Hubble Discovers Water Plumes Over Europa 74
astroengine writes "Scientists using the Hubble Space Telescope have found plumes of water vapor shooting off the southern pole of Europa, an ice-covered moon of Jupiter that is believed to have an underground ocean. If confirmed — so far the plumes have only been spotted once — the finding could have implications for the moon's suitability for life and help explain why its surface appears relatively young and crater-free. "The plumes are incredibly exciting, if they are there. They're bringing up material from in the ocean, perhaps there's organic material that will be laying on the surface of the south pole. Those are the things that we want to know about," James Green, head of NASA's planetary science programs, told reporters at the American Geophysical Union conference in San Francisco on Thursday."
Hmmm (Score:5, Interesting)
Presuming these plumes are not one off events, couldn't we send an orbiter there to sample the plumes to at least get some idea of the chemistry of Europa's ocean, if not possibly outright detect signs of life?
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If there's organic matter on the surface, maybe it's a source of foods?i would be concerned that it would be too high in carbs.
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Sorry!
All these worlds
are yours except
Europa
Attempt No
Landing there
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Sorry!
All these worlds
are yours except
Europa
Attempt No
Landing there
All we'd find is a bunch of surfing apes.
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So, we really DID dig a big trench on the moon and send humans to Jupiter ten years ago?
*shakes head in wonder*
Re:Hmmm (Score:5, Informative)
Presuming these plumes are not one off events, couldn't we send an orbiter there to sample the plumes to at least get some idea of the chemistry of Europa's ocean, if not possibly outright detect signs of life?
Yes, and according to the BBC article [bbc.co.uk] NASA researchers hope to do just that. However, Europa Clipper [nasa.gov] is expensive and long way off. They are hoping that a European probe due to launch in 2022 [esa.int] (like that is close) will do the job even though is not intended to go over the poles, which is where the plumes were seen.
Re:Hmmm (Score:5, Insightful)
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In europa, (Score:2)
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Meanwhile, SETI has decoded a message . . . (Score:5, Funny)
. . . "Have Leak! Send Plumber!" . . .
. . . believed to have originated from Europa . . .
Re:Meanwhile, SETI has decoded a message . . . (Score:4, Funny)
The only space-faring plumbers we have spend most of their time saving princesses.
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If it is an air-condition issue, Harry Tuttle is the best heating engineer around (as long as the job does not involve PAPERWORK!)
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Nonsense, they fixed this leak. [latimes.com]
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old news (Score:3, Informative)
We've known about the plumes for a long time:
http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/LPSC99/pdf/1603.pdf [usra.edu]
This is just direct confirmation of what we already knew about.
It's pretty clear Europa probably has some form of life under the ice. The odds are definitely in it's favor. It's just a matter of confirming it, just like these plumes. The really exciting bit will be if it's multicellular or even fish like animals. I really hope I live long enough to see it.
Re:old news (Score:4, Funny)
Perhaps they've evolved a better congressman.
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I don't think they could have evolved a worse one.
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Sure they could. They could have venomous stingers or acid blood or longer lifespans.
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Re:old news (Score:5, Insightful)
We've known about the plumes for a long time:
http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/LPSC99/pdf/1603.pdf [usra.edu]
This is just direct confirmation of what we already knew about.
That paper talks about the possility that one might observe plumes, as one of several possible explanations for the terrain features seen on Europa. Actually observing such plumes is something else entirely.
It's pretty clear Europa probably has some form of life under the ice. The odds are definitely in it's favor. It's just a matter of confirming it, just like these plumes. The really exciting bit will be if it's multicellular or even fish like animals. I really hope I live long enough to see it.
How is that clear? On what do you base the claim that the odds are so good that "it's just a matter of confirming it"? I don't think you would find anybody working in that field willing to make that bold claims.
Re:old news (Score:5, Informative)
Better article [nationalgeographic.com] (with sort of a picture of the phenomenon)
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That paper talks about the possility that one might observe plumes, as one of several possible explanations for the terrain features seen on Europa. Actually observing such plumes is something else entirely.
Isn't that
This is just direct confirmation of what we already knew about.
What I said?
How is that clear? On what do you base the claim that the odds are so good that "it's just a matter of confirming it"? I don't think you would find anybody working in that field willing to make that bold claims.
Google is your friend:
"I'd be shocked if no life existed on Europa," said Shank, of the Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2009/11/091116-jupiter-moon-life-europa-fish.html [nationalgeographic.com]
You don't seem to understand the difference between evidence and proof. We've plenty of evidence, just not the proof.
I've even go so far as to say I'm relatively sure we'll find life on every planetary body in our solar system. Even the moon. It may only be a few microbes in a lot of cases, but I seriously doubt life is nearly as unique as some believe.
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I've even go so far as to say I'm relatively sure we'll find life on every planetary body in our solar system.
So what? You have no basis for your surety.
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a few fossilized microbes on one piece of rock that came from another planet is hardly "finding life".
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I've even go so far as to say I'm relatively sure we'll find life on every planetary body in our solar system. Even the moon. It may only be a few microbes in a lot of cases, but I seriously doubt life is nearly as unique as some believe.
Life on Earth is obvious. Why are other planets different?
Re:old news (Score:5, Insightful)
It's pretty clear Europa probably has some form of life under the ice. The odds are definitely in it's favor.
I don't see how you can get from plumes to life so glibly.
Plumes can be strictly physical effects of tidal activity.
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I don't think anyone is claiming the plumes are a result of life.
We don't know what's under the ice but we can make an educated guess and say things like, it's almost certain it will have organic compounds, it's highly probable it will have simple cells if what we understand about the origins of life on Earth and deep sea volcanic vents is correct, if the ocean is oxygenated via some process, protein chains such a colognes (that bind cells together) can exist so it may have multi-cellular life, it's very unlikely to have nuclear submarines. No oxygen and no sunlight is not a problem to extremophile bacteria that can extract energy directly from minerals in the rock such as sulphur and uranium.
Of course at the end of the day, it's just speculation. If your own informed speculation leads you to think (single celled) life under Europa's ice is unlikely then you hold the minority scientific view. Still it's a Schrodinger Moon, you can't know if what is inside is alive or dead until you open it up and observe it, personally I hope I live to see a autonomous submarine rover trying to outrun a giant Europan squid, but I doubt I will live that long.
pretty clear? (Score:1)
Odds definitely in favour? How do you even go about assigning odds to something like life on Europa?
Plumes don't "confirm" the existence of life. It could be that water makes life more likely - if we're assuming that other life has somewhat similar processes to life on Earth - but we knew there was water on Europa anyway.
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Water under 100km of ice is a problem for life, because you want to have some cycling of materials from the surface down to the ocean. In 'Unmasking Europa' Richard Greenberg makes a very compelling (in my opinion) case that the icy crust is much thinner than this, as can particularly be seen in melt-through features such as the Connemara Chaos. This, combined with the likelihood that Europa's environment has been stable for billions of years, makes me think it by far the most likely body in the solar syste
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It's pretty clear Europa probably has some form of life under the ice.
Got a citation for that? Evidence rather than supposition?
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It's pretty clear Europa probably has some form of life under the ice.
Really? Just because there's water? You do realize that we found indications that Mars was once warm and wet, with salt and fresh water, yet still no indication there was ever life there?
It doesn't seem that clear to me. Seems to me that life is pretty damned improbable and is likely really, really rare. We haven't been able to produce it on purpose so it HAS to be a really rare coincidence for it to happen accidentally. I'd wager that th
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Oh so mature ;) Btw, that quote is from the book, not the movie.
Really? [youtube.com]
Another Hubble story (Score:3)
Can you remind me why a 12th aircraft carrier is a better use of taxpayer money than a bunch of space telescopes?
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Can you remind me why a 12th aircraft carrier is a better use of taxpayer money than a bunch of space telescopes?
I was going to post a snide comment about congresscritters getting a higher ROI with aircraft. Turns out it isn't so.
Lockheed (LMT) built Hubble, up 182% in the last decade
Northrop Grumman (NOC) owns the company that builds aircraft carriers, up 131% in the same time period
Ignoring other factors, it really is a better investment to fund more space telescopes.
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Lockheed Martin also secured a contract for the F-35 and F-22 which is going to be worth over 2 trillion dollars.
I don't think Hubble had much to do with it.
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Maybe an intelligent alien life form under the ocean just sent a spaceship to outerspace.
Or a test fire of a new ballistic missile, with the capacity to destroy a planet.
Its effectiveness to be determined, after it hits the third planet, and they determine whether they see a planet with no intelligent life on it incinerated.
Whales? (Score:2)
This is clearly indicative of the presence of whales under the ice.
Yawn (Score:2)
Europa Report (Score:2)
I didn't see anyone else mention it, but there's a decent low-budget sci-fi movie about the first manned mission to Europa where they're looking for life under the ice: Europa Report [netflix.com]. I thought it was quite good.