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AI Space Biotech

Should We Seed Life On Alien Worlds? (sciencemag.org) 231

Slashdot reader sciencehabit quotes an article from Science magazine: Astronomers have detected more than 3000 planets beyond our solar system, and just a couple of weeks ago they discovered an Earth-like planet in the solar system next door. Most -- if not all -- of these worlds are unlikely to harbor life, but what if we put it there?

Science chatted with theoretical physicist Claudius Gros about his proposed Genesis Project, which would send artificially intelligent probes to lifeless worlds to seed them with microbes. Over millions of years, they might evolve into multicellular organisms, and, perhaps eventually, plants and animals. In the interview, Gros talks artificial intelligence, searching for habitable planets, and what kind of organisms he'd like to see evolve.

"The robots will have to decide if a certain planet should receive microbes and the chance to evolve life," the physicist explains -- adding that it's very important to avoid introducing new microbes on planets where life already exists.
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Should We Seed Life On Alien Worlds?

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  • The Matrix was right. Humans are a virus.
    • FFS, the article is about seeding with microbes, not people. It is an interesting thought experiment, up there with, and related to, the fermi paradox. All this misanthropy on this slashdot article is out of place.
    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward

      Pretty sure the takeaway from that scene is that Agent Smith has no understanding of what a virus is, computer OR biological, or pretty much any form of life. Probably because anything outside the Matrix not part of the human stacks or baby farm is a desolate wasteland of broken machine parts utterly devoid of any form of life.

      Every mammal on this planet instinctively develops a natural equilibrium with the surrounding environment

      Not through its own accord. Only through predation does this happen. Otherwise they achieve "equilibrium" by reproducing out of control and then starving to death. see: Lotka–Vo [wikipedia.org]

  • Otherwise, yes we should go ahead and seed everything we can find.

    Note that we should use a pretty generous definition of "intelligence" for that caveat. I'm not sure I'd count a chimp, but would definitely count Australopithecus Africanus, and maybe Afarensis.

    • by Roger W Moore ( 538166 ) on Sunday September 11, 2016 @01:45PM (#52866601) Journal
      Actually I disagree. At the moment seeding remote worlds would involve firing off a probe blindly containing what, for the planet involved, could be a lethal virus which would wipe out life there. If there were intelligent life this would be effectively declaring war and if there is no intelligent life we have just wiped out what might have been our first chance to study extra-terrestrial life.

      ...and for what? The possibility to seed a planet so that in a few billion years time (on Earth it took 3 billion years before the first microbes evolved into multi-cellular lifeforms and 100's million for those lifeforms to populate the land) we might have a habitable planet which is too far away to reach with current technology? So on the one hand you are expecting us to develop the technology to be able to travel there while at the same time not developing any technology which can terra-form a planet in less than a few hundred million years at best?

      The time to do this is when we develop the technology to travel there. Doing it beforehand is lots of risk with no reward.
      • by Jack9 ( 11421 )

        You've made an assumption that our species will be able to develop the technology prior to an ELE.
        There's lots of risk, but it's risky to NOT do it, if you think our ecology should propogate.
        Paradoxically, I think humanity is great, but our ecology is not with high-energy requirements and relatively short adaptation cycles leading to a lot of missed genetic advantages and junk encoding in the DNA.

      • by PhilHibbs ( 4537 )

        If there's life there, what are the chances that the microbes that we send there will be better at living on their world than the nativre stuff is? Sure, some of the native life might die out, like when an invasive slug or fish or plant drives out an indiginous one, but ALL life? No way. Grey squirrels may have driven out the red squirrels here in the UK, but they aren't threatening any other life. Most likely the Earth life will cause some damage, and then crash and die out, and the native life will be bac

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Gr8Apes ( 679165 )

      Note that we should use a pretty generous definition of "intelligence" for that caveat. I'm not sure I'd count a chimp, but would definitely count Australopithecus Africanus, and maybe Afarensis.

      Not chimps? How about Gorillas? Dolphins? Whales? Heck, it's possible a dog is as smart as Afarensis. I think your definition of "intelligence" may not be very smart.

    • Totally ignoring the ethical implications of wiping out a planetary biosphere, if the point is to spread life rather than prepare it for colonization, then wiping out the local life by introducing a hostile microbial "seed" would potentially set back the evolution of complex life by billions of years. Even if there's nothing more complex than worms to start with, how many hundreds of millions of years do you suppose it would take our bacteria to evolve to that complexity?

  • by luckypunq ( 3769095 ) on Sunday September 11, 2016 @12:51PM (#52866341)
    1) Send microbes and viruses, algae across interstellar space in probe 2) Probe arrives .. primative aliens witness the strange falling star ... probe soft lands and delivers payload. 3) Alien genetics without any ability to compete against earth organisms overwhealmed in short order (High CO2 environment ecology) 4) Alien life wiped off the planet and human freindly Oxygen producing algae conquer alien ecology. 5) ... profit !?!
    • by crow ( 16139 )

      The probe would have to be able to analyze the planets in the target system to look for any signs of native life, and switch from seeding to analysis.

    • by kheldan ( 1460303 ) on Sunday September 11, 2016 @01:27PM (#52866529) Journal
      If there are in fact other spacefaring civilizations out there in our galaxy, what would they think of us willy-nilly tossing our biologicals at random planets? Would they think we're smart and forward-thinking, or would they look at it as arrogant, self-centered, thoughtless, or hostile? Here on Earth (well, at least here in the U.S.) we expect Environment Impact studies done before real estate is developed, because we've learned that not doing so may cause us to do more harm than good. Why shouldn't we adopt the same policy with regard to exoplanets? Observe-and-report first, then consider carefully whether we do anything to 'develop' anything.
      • Why do you assume they are smarter than us? When are you going to accept Earth Exceptionalism as the universal phenomena?
        • Why do you assume they are smarter than us?

          For the same reason midgets assume people are taller than them?

        • Why do you assume they are smarter than us?

          If they're spacefaring, they're further along technological development than us, which grants them better communications and computers, which make them effectively smarter. Which, of course, helps them design still better comunications and computers. Universe seems to like exponential growth.

      • If there are in fact other spacefaring civilizations out there in our galaxy, what would they think of us willy-nilly tossing our biologicals at random planets? Would they think we're smart and forward-thinking, or would they look at it as arrogant, self-centered, thoughtless, or hostile? Here on Earth (well, at least here in the U.S.) we expect Environment Impact studies done before real estate is developed, because we've learned that not doing so may cause us to do more harm than good. Why shouldn't we adopt the same policy with regard to exoplanets? Observe-and-report first, then consider carefully whether we do anything to 'develop' anything.

        This is basically the same thing, it's just making the decision beforehand based on a set of conditions and having a computer make the final call according to those instructions. You could radio back for instructions, but that means an absolute minimum of another 8.6 years before you can begin the terraforming/seeding operation.

        Any other rational civilization will look at it and say "these humans didn't know what they are doing, now let's go tell them how interplantary law works."

    • Kind of like in the original 1953 movie "The War of the Worlds", only in reverse. The Martians came and it was the littlest things that destroyed them. I often wondered whether the earthlings sent some germs to Mars to make sure the Martians could never come again because they would be destroyed. Then again, the Martians could develop vaccines against the germs and come again and wipe out Earth's people. On the other hand, the Martians were doomed because of climate change on Mars and Earthlings would be pr
    • Alternative storyline. 1) Earth probe lands on alien world and native life forms watch it land. 2) native life forms eagerly eat the "stuff" that comes out of it. 3) Native lifeforms get slight upset stomach and produce a few piles of slightly runny droppings. 4) Microbes in droppings merge with local microbes and evolve into some new micro organisms that find a nice niche within alien eco system. 5) Same as it ever was...

  • Won't we just create space (pun intended) for Church of Scientology? If and whenever Intelligent life evolves?
  • I see no issue [google.com] with this whatsoever. Also, I for one welcome our giant insect overlords.
  • by Elledan ( 582730 ) on Sunday September 11, 2016 @01:09PM (#52866431) Homepage
    Star Trek as well as many other sci-fi series covered this topic from a variety of angles. The take-away message is that until we can say with absolute certainty what 'life' entails - even if it's outside our own narrow definition - we stand to only destroy life, not create it.
    • You must have forgotten about the TNG episodes where it was revealed that all sentient species were actually artificially seeded by an advanced parent race. Of course, even that one didn't end quite as nicely as the parent race had envisioned, so maybe you've got a point.

      My guess is that humanity won't have a lot of interest in artificially seeding life unless it's with the express purpose of terraforming planets for later habitation by humanity, and we're not going to want to wait a billion years for evol

  • I would think of this as being pre-colonization. The probes would analyze the planets in the target star system, determine if any are both suitable for life and lifeless, and then determine the fastest way to bring those planets up to human standards.

    I don't think we're talking millions of years here. Depending on the state of the planet when found, it would be hundreds to thousands of years.

    The probe could even include more advanced species as frozen embryos with artificial gestation pods to introduce al

  • Can we leave an instruction book - stone tablets perhaps - explaining we are not gods, and that they should adopt a rational moral code that does not require our approval, or approbation.

    • by khallow ( 566160 )
      It would be better to leave nothing at all.
      • Nothing at all led to what we have now - clearly not the optimal solution.

        • by khallow ( 566160 )

          Nothing at all led to what we have now - clearly not the optimal solution.

          And you have evidence for this? I'll note that such guidance on Earth would be both dependency forming and likely to result in reactionary behavior. Hands off means we have to learn how to deal with our world not merely ape what we are told. Further, by openly supporting a particular choice, you create another political faction and incentive for others to oppose the choice.

          Just look at modern religion. There's a bunch of people who, if they became convinced that their religion was fake, would go off the

          • Hands off means we have to learn how to deal with our world not merely ape what we are told.

            It's being told rather than having to learn by yourself which allowed humans to transcend mere instinct and develope culture. Indeed, that's what culture is - a stream of acquired knowledge being passed down to the next generation.

            Then there's the concern that the budding civilization might jihad your ass, if they knew about you.

            A budding civilization might want to jihad your ass, but how are they're going to do th

    • Can we leave an instruction book - stone tablets perhaps - explaining we are not gods, and that they should adopt a rational moral code that does not require our approval, or approbation.

      Or just drop empty Coca-Cola bottles [wikipedia.org] ...

    • Can we leave an instruction book - stone tablets perhaps - explaining we are not gods, and that they should adopt a rational moral code that does not require our approval, or approbation.

      "Hey look, it says here right off that we shouldn't worship them as gods, and that we shouldn't call them gods. But since this was clearly written by the gods, it must be a translation problem. Surely it means we shouldn't worship any other gods, and that we shouldn't call them gods without reason. Okay guys, first rule:

      • by PPH ( 736903 )

        Otherwise it makes about as much sense as pointing to a tree and saying, 'See that delicious fruit? Don't eat that.'

        The forbidden fruit was a test of subservience. Don't eat the stuff that is good for you. Just to prove that people would follow authority figures. And since gods and religions are constructs of men, it was just a lesson to be subservient to the high priests. The metaphor of the "tree of knowledge of good and evil" was just an additional lesson that the people were expected to delegate issues of morality to these priests.

        Just leaving a bunch of stone tablets with instructions on another planet would be poi

  • Amino acids (Score:3, Informative)

    by Okian Warrior ( 537106 ) on Sunday September 11, 2016 @01:14PM (#52866449) Homepage Journal

    Background: Proteins are made by chaining tlgether amino acids drawn from a specific set, and there is a coding scheme that selects a specific amino acid for each DNA nucleotide triplet.

    According to my biology book, the amino acids that make up life on this planet are largely random. There are a couple that are so close in form and function that they can substitute for one another with little difference, there are other compounds which might have useful forms which are not used as amino acids, and there are gaps and duplication in the coding scheme.

    Once the amino acid and coding scheme evolved, it became a survival characteristic to use that same scheme, simply because you could eat the other living matter on the planet. As a result, virtually everything on the planet uses the same amino acid/coding scheme.

    On another planet, life might evolve with a different set of amino acids (possibly even mostly the same as ours, but with one or two differences) and a different coding scheme. While AAA might be Lysine on Earth, it might code for something else on a distant planet.

    This means that if we find life on another planet, it probably wouldn't be edible by humans. It's highly likely that none of the vegetation could be farmed or eaten, and any animal life would probably be poisonous. (But the good news: alien pathogens wouldn't be able to infect us, so there's little chance of bringing "space herpes" back to Earth.)

    If we seeded the distant planet with life from Earth, it's likely that the same amino-acid/coding scheme would proliferate and remain unchanged. If and when we choose to go there, the flora and fauna would be available to us as a resource.

    We would of course need to sort out the philosophical implications of doing this. If we could get to another planet, we'd probably also have the technology to make our own food as needed, and it would seem wrong to destroy a planet harbouring animal life for our own gain. Maybe if it only had plant life, lichens or moss, say.)

    In ancient Rome the zeitgeist of the times would be "yeah! let's do it".

    I don't know what the prevailing opinion would be 100 years in the future.

  • by kheldan ( 1460303 ) on Sunday September 11, 2016 @01:15PM (#52866459) Journal
    Consider the following:
    1. Are we really so arrogant as to think that even if we managed to send a human being to an exoplanet capable of sustaining life, that we'd be able to determine with 100% accuracy whether it's lifeless or not? Rhetorical question, the answer is no, and we sure as hell can't send a so-called 'AI' (which we really don't have anyway) that could do any better than a human being could anyway.
    2. The lifeless-or-not question aside, how can we be sure that this planet we send it to isn't real estate claimed by some other spacefaring race? Another rhetorical question, because again we can't. We might be invading someone else's property with our unwanted microbes.
    3. Even the previous rhetorical questions are rhetorical; it would take hundreds and hundreds of years for any probe to reach any exoplanet we currently know of, and it would take an incredible amount of time after that to receive any sort of data back from the probe indicating it's arrived and seen and done anything there. At the rate we're going, in a few hundred years no one might even be here to receive any such signal, let alone remember how to receive it; at the rate we're going we might be living in a post-apocalyptic world like in Mad Max, sans Charlize Theron of course.
    4. The best thing we should do, if we're going to do anything like this at all, is to just send a probe to an exoplanet to observe and report, just like the other probes we've been sending out for decades into our own planetary system. The fact of the matter is, the observations we've made of exoplanets thus far from light-years away are not going to be as accurate or detailed as close-up observations from a probe. Besides, if there are other civilizations out there and perhaps they own one of the planets we're planning on visiting, aren't they more likely to look kindly on it (and us) if it turns out the device we send is obviously there only to look and listen, not drop off something potentially offensive or destructive? If there are in fact other civilizations out there, we can't know how they'd regard some alien spacecraft entering their space with, upon examining it, the intent to drop off some sort of biologicals. They might consider it an attack, and rightly so. Better to not interfere. Besides, we have a lot to learn about our Galaxy and Universe yet, we've hardly even begun to scratch the surface. We've also go a long ways to go before we'd be able to build any craft that would survive such a journey anyway, and in fact having lots of time to debate the subject would also be a good thing, while other space-related technologies are being developed, like the new engine that doesn't require any reaction mass; if it in fact works as advertised, and can be scaled up and refined, then it would be perfectly suited for such a long journey, and in fact would shorten the transit time considerably.
    • Q1. I think there are good reasons to think we can detect life even with simple probes. James Lovelock explained this well with his daisyworld thought experiment. Figured that the one characteristic of life is homeostasis, and widespread life would do that to the planet itself.

  • by Tony Isaac ( 1301187 ) on Sunday September 11, 2016 @01:17PM (#52866475) Homepage

    Why not fully-developed plant and/or animal life, if the world can support them!

    Long term, we will have to find a way to survive in other places. Eventually, something will happen to Earth. We've already been hit by monster meteors that killed 90% of life on earth. There's surely another one out there that could go farther. Eventually, we'll need to find other places to live, if we want to survive.

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward

      Not sure if you are just joking. In case, fully developed plant and life won't survive most alien conditions. Microbes can. Transporting several redwoods across space is not an easy task. you have to keep them alive on the trip, and they do weight a lot. but planting them is even harder. With microbes, you just need a few cups of goo, and you are good to go. practically, you have to crawl before you walk, and walk before you run.

  • by Tony Isaac ( 1301187 ) on Sunday September 11, 2016 @01:24PM (#52866519) Homepage

    Here on earth, it's so important to preserve our natural environment because we're causing damage to our ecosystem that, if not checked, will become irreversible and deadly. If you were the ONLY human being in the Amazon rain forest, it wouldn't be an environmental problem for you to clear-cut an acre of land to grow some crops. But when you're one of millions who are doing the same thing, you are now causing serious damage to the planet.

    In our universe, there are so, so many potentially inhabitable planets. There is room to experiment, even if it turns out badly on some of the planets, it's OK, there are so many more. We're still the lone farmer in the Amazon rain forest.

  • Considering we don't even have the technology to get to worlds outside the solar system yet, we'll have plenty of time to debate the ethics of seeding them....

  • Should We Seed Life On Alien Worlds?

    I see nothing wrong with seeding life on sterile planets. Planets which already have life should be off limits. There is something to be said in favour of Star Trek's prime directive although, knowing humans, we'll probably adopt a strategy that will resemble a blend of the Ferengi Rules of Acquisition and Klingon foreign policy.

  • Can we put T-Rump on an purposefully UN-intelligent space probe, and shoot him off to a random destination?
  • Most -- if not all -- of these worlds are unlikely to harbor life, but what if we put it there?

    There is no evidence that there is a large number of habitable but sterile planets. In fact, most scientists would likely find that notion rather surprising. Life developed so rapidly on earth after conditions were suitable that the same is likely true elsewhere. That is, if we don't find life on other planets, it's likely because they are too dry, too hot, or too cold. Any planet with lots of liquid water probabl

    • > Any planet with lots of liquid water probably already has life.

      We'll see fairly soon, won't we? Maybe even in our lifetimes. Both Mars and Europa show strong evidence of having liquid water, but as yet we haven't made any serious attempts to determine if either harbors life.

  • By the time we've mastered interstellar travel I expect we got synthetic biology [wikipedia.org] solved so all we need are the chemicals to construct humans on site and how to build a sustainable colony from Mars. The microbes would start a terraforming process, meanwhile the outpost can start with a small greenhouse that slowly processes part of the native atmosphere then grow into larger and larger domes building up an earth-like habitat. In time we could expose the toughest plants to growing outside or in semi-shielded

    • by swb ( 14022 )

      What about consciousness transfer to fully synthetic android type bodies?

      I keep thinking that the a reasonably likely way an advanced civilization would conquer the problems of relativity and distance is by altering the relationship with time. If consciousness can be transferred into a synthetic machine and time is no longer defined around human lifespans, interstellar distances no longer matter because a trip of a 10,000 years doesn't matter.

      I would wager if we do encounter alien intelligence they will be

  • i figure it will take a long time for any probe to get anywhere. We'll probably be able to easily intercept it with our warp drives by the time we figure out if it's a good idea or not. in the meantime, we will feel like a cool space faring species.
  • Keep in mind that by sending earth microbes we're giving life there a 3.8 billion year head start. How long is it going to take to have an intelligent species? Probably somewhere between "relatively soon" and "never" with the exact timing left to some genetic rolls of the dice. What if we choose other colonization targets later on? Will we sterilize the discarded planet (presumably difficult and costly) or let it continue evolving? What if a species optimizing for intelligence turns out to be much smarter

  • by nukenerd ( 172703 ) on Sunday September 11, 2016 @02:27PM (#52866777)

    FTFA:

    Over millions of years, they might evolve into multicellular organisms, and, perhaps eventually, plants and animals.

    ..... and eventually they will supply us with some fresh, warm, lemon-scented towels.

  • I have little doubt that some types of bacteria survived the hostilities of space to land on Mars with at least some of the probes that we've sent there.
  • .. a virus on a galactic scale.
  • by careysub ( 976506 ) on Sunday September 11, 2016 @04:16PM (#52867229)

    .. when it was first published in Science last week, and I was surprised they were devoting any space to it.

    The physicist had no insights to offer, just opinions about far off fanciful speculations unconnected with any current real science. The same interview could have been given by most any SF fan, and many SF authors could have offered far more substance and insight.

    Here is Gros's original paper which was the hook on which the interview hung. [arxiv.org] Not a terrible paper at that, providing some interesting summaries about the evolution of the Earth and about planetary stability. But the "Genesis mission" seeding stuff is just SF hand-waving, even in the full paper. And the whole notion is based on the very questionable premise that organism-ready planets are common that do not already have their own biology established ("The objective of the Genesis mission is after all to give life the chance to prosper in places where it has not yet a foothold..."). Life on Earth may have become established within 300 million years of its formation - i.e. about as soon as compatible conditions existed.

  • We'll be OK as long as Professor Gros doesn't use unstable protomatter in his Genesis Device.

  • by FrozenGeek ( 1219968 ) on Sunday September 11, 2016 @10:03PM (#52868665)

    Let's put aside the ethics/morals debate for a moment and consider the math.

    To send a spacecraft, using our current technology, to the nearest star would take tens of thousands of years. There is no reasonable expectation that a spacecraft built using our current technology could survive that long, so we cannot simply do this yet. Realistically, we're at least centuries away from being able to do this. That gives us a lot of time to research these planets.

    Yay! Rationality!

Understanding is always the understanding of a smaller problem in relation to a bigger problem. -- P.D. Ouspensky

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