Ford, GE To Produce 50,000 Ventilators In 100 Days (cnbc.com) 151
Ford Motor and GE Healthcare plan to produce 50,000 ventilators within the next 100 days at a facility in Michigan to assist with the coronavirus pandemic. CNBC reports: Production of the critical care devices is expected to begin with 500 United Auto Workers union members the week of April 20, according to executives at both companies. Ford's Rawsonville Components Plant in Ypsilanti, Michigan will be able to produce 30,000 ventilators a month after early-July, officials said. The companies expect to produce 1,500 by the end of April, 12,000 by the end of May and 50,000 by July 4, officials said.
The design of the ventilator is being licensed by GE Healthcare from Florida-based Airon Corp., a small, privately held company specializing in high-tech pneumatic life support products. The devices are simpler, less complex than GE ventilators Ford previously said it would assist the company in producing at other facilities .
The design of the ventilator is being licensed by GE Healthcare from Florida-based Airon Corp., a small, privately held company specializing in high-tech pneumatic life support products. The devices are simpler, less complex than GE ventilators Ford previously said it would assist the company in producing at other facilities .
By the end of May it would be over (Score:5, Interesting)
By the end of May this would be mostly over in the US. They are too late.
Italy is having their new cases coming down, after (surprise, surprise!) about 3 weeks of lockdown since 9th March. The same with Spain.
In another 2 months, by end of May, either most of the US population would be infected (then 12,000 would be too few to make a difference), or by end-April the lockdown measures would be having its effect and new cases would be slowing down. Unless the US was so stupid as to relax the measures at that time, with some luck, by end-May we should be seeing the tail of the epidemic even though the death toll would be horrible.
They could donate the ventilators to African and South American countries though, their epidemic was just starting, and many countries would be in dire situation in May and June.
Re:By the end of May it would be over (Score:5, Interesting)
It's not crazy late.. This Virus will be with us for a LONG time and social distancing is both extending how long this initial wave takes and killing our economy so it will need to end eventually.
Besides, we need to restock the national stockpile which is now largely depleted, the next pandemic can happen at anytime and if we've learned anything it is that we need to be ready before it starts. Second, we would like to help others when it hits them. And last, but not least, we don't know how long this will be - yet - and we DO KNOW that there will be a rebound once we start to return to work as well as next fall when flu season traditionally gets going next winter. We may still need these things.
Re: (Score:3)
Re: (Score:2)
They keep them for a few years. Then they will cut the cost. Then they will give them to Africa, because they are broken anyway and that is a way to deduct them from some budget and taxes. Then there will be a need for them and the whole thing starts over again.
My God your cynical but I think your right the corporate mindset is do anything to avoid and reduce paying taxes.
"That money is ours !!!"
Re: (Score:2)
Two things: "you're", not "your", and do you, when you do you do your taxes, just toss a bit extra Uncle Sam's way? After all, you've just stated that it's wrong to take all the tax breaks allowed....
Re: (Score:2)
Two things: "you're", not "your", and do you, when you do you do your taxes, just toss a bit extra Uncle Sam's way? After all, you've just stated that it's wrong to take all the tax breaks allowed....
Just a gentle bit of ribbing here, but "...and do you, when you do you do your taxes..." is just a bit clumsy there, don't you think? However, I agree with your point. I suspect there are very few (read none) that reject the opportunity to claim their legal deductions on their personal or business taxes. But there will always be some who complain when big businesses or wealthy people claim their deductions. Don't like the tax code, replace the people in charge of establishing and maintaining the tax code.
Re: (Score:3)
Don't like the tax code, replace the people in charge of establishing and maintaining the tax code.
You mean replace the lobbyists and other special interest groups?
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Lobbyists get exactly one vote at the polls - just like you and me (and they don't necessarily even vote for those politicians supporting positions they are lobbying for).
"Special Interest Groups" (like the ACLU, FSF, Teamsters, or NRA) don't get even one vote at the polls. They merely represent those individuals who share their goals.
For example, the NRA is not powerful because it's the NRA -- it's powerful because a significant segment of the voting public shares the general goals of the NRA and place som
Re: (Score:3)
Two things: "you're", not "your", and do you, when you do you do your taxes, just toss a bit extra Uncle Sam's way? After all, you've just stated that it's wrong to take all the tax breaks allowed....
Opps you're ....
I have no problem paying taxes, by the way I'm not an American , as I know it is going towards funding of Hospitals , Schools, Roads, etc.
After all, you've just stated that it's wrong to take all the tax breaks allowed....
It means less social services will be provided by the Government and experience tells me that society is poorer as you get increased poverty , homelessness and crime when Governments don't fund social services.
Re: (Score:2)
The peak will be in the next month most likely. The US will need a lot more than 50k extra ventilators. That's why you need to stockpile.
Re:By the end of May it would be over (Score:4, Interesting)
No. The peak for the first wave will likely be at the end of next month. As we go back to work a second and third wave will come in especially by next fall just like with the regular flu.
Until we have billions upon billions of vacines like we do for other diseases we will need these ventilators. This is a nasty bug and it shows how in the next 50 years as we advanced with computers and electronics we will need the same for RNA vaccines (still in research) and 3d printing to make stuff in demand FAST. Medicine still is not innovating and neither is manufacturing. Sure we have computers now attached to robots and new vacines and drugs but the base line technology and methods are 50 years old. It is not practical anymore.
Re: (Score:2)
That's literally what I said, the peak will be next month.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:3)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Yes except there is no real proof the social distancing and stay-at-home orders accomplish anything at all. Remember nobody every put any numbers on those curve bending charts; that was just a nice conceptualization.
The statistics so far in every country pretty much so that infections grow exponentially until suddenly they don't (probably because most of the population has been exposed). Given all these nations have responded with differing degrees of stringency and the curve has been basically been the sam
October more likely for US than May (Score:2, Insightful)
which will take a large effort by the US medical system to stop.
The US doesn't have Universal medical care which will mean the Poor can not even get access to needed help and
there is a large Homeless population who live in "3rd World" conditions.
There is the possibility that this can't be stopped in the US until next year when vaccines for the virus start to become available.
Re:October more likely for US than May (Score:4, Informative)
I can see this lasting a least until October for the US as they have a high amount of infections spread over a large area which will take a large effort by the US medical system to stop. The US doesn't have Universal medical care which will mean the Poor can not even get access to needed help and there is a large Homeless population who live in "3rd World" conditions.
WTH? We DO have universal health care by law. Hospitals MUST treat you, regardless of your ability to pay. THEN, they cannot simply turn you back out on the street to die if you are in need of medical care, but MUST at least arrange care for you. That may include getting you on Medicaid or other public assistance and transferring you to a facility which agrees to accept you. Being homeless doesn't prevent you from getting critical medical care.
Now of the homeless person doesn't want to stay in the hospital, they cannot be imprisoned, hospitals must let them leave. This problem isn't going to be fixed by having single payer, or publicly funded healthcare. Mentally ill patients will die from lack of care but it will be due to their own choice and our respecting their rights.
So stop with this lie that because we don't have single payer the homeless are going without healthcare services. It's NOT true. They may not get PREVENTATIVE care or treatment for chronic illnesses, but they have healthcare options for critical conditions AND if they availed themselves of the Medicaid option they could get free medical care if they cared to try.
Re:October more likely for US than May (Score:5, Interesting)
WTH? We DO have universal health care by law. Hospitals MUST treat you, regardless of your ability to pay. THEN, they cannot simply turn you back out on the street to die if you are in need of medical care, but MUST at least arrange care for you.
So was this fake news?
Teenage boy whose death was linked to COVID-19 turned away from urgent care for not having insurance [independent.co.uk]
The mayor said the teen “didn’t have insurance, so they did not treat him” when he arrived at an urgent care facility in the area. The medical staff then told the child to go to a local public hospital.
Re:October more likely for US than May (Score:5, Insightful)
WTH? We DO have universal health care by law. Hospitals MUST treat you, regardless of your ability to pay. THEN, they cannot simply turn you back out on the street to die if you are in need of medical care, but MUST at least arrange care for you.
So was this fake news?
Teenage boy whose death was linked to COVID-19 turned away from urgent care for not having insurance [independent.co.uk]
The mayor said the teen “didn’t have insurance, so they did not treat him” when he arrived at an urgent care facility in the area. The medical staff then told the child to go to a local public hospital.
IF he wasn't requiring critical medical care when he presented himself to the doctors, then it was his failure to seek medical care at the correct time. IF the doctors didn't evaluate him properly and he DID require critical medical care then they violated the law and need to be held responsible.
Mistakes where apparently made in this case.. But it doesn't change the fact that hospitals (not urgent care facilities by the way) and emergency rooms are REQUIRED by LAW to provide you critical medical care without regard to your ability to pay. They CANNOT turn you away.
So this story isn't about the law or what *should* have happened. It's about a mistake that somebody made. It's not about not having insurance causing some kid's death, it's about a medical decision that was a mistake. Who made that bad decision is an open question, one likely to be argued in court.
Re: October more likely for US than May (Score:2)
You've obviously haven't visited an ER anytime recently. ERs are in fact turning patients away by discouraging them from seeking emergency help and pointing them to local urgent care facilities as a way to be seen sooner. For those that don't, they leave them stuck in triage for hours. Todd's was going on well before the outbreak and is no surprise that this kid went to an urgent care since that's what hospitals and insurance providers have been pushing people towards instead of visiting the ER. They may no
Re: October more likely for US than May (Score:4, Insightful)
IF he wasn't requiring critical medical care when he presented himself to the doctors, then it was his failure to seek medical care at the correct time.
Most people don't know the difference between a walk-in clinic, urgent care, and a ER. They certainly do not have a card in the wallet or a pamphlet in their mailbox that says they can go a a facility marked XYZ, and they will HAVE to treat you. That is a system of last resort, not universal health care. It's only well known to people that bitch about paying for it, not the people that can't afford care and haven't seen a doctor of any sort in ten years.
To call an ambulance or not is still a financial decision for many people, probably most. Nobody KNOWS if you're going to go into cardiac arrest on the way to a hospital, if you KNEW that, everyone would choose the no matter the cost option.
You can't deny the effects of people making financial decisions in the last moments of their lives. They aren't planning on dying, they are planning on coming out with medical bills, and that frames their decision making. Saying they would have could have found someone that "had" to save them if they'd chosen better options doesn't wash anyone's hands.
When does anyone take ownership and say our healthcare system is at fault for that, if you can blame the dead guy for not knowing the difference between urgent care and an ER??
Re: (Score:3)
OK.. But my point was, and still is, you will get critical medical care without regard to your ability to pay. You get critical care, nobody can deny you.
You want to argue that the way you get care is too hard, to confusing, or difficult, then I'm not going to take you to task on that. Sure, for some folks, you are right, it's too confusing. But I don't have any clue how you fix *that* problem and I dare say you don't either. Even if you had insurance, the same considerations would be true. I have insu
Re: (Score:2, Troll)
Yup the same "civilized" countries, such as Canada, which say to an older person with cancer, sorry, you're too old and not worth it to spend the money on to save. There is too many people in front of you waiting for this care. Here is a bunch of pain killers. Go home and die slowly for the next 3-6 months.
True story, from a close friend. Exactly how his Grandmother died, in the civilized country of Canada with their kind of medicine.
Also, BS on the immediate treatment. Blow out your knee, see you in 3
Re: (Score:2)
I call bullshit.
True story, from a close friend. Exactly how his Grandmother died, in the civilized country of Canada with their kind of medicine.
Third hand information with no substance to backup that up. This article:
https://www.commonwealthfund.o... [commonwealthfund.org]
states that if you need surgery now you will get surgery now. There are ALWAYS statistics involved in whether you should get the surgery instead of someone else. If you are 86 years old and likelyhood of survival of some surgery is only a short period you probably wont get your surgery in the USA either. You will be referred to Hospice care and given those very same pain killers.
Re:October more likely for US than May (Score:4, Informative)
An urgent care facility is not a hospital. In fact, they are generally not well equipped to deal with emergency/critical care situations and will send people to a hospital.
Basically they work for non-emergency general practitioner situations on a walk-in basis rather than appointment.
Of course, this arrangement is terrible for day to day because:
-People who are getting mandatory care have frequently let things go to the point where they finally can't be refused, and require much more expensive measures to try to come back from something that could have been handled much more efficiently when caught early, and with more limited success
-The ER waiting room can get clogged by uninsured sick people waiting for triage that could have gone to their own doctor or an urgent care facility instead if they had insurance.
Re:October more likely for US than May (Score:5, Informative)
Re: October more likely for US than May (Score:2)
Urgent care centers with rare exception do not operate as emergency rooms. They have a rather limited range of stuff they can do, and most certainly were not equipped to help the patient, regardless of his ability to pay. You go to one when you have a sprain, simple fracture, the seasonal cold, drug tests, and other stuff for which you'd normally see a family physician. You don't go to one when you have significant trauma, or you're on death's door step with a disease.
That's why he was sent to a real hospit
Re:October more likely for US than May (Score:5, Insightful)
We DO have universal health care by law. Hospitals MUST treat you, regardless of your ability to pay.
In most sane countries "universal health care" treats you without you wishing you were dead when you get the bill.
Re: (Score:3)
We DO have universal health care by law. Hospitals MUST treat you, regardless of your ability to pay.
In most sane countries "universal health care" treats you without you wishing you were dead when you get the bill.
IF you get a bill, then the evidence says you got your medical care... SO my point was valid, you get critical medical care without consideration of your ability to pay. Yea they may bill you, but you got treated.
If you want to argue about medical debt, have at it.. Just understand it's a separate debate and proves my statement right.
So the argument that you don't get medical care without insurance is incorrect...
Re: (Score:3)
We DO have universal health care by law. Hospitals MUST treat you, regardless of your ability to pay.
In most sane countries "universal health care" treats you without you wishing you were dead when you get the bill.
IF you get a bill, then the evidence says you got your medical care...
You got initial care to stabilize you. But if you require ongoing care you are SOL without again going to the ER which wastes resources. Much cheaper and efficient to provide preventive care BEFORE someone is on the verge of death.
Re: (Score:2)
Though that medical care is likely too late for a lot of situations that would be caught earlier in a strategy that most people would consider 'universal health care'.
It's not particularly worth bragging that the government only mandates that critical care be provided, and does so without funding that requirement exacerbating emergency care costs for everyone as hospitals have to try to gouge everyone to be prepared for the unfunded care they must provide.
Re: (Score:2)
IF you get a bill
IF? *IF** maybe bold and italicize it as well IF ? What kind of non USA country do you live in where there is any open question on IF you get a bill?
SO my point was valid
Your point was valid. So was mine. Just to re-iterate, my point is that you are either completely dishonest or willfully ignorant about the term "universal healthcare". Universal healthcare does not mean, nor has ever meant or simply been limited to the fact that you can get healthcare.
Go take your republican propaganda to someone who will buy your bullshit. T
Re: (Score:2)
So the argument that you don't get medical care without insurance is incorrect...
Also learn to read. You may realise that I said none of what you just wrote.
Re: (Score:3)
Re: (Score:2)
I think a more accurate term for what you are describing is "Universal Emergency Medical Care." When you describe the current arrangement as "Universal Health Care," it suggests that everyone has some sort of readily accessible healthcare--not that there is a subset of critical ailments and symptoms for which treatment cannot be denied.
It's sort of like saying we have universal funeral arrangement because the state will dispose of your body.
Re: (Score:2)
In reality poorer people don't want to go to hospital in the first place for fear of racking up debts. The treatment isn't free, the hospital will pursue them for payment. It's for emergency care only too, you certainly aren't going to get any "free" preventative care or even treatment for anything less than a life-threatening illness. They will wait until you are imminently about to die before helping and then stop as soon as you are stable.
Are people getting free COVID-19 tests? Will the hospital treat th
Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
What rea
Re: (Score:2)
Sure they MUST treat you. But will you go in the hospital if it means you can loose your home? At $30,000 a day for treatment it can be devastating to all but the wealthy.
Europeans and Ausies reading this comment are probably HORRIFIED by my first sentence but my bill to the hospital was $30,000 a night, plus $1100 ER fee (just to check in) and a $4000 blood work, and $5,000 admittance fee.
This is INSANITY! As a result people will REFUSE TO SEEK TREATMENT short of innement death to save money.
Face it Americ
Re: (Score:2)
I've been to the ER a few times. Literally the first thing they do when you finally get to a room is send in a lady with a clip board to ask for your insurance information - BEFORE they do ANYTHING.
Tell that to this 17 year old boy (Score:2)
Hospital ERs don't work for a lot of reasons.
First, they will sue you for the money you owe. As little as $300 these days. Your wages will be garnished. In parts of the South if you are unemployed and can't pay a judge will find you in contempt of court and throw you in jail until your relatives pay. In the meantime you will be pressed into prison labor for 10-70 cents/hr. A lot of fruit is
Re: (Score:3)
WTH? We DO have universal health care by law. Hospitals MUST treat you, regardless of your ability to pay.
From What I have heard but I do not live in the US going to emergency means at least a $2000 bill and if can't pay it means creditors coming after to you. However your are corrrect they can't deny you access but If your poor and don't have $2000 are you going to go anywhere near a hospital?
So stop with this lie that because we don't have single payer the homeless are going without healthcare services. It's NOT true.
I believe that is incorrect except from an emergency put of view but please correct If I am wrong but as I say I do not live in the US. https://www.reddit.com/r/expla... [reddit.com]
IF you look at the post I was responding to, it was about HOMELESS people. Creditors have a serious problem collecting from the homeless. What are you going to do? Repossess the shopping cart and stash of empty beer cans it contains?
But my point was that if you need critical care, you will get it. Regardless of your ability to pay. They don't check your credit history, they don't check your insurance before they save your life, they just treat you.
But if you want to change the subject to debt do to medi
Re: (Score:3)
Re: (Score:3)
I am not quite sure why you are bragging about this.
who is bragging? I'm responding to the LIE that if you don't have insurance you don't get any medical care. This is not true.
I'm not arguing that this is a GOOD system, I'm just arguing that folks are lying about the system when they say the poor, without insurance, don't get care. That statement is not true.
Re: (Score:2)
-Higher likelihood of going without needed care.
-Higher likelihood of bankruptcy due to a medical issue.
-Higher likelihood of needing additional government assistance programs (such as SNAP) due to the bankruptcy and cost of medical care.
-Lower chance of receiving preventive care and car
Re: (Score:2)
So you have to redefine the terms to make your argument? You have access to critical care without regard to your ability to pay. This may not be enough for you, but it is access to health care at some level.
So what's your solution?
For the uninsured poor we already HAVE an option, Medicaid. It covers critical care and treatment for a wide range of common medical issues at little to no cost if you qualify. Is that no enough for you? Why or why not?
Re: (Score:3)
IF you look at the post I was responding to, it was about HOMELESS people. Creditors have a serious problem collecting from the homeless. What are you going to do? Repossess the shopping cart and stash of empty beer cans it contains?
But my point was that if you need critical care, you will get it. Regardless of your ability to pay. They don't check your credit history, they don't check your insurance before they save your life, they just treat you.
But if you want to change the subject to debt do to medical bills, that's a totally different question. If you are in debt to a hospital and they have sent you to collections, you got your medical care did you not? I rest my case..
What I was talking about is the cornovirus in the USA will not disappear in May as the first poster said as it will hit the Poor and Homeless hard as their ability to get care is limited unless its consired an Emergency.
We appear to be talking about two different things here your talking about Emergency Care and I'm talking about what I call Universal Access which is Hosptial care provided by the state without a bill that keeps you in debt for the rest of your life.
The reason I say that this will con
Re: (Score:2)
I will agree that US health care system is in need of reform and it's odd to be trying to stand up for the half-assed critical-care only strategy the US has.
I will say that in the case of COViD19 *currently*, the biggest problem for poor and homeless is not medical, but economic. The majority of carriers will not be sick enough for hospitalization (there isn't the capacity to house every single individual even if they have only mild symptoms) and the strategy is 'stay at home for 14 days'. Which is obviou
Re: (Score:2)
Then say what you mean.. Don't say stuff like Homeless or folks without medical insurance don't get medical care, because they can and do.
IF you want to argue about medical DEBT, that's a horse of a different color and I'm not debating that folks are often subject debt for medical care that they cannot hope to pay. But insurance doesn't fix this either, having premiums and out of pocket expenses you cannot pay doesn't help anybody.
What's your solution? Having the government take over a bit more than 15
Re: (Score:3)
Then say what you mean.. Don't say stuff like Homeless or folks without medical insurance don't get medical care, because they can and do.
Thats not what I said , I said The US doesn't have Universal medical care which It doesn't I will qoute my first post for you
I can see this lasting a least until October for the US as they have a high amount of infections spread over a large area which will take a large effort by the US medical system to stop. The US doesn't have Universal medical care which will mean the Poor can not even get access to needed help and there is a large Homeless population who live in "3rd World" conditions. There is the possibility that this can't be stopped in the US until next year when vaccines for the virus start to become available.
As far as I can see I wasn't talking about debt though I did bring up in another post (silly of me) to counter your argument that people have access to medical care in the USA.
I was just pointing out how they don't and what barriers there are to getting access and now I realise now your talking about Emergency care which is not what I am talking about.
Re: (Score:2)
What's your solution? Having the government take over a bit more than 15% of the nation's economy? Medicare for all?
Yes thats what nearly every country in the Western World does and it works fine. You do however pay a bit more in taxes.
You want to debate that? Fine, but leave the heart rendering "the poor don't get medical care" lie at the door and we can discuss this for that it is, and economic problem.
The poor in the USA don't get the access to medical care its not an argument it is a fact.
What they get is the "Patch em up and send them on" Emergency care and that is not proper full medical care
and it will mean that once this virus takes hold in the homeless and poor , if it hasn't already, this pandemic will continue
and I'm probably being optimistic when I say October it will end
Re: (Score:2)
Usually it is at this point to where I mention this and politely tell them it really is NONE of their business how we decide to govern ourselves nor how we conduct our social services, taxation...or even out viewpoints on guns.
And then I wonder WTF they think it is so important to argue with us how we wish to run our own country with regard to these topics.
Perhaps they should mind their own business and if they like how it is in their country, then be
Re: (Score:2)
The person you are arguing with is not in/from the US.
Usually it is at this point to where I mention this and politely tell them it really is NONE of their business how we decide to govern ourselves nor how we conduct our social services, taxation...or even out viewpoints on guns.
And then I wonder WTF they think it is so important to argue with us how we wish to run our own country with regard to these topics.
Perhaps they should mind their own business and if they like how it is in their country, then be happy with it, but really....leave us alone, thank you.
And then I wonder WTF they think it is so important to argue with us how we wish to run our own country
Well it seems so criminal how such a large group of people are needlsy kept in poverty because your Goverenments don't want to help them.
Maybe it will elighten you ?
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
It sucks for people who have barely enough money to have $2000 dollars ever.
Financially, it doesn't suck for an utterly penniless person for whom bad credit doesn't even matter. Health wise it sucks because they can only try to get health care when it's likely too late.
It also sucks for people who have enough money because the hospitals make it up on your bills. The mandatory health care is an unfunded mandate.
I'm not sure what the point is of standing up for the critical care must be provided situation i
Re: (Score:2)
That is only the beginning in the hell hole of the US (I am an American). That is just the ambulance fee to get TO THE HOSPITAL. If you sign into a hospital you need to get processed. This is outsourced to a different company. The charge is $1,000 to sign in and wait for a doctor from this 3rd party. THen the hospital can start chaging you. It is $5000 blood work. $5,000 for an xray and $30,000 a night to stay.
I know this because insurance only covered $4000 for the hospital. All the others they only covere
Re: (Score:3)
"Hospitals MUST treat you"
That's not 100% true. Local hospital here will NOT treat you unless you have insurance. They will treat you if you are brought in by ambulance for a life or death emergency.
If you got a kidney stone or the flu, forget about it...
If you had chosen to read on, you would have seen that I qualified that statement. They MUST provide critical care and cannot turn you away.
Now if you show up with a non-critical need, then yea, you get shown the door unless you have the ability to pay. But you ALWAYS get rationed medical care, even with insurance, even if you don't realize it. Trust me, your doctor knows what your insurance will pay for and what it won't and this often drives decisions about what care you get, even if you don't realiz
Re: (Score:2)
Then why are you calling it universal health care when it is clearly not?
Re: (Score:2)
They will treat you if you are brought in by ambulance for a life or death emergency.
Do they charge you for it...?
Re: By the end of May it would be over (Score:3)
Italys infections are decreasing, but their hospitalization rate continues to increase. It takes 4-6 weeks to recover from a serious case, but only 4-6 days to come down with a new one. Hospitalizations will still increase for week in the best case.
Re: (Score:2)
Not really. Italy and Spain still see increases. The US will probably see increases for at least several months and only then a slow decrease.
Re: (Score:3)
That's the first wave. Many epidemics of this kind come in multiple waves until vaccine is developed or herd immunity is achieved via natural means. Essentially bad part hits, everyone hides in their homes and sits out the incubation period, epidemic eases, people go out and new infection wave starts.
Considering the level of threat involved, it makes sense to prepare for the second wave.
Re: (Score:2)
America should prepare for a second wave. It's only sensible.
China is preparing for a second wave. See it's proof that the Commies can't contain the spread!!!
Re: (Score:2)
The what now?
Re: (Score:3)
Re: (Score:3)
The lock down is necessary to give time to effectively "process" the critically ill portion of covid through intensive care and ventilation and allow time for more effective treatments and treatment capacity to come on line.
The issue in Italy and initially China was the cases far exceeded the health care system capacity to put critically ill on ventilators, therefore many hard choices were made and many people had to be allowed to die. This partly explains the very high elderly representation in the death s
Re: (Score:2)
In some states and communities, but not for others.
Each US State is the equivalent of every EU Country. While each State is United under a federal government, they actually have a lot of autonomy on how they do things. As well they have different economic drivers, and more or fewer cities and sizes. New York City is getting hit now, however, in the next few weeks, we could be having problems in Dallas Texas.
Re: (Score:2)
Well, if they say that in a 100 days they will have built x units, then that doesn't mean that at 100 days from now, on the exact date, they'll put a few containers in front if you with x units.
It can also be the case that per day they will create ( x units / 100 days ) and after 100 days they will have created ( x units / 100 days ) times 100 days units, or, x.
I know this sounds like a very strange concept to some people. But it's totally plausible that it actually works that way. Think about it. You'll fi
Re: (Score:2)
Italy is having their new cases coming down, after (surprise, surprise!) about 3 weeks of lockdown since 9th March. The same with Spain.
They've both gone back up again today.
Re: (Score:2)
In another 2 months, by end of May, either most of the US population would be infected (then 12,000 would be too few to make a difference), or by end-April the lockdown measures would be having its effect and new cases would be slowing down.
Not every pandemic is a once and done. Even without self-isolation and social distancing, only 40% of the population infected this round is possible, assuming the virus dies out in warmer weather (far from a certainty yet). Yet waves of infection rates as low as 35 percent of the entire population in an area likely collapses the local health care system, as hospitals are overwhelmed with patient load, while large numbers of medical staff get infected and are no longer available for weeks. Even if your ar
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:3)
Italy is having their new cases coming down
Other than the weekly saturday, sunday dip in cases across the world where's your data to back the idea that Italy's case number is going down? Based on the trend until friday they were increasing exponentially, and the weekend they held flat like they have for every weekend since the outbreak began.
https://www.worldometers.info/... [worldometers.info]
New cases stopped growing exponentially since 22 March, had been steady at under ~6k for a week now.
Re: (Score:3)
https://covid19info.live/italy... [covid19info.live]
The chart on the right seems to support the claim that since March 20th, it's been roughly linear growth rather than exponential.
Also, the dip over the past few days seems to be very promising.
That will be a bit too late (Score:2)
That is, unless the US wants to extends its global leadership role ( Yeah! US is global number 1! MAGA! ) in infection cases unmitigated, then saturation should happen around the time these devices are finished. Of course, most people with severe cases will just die in this case.
Open Source design, approved, production starting (Score:4, Interesting)
So it turns out the govt has known (Score:5, Informative)
Re: (Score:2)
It's not treason (Score:2)
At this point the only thing to do is change how you vote. Look for and demand politicians who refuse corporate PAC money. That is the defining issue of our time. The only way to get money out of politics is to refuse to vote for anyone who's bought and paid for.
And vote in your primary, if you don't then you'll be left with the old "Turd Sandwich" vs "Giant Dou
Re: (Score:2)
Very legal and very cool, if you like money.
While I'm on the subject (Score:3)
It was shelved because it wasn't deemed profitable enough (hindsight's a bitch) and there wasn't any gov't funding (decades of cuts).
Re: (Score:2)
Companies should not be allowed to buy out other companies.
Re:Pipes dreams are made of this (Score:5, Insightful)
I call bullshit on the quantity and we probably won't need them at the end of July because everybody who will need a ventilator will be dead for not having a ventilator. They will also probably cost too much and not have been probably qualified for use which will end up in deaths do to equipment failure.
Pick your poison then. How do you want to die? Due to equipment failure, or because there isn't any equipment in the first place?
We may not need all this production capacity, or we might. Have we not learned anything? Unless you have the equipment on hand when the pandemic starts, you have to sacrifice the economy for a long time to blunt the curve.
So let them build a couple hundred thousand and put them into storage. It will keep people working and getting paychecks, help prepare us for the next pandemic which could start next week or a decade from now. Plus, it might actually help if this thing drags on too long or spikes again after we all get out of house arrest..
Re: (Score:2)
Pick your poison then:
That one is easy. I choose equipment failure. Then my wife can sue Ford and settle for something between 1-3 million.
Re: (Score:2)
I can't recall which podcast or youtube video I saw it in, but they made a good point.
Public health (as in epidemics/pandemics)... are a lot like the military. You need a certain level of investment to just be in the game. You hope you don't have to use it. But you need it immediately when you need it. Not having it ready could bring society collapsing problems.
If another country attacks you, you can't just start building fighter jets and nuclear submarines immediately. You can't just magically have soldier
Re: (Score:2)
I don't know much fuel reserves the US has, but I'm sure they make sure they have enough stored for a military war.
As much as they can squeeze in at these prices. [www.cbc.ca] Currently at an 18 year low.
Re: (Score:2)
Initially, that was true, in China, however...Physian's Weekly: [physiciansweekly.com]
Probably the best published information we have so far is from the Intensive Care National Audit and Research Center (ICNARC) in the UK. Of 165 patients admitted to ICUs, 79 (48%) died. Of the 98 patients who received advanced respiratory support—defined as invasive ventilation, BPAP or CPAP via endotracheal tube, or tracheostomy, or extracorporeal respiratory support—66% died. Compare that to the 36% mortality rate of non-COVID patients receiving advanced respiratory support reported to ICNARC from 2017 to 2019.
I don't know about you, but when faced with a near 100% chance of death when I can no longer breathe, I'd appreciate the opportunity to upgrade to even a 33% chance of survival.
Re: (Score:2)
I don't know about you, but when faced with a near 100% chance of death when I can no longer breathe, I'd appreciate the opportunity to upgrade to even a 33% chance of survival.
Indeed. And that survival rate will improve the better this thing is understood and if medication is found that reliably improves symptoms. Sadly, it does look like the US will have ventilators only for a small fraction of those that urgently need it. The delayed response and continued bumbling will soon overwhelm the US medical system as they will make the epidemic plateau at a far higher number of cases than needed. I predict a certain psycho to claim in the not too distant future that "Only 500'000 dead
Re: (Score:2)
The vast majority of people who go on ventilators wind up dying anyway. Ventilators don't do a lot to change the survival rate, they just allow things to drag on a little longer. People are acting like ventilators are some kind of game-changer; they are not. They simply give us something to do when there really isn't a lot you can do.
No , most people survive. It really depends on the persons ability to heal as your buying them time for their lungs to once again take over breathing.
What are the chances of survival after being put on a ventilator ? https://www.quora.com/What-are... [quora.com]
despirate? (Score:2)
Just itching for those rare moments when Trump finally does something sane people have been screaming about for days to years?
You just long to forget all the defending and excusing you've been doing to the point of embarrassing yourself -- at the back of your mind you just count down the days to when you can flip flop (like dear leader?) Then you can act like it was your position all the time and move on, never looking back. Repeat.
Each repetition puts unnecessary stress on you; don't you want to stop the
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Too bad for your argument that he did; severely restricting travel to China on January 31, and taking flack and accusations of "racism" from several Democrat congressman. The only thing he tried to do was counter the mounting panic. At the same time he was restricting travel to the origin of the virus, the Dems were still drooling over their golden pens and impeachment circus. Even in February, New York City health officials were on TV telling New Yorkers not to worry, they're a "resilient" people, so "t
Re: (Score:2)
To be fair, you didn't die from Coronavirus if you actually starved to death because you were welded into your home.
Re: (Score:3)
Re: (Score:2)
Why do you fuckers keep acting like he did nothing when he started doing more than the poisonous impeachment fixated democrats did? What about restricting travel on Jan 31 from the country/origin of the virus? How about NYC health officials telling everyone in Feburary "Take the subway" "live your life" "don't worry" about it.
He's given the governors what they wanted, even Gavin Newsom has complimented his lead on this crisis; but trump also directed them to go directly to the private sector if they neede
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Please, God, don't let them give me a Ford ventilator!
To be fair, 2 out of my 3 Fords have been awesome. My 1980 Bronco sat in a 100 year old barn for a decade before I got it, and my grandfather's '04 farm F150 never saw the inside of a garage and runs great (looks like a farm truck though). My '14 Focus, on the other hand, had more transmission issues than satellite tv during a hurricane. If someone can find a 15 year old Ford ventilator I would take that.
Re: (Score:2)
Please, God, don't let them give me a Ford ventilator!
Fix Or Repair Daily - Found On Road Dead? You afraid? Pray for a GM model.
Re: (Score:2)
This whole story makes my blood boil. If I read this right it went like this: We pay them to design us a respirator. They design the respirator. They design a "commercial version" based off OUR design. Instead of making ours, they make (and presumably sell) 1,000 of the commercial version/week. When approached to make ours they say something to the effect of "we can't make yours because we're too busy making the ones that we can sell for 5x the price. Want to buy those instead?"
I think it would be helpful if the US gov purchased the entire IP for a useful machine like this
It looks like we alrea