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Medicine Biotech Science

Hints of a Link Between Autism and Vinyl Flooring 356

SpuriousLogic sends in a link from Scientific American to a study by Swedish and US researchers that reaches the surprising conclusion that there may be a link between autism and vinyl floors. "Children who live in homes with vinyl floors, which can emit chemicals called phthalates, are more likely to have autism, according to research by Swedish and US scientists published Monday. ... The scientists were surprised by their finding, calling it 'far from conclusive.' ... The researchers found four environmental factors associated with autism: vinyl flooring, the mother's smoking, family economic problems, and condensation on windows, which indicates poor ventilation. Infants or toddlers who lived in bedrooms with vinyl, or PVC, floors were twice as likely to have autism five years later... than those with wood or linoleum flooring. ... Several scientists who did not participate in the study cautioned that it has too many limitations to draw conclusions, but they suggested that new studies be designed to look for a connection between autism and indoor air pollutants."
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Hints of a Link Between Autism and Vinyl Flooring

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  • by G3ckoG33k ( 647276 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @03:58AM (#27413381)

    I have a friend with a large vinyl album collection. Some 5,000 vinyls!

    Funny, I always thought he was a bit of an introvert. Now I know why. ;)

    • by The Clockwork Troll ( 655321 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @04:14AM (#27413455) Journal
      It's actually 4,936 albums.  I counted them.  Yeah, definitely 4,936 albums.  64 more to be 5,000.  7,352 more to be 12,288.  So, 4,936 albums really.
    • Re:Album collection? (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Red Flayer ( 890720 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @04:44AM (#27413599) Journal

      I have a friend with a large vinyl album collection. Some 5,000 vinyls!

      Funny, I always thought he was a bit of an introvert. Now I know why. ;)

      Tangentially, what about new cars? Part of the "new car smell" is phthalates and other plasticizers outgassed from the car interior... I wonder if there is a higher incidence of autism in children whose parents bought a new car early in their life?

      Unrelated to autism (I think), I get nauseous in new cars, or in limos with the "new car small" releaser thingy on the dashboard. So much so that I'll never buy a new car without having my wife use it for the first few months... but since she does the majority of schlepping the kid around, maybe I should rethink that strategy.

  • by krou ( 1027572 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @03:58AM (#27413385)
    ... someone says correlation is not causation?
    • by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @04:15AM (#27413469)

      Good point. We should be looking for a common cause, something that causes BOTH autism AND vinyl flooring.

      Or possibly that autism causes pre-emtive vinyl flooring

      • Why is this funny? (Score:5, Interesting)

        by tygerstripes ( 832644 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @05:34AM (#27413809)

        Low income. Increases the likelihood of smoking, vinyl flooring, poorly ventilated housing and... oh look, it's right there in the list: "family economic problems".

      • by 2.7182 ( 819680 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @06:15AM (#27413979)
        Maybe the latent form of the autism gene causes terrible taste in interior decorating.
        • by geschild ( 43455 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @09:38AM (#27416813) Homepage

          I'm unsure why you're labled funny. I think you managed to hit the nail on the head. Autism an autistic tendencies might very well lead to a taste for minimalism.

          This is a testable hypothesis: are there any other ways in which the interior of these houses is minimalistic? Interior blinds instead of (draped) curtains, leather instead of fabric on the chairs and couch? Vynil _or_ tiles instead of carpet?

          I do think alternative underlying reasons for the correlation can and will be found :).

      • by MindKata ( 957167 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @06:15AM (#27413981) Journal
        "correlation is not causation"
        Its very unfortunate that everyone in the world doesn't know the difference. It would solve so many problems in the world, if everyone was forced to learn the difference throughout school and in everyday adult life. Everyone would find life so much better as so many arguments would be avoided and things would get fixed quicker. The people behind funding education in science need to focus a vast amount of time, money and effort into promoting understanding in this simple yet vital bit of education. (I would go as far as to say we need a day per year to remind everyone, like a "world correlation is not causation day!" ... and i'm not joking, we really need to get everyone in the world finally past this stumbling block.

        "autism AND vinyl flooring."
        It could also simply be for example, (on average) more autistic people prefer and enjoy the look, patterning, practical ease of use, feel and/or smell of vinyl flooring. Its like saying, which comes first, Autism or Vinyl flooring.

        They could just as easily say looking at the sea causes Autism ... because they will find (if they bother to study it) that most Autistic people will (on average) enjoy spending longer looking at the sea waves with their every changing details and changing specular highlights as they break and merge combined with the complex yet rhythmic sounds of the waves breaking on the beach etc..
        • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

          by Roxton ( 73137 )

          See, the biggest problem with "correlation is not causation" is that it's a tool most frequently used by post-conclusion rationalizers -- people who start from a conclusion, and then create a rationale to justify it. Such people only feel compelled to discount evidence that runs contrary to their conclusion, which is much easier than actually justifying one's position in the face of alternatives. "Correlation is not causation" is a very simple formula for discounting overwhelming bodies of evidence.

        • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

          by gnieboer ( 1272482 )

          Yes, while the correlation != causation is a time-honored /. tenet, the researchers here do actually clearly grasp this concept, note all the clear caveats on just the summary.

          To -prove- a causation requires a correlation.
          You can either theorize a causation and later prove correlation (Einstein/Relativity)
          Or find a correlation and later construct a causation that explains it (Gravity, Why girlfriends dump guys after they show off their Battlestar Galatica action figure collection) [often requires additiona

        • by geekoid ( 135745 ) <{moc.oohay} {ta} {dnaltropnidad}> on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @10:35AM (#27418315) Homepage Journal

          really? those children are making decoration decisions about flooring?

          "correlation is not causation"

          I hate that statement. How about:
          "correlation does not necessarily mean causation"

          However, you will have correlation if there is causation.

          All this is covered when they said it is not conclusive. from what I read it seems to me there is enough evidence to warrant another study.

      • pre-emtive vinyl flooring

        That sounds like it could be one of the side effects of Vaxadrine [wikiality.com]

      • by Yvanhoe ( 564877 )

        Good point. We should be looking for a common cause, something that causes BOTH autism AND vinyl flooring.

        Like a specific character in parents ? That both makes them like the easy-to-clean vinyl flooring and autism in their kids ?

        Or possibly that autism causes pre-emtive vinyl flooring

        Heh, don't dismiss that so easily. There could have been a popular book about autist kids raising that would suggest that carpets floor are bad for them, that vinyl is better, and urge parents to provide such an environment. Okay, that is a bit improbable, but don't forget to consider these things, possibilities exist.

      • by hayesk ( 561264 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @09:24AM (#27416361)
        If my wife reads this study, autism is going to cause brand new ceramic tile in my kitchen.
    • Not too long. The summary's title says "hints at", and TFA actually mentions that The scientists were surprised by their finding, calling it "far from conclusive." Because their research was not designed to focus on autism, they recommend further study of larger numbers of children to see whether the link can be confirmed., which is almost repeating the correlation/causation thing.

    • To have any effect, the vinyl plastic must degrade somehow, perhaps because of abrasion or other chemicals. If there is a connection, it could be to any chemical associated with vinyl floors, such as the chemicals in the cement used eventually diffusing through the vinyl.

      The article says, "The researchers found four environmental factors associated with autism: vinyl flooring, the mother's smoking, family economic problems and condensation on windows, which indicates poor ventilation."

      I assume they me
      • "Most people in the U.S. have vinyl floors in the kitchen. I notice that people who have vinyl floors throughout the house do not clean them as often as a kitchen floor is cleaned. "

        Do THAT many houses have vinyl floors these days? Most every house I know of, that is either new, or has been restored/updated...have wood, tile and even carpet on the floors.

        • If you are renovating in an established area you would go for polished floorboards. For a new house out in the suburbs plastic flooring of some description may be the most cost effective way to go.
          • "For a new house out in the suburbs plastic flooring of some description may be the most cost effective way to go."

            I wonder....is this maybe regional?

            I live in the South...and most homes I know of down here, especially new ones, are mostly done with wood and tile as the primary flooring materials, along with carpet. I'm seeing carpet even not being put on that many new places. Just anecdotal observations mind you.

            And I'm talking largely suburban areas, in that there aren't that many 'urban' areas down h

      • by Waffle Iron ( 339739 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @08:00AM (#27414793)

        To have any effect, the vinyl plastic must degrade somehow

        PVC *does* degrade, all by itself. Pure PVC is very brittle (like your PVC drain pipes), so any flexible PVC product has lots of plasticizers mixed in. Some of these are volatile and gradually evaporate out of the plastic at room temperature. It's the plasticizers that are under suspicion here.

        However, I would imagine that most babies and toddlers are exposed to more PVC emmisions from the vynyl mattress covers in their cribs and beds. After all, they spend half of each day with their heads a couple inches away from the mattresses. These things are extremely stinky when new, and over the course of a year or so they seem to lose much of their plasticizers into the air and become brittle (and no longer stinky). Unfortunately, at that point they often shred into ribbons and must be replaced.

        IMO, given the safety questions that have recently come up regarding the phthalate plasticizers used in PVC products, it's probably worth the extra cost of buying polyethelene mattress covers for kids.

        • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

          by PitaBred ( 632671 )
          There's a reason I wrapped my kid's mattress in impermeable plastic. You know, the stuff they seal houses with. Figured it was worth $20 and half an hour to have a bit of peace of mind while he was sleeping... they've also found that wrapping those mattresses in New Zealand has drastically cut the incidence of SIDS.
    • by saiha ( 665337 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @05:00AM (#27413661)

      I find that "correlation is not causation" to be a great way to filter out those with zero (well actually negative because they are actively spreading misinformation) knowledge of statistics.

      • by jamesh ( 87723 )

        I find that "correlation is not causation" to be a great way to filter out those with zero (well actually negative because they are actively spreading misinformation) knowledge of statistics.

        How have you come up with this finding? What was your sample size?

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by $1uck ( 710826 )

        I can't tell what you're saying. Are you actually trying to say "correlation is causation" because that is simply not true. Correlation is not causation, but hell that isn't even what most people say. "Correlation does not imply causation" which is also true, correlation doesn't say anything about the nature of the relationship between two events.

        • by $1uck ( 710826 )
          to clarify correlation coefficient says something about the "strength" of the relationship.
    • Re: (Score:3, Funny)

      by dr_dank ( 472072 )

      They'd better do it soon. Five minutes to Wapner.

    • Oblig. XKCD (Score:2, Insightful)

      by Kryis ( 947024 )
    • The summary didn't say it's the cause. The correlationisnotcausation tag isn't entirely relevant here.

    • by jellomizer ( 103300 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @06:51AM (#27414189)

      Part of the problem is the fact that it is easier to get diagnoses as Autism. In the past minor forms of Autism were ignored or just considered bad behavior, Even Moderate-High Autism the person was just considered Stupid. So the past records are faulty. Espectially before the age of Vinyl flooring.

       

  • OMGPONIES (Score:3, Insightful)

    by MrMista_B ( 891430 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @04:02AM (#27413399)

    April Fools! ... ...

    • by lobiusmoop ( 305328 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @04:11AM (#27413439) Homepage

      Besides the article being dated March 31, 2009, joking about autism isn't exactly a barrel of laughs. Apr 1 seems to have turned into some kind of trial of trust of the media now, which pisses me off.

      • It's good if it makes people question the truth of the media for the other 364 days of the year.

        Obama meets Brown for G20 talks ...pfft, yeah right.

        • Disagree. If you haven't figured out how to question authority by the time you're out of school there's no hope for you, whether there's a day of the year supposedly dedicated to it or not. There's quite enough bullshit on the internet as it is, without degrading the established science sites down to that level on one day of the year.

      • Apr 1 seems to have turned into some kind of trial of trust of the media now, which pisses me off.

        I dunno. I like to think of it as "National Skepticism Day."

      • Re:OMGPONIES (Score:5, Insightful)

        by Spatial ( 1235392 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @07:24AM (#27414443)
        Pro tip: the media isn't much more reliable any other day of the year.
    • Comment removed based on user account deletion
    • probably not (and please tag this !aprilsfools until you are sure)

  • REACH (Score:3, Informative)

    by polar red ( 215081 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @04:07AM (#27413427)

    this is why http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Registration,_Evaluation,_Authorisation_and_Restriction_of_Chemicals [wikipedia.org]REACH is so important. from wikipedia : "There were 100,106 chemicals in use in the EU in 1981, when the last survey was performed. Of these only 3,000 have been tested and over 800 are known to be carcinogenic, mutagenic or toxic to reproduction." So, only 3% of chemicals in use by man have been tested for environmental and health safety.

    • by slashbart ( 316113 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @05:56AM (#27413909) Homepage
      They once analyzed all the constituents of coffee (hundreds) and found that a quarter or so of them are carcinogenic. So we all should be pretty much dead by now.
      So how do you study carcinogenicity: Simple. You feed a couple of rodents that you don't particularly like 5% of their bodyweight of a certain stuff each day, and see how many of them develop cancer within their short lifespans. Now comes the fun part: You extrapolate the 5% bodyweight daily ratio to 1 ppm bodyweight daily ratio, and similary divide the rate of mammal acquiring cancer. Voila, a new PhD promotion based on the completely meritless assumption that there is any kind of linearity involved in these rates.
      I know a lot of current research is not so stupid, but most of the 1970's cancer scares were based pretty much on the scenario I just described.

      Determining whether or not a compound is carcinogenic in humans is extremely hard, except for the really bad ones.

      • Determining whether or not a compound is carcinogenic in humans is extremely hard

        I still find every chemical must be tested thoroughly before bringing it into the environment, our livers and kidneys ar feeling the strain allready.

        • This is quite impossible and not really needed. Also as pointed out, its useless if the tests are meaningless. further is the bias introduced via publishing. Its easy to get "Kryptonite causes cancer" published. But getting "Chemical X totally harmless" is a lot harder sell. Also liability concerns which add further bias preventing any official line claiming something as harmless.

          You could always live in a oxygen tent and only let in fully test "chemicals". But that would make the strictest vegan look li
        • So how would you do that? Test every chemical? The natural world on its own already has millions of different compounds, many of them toxic, some of them scarily toxic (box jelly fish toxin, botulinus toxin).
          We don't have the capability to test everything, we don't have the capability to test even a fraction, we don't have good methods for testing low toxicity compounds, we don't have methods for testing carcinogenicity in humans at all, because we can't experiment
          All we have are epidemiological studies
      • There is still a lot of this sort of study going on. Also corrections for base cancer rate in mice and rats is often not done. We use mice and rats cus that natural rate is pretty high. Finally there are a lot of things that are bad in high doses but harmless or even beneficial in small doses. Some are even needed (aka vitamin A IIRC)
      • by rve ( 4436 )

        EVERYTHING causes cancer in rats. ALL laboratory rats, provided they don't die prematurely of an infection, will develop tumors.

        Pet rats, lab rats, they're funny, fluffy, curious creatures, but boy are they ever susceptible to health problems, especially cancer.

        There has been little selection pressure against susceptibility to cancer in their evolution, because rats are just considered so damn tasty by a huge, varied range of predators. In the wild, they won't last more than a year to 18 months, as by that

    • by rve ( 4436 )

      ...There were 100,106 chemicals in use in the EU in 1981, when the last survey was performed...

      Water is a chemical. So are oxygen, nitrogen, glucose, all proteins. You are a big bag of chemicals yourself.

      Every single one of them can kill you, given a large enough dose. Think about that. Every time you exhale, you emit a noxious cloud H2O, CO2 and various organic compounds mixed in with the left over air. CO2 has been widely implicated in various environmental threats to the survival of life on earth.

      The only way you can avoid being surrounded by chemicals is to retreat to the vacuum of deep space.

  • so is /. just going to be a melangé of all the April Fools jokes from around the web today?

  • The other three factors mentioned are economic, are poor people more likely to have vinyl flooring than, say, wood flooring? Anecdotally it would seem so to me...
    • Not necessarily, because not very long ago vinyl flooring was the "upscale" thing to do.

      But this raises a question: carpets were not mentioned. Carpets are also made of plastic: generally nylon, more rarely polyester, and either may have a polypropylene backing. Carpets are known to outgas organic fumes for an extended time after they are installed. Not to mention the (usually plastic foam) padding underneath. Do those contain phthalates?
  • One of the funnest things on April Fools Day is trying to pick out the one or two legit stories on the Slashdot front page. I'm really not sure whether this is one of them. The website is SCiAM.com though, so maybe it's trying to tell us something.

  • by haeger ( 85819 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @04:58AM (#27413659)

    Not too long ago I learned that phthalates were used as "softeners" in plastic containers. That's not a problem normally but if you put plastic boxes that aren't supposed to be recycled into your dishwasher to use them as a lunch-box then you have a problem since they weren't designed for such high temperatures and the phthalates are released. Same thing if you microwave it.

    Boxes that are "microwave/dishwasher safe" don't have this problem naturally. This is generally printed on the container itself.

    And phthalates aren't good for you. Even if you're an adult.

    • high temperatures and the phthalates are released.

      are phtalates released only at high temperature? or does high temp just increase the rate of release ? the way I understand fysics, even an I-beam releases iron into the air at room-temp, due to backgroundradiation, someone correct me if I'm wrong.

      • I'm pretty sure "backgroundradiation" doesn't have anything to do with it.

      • by Red Flayer ( 890720 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @07:52AM (#27414707) Journal
        High temp increases the rate of release, but it's not a linear relationship.

        Consider DEHC release from PVC... the diffusion coefficients [D × 1010 cm2 min1] at 5 and 40 C are 9.1 and 156.0 according to this paper [sciencedirect.com]. Seeing as microwaves can easily create temps over 100 C, it's pretty trivial to deduce that though some phthalates are released at room temperature, high temperatures could easily cause much higher concentrations of toxins in your food.

        As for vinyl floors, if the area is poorly ventilated, even a slow rate of diffusion could result in toxic contentrations of phthalates.
    • That's not a problem normally but if you put plastic boxes that aren't supposed to be recycled into your dishwasher to use them as a lunch-box then you have a problem since they weren't designed for such high temperatures and the phthalates are released.

      It's not just phthalates that are a problem when microwaving/dishwashing soft plastics. Everyone has heard of the plastic wrap/dioxin issue... and though this is a myth, it pays to be cautious and only use recommended plastics [scn.org] in the microwave.

      Some of the

  • Comment removed based on user account deletion
  • This makes me angry! Seems like I can't go anywhere without being tricked by some stupid trick.

    Ahhh, at least I can view my cat videos on YouTube without any prob....

    qnno no up

  • by Anonymous Coward

    But there are some things you just shouldn't do on April Fool's Day, and one of them is encouraging parents of autistic children desperate to blame something for their children's condition. I mean, come on; this is a group that thinks vaccines can cause autism; they'll swallow this one hook, line, and sinker.

  • Condensation on windows doesn't imply bad ventilation, as the study authors suggest. Condensation happens when windows leak, so that the cold air coming through the leak chills the warmer air inside next to the window, lowering its dewpoint. So condensation on windows implies more air exchange between inside and out, not less. Air exchange of course is ventilation.

    Now, leaky windows with condensation tend to be older windows. Might they be older vinyl windows? Might they be older, wooden, lead painted windo

  • My thoughts (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Kibblet ( 754565 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @07:16AM (#27414387) Homepage
    If it IS vinyl flooring, it isn't from the kid, it's from pregnant mom, I think. Although we didn't have vinyl floors (and because of insurance screw-ups, didn't get my son properly vaccinated well until after he was full blown autistic), I was exposed to a lot of toxins (airborne) during my pregnancy. But the interesting thing is, in retrospect, he had signs of autism almost immediately after birth. Part of autism (which he has to the point where he cannot speak, and most likely will never live independently) can be sensory problems, and his are oral/eating related. He would not breastfeed. He would not take food from a bottle. He could not leave the hospital for two weeks because of this. Even when he got home, formula or breastmilk would pour down his face as much as it would pour into his mouth. I've spoken to other parents who saw signs, small ones, very very early on. Yes, my kid did have a bit of that 'developing ok and then all of a sudden went backwards' stuff, but he was already a bit off, I think. And he still does that today -- over the summer, without school, he lost the ability to communicate completely. It's just that parents seem to notice that first change. So vinyl floors? A bit of a reach. Something happening during pregnancy? A possibility. Toxins? A possibility. But my wood floors didn't 'save' my son.
  • by wiredog ( 43288 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @07:34AM (#27414527) Journal

    The article seems serious. Weird, but serious. All the citations and names check out.

  • by reed ( 19777 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @07:38AM (#27414561) Homepage

    Note that just because correlation is not causation, doesn't mean that correlation is not important...

  • by dcollins ( 135727 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @09:10AM (#27415887) Homepage

    (1) Does the article or summary assert causation at any point? No, they don't. Therefore, "correlationisnotcausation" is an entirely irrelevant response here.

    (2) Is correlation the strongest possible result from research like this? Yes, it is. To demonstrate causation you'd need a designed experiement, with babies raised for years in a controlled environment with vinyl to see how many became autistic; experiments like that are not possible.

    (3) As another poster said, "correlationisnotcausation" has become Slashdot shorthand for "I choose to ignore all of your scientific evidence". Compare to: "Evolution has not been proved, it's only a theory."

  • Condensation? (Score:4, Informative)

    by RalphSlate ( 128202 ) on Wednesday April 01, 2009 @09:27AM (#27416439) Homepage

    Condensation on windows is not a sign of a poorly ventilated house. Condensation forms when humid air comes in contact with a much cooler surface. So, for example, if you have no storm windows on your windows but you are running a humidifier you will get condensation in the winter.

    Vinyl windows will actually reduce condensation because they are like built-in storm windows. The inner pane isn't as cold as a single pane of glass -- yet vinyl windows also reduce airflow, meaning that ventilation is reduced.

    That part of the study just doesn't make sense.

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