One Variety of Sea Slugs Cuts Out the Energy Middleman 232
dragonturtle69 writes with this story, short on details but interesting: "These sea slugs, Elysia chlorotica, have evolved the ability to gain energy via photosynthesis. Forget about genetic modifications for sports enhancements. I want to be able to never need to eat again — or do I?"
Mail Order Monsters (Score:3, Insightful)
That was my totally favorite upgrade in Mail Order Monsters - recharge from the sub!
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Sun.. not sub.
Re:Mail Order Monsters (Score:4, Funny)
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Mod up for kickass game reference. One of my favorites on the Commodore 64.
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Stay out of the sun or you'll get fat!
eating (Score:5, Insightful)
I want to be able to never need to eat again -- or do I?
I'l like the ability to never HAVE to eat again, but I wouldn't want to lose the ability to eat at all. Eating is enjoyable. One would hope that you could control the photosynthesis to keep from getting too fat, though.
Re:eating (Score:5, Insightful)
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Slugs aren't very energetic. It's doubtful that photosynthesis alone will provide the energy necessary to power your body and that meat based computer in your head.
So this would work for my boss, then.
Re:eating (Score:5, Informative)
I just did a few quick calculations. Assuming humans have 2 square meters of skin, and stood naked in direct sunlight in the best conditions for 8 hours per day, and assuming 5% efficiency for photosynthesis, we would only get enough energy to provide for 11 hours of sleep (250 BTU/hr), 7 hours of sitting still (400 BTU), 4 hours of light work (650 BTU) or 1 hour of heavy work (2400 BTU). We'd still probably need to consume 2/3 or so of our normal caloric intake from food.
Sources:
http://www.solarexpert.com/Heat-theory.html [solarexpert.com]
http://hypertextbook.com/facts/2001/IgorFridman.shtml [hypertextbook.com]
http://www.answerbag.com/q_view/514275 [answerbag.com]
http://www.ccmr.cornell.edu/education/ask/index.html?quid=1021 [cornell.edu]
So What, It would still be a good thing... (Score:3, Insightful)
Especially in Third world countries where there is plenty of sun, not much food and not much to do other than subsistence living,. At least it would be enough to get a lot of starving humans through the dry famine months that they get in thrid world countries near the equator.
Sure their skin would be green, but that beats starving to death.
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That covers my needs. I'm in!
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and assuming 5% efficiency for photosynthesis
Interestingly, this estimate is right around the theoretical maximal efficiency of photosynthesis. As outlined in Current Opinion in Biotechnology 2008, vol. 19, pp. 153-159 (sorry, subscription only), the maximum theoretical efficiency of C3 photosynthesis is a mere 4.6%. C4 photosynthesis has a bit higher potential at 6.0%.
We can't even reach these efficiencies in plants (best for crops in a growing season is 2.4% for C3 or 3.7% for C4; see above reference), so sarahbau is right in saying that the amount
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Yeah. I know it's not perfect, and that all 2 m^2 of skin wouldn't actually be receiving full sunlight. I was just trying to emphasize that even with unrealistically optimal conditions, we wouldn't get nearly enough energy from the sun to live on photosynthesis alone.
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Yeah. I know it's not perfect, and that all 2 m^2 of skin wouldn't actually be receiving full sunlight. I was just trying to emphasize that even with unrealistically optimal conditions, we wouldn't get nearly enough energy from the sun to live on photosynthesis alone.
we just need to evolve (or bioengineer) larger backs to catch more sun. Note that the creature doing photosynthesis has quite a large back
Re:eating (Score:4, Funny)
Perhaps the GP planned to unzip his skin down the back, peel it forward, and present his entire "surface area" to the sun?
** shudder **
Re:eating (Score:4, Funny)
There are lots of options; the human body is flexible. Remember that Goatse guy? I bet there are other areas of the human body which can be slowly trained and stretched over time, until finally you are able to zip down your pants and fold out your bright green, photosyntesizing scrotum.
(Oh, how I miss alt.tasteless from the early 1990s ...)
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I use the term 'Underground Lair of Ubertude'. It has an astoundingly effective 'no girls allowed' sticker on the door.
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I seriously doubt that we have enough surface area to replace eating with photosynthesis.
That can be remedied. Who doesn't want enormous green wings sprouting out of their back?
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One would hope that you could control the photosynthesis to keep from getting too fat, though.
Sunscreen.
SPF: Diet
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You will probably need to eat something to gain minerals, but eating for energy can be restricted.
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One would hope that you could control the photosynthesis to keep from getting too fat, though.
Wear variable amount of clothes.
Strange side effect -> women in tiny bikinis would be fat, women in the cover it all up wetsuit like one pieces would be skinny.
Re:eating (Score:5, Funny)
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Guess you never heard of UV lamps ...
Re:eating (Score:5, Informative)
whoosh.
The sun rises on the eastern horizon just as you are going to bed after sitting at your computer all night.
Re:eating (Score:5, Insightful)
New rule: You’re only allowed to intentionally miss the point of a joke if the joke you’re making is funnier than the one you’re ignoring.
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Sure it is. It;s just not a good joke. And what I may consider hilarious, you may think rude. And vice versa.
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If the joke wasn't that we stay up through all hours of the night
It was.
“that big, bright, yellowish thing on the eastern horizon when you go to bed” – funny.
“Where I live the sun sets on the western horizon” – not so funny.
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Just nod if you can hear me...
Is there anyone at home?
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For me, some foods are enjoyable, most are a chore.
I'd like to be able to eat some candy bars or ice cream or an occasional steak or whatever for pleasure, maybe pop a vitamin supplement, and not worry about having to eat to survive.
Re:eating (Score:5, Insightful)
The point I think you (and GP, and the submitter, and many others) are missing is, photosynthesis does not remove the need to eat. Energy isn't the only thing you get from food. If you had vitamin pills so effective that you could live on them, plus sugar, plus water - and nothing else - then you could replace the sugar with the ability to perform photosynthesis. Such pills do not exist.
In case you're wondering, plants do indeed "eat". That's why they need roots in fertile soil.
They're Zerg. Duh. (Score:4, Funny)
Any other questions that could be easily answered by playing Starcraft?
No you don't (Score:3, Insightful)
As everybody knows....
It's not easy being green.
I want the reverse. (Score:5, Interesting)
I want to be able to consume as many extra calories as I like, and then radiate the excess as visible light, with radiant area, spectrum and direction under my conscious control.
Or, at least, I'd like to be able to metabolize my food and store excess energy as electric charge, easily transferred to whatever devices are handy.
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It seems you've been playing too much inFamous. Now glucose powered devices that run off your blood stream, that seems more feasible.
Re:I want the reverse. (Score:5, Funny)
This would be awesome. having a + and - poll could give men's nipples a purpose.
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Re:I want the reverse. (Score:5, Funny)
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Modern man in effect eats a fair bit of oil and coal. It allows them to generate light, travel great distances fast etc.My car consumes about as much in $$$ terms as I do per month.
But yeah, being a superhuman could be fun :).
What you might want in addition to your lightbeams and electric zapping superpowers is the ability to use energy from an external power source to power your anaerobic metabolic modes = e.g. you can sprint and not get tired[1] till you run out of energy from that power source.
While powe
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Well, the problem would be that you then would also be very hot. And not in the good sense. More in the “spontaneous combustion” sense. ;)
But I agree that a way to not use unnecessary calories without an effort would be great. Decadent beyond belief. But great. ;)
You already have metabolized it into a storage. That’s your fat. You just never use it up. I once calculated, that if released all at once, the fat in my body would give enough power to run a flux compensator for 0.88 seconds. No
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Eh, screw radiating it all over - I want to focus it out of my eyes, or perhaps a finger. That'd rock!
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That's so much better than my idea of a bicycle powered TV. With your method, you could power the TV directly, just by eating.
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I want to be able to radiate invisible light [wikipedia.org], perhaps also radiate cold heat and dry water.
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Light is electromagnetic radiation, particularly radiation of a wavelength that is visible to the human eye
Is not the same as:
Light is electromagnetic radiation of a wavelength that is visible to the human eye
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If you would be so kind as to go soak your head in a large reservoir of liquid nitrogen for a few hours, you'll have your opportunity. Your head will be radiating light/heat at a blackbody temperature around 77K, which is (a) invisible and (b) cold. For the "dry water" part, well, frozen tissue at 77K really isn't very "wet" at all, except in the chemical sense.
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Just eat some lava, and heat yourself up to a >1000K
You'll radiate as visible light!
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Personally, when I feel so stuffed I can't eat any more, I just use the restroom. Then I can eat more.
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Or, at least, I'd like to be able to metabolize my food and store excess energy as electric charge, easily transferred to whatever devices are handy.
Hook an excercise bike up to a generator which is connected to a battery. Satisfies your requirements other than the "easy" part.
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Well played. In fact, once you've got the charge in the battery, I'd argue that it is "easily transferred to whatever devices are handy".
It would be nice to have a more direct metabolic conversion, though, preferably one that doesn't generate quite so much sweat, fatigue, and boredom.
Whatever, Captain Sunshine! (Score:2)
Just try not to get Wonder Boy killed off will ya?
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Ugh. I don't want to need welding goggles just to drive by McDonalds.
Photosynthesize! (Score:4, Interesting)
Once you've "eaten enough algae to steal the necessary chloroplasts", you'll be good to go!
I would happily endure eating algae for X days/weeks/months in order to get photosynthesis going in my body. I realize that I'd have to start going outside, but it sounds like a fair trade off to me.
You do realize (Score:2)
That you'll still have to eat something and eating like a plant means eating ... fertilizer.
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That you'll still have to eat something and eating like a plant means eating ... fertilizer.
Nah, you can just absorb that stuff through your roots.
Exactly, eating like a plant (Score:2)
Means you'll be sucking up ... "fertilizer".
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Shortcut the whole process and just stand in the toilet.
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Don't piss on my leg and tell me it is good for me.
Re:Exactly, eating like a plant (Score:4, Funny)
What should I say then when I piss on your leg?
Re:Exactly, eating like a plant (Score:5, Funny)
I’d say, “hi, did you realise that you’re standing in the toilet?”
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I thought we already produce "fertilizer" ?
Would that mean that we would no longer have to go to the bathroom, or would it only just give a different meaning to the term "Morning Wood" ?
been a while since bio class (Score:3, Interesting)
In a normal plant cell is the chlorophyll produces by the cell and then shuttled to the chloroplast to be used or does the chloroplast itself produce the pigment within it's own membrane? If the latter, I would imagine this gene in the slug is redundant as the creature has to eat algae for the chloroplasts anyways.
Re:been a while since bio class (Score:5, Informative)
Chlorophyll itself is made in the cytoplasm, and actually requires relatively few new genes for an animal to be able to produce it, since the complicated steps of its biosynthesis are identical to the heme structures it is already able to make. The real difficulty, and one that this sea slug seems to have been able to surmount according to the Wikipedia page, is the production of the "oxygen-evolving complex," a metalloenzyme with a manganese-calcium core which transfers absorbed energy to a bound water molecule to break it into electrons, protons, and molecular oxygen. Heterotrophic organisms don't produce anything like it.
Gene transfer question? (Score:3, Interesting)
Wouldn't that be a fluke that only needed to happen once? They do point out that the animals also have to get chloroplasts by eating plant material (these are not passed on to offspring), so perhaps they meant to say they aren't sure how they appropriate the chloroplasts. I would agree that's a really good question.
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Wouldn't that be a fluke that only needed to happen once?
Calling it a "fluke" is not an explanation. The thing about scientists is, they like to find out how these "flukes" happen.
Sea Slugs and nematocysts (Score:5, Interesting)
Some species of Sea Slugs have another similar interesting ability -- to adsorb and host nematocysts (stinging cells) from jellyfish and hydrozoans they've eaten, and use them for their own defense. The mechanism is substantially different (foreign cells are sequestered in specialized sacs, compared to the intracellular hosting of an organelle) though.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glaucus_atlanticus [wikipedia.org]
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Slugs, the Peter Petrellis of the animal kingdom....
There are other ways to do this (Score:3, Interesting)
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We already do almost that (except the inside body part). It's called agriculture :)
Yes, Sea Anemones for one (Score:3, Informative)
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Couldn't you just form an symbiotic relationship with algae or photoplankton, allowing them to live inside you for protection in return for using them for energy? Aren't there already animals that do this?
There are. That process is well understood, and thus, not all that interesting to scientists. What this slug does in addition to that is novel and thus interesting.
Yes. (Score:2)
Eating is not just energy (Score:2)
Actual evolution? (Score:2)
Is this actual, observed evolution?
Is this the proof creationists are always demanding?
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Is this actual, observed evolution? Is this the proof creationists are always demanding?
Yes and no. It is one of thousands of examples of observed evolution, and the process is already well proved. This will not stop the demands, however, since the demands are not made in good faith...
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No, God just invented them with the ability to do this to confuse us all. God loves gettin' his jollies off keep mankind eternally confused.
The Nigerian leader in District 9 was right! (Score:4, Funny)
I'm gonna go find and chow down on some ninjas right now, so I gain Real Ultimate Power!!
How is this news? (Score:3, Funny)
Slugs have been around for millions of years!
forget absorbling light (Score:2)
I want to emit light. at will. So I don't need a flashlight, or could get a job as an organic tanning booth and loose weight at the same time. Or, dare I say, sparkle when outdoors.
I know i do. (Score:2)
if you take time to think how much of our time passes while doing mandatory eating, strenous digesting and dealing with the excrement and crapping it, you would be appalled.
in addition, a good deal of energy we take in by eating is spent on digesting the food itself. check your body in an atlas. almost 1/3 of the internal organs are allocated to digestion.
imagine cutting out the middleman.
See, this is why we shouldn't discount cannibalism (Score:2)
Eating the brains of our slain foes is probably as close as we'll ever get to a Highlander quickening. These slugs are already workin' their way up the ladder, and they just might be coming for YOUR brains in a few years....
Exactly right (Score:2)
I too think that ABC Family are a bunch of sea slugs for having canceled The Middleman.
Never eat again? Ask Roger Ebert about that. (Score:3)
Roger Ebert recently wrote about his life after surgery. He can no longer take anything by mouth. I can't imagine life without taste, but he lives it.
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No I didn't read the article, MSNBC rarely loads properly here at work. I believe that saying it gains energy via photosynthesis is incorrect. Photosynthesis causes a chemical reaction that converts Carbon Dioxide and Water (CO2 and H2O) into Sugar and Oxygen (C6H12O6 and O2). The sugar is then metabolized (correct term?) into energy.
Converting CO2 and H2O to sugar and oxygen requires energy, that energy comes from the sun. So saying that it obtains energy via (which means "by way of") photosynthesis is correct.
Re:Nitpick (Score:5, Informative)
No, the statement is essentially correct. The slugs harvest (i.e. gain) energy via trapping photons with chlorophyll. They store that energy as chemical bonds in sugar molecules. They then release the energy as needed by metabolizing the sugar. Photosynthesis is the coupled capturing and storing of energy so saying that it "gains" energy via photosynthesis is a reasonable simplification.
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To summarize the article:
Slugs have somehow included algae DNA with its own, and are now capable of actual photosynthesis. The DNA that was copied didn't code for the creation of chloroplasts, so the slugs have to consume a sufficient amount of algae before they can begin the process.
As long as they are exposed to light for 12 hours per day, they can live without the need for food.
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Slugs have somehow included algae DNA with its own
Good thing it wasn't frog DNA. Then they'd be able to reproduce, too!
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Here's the thing. Animal cells have the ability to do a lot of biochemistry, but they have very limited ability to do some exotic chemistry that is essential to animal life. The major example of this is a molecule called adenosine triphosphate, aka ATP. All life uses ATP as an energy source.... lemme back up. Chemical reactions are reversible. To get from the reactants to the products requires that you put in a certain amount of energy to
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You might want to look up the word "via".
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Photosynthesis is not like solar power generation that converts sunlight into a different form of energy (electricity).
Instead it uses the energy to produce an energy source (similar to coal as you point out). This energy source is then metabolized into energy. The sun's energy is used indirectly.
Still it is very cool to see an organism that isn't a plant being able to use the sun for more than just heat.
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If you think about the laws of thermodynamics, you will realize that "uses the energy to produce an energy source" is just a confusing way to say "cnoverts the energy to another form and stores it".
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