Missing Out On Deep Sleep Causes Alzheimer's Plaques to Build Up (discovermagazine.com) 103
"Deep, non-REM sleep helps people's brains to wash away toxic proteins and waste, a new study found, reinforcing the link between sleep deprivation, aging and Alzheimer's disease," reports U.S. News & World Report.
Or, as Discover magazine puts it, "Getting enough deep sleep might be the key to preventing dementia." The discovery reinforces how critical quality sleep is for brain health and suggests sleep therapies might curb the advance of memory-robbing ailments, like Alzheimer's disease... Cerebrospinal fluid (CSF) churns through a system of brain tunnels piped in the spaces between brain cells and blood vessels. Scientists call it the glymphatic system. This system circulates nutrients like glucose, the brain's primary energy source, and washes away potentially toxic waste. And it may be the reason why animals even need sleep. The system takes out the brain's trash when we're asleep, and it shuts down when we're awake.
Maiken Nedergaard, a neurologist at the University of Rochester Medical Center in New York, who led the new research, and her team were curious if the system works best and clears more waste -- like Alzheimer's causing beta amyloid plaque -- when animals are in deep sleep. To find out, the researchers used six different anesthetics to put mice into deep sleep. Then they tracked cerebrospinal fluid as it flowed into the brain. As the mice slept, the researchers watched the rodents' brain activity on an electroencephalograph, or EEG, and recorded the animals' blood pressures and heart and respiratory rates. Mice anesthetized with a combination of two drugs, ketamine and xylazine, showed the strongest deep sleep brain waves and these brain waves predicted CSF flow into the brain, the researchers found.
The lead researcher now argues that focusing on sleep in the early stages of dementia "might be able to slow progression of the disease."
Or, as Discover magazine puts it, "Getting enough deep sleep might be the key to preventing dementia." The discovery reinforces how critical quality sleep is for brain health and suggests sleep therapies might curb the advance of memory-robbing ailments, like Alzheimer's disease... Cerebrospinal fluid (CSF) churns through a system of brain tunnels piped in the spaces between brain cells and blood vessels. Scientists call it the glymphatic system. This system circulates nutrients like glucose, the brain's primary energy source, and washes away potentially toxic waste. And it may be the reason why animals even need sleep. The system takes out the brain's trash when we're asleep, and it shuts down when we're awake.
Maiken Nedergaard, a neurologist at the University of Rochester Medical Center in New York, who led the new research, and her team were curious if the system works best and clears more waste -- like Alzheimer's causing beta amyloid plaque -- when animals are in deep sleep. To find out, the researchers used six different anesthetics to put mice into deep sleep. Then they tracked cerebrospinal fluid as it flowed into the brain. As the mice slept, the researchers watched the rodents' brain activity on an electroencephalograph, or EEG, and recorded the animals' blood pressures and heart and respiratory rates. Mice anesthetized with a combination of two drugs, ketamine and xylazine, showed the strongest deep sleep brain waves and these brain waves predicted CSF flow into the brain, the researchers found.
The lead researcher now argues that focusing on sleep in the early stages of dementia "might be able to slow progression of the disease."
Re: (Score:1, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
The US has neither the only, or even the most robust constitutional protections of free speech.
Re: (Score:1, Offtopic)
It's just some autist incel who thinks he's clever. My only surprise is that Slashdot has not found the means or the interest in permanently blocking him.
Mankind wastes too much of... (Score:2)
...their lives on sleep.
The lathe of heaven (Score:2)
You need D-sleep or you go insane and the world is destroyed.
Re:Mankind wastes too much of... (Score:5, Interesting)
It's not a waste of time, otherwise evolution would have removed it. There's a number of species that sort of remove sleep effectively: aquatic mammals/some birds sleep with half their brain and with one eye closed for mostly avoiding being eaten while asleep and for the aquatic mammals to be able to breathe; however they are still sleeping, so it is required in ways we don't fully understand yet, and TFA might be a clue.
Re: (Score:1)
It's not a waste of time, otherwise evolution would have removed it.
That's not how evolution works. All sorts of animals develop behaviors that could be described as a "waste of time" but evolution doesn't necessarily remove them. "Survival of the fittest" is a backward way of looking at evolution. A better perspective is "death of the unfit." An organism can develop all sorts of useless traits as long as they don't have such a negative impact on survival that the species goes extinct.
Having said that, sleep is definitely a trait that is required for human survival, but it
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
" but it has nothing to do with preventing Alzheimers"
Says random internet guy. Clearly, unless we're experts on the topic, and you're not, we shouldn't even have an opinion on this until further study is completed.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Wow, you call what he stated logic...SMH. He demonstrated nothing other than random items of basic evolution, and proved nothing to negate the study. Again, unless you're an expert on the topic...and you also clearly are not or you'd understand actual logic, we shouldn't be judging until additional studies are done.
Re: (Score:2)
Wow, you call what he stated logic...SMH.
Of course I call it logic... it was literally a logical train of thought in the form of an argument. What the fuck would you call it?
He demonstrated nothing other than random items of basic evolution
Demonstrated random items of basic evolution? My apologies if you're not a native English speaker, but I'm not sure what you're actually trying to say right there.
and proved nothing to negate the study.
Wait what? The discussion wasn't about the study. The study was about the affects of CSF cleaning during deep sleep. The further discussion outside of the scope of the paper was whether or not this was an evolutionar
Re: (Score:2)
sleep is definitely a trait that is required for human survival, but it has nothing to do with preventing Alzheimers
so the discussion was very much about the study.
Re: (Score:2)
AC also said:
That's not how evolution works. All sorts of animals develop behaviors that could be described as a "waste of time" but evolution doesn't necessarily remove them. "Survival of the fittest" is a backward way of looking at evolution. A better perspective is "death of the unfit." An organism can develop all sorts of useless traits as long as they don't have such a negative impact on survival that the species goes extinct.
Cherry pick much?
Re: (Score:2)
It's not a waste of time, otherwise evolution would have removed it. There's a number of species that sort of remove sleep effectively: aquatic mammals/some birds sleep with half their brain and with one eye closed for mostly avoiding being eaten while asleep and for the aquatic mammals to be able to breathe; however they are still sleeping, so it is required in ways we don't fully understand yet, and TFA might be a clue.
Well, first thing is that unless sleep is the one exception in variance, it isn't likely that every single human needs the exact same amount of sleep. In addition modern health practices have taken many people into an age when evolution doesn't matter that much. Another way of saying that more people live longer, but the extremes are still pretty much the same - the longest lived have a genetic predisposition.
Regardless, if this study is any indication, I've been dead about 20 years now, as I only sleep
Re: (Score:2)
I'm not a doctor but what you're looking for is a sleep study. The doctors that do that will be able to help you from there. I use a CPAP machine myself but they would need to see what is going on through the sleep study and give you what you need.
Re: (Score:2)
Sleep does many, many things.
There is a natural evolutionary process that makes it so. Of all the many metabolic processes your body conducts some of them will be done more efficiently when the organism is quiescent. If there is a quiescent period as part of a diurnal cycle, those processes will migrate to being normally conducted during this period. For example (to pick one that is easy to relate to) muscle growth normally occurs during sleep. It is easy to see how cellular changes would be more efficientl
Re: (Score:2)
It's not a waste of time, otherwise evolution would have removed it.
No. That isn't how evolution works. It does not seek maximum efficiency. If it did, you and I couldn't even imagine the form that life would take at this point in history.
Evolution seeks only to survive. If a trait is not harmful enough to affect your fitness function, it won't be selected against. Furthermore, even if it does, it may not necessarily every be successfully selected against- it may simply be selected *around*.
Re: (Score:2)
...their lives on sleep.
Similarly, my computer wastes too much of its time on wait states. That's why I've cranked my DRAM timing to` the mini/MUm# (A32X.$$ [F/3x ., . [F/3x ., . .-..
AND, THC/CDB causes prot-plaques NOT to build up. (Score:2, Interesting)
https://www.sciencealert.com/marijuana-compound-thc-removes-toxic-alzheimer-protein-from-brain
https://www.salk.edu/news-release/cannabinoids-remove-plaque-forming-alzheimers-proteins-from-brain-cells/
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S104474311300064X
Re: AND, THC/CDB causes prot-plaques NOT to build (Score:5, Interesting)
Re: (Score:2)
infections in the brain such as P. gingivalis [wikipedia.org] or Herpes(HSV1) travel along the nerve cells into the brain and cause inflammation (Protein plaques) to build up. Cannabis is also known to reduce inflammation.
Well then - Let's get baked for our health! I am sold....
Re: (Score:2)
Alzheimer's and pot is today's cancer and caffeine.
Excellent (Score:2, Funny)
I can stop eating healthily and exercising and simply SLEEP a lot more.
I love sleep. It's like death without the commitment.
Re: (Score:2)
I can stop eating healthily and exercising and simply SLEEP a lot more.
moar hamburder? moar hamburder? with cheeze? can haz cheezeburder?
Link to actual paper (Score:1)
Not that anyone cares about the nature or quality of the research when discussing their preconceived notions, but for the few that might here's a link to the paper, which for a change doesn't appear to be paywalled.
http://advances.sciencemag.org/content/5/2/eaav5447
Re: (Score:2)
That URL takes me to an article titled "Increased glymphatic influx is correlated with high EEG delta power and low heart rate in mice under anesthesia".
Re: (Score:2)
Ah, one of the references suggests why this might be a relevant article.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29101220?dopt=Abstract [nih.gov]
Anecdotal... (Score:2)
...CPAP has restored my sleep to where it was 10 years ago, and i feel so much younger. I was sure I was headed for the foggy clouded numbness of old age, but my youth is back, my mind is back and I owe it all to CPAP.
[Paid shill for the CPAP industry] .....NOT!!!
Re: (Score:2)
CPAP is important for people with sleep apnea ... Not every sleep apnea product is going to be equally effective or equally advertised, that's true.
Saw announcements about 3-D printed CPAP masks a few years ago. I'm guessing they are mainstream by now:
http://inspiratemedical.com/ [inspiratemedical.com]
https://www.3ders.org/articles... [3ders.org]
Whoa. Easy there boss. We're all only human. It ain't the end of the world.
Re: (Score:2)
[Paying shill for the CPAP industry] .....NOT!!!
ftfy
That's not the conclusion at all (Score:4, Interesting)
Nowhere is the increase in glymphatic output correlated with a reduction in amyloid plaques nor an hypothesized reduction in Alzheimer's
The study simply shows that if you choose the correct anesthesia you'll get higher glymphatic output
Why we sleep (Score:5, Interesting)
Re: (Score:2)
Is anyone working on tech to help improve sleep? Like some kind of sleep regulator?
I'd love to have a device where I press a button and get a decent 8 hours of sleep.
Re: (Score:2)
John C Lilly (Score:2)
So if I spend 12 hours a day in a Ketamine-induced stupor, I can lower my risk of Alzheimer's disease? Of course, when you do that, you greatly increase your risk of a bathtub-induced drowning.
Michael Jackson (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
So if I spend 12 hours a day in a Ketamine-induced stupor, I can lower my risk of Alzheimer's disease? Of course, when you do that, you greatly increase your risk of a bathtub-induced drowning.
This whole thing is bullshit. I hate to use the correlation is not causation meme, but the whole thing is like "Sitting increases your likelihood of death. I mean, it's not like people who are already dying can't often do much more than sit.
My 5 hours a night should have killed me 20 years ago to hear the "get more sleep" crowd. Yet I feel good with 5, and don't use an alarm clock to wake me up. I've slept that much since high school, and if it kills me, at least I'll have been awake and alert more than
Re: (Score:2)
So if I spend 12 hours a day in a Ketamine-induced stupor, I can lower my risk of Alzheimer's disease? Of course, when you do that, you greatly increase your risk of a bathtub-induced drowning.
This whole thing is bullshit. I hate to use the correlation is not causation meme, but the whole thing is like "Sitting increases your likelihood of death. I mean, it's not like people who are already dying can't often do much more than sit.
My 5 hours a night should have killed me 20 years ago to hear the "get more sleep" crowd. Yet I feel good with 5...
Good for you. As with absolutely everything in human physiology there is a statistical distribution of requirements, and for some people it is higher than the mean, and for some it is lower. Maybe you are just on the low end.
I am sure this does not apply to you, that your sleep-time estimates over time are absolutely accurate, but it is well known by sleep researchers that people in general are very bad about estimating how much they sleep. If, in the culture or subculture, needing little sleep is seen as
Re: (Score:2)
Good for you. As with absolutely everything in human physiology there is a statistical distribution of requirements, and for some people it is higher than the mean, and for some it is lower. Maybe you are just on the low end.
I am sure this does not apply to you, that your sleep-time estimates over time are absolutely accurate, but it is well known by sleep researchers that people in general are very bad about estimating how much they sleep.
I think I'm just going to post that 8 hours isn't enough, that you'll die if you get less than 12 hours a night.
Whenever Slashdot mentions that lack of sleep is a killer of people, and that it is a ticket to an early death - I'm foolish enough to mention my personal sleep needs. The real fun starts when first people tell me I'm "lucky" then that I'm conforming to some weird idea that lack of sleep pleases some meme of western man, then the subtle and not so subtle inferences that I'm lying.
Well, I'm
Oh, great (Score:3)
I'm screwed.
Re: (Score:2)
Ditto. :(
Re: (Score:2)
While lighting the homeless on fire is of course reprehensible, I would imagine that developing alzheimers is low on the list of worries for the homeless.
How bad is... (Score:1)
I sleep 5 hours a night. I go to bed when I'm tired, and don't use an alarm clock to wake up. I wake up feeling refreshed. I'm alert all day except for about 10 minutes around 3 PM.
So am I supposed to use drugs or something? Get addicted to something because it's healthy?
Re: (Score:2)
>"The current trend of obsessing and fixation and stress over not getting "enough sleep"? I sleep 5 hours a night. I go to bed when I'm tired, and don't use an alarm clock to wake up. I wake up feeling refreshed. I'm alert all day except for about 10 minutes around 3 PM. "
Indeed. It isn't as much the quantity of sleep that is important as much as the quality. I used to be like you. But now I can sleep for 6 hours, 8 hours, 10 hours, or 12 hours and still hardly waken and feel completely unrefreshed a
Re: (Score:2)
>"The current trend of obsessing and fixation and stress over not getting "enough sleep"? I sleep 5 hours a night. I go to bed when I'm tired, and don't use an alarm clock to wake up. I wake up feeling refreshed. I'm alert all day except for about 10 minutes around 3 PM. "
Indeed. It isn't as much the quantity of sleep that is important as much as the quality. I used to be like you. But now I can sleep for 6 hours, 8 hours, 10 hours, or 12 hours and still hardly waken and feel completely unrefreshed and tired. The sleep study was useless because I don't have "apnea" or "restless leg syndrome", which are apparently the only two things they know how to treat. All they could do was say my deep sleep was severely fragmented and send me on my way. "60 alpha intrusions into delta sleep every hour." And after 20 years of it, I can attest that it does adversely affect memory and seems to create or worsen other health issues.
That sucks big time. No physical possibilities like sciatica or there's a wear and tear issue on a spinal column disk that and make your arms need constant shifting through the night? I'm no medical doctor, but pain might factor in for kicking out of deep sleep.
Re: (Score:2)
>"That sucks big time. No physical possibilities like sciatica or there's a wear and tear issue on a spinal column disk that and make your arms need constant shifting through the night? I'm no medical doctor, but pain might factor in for kicking out of deep sleep."
No, they had no explanation. That is when I realized they really don't know all that much about sleep.
Re: (Score:2)
Hey Mark,
This is kind of a long shot, but have you tried meditation? It's not directly related to sleep, but it does calm the mind and gets the body more in tune with itself. It may also be a way for you to refresh your mind without sleep. Though, as I said, a bit of a long shot.
Re: (Score:3)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Do you get exercise? Would you sleep more heavily if you were tired from exercise?
Re: (Score:2)
>"Do you get exercise? Would you sleep more heavily if you were tired from exercise?"
I will admit I do not get much exercise. It does seem to help a little, but it is extremely difficult to get motivated to do it, then I quickly lose interest.
Re: (Score:2)
>"I had considerable trouble getting to sleep"
In my case, I can sleep just about anytime, anywhere. And I am unconscious within about 60 seconds with no more awareness until many hours later.
Re: (Score:2)
Maybe you're lucky. Maybe 5 hours a night is enough for you.
Now, I'm quite lucky too, but I have a very different situation. If I did as you do, I would happily sleep 16 hours and not even notice. That's just not compatible with a working life.
Hence I *have* to wake myself up. Now, I can operate on zero sleep (48 hours without sleep). I've done it quite a bit and it works fine. I can operate on 6-7 hours sleep, no problem, for a long and regular basis.
But I can easily imagine that if you were someone
Alzheimers is a real worry.... (Score:4, Interesting)
Friends and family put it down to absent mindedness or just overall busyness and say other things occupy my mind and it'll get better but secretly, I don't believe that's the case. Right now, I'm trying to remember what I did at work last Monday and other than recalling things that happened during recurrent meetings, I can't remember. E.g. I know I had a one-time meeting between 10:30am and 11:30am and for the life of me, I can't remember the discussion but can remember the people. Times and dates are especially hard, my wife has come to provide frequent reminders of dates and activities because I just cannot remember them anymore. E.g. if we have a appointment this Saturday, by tomorrow I will have completely forgotten.
For the past 4 years, I've been sleeping maybe 3-4 hours a night. I track this formally via my FitBit but informally, I make a note when I get into bed and then whatever time I get up. Of course, I know I'm worrying about it which is likely contributing to my stress and therefore lack of sleep but nonetheless, I'm def. not sleeping as much. No TV, no phone, just lying in the dark trying to think of nothing. Which is hard... I often imagine myself flying through the nothingness of space just to stop me from thinking about a thousand other things and the darkness of space helps kinda blank everything.
I will say - when I wake up, I'm full of energy. No problems swinging out of bed and getting on with the day so the 3-4 hours sleep isn't affecting my energy level.
I have spoken to my doctor and she was willing to prescribe sleeping pills but I got the impression she didn't really want to investigate the root cause. She's a crap doctor that way but with OHIP being the way it is, I haven't been able to find another doctor in a year. I declined her offer of sleeping pills - I tried prescribed Ambien once and it left me in a bad way - when I woke up in the morning, I was dizzy, dis-orientated, and it was a real effort to even sit up. I was tired until around noon so I gave that up after a few days.
What's the point of this long rant? I'm kinda terrified of getting Alzheimers so I have not researched it a lot. In everything else in my life, I am constantly researching things but the fear of Alzheimers has a strong mental block on me. I would love to hear from others who have experience with it, the folks here (for the most part!) are rational and intelligence so I value your feedback moreso than random forums
Re: (Score:2)
I literally have a tough time remembering things from 3 hours ago and struggle to recall specific events more than 6 days ago.
FTFM (fixed that for me)