One-Way Ticket: Mars One Project Applicants Top 100,000 240
Bas Lansdorp's projected trip to Mars has a well-known catch: the ticket to space is free (rather than the millions of dollars for the more conventional kind of space travel available to civilians), but it's one-way only. That's a downside for any potential astronauts who'd like to do things like visit the beach or ever see their Earthside family again in person. Still, the Mars One project announced this week that more than 100,000 volunteers have announced their willingness to forsake this planet in favor of the next. The application process is ongoing; have you signed up?
what happens if the chick get pregnant? (Score:5, Interesting)
will they sterilize the women first or will they risk children being born on Mars?
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will make for one hell of a reality show
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At this point, I think that's pretty much the least of their worries. For example, I doubt they have any solution to the problem of how to actually get humans to Mars.
Re:what happens if the chick get pregnant? (Score:5, Funny)
Re:what happens if the chick get pregnant? (Score:4, Funny)
Why? Virtually no crime, pretty much nonexistent unemployment, lots of free space, no environmental issues, no civil unrest or wars anywhere on the horizon... it's THE place to be!
Re:what happens if the chick get pregnant? (Score:4, Funny)
In fact it's cold as hell.
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And there's no one there to raise them if you did.
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Actually, Hell [wikipedia.org] freezes over fairly regularly in the winter.
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Actually, Hell [wikipedia.org] freezes over fairly regularly in the winter.
I remember reading a memoir of a US soldier in WW2 who wrote about seeing a sign pointing to Hell in Norway, and noticing that the roadway headed UP from his current location.
That Hell regularly freezes over too. According to Wikipedia, the name come from a word for "cliff overhang" in the Norwegian case.
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According to Wikipedia, which is always right, there is a Hell in Norway too. But it's not that high up, only 14 meters of elevation.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hell,_Norway [wikipedia.org]
Re: what happens if the chick get pregnant? (Score:2)
Not so sure about there being no environmental issues...
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I suspect humans make it there and create permanent settlements the crime and war situations may change rapidly.
Speaking of which, I should finish reading Green Mars...
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Virtually no crime
What planet are you from? General human nature makes us all selfish self centered pricks. Here, on earth, you put two people within 100 yards of each other and you're going to get some form of confrontation. Theft, argument, fight or death. That's just the way it is, was and has always been. Will pretty much be the same on mars as well.
Although I would like to nominate my ex wife to be on the next shuttle when it leaves ..
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Virtually no crime
What planet are you from? General human nature makes us all selfish self centered pricks. Here, on earth, you put two people within 100 yards of each other and you're going to get some form of confrontation.
Funny you should say that. I live in a backwood area (remote by UK standards) and my nearest neighbour is 1/4 mile away, four times your distance, separated by forest, and not even in sight. He is a guy with a tractor for hire. I never met him until four months after moving here, when he dumped a truckload of building gravel in a forest entrance near my house, incidentally blocking one of my two rights of way to my house. Basically, he started using the area as a storage yard. So we had a bit of a conf
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And the reason why a Mars base won't have unemployment is the exact same reason why military submarines don't have unemployment. There's also about as much free space. Unless you exit through the hatch, in which case the consequences will be the same too.
We are not talking about a settlement, we're talking about a base. Well, actually we're almost certainl
Re:what happens if the chick get pregnant? (Score:5, Informative)
The OP is probably referring to the fact that conception and gestation are likely impossible on Mars due to it's low gravity.
That's not a fact. That's unfounded speculation.
1. The child will be unable to travel to Earth, because the higher gravity of earth will kill him or her.
More speculation. There's no data on which to base that conclusion. No person have ever been in gravity between 0 m/s2 and 9.8 m/s2 for more than a few days.
2. If the child is part of this group then it will die of starvation or whatever, just as they will, except of course, they chose to die, and the child didn't. It's an ethical minefield.
That's pretty likely.
Mars will be in a very disadvantageous position WRT to Earth. They will lack power, industrial skills, economies of scale freedom of movement, everything that goes to making a society prosperous. Mars has nothing the Earth dwellers want or need, and craves the things the Earth can provide. ... Mars lacks the water and sunlight to be competitive or even self sufficient agriculturally, it lacks the power, and likely, the metals needed for industrialisation, it cannot support a population large enough for a diversified economy. Mars will be a ghetto. Unemployment and crime will be rampant.
That also seems likely.
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The OP is probably referring to the fact that conception and gestation are likely impossible on Mars due to it's low gravity.
That's not a fact. That's unfounded speculation.
Not exactly: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15607544 [nih.gov]. The premise of the study is logical: to stave off the effects of low gravity, martians need to rigorously exercise. Constantly. Fetuses cannot do that. The need to exercise will increase dramatically during developmental phases. That is, in utero and childhood.
Of course, there have been no experiments that confirm these observations but we are choosing between 2 contrasting speculations:
(a) that despite our observations of the effects on post de
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The OP is probably referring to the fact that conception and gestation are likely impossible on Mars due to it's low gravity.
That's not a fact. That's unfounded speculation.
Not exactly: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15607544 [nih.gov]. The premise of the study is logical: to stave off the effects of low gravity, martians need to rigorously exercise. Constantly. Fetuses cannot do that. The need to exercise will increase dramatically during developmental phases. That is, in utero and childhood.
Of course, there have been no experiments that confirm these observations but we are choosing between 2 contrasting speculations:
(a) that despite our observations of the effects on post development adults, developing humans will be unaffected by low gravity or
(b) based on our observations of the effects on adults, developing humans will also be affected, severely and detrimentally, more so if the cannot be made to exercise.
Out of those speculations, we should pick the one that is logical.
Fetuse in flotation, which is pretty much the same as zero G except for the resistance provided by the aqueous medium. There is no reason to expect that the minute differences would affect fetuses.
There's also no logic in either of your false choices. First, because there are no observations of effects of fractional gravity on adults and because there could be effects is not the same as there would be severe and detrimental effects.
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Fetuse in flotation, which is pretty much the same as zero G except for the resistance provided by the aqueous medium. There is no reason to expect that the minute differences would affect fetuses.
So you imagine that somehow, amniotic fluids cancel out gravity waves? *facepalm*
Just an FYI - uteruses aren't anti gravity devices. Foetuses feel gravity just the same as born people do.
There's also no logic in either of your false choices. First, because there are no observations of effects of fractional gravity on adults and because there could be effects is not the same as there would be severe and detrimental effects.
You're in denial.
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Wars, maybe not, because there will never be enough people there to ever go to War, and the classic geographical style war is impossible anyway.
People will engage in war under any circumstances, geography is hardly a factor. A more likely scenario is that war will be difficult due to the scarcity of resources on Mars. War requires the squandering of vast amounts of resources, weather its money, goods, materials, or people. Far more likely is guerilla insugency, backed by earthly powers (countries) with some kind of vested interest in the social disruption of Martian society. Crime will be a given with the same scarcity of resources.
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So you think that Elton John posts on slashdot?
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Oh, and instead of $38 each, they should be paying $38000000 dollars apiece.
No... they should spend $38 each to get there.... but before they leave, they should sell all the rest of their assets, and use the proceeds to create an enormous foundation whose purpose for existing is to get them back to earth: in case they later realize the mistake they have made.
Re:what happens if the chick get pregnant? (Score:4, Insightful)
The main problem with your analysis is that the kind of people they will (or ought to) send will be very easy-going, non-violent, kind, highly intelligent and well educated.
Quite likely. For a working model we could actually use the early internet. Back before the arpanet became the internet there were fewer users and most were highly educated researchers. Forward to the present and we know what we have now.
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Mostly. Yes.
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Of course, when you limit the discussion to the ultimate outcome, this is true for just about any activity that can be contemplated. You can live out your life, in all likelihood a mere cog in the machine called civilization, or you can be cremated and have your ashes scattered in some place of significance to you.
I'm not telling these people what they can do with their own money. As long as it's their money, and not someone elses. As long as it's understood that this is about personal ambition and ego (as you have helpfully pointed out).
So, are you planning on killing yourself today, or will you try to do something truly memorable instead?
Well, that's a bit off topic, however - if I had $38000000 dollars I would not spend it on some death cult ritual, no building a monumental pyramid, self aggrandising statue made of gold, or scattering of my ashes on another planet. If I'm to be remembered beyond my death, I don't
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"High radiation levels"
You might want to do a little research, Curiosity has only recorded radiation levels equivalent to being aboard ISS, and that is without any shielding (I believe). Astronauts on ISS itself receive about 1 millisievert per day, whereas people in Colorado for example are probably exposed to 9-15 millisievert per year. So it is quite an increase from Earth normal, but even astronauts with long duration space stays only have a few percent higher risk (3% I believe). There is no doubt t
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That would be a crime against humanity. It is one thing to throw your life away because you are stupid, but it is something else entirely to inflict this on e person that did not get a choice in the matter.
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Fun fact: having a child on Earth also means inflicting an uncertain existence upon them including certain death. That fact doesn't appear to have stopped significant numbers of earthers from breeding either, even in conditions most of us wouldn't want to spend a day in let alone a lifetime.
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I agree. Life is really cheap to most people as long as it is the life of somebody else, even if it is their child. The problem is of course just the original one: It is far too cheap and easy to produce more human beings. Kind of the main problem we have.
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One unsterilized woman can get pregnant. One unsterilized man can get all the women pregnant.
Or you could ship fertilized embryos in heavily shielded containers and implant them there, although I'm no sure why you'd want to.
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What happened when European men and women landed upon the shores of the glorious New World? Why, they had children.
Who did these children grow up to become? THE FOUNDING FATHERS OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA!
What would happen to the first children on Mars? They would become THE FOUNDING FATHERS OF THE UNITED STATES OF MARTIAN AMERICA!
It's not an equivalent situation. Conditions in the early American colonies were harsh because the colonists weren't prepared for the transition and unused to the climate which led to a 50 percent mortality rate in the first year. However as settlements stabilised, the environment soon became as habitable as the one they left. Mars isn't like that. It hasn't got an atmosphere worth a dam, and you're going to have the option of striking out and staking your acre of land as you're not going to be able to
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Early visitors mostly died or went home. You seem to be under the impression that these volunteers will be starting families and chowing down on turkey dinners with the natives. A manned trip to mars is very ambitious, and with no way back these volunteers will probably die. Even if they had a return ship
Or not... assuming the plans are suitably laid out ahead of time, and they receive appropriate training.
To be successful they do not a reasonable plan that results in a sustainable settlement, where t
That's OK, You Can Go First! (Score:3, Interesting)
How a Mission to Mars Could Kill You [discovery.com]
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As a bonus (Score:5, Funny)
All 100,000 get honorary darwin awards.
Re:As a bonus (Score:5, Funny)
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There is a difference between dying due a resupply ship malfunction (or cutting of funds) and dying in a few thousand generations.
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fun fact: material doesn't disappear just because you eat it. plenty of resources to keep going for a thousand generations, lifestyles might change and overall population might go up and down but that's to be expected.
compared to mars we're living in garden of eden. any tech that would sustain you on mars would sustain you easier here(in biodomes or whatever, if you think the atmosphere is going bust) and mars isn't filled with unobtanium magic feed crystals...
if you just count stuff such as oil and coal as
Re:As a bonus (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:As a bonus (Score:5, Interesting)
I find it very disheartening
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It's funny how we claim in western culture that we should be free to do as we please as long as it's not hurting anyone else, but there are so many that feel the need to jump in and stop others from go on what could be the greatest adventure any of us could ever go on, possibility for the betterment and all mankind, but everyone and their dog feel it's absolutely necessary to try and stop them.
I find it very disheartening
The problem is that statistically they are all lying. Maybe there are a few who understand and accept the risks for a higher cause. But for the most part these are people hoping for their 15 minutes. Maybe a quick interview on local news, maybe a bragging right on Facebook, maybe just frat boys who think its funny. Sorry, but almost no one is taking this seriously.
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I think you put too much faith in these "needy" adults to do much of anything. There are many countries where people live in far worse conditions with far more unemployment and far less military and police technology to deal with these types of things. I also don't think you'll get very far with the government with a rising minimum wage, at least not in any meaningful sense.
Why do you thing the US G keeps printing money expect as a way to reduce everyone's effective paycheck even further than what it is now
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And it wouldn't surprise me if someone said something similar about the humans who first moved out of Africa.
No doubt they did, but walking from Africa only meant going through a progressively changing environment in which you could turn back at any point, and which you could do in small stages over generations. Even those who sailed away in ships (a closer analogy) had no thought that it might be impossible to breathe air or find water at the destination (they were OK as it happened), or have to be confined to a small enclosure. They assumed (rightly as it happened) that it would be the same as home with perhap
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No they thought they might fall off the end of the world. Anyway you are right they will most certainly die (relatively quickly) but I am sure many previous explorers had a high change of death.
But in the end, if we ever want to expand to other planets some people are going to have to take incredibly risky step of being the first people to go.
Can we wait until we have better technology, yes, but at some point we will go (or at least I believe so).
Their deaths will provide invaluable knowledge about next ti
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There's a real problem here: they're planning to fund this project through Survivor type television selection process.
And there is a relatively high probability that these people could die. We'll have the world watching as we send a group of four likely under-equipped people to Mars. I would wholeheartedly like to see us go to Mars and beyond, but I'm concerned that this half-hazard approach may end up damaging the long-term will to do this than succeeding.
We need better radiation shielding - which is e
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...building things in orbit - not plugging modules together...
You will apparently be surprised to learn that modern building techniques make heavy use of modularized materials.
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Comment removed (Score:5, Funny)
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Really? I heard
There are nooooo cats on Maaarrs, and the streets are paved with cheeese!
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How to build a better world (Score:5, Insightful)
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Destination - Golgafrincham
Mars One torn to shreds by their own AMA (Score:5, Interesting)
Can we volunteer *other* people? (Score:2)
I a little list. They will never be missed...
I'm sure she'll be fine. (Score:5, Funny)
DOA (Score:2)
One solar flare pointed in the wrong direction and they will fry before they get there. Without science fiction, there is no practical shielding tech that offers a solution (a room with 6 inch think lead walls is heavier than you think). Keep in mind, if you have a heavy shielding solution and you get that thing up to speed, slowing down becomes a problem. You could end up flying right past Mars. You could bring some big thrusters to slow you down. Oh wait, that is more weight. Or you could use some su
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I heard one idea of using the water supply as shielding. If we could get the water from the moon it would save a lot of energy lugging it out of the gravity well.
They could do a 'reverse-slingshot' maneuver to bleed off speed using one of Mars's moons.
As to landing, yeah, thruster-based is really the only option. Maybe some way of using some of that shielding as a propellant would work to cut down weight. If they land in the right spot they can dig for more water once they are down.
If a comet comes along at
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Not that bad (Score:5, Informative)
They will need radiation shielding on Mars too.
In a talk on current measurements for radiation levels on Mars I attended, the scientists responsible for the radiation measurement instrumentation said the rough dose you would get per year is around 100 x-rays worth. That's quite a lot, but not going to kill you anytime soon.
That was with little solar activity, but you could provide a shielded area to retreat to if something happened to hit while the sun was up.
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They could do a 'reverse-slingshot' maneuver to bleed off speed using one of Mars's moons.
Mars' moons are way too small to do any kind of gravitational slingshot manoeuvre. You'd probably use an inflatable heatshield [space.com] and aerobrake into orbit.
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Machinery only needs to be lugged up once. In fact, it could even be manufactured up there.
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The awesome thing about humans is that we have these people called Scientists and Engineers who make things which haven't been done before. No really, true story. /snark
Stop being such a downer. If you had your way we'd be sending these messages to each other on papyrus scrolls.
Re:DOA (Score:5, Insightful)
One solar flare pointed in the wrong direction and they will fry before they get there. Without science fiction, there is no practical shielding tech that offers a solution (a room with 6 inch think lead walls is heavier than you think).
sigh, and also sigh. It's called water. You need it anyway. It's good for everything.
Are they going to land on the surface? I doubt it. The atmosphere makes it very hard to land anything larger than the rover without making a new crater. If you landed, you would have supplies for a few hours before death. You can't do it with parachutes. You need a big rocket to slow you done
You missed some punctuation there: "You need a big rocket to slow you. Done."
It goes on and on. Mars is distraction. Money and energy should be spent on more practical projects.
Yes. Like asteroid mining. Which would give us the mass in orbit necessary to build meaningful interplanetary missions.
We'll all be dead from a antibiotic resistant super-bug before we have any hope of putting someone on Mars.
Unfortunately, aerospace engineers aren't very useful in solving that problem. Probably we should still let them work on getting us off this mudball before the impactor arrives.
Re:DOA (Score:4, Insightful)
Can you define a value of "us"? How many people is that?
I mean the species. But if we had space elevators, and we stopped breeding, and we built sufficiently large ships, we could probably get a significant portion of the population out of here.
Do you realize how little difference there is between you and a regular doomsday cult?
Yes. The only difference is that most of them are worried about something that will probably never happen, whereas I am concerned about something that will probably happen eventually.
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"I mean the species. But if we had space elevators, and we stopped breeding, and we built sufficiently large ships, we could probably get a significant portion of the population out of here."
We don't need to evacuate anyone. Making a colony doesn't require moving a bunch of Terrans with short lifespans to Mars, it requires moving a cadre who whose progeny will become Martians.
Ants don't make new anthills by moving the group.
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One solar flare pointed in the wrong direction...science fiction...blah blah...
And then you go on to paint a very bleak portrait of space travel. We have sent men to the moon, have functioning sattellites, and sent man-made probes to Mars. Also, "one Solar flare" will be a factor with diminishing consequences the further from the sun you are. Clearly your "Space Travel == Instant Annihilation" scenario is not exactly (not even remotely) true. Are you writing a Science Fiction novel?
Re:DOA (Score:5, Insightful)
The "we must not do anything speculative until all more mundane problems are totally solved" view is broken on many fronts, not least of which is ignoring the potential parallelism in progressing our culture and expertise, and the actual practical intractability of many of the "simple" problems especially if they are even defined in relative terms.
Life is neither binary nor single-threaded.
Rgds
Damon
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There is no need to slow down once you get to Mars (due to the Sun's gravity and orbital mechanics). It's called a transfer orbit. Think of it like throwing an object up on the roof of a building. If you toss it just right, it will land softly. This is also why it takes so long to get to Mars -- if you go any faster, then you would have to "put on the breaks" when you get there.
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Not true. At the end of the trip using a transfer orbit, you're still going about 6 kps. That's what the MSL mission control video mentioned on reentry.
The expensive (and completely impractical way) to slow down from 6 kps to under 1 is to bring enough rocket fuel and an engine to make that kind of velocity change. However, you'd need to have a lander almost as big as the rocket that launched the mission.
Or you can try to skim the atmosphere and use a really great heat-shield. That's what MSL did. I un
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a room with 6 inch think lead walls is heavier than you think
Minor point, but lead (or any metal) is not the appropriate shield in space. It produces secondary radiation showers that are worse than the incoming radiation. The shielding of choice is hydrogen. That means high-H plastics or water, the latter is preferred for long duration missions for reasons that should be obvious.
Nope (Score:2)
"The application process is ongoing; have you signed up?"
Nope. I'm not a fool.
And I suspect all but a tiny number of those signed up would turn tail and run if and when they were actually selected and it came time to board. The number of people chasing a 'net fad is pretty much meaningless.
Hollywood title to come in a near future. (Score:2)
Stop giving this scam free press! (Score:4, Interesting)
I really wish people would stop posting MarsOne propaganda. It's a scam, pure and simple. It's been pointed out time and time again that their team is primarily artists and PR people. Just look here for yourself:
http://www.mars-one.com/en/about-mars-one/team [mars-one.com]
Of the 7 people listed there's: an artist, an editor, a communication specialist, a communications director, and an MD. There's only 2 people who could conceivably have any expertise on getting to Mars.
They did an interview (AMA) on reddit and were torn apart:
http://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/ufb42/ama_i_am_founder_of_mars_one_sending_four_people/ [reddit.com]
STOP FEEDING THESE PEOPLE FREE PRESS!
Not in this body (Score:2)
However, if a cyborg or fully synthetic body becomes possible meanwhile...
Life imitates art (Score:2)
"I don't want to live on this planet any more."
-- Hubert J. Farnsworth
(Made you read that in his voice.)
forget the humans (Score:3)
Never send a man to do a robot's job.
Potential PR Nightmare (Score:2)
I understand this - I really do, but the potential for negative publicity is high here.
Everybody's imagining brave souls doing this for exploration and such, but when death is closer the chance of one person buckling is much higher. Can you imagine the videos circulating of one or more of these people sending back messages when they got there saying that they made a mistake and begging for help? Help that we couldn't really provide even if we wanted to? It could really taint the public perception of spac
As phony as could be (Score:2)
If this project is real, where are the rocket designs? Where are the hundreds of engineers and scientists working on the project? In fact there is NOT A SINGLE ONE! Not one person with scientific, engineering or technical knowledge has been identified as working on this. There are no want ads to hire those hundreds of engineers either.
Why should i leave earth? (Score:2)
Putting a human on mars without the possibility to return or build something meaningful there is a pointless exercise. We know the effects of zero gravity and radiation on the body, and the amount of drugs they would have to take regularly to reduce the probability of a psychological breakdown would be huge. What happen is somebody actually only realizes on the way to Mars that he actually does *not* want to die but live another 50 years on earth. Selecting a mission crew from people who volunteer for death
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whip up a signup site, start spreading it around on facebook.
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$30, and I'll name a star after you too.
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I'll do it for $20. I'll put the name in a database, and will print a handsome certificate of ownership.
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So you want to say Mars ain't the place where we could escape that?
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Yes, at least they are attempting to provide for all those things. But even with multiple redundant fallbacks, it will be a very risky endeavor.
As for landing, Elon Musk claims his next-gen Dragon capsule will be able to land (propulsively) on Mars. That remains to be seen, but at least on paper it is possible. If he can get the Falcon rocket to be fully reusable (another big "if"), it would dramatically reduce the cost of the mission, possibly to the point where this odd "reality show" funding scheme might
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Do these people have plans for recycling systems and habitats that can survive ...
As well as have medical staff to deal with people possibly being injured and/or dying?
Don't worry, maybe they will folow the example of the Pilgrim Fathers, who went to America equipped only with several hundred copies of the Bible (but not a single book on agriculture) to help them. The only qualification to go was that they shared some religious issues which today seem not of the slightest importance, and the hope that by resettling in the middle of nowhere their children could not be "drawn away by evil examples into extravagance and dangerous courses". Presumably these volunteers are t
Re: So, wait... (Score:5, Insightful)
The religious idiots had an advantage : they could slaughter the inhabitants and just seize already cultivated land and resources and eat all the animals they could find. Settling 'Murica was probably the easiest in the history of mankind.
The advantage they actually had was that the native Americans had already been decimated (in the modern sense; actually, they were reduced to the tenth man, not by him) by contact with the diseases of the Spanish.
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The religious idiots had an advantage : they could slaughter the inhabitants and just seize already cultivated land
The Pilgrim fathers were idiots, but were idealists, and I don't think you can accuse them of that behaviour. That was by later waves of settlers who only came when they heard exagerated stories of free land and gold. It was always so with vested interests trying to encourage migration (that is why Greenland was called "Green" land or even "Vine" land - as if it were warm enough to grow vines). We see similar today, with immigrants wanting to get to the UK and USA in the mistaken belief that the streets a
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Yes. They clearly want the predictable "oh, I wanna go" morons.
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Listen, these numbers include wives/girlfriends signing their SO up without their knowledge
So that explains my name on the list.