very low altitude, only a couple of meters off the ground and not travelling all that fast. It's still massively faster than trying to hike up a mountain.
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In America we a device called by different names, ATV, quad bike, quad (cycle), three-wheeler (Not so common anymore) , four-track, four-wheeler, motorized quadracycle or quadricycle, They don't fly, at least not under normal conditions. But they can traverse rather rough terrain in a few minutes that could take us hours to hike by ourselves. While they are often used as a recreational vehicle they are also used for many practical jobs, including Emergency Services.
While for recreation I would rather Hik
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Looking at the video in TFA it seems that an ATV would have trouble with some of the rocky parts, with steps too large for it to climb. Maybe it could go a different route to avoid them at the expense of time.
I assume they have thought of this, and of using larger 4x4 vehicles etc. before deciding that a helicopter and now a jetpack are worth the expense.
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The jetpack could actually save expense. For example, if the caller is panicking too much to give a proper assessment. If a paramedic can get there quickly it may turn out that the injury isn't critical and with splint and pain killers, hiking out with the patient is all that's needed rather than risk a helicopter in bad flying conditions.
Re: Seems like a good idea but...ATV (Score:3)
So the trial was in the Lake District. Let's be clear there is no way on earth you are getting an ATV onto Striding Edge, an extremely popular route to reach the summit of Helvellyn, one of the main peaks in the Lake District.
ATVs not really practical for most remote places (Score:2)
In America we a device called by different names, ATV, quad bike, quad (cycle), three-wheeler (Not so common anymore) , four-track, four-wheeler, motorized quadracycle or quadricycle, They don't fly, at least not under normal conditions. But they can traverse rather rough terrain in a few minutes that could take us hours to hike
I have hiked in a LOT of areas in America that would utterly stomp on the ability of an ATV to traverse.
An ATV is more capable but not magic. Thick vegetation? Deep ravines? Excee
Re:Seems like a good idea but... (Score:5, Informative)
... its a rather risky method of travel for its user. Sure, it'll get to a casualty fast but there's a far bigger risk than with conventional travel methods of the paramedic becoming a casualty himself if he makes a slight error or one of the jets fails even if flying low. I suspect if they do go ahead with it it'll only be used in the most time critical situations., ie the patient is on the verge of death, not if they just have a broken leg or similar.
This was a problem with the martin jetpack. It used a 2 stroke engine driving ducted fans (Browning is using lots of turbojets). The trouble martin had was with making it safe. The original design was pretty cool, bulky but definitely looked close to a jetpack. But they eventually had to add a ballistic parachute and impact absorbing landing gear, and all the extra weight kept scaling things up. By the end of it they basically had a mini-helicopter with ridiculously low propulsive efficiency.
However, this gravity jetpack is pretty cool and simple. I would be interested in whether they can come up with a sort of hybrid system, where you make the rear engine bigger and add a generator which you then use to drive electric fans on the arms. Something like this would give them a lot more options for surviving failure of any one component (e.g. small battery to give you a 'electric parachute' if main engine fails, redundant e-fans on the arms etc).
I think the coolest thing is that he has the balls to actually fly it. I mean, he keeps at a low level and many times over water, but he could still get pretty messed up if he crashed that thing. But unlike the martin jetpack company who only ever used tethers or a dummy, he is blasting around the country side which is really capturing people's imagination. Good on him is all I can say.
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With the many drone type vehicles in development, it seems it would be a relatively simple task for some aerospace giant to design, certify and build something that would carry two people to perform the same task.
I get the impression that the technology is mature enough and reliable enough, but someone with the resources just need to jump in and make a splash.
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... its a rather risky method of travel for its user.
It also needs a lot of practice and a lot of upper body strength to use.
There's a video somewhere of Adam Savage trying to learn one, he had real problems.
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That was also a long time ago. There is an interesting thing with progress in technology over time. Many of the problems of the past are fixed and are no longer problems.
I use to have an old 1985 Chevy Pickup Truck, We kept that thing until around 2004 or so. To start it even when it was new, was to turn the key, and apply just enough extra Gas to get it going. If it was cold you would need to do a little more, then after it started you needed to let it idle for a bit, and give it some gas until the engin
Totally the next Jet Ski (Score:3)
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This is what I was thinking as well. The first 'C' in 'CCC' is Check, as in: "Check the scene". The whole point is to ensure that you, as the first responder, are not putting yourself in danger.
If you are out hiking or skiing or whatever, it seems like you are taking an implicit risk and shouldn't expect others to take extraordinary risks to save you...
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But if the first paramedic crashes, they can just send another to help him!
Finally... (Score:3)
... the UK has caught up with Austrialia. They have had a flying doctor service for decades. :-)
On a more serious note, those jet systems look great for access to difficult to reach casualties, but their flight time is very limited. Only about 10 minues. So not really suitable for finding people who cannot provide an accurate location. Also, these suits also need a fair degree of skill to fly, and may not meet legal requirements in the UK.
$440,000 would buy a lot of helicopter hours, and that would offer a lot more flexibility.
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They already use helicopters.
The fact that they are looking at alternatives implies that choppers have some disadvantages in certain situations.
Maybe like attempting to land a chopper on a steep, rocky slope to get to a casualty? With erratic winds caused by terrain which a jetpack can avoid by staying close to the ground, while still avoiding the problem of having to climb said rocky slope.
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Maybe like attempting to land a chopper on a steep, rocky slope to get to a casualty?
I watch the USCG train to do this all the time. They hover over a hillside, lower a man on a cable, and the man on the cable attaches the cable to a dummy which they hoist away. They do it right across the street from where I work, right next to a live muni airport. It's loud AF, but they can do it all day. Odds are that if you try to field a paramedic with a jetpack to rescue someone on the side of a hill, you're going to need a second paramedic unit.
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I think you're overlooking the novelty factor. A jetpack would do nothing to improve my job, but I'd sure as hell sign up to test it if I was given the chance
Being willing to test something does not mean there's any chance you'd buy it.
GNAAS FAQ (Score:4, Informative)
The Great North Air Ambulance Service have posted a FAQ about this: https://www.greatnorthairambul... [greatnorth...ance.co.uk]
Re: (Score:2)
Thanx.
GNAAS? Seriously? (Score:3)
A slashdot post about an organization called GNAAS and its not April 1?
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Perhaps they didn't know about the GNAA before choosing that acronym. GNAA could have trolled them hard over the years but never did.
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Perhaps they didn't know about the GNAA before choosing that acronym. GNAA could have trolled them hard over the years but never did.
The wrong way around:
The trolling group founded 2002 (I can't actually link this because of Slashdot's lameness filter).
At any rate, I'd not heard of the trolling group before this comment - I can't be the only one.
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They were infamous on Slashdot. If you browsed at -1 over the years, it was impossible to avoid them. Since they predate GNAA by over a decade, I'm a little surprised the GNAA didn't go after them at some point.
Small jet turbines... (Score:2, Informative)
They are using 5 small jet turbines - probably those found for model [bananahobby.com] jets, the largest of which produces 30 kG of thrust for $3800. That works out to 150 kG (~330 lbs) of thrust - sufficient for a 180 lbs pilot. They might be using something else, but the market for small jet engines isn't exactly huge so I doubt it.
The required maintenance is crazy - a jet pack would be insanely expensive to operate.
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They're quite obviously not those you linked to, just by looking.
They didn't use toys, they used a device engineered for this purpose. This should be obvious even if the only device you ever had approved was a lamp plug.
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they used a device engineered for this purpose
I really doubt that. Perhaps they were able to obtain some military goods designed for another purpose, but they clearly did not design the jet engine nor will they generate enough demand for such a product to be designed. Looks like their work went into the frame and controls. And there is nothing wrong with that - they probably did a good job.
They're quite obviously not those you linked to, just by looking.
All I could see is an engine within a shroud that they had built. A shroud is required to prevent getting burned. What is underneath the shroud was not shown
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I think the arm engines are just those hobby engines, but the rear engine seems to be significantly bigger. I think on their original prototype they had 2-3 more of the hobby engines on the back but now they use a single larger engine. Since this likely provides more than half the thrust, it's probably where they have focussed their efforts for now.
I imagine this provides at least half the thrust, and I don't think hobby engines go that big, so it might be something repurposed from an APU/small heli, otherw
Re: (Score:2)
I think the arm engines are just those hobby engines, but the rear engine seems to be significantly bigger. I think on their original prototype they had 2-3 more of the hobby engines on the back but now they use a single larger engine. Since this likely provides more than half the thrust, it's probably where they have focussed their efforts for now.
The thrust from the rear engine is about the same as one pair of arm engines, according to the inventor [youtu.be]. So it accounts for around 1/3 of the thrust.
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That is even dumber, thinking they be able to buy military jets.
Why did they clearly not design the jet? The design of jets is easy. Half the engineers here on slashdot know how to do it.
It is the manufacture of jets that is hard, not the design. But that's large jets. Small jets are easy, because of various squared losses. That includes manufacture; high school pre-engineering students build small jets, for fucks sake.
GNAA (Score:1)
Did they finally go straight?
Fun morning TV (Score:4, Interesting)
First aid kit by air (Score:2)
In many cases the first aid could be provided my people nearby or even by the wounded himself.
Modern medical tools and medicament are easy to use. For example, disposable syringes with the medicine already inside ad the needle attached, with the pictogram explanation on the packing. Plus skin disinfectant napkins.
Or woundseal antihaemorrhagic powder, which in many ceases can save lives. The problem is how
jet powered motorobike (Score:2)
Wasn't there someone who was going to put ten of these (or fewer but slightly bigger more powerful) model airplane jets together on an carbon fiber or titanium frame and make it a flying bike form factor? Whatever happened to that? It would have been cool.
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Aircraft has always been an issue to be consumer ready.
The Fixed Wing Airplane is by far the safest way to travel, As it can be safely landed even in case of an engine failure. But it takes a lot of extra training and certification before you can handle that appropriately. Also there is a lot of inspection that happens before you take off, even for a small aircraft. All this doesn't really make it consumer ready.
The biggest problem with personal airflight is the high cost of failure, and competing enginee
Great (Score:4, Insightful)
"He said the suits had two mini engines on each arm and one on the back allowing the paramedic to control their movement just by moving their hands." ...after having done bodybuilding for 5 years to develop the necessary musculature.
Re: Great (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
Did you see the video?
He's doing a plank on 2 wobbling balls in a storm for 90 seconds.
It's not as easy as it looks and if you fail, it's not like falling on your yoga mat.
Mitchell & Webb predicted similar - Helivets (Score:2)
Seems rather limited (Score:2)
great idea (Score:2)
This could also be used in large disaster areas depending on how far it can fly.
Commerce (Score:2)
Have they been testing in California? (Score:2)
Wondering if our Aussie friends have been testing around Los Angeles...like near LAX
https://www.nbclosangeles.com/... [nbclosangeles.com]
YES! (Score:1)