Space Lichens 250
moon_monkey writes "According to a report lichens - a composite of algae and fungi - can survive in space for up to two weeks. An experiment carried out by the European Space Agency saw two species of lichen carried into orbit and then exposed to the vacuum of space for nearly 15 days. These are the most complex form of life now known to have survived prolonged exposure to space. The experiment adds weight to the theory of panspermia - that life could somehow be transported between planets."
impressive? (Score:2, Funny)
Re:impressive? (Score:2)
Not intelligent, but hard to eradicate.
panspermia (Score:5, Funny)
Eww. (Score:3, Funny)
Microscopic image of the lichen after the flight (Score:3, Informative)
Electron microscopic image of the lichen [esa.int] after the flight.
Re:panspermia (Score:3, Insightful)
Panspermia Makes Evolution Much Less Likely (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:panspermia (Score:3, Informative)
He must be from the future. Today the microwave background is 2.73K. Wait 2.5 billion years and it'll be 2.3K.
That said, in interstellar space the radiation field is a significantly higher temperature than that. 50-100K or so might be more typical within the galaxy.
Already done with mold (Score:2, Informative)
They didn't describe the details of the flight. Was this a mission to the ISS? If so, I wonder how much risk they took by "opening" the box in the presence of the station? Could they have infected it with lichens, or more likely with "tramp mold"
Re:Already done with mold (Score:5, Informative)
Not in space. (Score:2)
This is much different as the lichen had to survive the vacuum of space, including direct solar radiation and dramatic temperature variations that come with it.
Re:Not in space. (Score:2)
The techniques that we'd normally use to sterilize mold on earth would include flame and chemicals. Fire in a spacecraft is generally a really bad idea. It would have been especially bad considering some of the mold was growing on electrical wire insula
Re:Already done with mold (Score:2)
And no, the mold problem was not why they brought down MIR.
Re:Already done with mold (Score:2)
Hate to break it to you, but MY understanding is that exposure to space is also toxic to astronauts.
Re:Already done with mold (Score:2)
As for treating the mold/mildew/fungus, we have the same problems even on Earth. The chemical vulnerabilities that the mold cell has are similar to those of human cells. Because of this it is difficult to treat any kind of fungus infection in humans without hurting the human as well.
For instance, most anti-fungal treatments are so toxic that they
They needed space to test a vacuum? (Score:2)
Maybe they wanted to test radiation, or is this just a high-profile confirmation of something we already knew?
Re:They needed space to test a vacuum? (Score:5, Insightful)
* Vaccuum. (Of course.)
* Assorted forms of radiation.
* Zero gravity.
* Extremes of temperature.
Those conditions tend not to support life from Earth, and so to see that lichen can indeed survive in space, if only for a short time, is astounding. Not only does this add weight to the panspermia theory, but it also could stand to change our take on the 'qualifications' for a habitable environment completely, raising questions such as, "Could it be possible for more complex organisms to actually thrive in space?"
I for one welcome our moldy overlords.
Re:They needed space to test a vacuum? (Score:2)
Re:They needed space to test a vacuum? (Score:2)
Thank you! This is the question people seem to be skirting. Life as "we know it" is really just "as we know it." Certain people assume that water is essential for life. That life is carbon based. These are only linchpins of life on EARTH.
So the "panspermia" theory is nic
Re:They needed space to test a vacuum? (Score:5, Interesting)
Theories about the possible environments wherein living things could exist are endless. Looking at the extremophilic algae and tube worms - That was the name you were looking for, I believe - here on Earth, we could see similar creatures living in the hot, highly acidic, CO2 rich environments of Venus. Lichens and other organisms tailored to exist only on the essentials, on the other hand, could thrive - and may actually exist - on Mars. (And if Mars was once like Earth, that theory certainly takes off, doesn't it?) Of course, those schools of thought only support organisms akin to the ones that exist here on Earth.
Meanwhile, the moons of Jupiter and Saturn provide a plethora of environments known to support life on Earth in some cases, but there are also theories that organisms could exist in the extreme cold of some of these celestial bodies by catalyzing acetylene and other volatile substances at extremely slow rates. If that theory were to pan out, then the idea of 'ice creatures from outer space' might not be too far off - and possibly a springboard for dozens of cheesy new sci-fi movies. (It'd certainly beat Spielburg's take on 'War of the Worlds'.)
While we're discussing theoretical models for living things unlike those that exist here on Earth, let's take a look at what we're made of - that all-important element carbon, I'm no chemistry expert, but doesn't boron nitride behave in a remarkably similar fashion to carbon? What about the possibility of a boron-based group of organisms? Or maybe plants and animals composed of different substances entirely? When one begins to consider the possibilities, it becomes immediately evident that they are indeed virtually endless.
The void of space may indeed host living things. Other worlds thought to be uninhabitable may also support life as well. I agree that it'd be pretty silly to disregard that possibility until we can conclusively prove that life simply can't thrive in these environments. Heck, maybe there's some kind of lichen out in some nebula somewhere, feeding off of plasma... Who knows.
Conditions they forgot (Score:3, Funny)
- Boredom. Lichens are fairly uncontemplative creatures, however.
Re:Conditions they forgot (Score:3, Funny)
> - Boredom. Lichens are fairly uncontemplative creatures, however.
Bored lichens. On fire.
Dude, the Star Wars Galaxies thread is this way [slashdot.org], bud!
Re:They needed space to test a vacuum? (Score:2)
At the most, I think we can achieve seven or eight minutes of simulated weightlessness. The experiment called for an extended period of exposure time to a constant weightless state, while simulatenously being bombarded with cosmic radiation, a vacuum, and countless insults. ("You worthless mold! Lazy fungus!")
So this means Little Green Men DO exist! (Score:2)
Panspermia (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Panspermia (Score:2, Funny)
Tosty mold, coming right up!
Adds weight? (Score:3, Interesting)
But not much, 2 weeks doesn't even get you to Mars... I thought most of the theories of life coming from other planets were based around elements being embedded inside rocks etc rather than being directly exposed to space.
But it is nice to see Europe continuing to treat Space as a learning experience rather than a PR stunt.
Re:Adds weight? (Score:2)
-matthew
Obligatory (Score:4, Funny)
an organic spaceship patch kit? (Score:5, Interesting)
"Lichens have a tough mineral coating that could shield them from UV rays. They are also made from individual organisms layered on top of one another, so outer layers may provide protection for underlying cells. The organisms have already been shown to be capable of withstand high levels of UV radiation on Earth."
This is interesting, I wonder how well they the outer layers could protect things below? Would it be possible to use some lichen in a pinch to make a repair to part of a ship? Could this be the poor mans self-replicating nano robot patch kit?
I have no idea about these things, just an interesting prospect, I think.
At least two weeks, not up to. (Score:4, Insightful)
No, "At *least* two weeks". They were exposed for 15 days and were unchanged.
Lichen and spores are sure durable; I wouldn't be surprised if they could survive basically indefinitely in a cold vacuum.
If it can survive 2 weeks in the vacuum of space.. (Score:2, Insightful)
Feasibility of Panspermia (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Feasibility of Panspermia (Score:4, Insightful)
What I've never understood about that theory, though, is how the life forms got off their home planet and onto an interstellar-bound rock.
Re:Feasibility of Panspermia (Score:3, Interesting)
Asteroid strikes. They can 'splash' up a lot of material, which can easily reach escape velocity.
Re:Feasibility of Panspermia (Score:3, Informative)
Via ejecta, large pieces of debris that are thrown off the planet from meteor strikes. That's the significance of the Mars rocks found in the Antarctic tundra [theregister.co.uk].
If you've got life floating around in your atmosphere, it might not even require ejecta but instead just near collisions with porous asteroids passing through the upper atmosphere.
Re:Feasibility of Panspermia (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Feasibility of Panspermia (Score:2)
Essentially, it seems like being spun around blindf
Re:Feasibility of Panspermia (Score:2)
Re:Feasibility of Panspermia (Score:2)
Solution: A gun with nearly unlimited ammo. (Score:4, Insightful)
Alien weapon systems (Score:3, Insightful)
Also, we can't forget that it could have been on pieces of the ringworld from Halo.
Re:Feasibility of Panspermia (Score:2)
Reminds me of an old joke (Score:5, Funny)
Answer: Almost indefinitely <evil grin>
Obligatory NetHack (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Obligatory NetHack (Score:2)
Re:Obligatory NetHack (Score:2)
Etymology of "panspermia" ... aren't YOU curious? (Score:3, Informative)
the etymology of panspermia [answers.com]:
Greek panspermia;, mixture of all seeds : pan-, pan- + sperma, seed
Re:Etymology of "panspermia" ... aren't YOU curiou (Score:3, Informative)
Terraforming (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2, Funny)
Re: (Score:2, Funny)
That's Not What the Article Said (Score:5, Informative)
What I get from this is that lichens can survive for an undetermined amount of time in space. Assuming they can survive reentry, a rock from Earth could potentially deliver lichens to Mars or elsewhere.
Re:That's Not What the Article Said (Score:2)
Re:That's Not What the Article Said (Score:4, Funny)
Panspermia (Score:2)
Re:Panspermia (Score:2)
composite!!?? COMPOSITE??!!!!!! (Score:2, Insightful)
I had this friend (Score:2)
"Panspermia" (Score:3, Funny)
Oh wait...
This immediately reminded me of... (Score:2)
Surviving in space (Score:2, Funny)
Latest Issue of Scientific American (Score:2, Informative)
http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?chanID=sa006&col
I liken this lichen is alien (Score:5, Informative)
From: http://www.lichen.com/biology.html [lichen.com]
They tend to thrive in unfavorable conditions, maybe there could be Lichen on Mars if it had a more stable atmosphere? They could also survive on a rusty hull of a space ship, so the panspermia theory is not too far off.
British Soldier Lichen is also very beautiful:
http://www.buenavistatownship.org/Photos/British%
Re:I liken this lichen is alien (Score:2)
Why would there be rust on the hull of a space ship?
Re:I liken this lichen is alien (Score:2)
Shoving will protect you (Score:5, Funny)
Hmmmf... (Score:3, Funny)
Wow (Score:2)
As a firm ID believer... (Score:2, Funny)
Of COURSE panspermia is possible. Life can easily travel in space.
While panspermia is possible... (Score:2)
(even though physical theor
Re:While panspermia is possible... (Score:2)
-matthew
Re:While panspermia is possible... (Score:2)
It was argued previously on here that people could have come separately. I was just trying to clear things up before someone tried to make that argument again.
Re:While panspermia is possible... (Score:2)
No, it's now not too improbable. Just less probable than life originating here. But both theories fit with all currently known observations.
Re:While panspermia is possible... (Score:2)
Re:While panspermia is possible... (Score:2)
Replace "find" with "fine" for great justice.
Re:While panspermia is possible... (Score:2)
Re:While panspermia is possible... (Score:2)
Re:While panspermia is possible... (Score:2)
Re:While panspermia is possible... (Score:2)
Re:While panspermia is possible... (Score:3, Funny)
What if the Aliens did the 'nasty' with the monkies?
The thing is hollow... (Score:4, Funny)
Any Lovecraft fan could have told you that. (Score:2)
"The things come from another planet, being able to live in interstellar space and fly through it on clumsy, powerful wings which have a way of resisting the aether but which are too poor at steering to be of much use in helping them about on earth. I will tell you about this later if you do not dismiss me at once as a madman. They come here to get metals from mines that go deep under the hills, and I think I know where they come from. They will not h
Hmmm.... Space herpes! (Score:3, Funny)
Lightweight idea (Score:2)
The experiment adds weight to the theory of panspermia - that life could somehow be transported between planets.
Given that the panspermia theory has the weight of a neutrino, that isn't very much. Organisms in small asteroids would be incinerated in earth's atmosphere. Bugs ridding larger ones would have to survive awesome shock forces and intense kinetic heating. Earth is such an ideal organic molecular playground it doesn't seem necessary to invoke some outside agent, like Mars. I think Occam's Razor
Re:Lightweight idea (Score:5, Informative)
No, you're wrong.
"As it falls through 80 km, it loses 3 to 6 mm of surface mass per second through ablation. The melted material and metal, heated to over 1800 C, is being swept away from the meteoroid, carrying away the accumulating surface heat so efficiently that the interior remains cool."
That was from meteorlab.com. Look it up so that next time you won't be spreading incorrect information.
No, sorry... (Score:3, Interesting)
I'll believe that as soon as they finish the experiments that show lichen's ability to survive entry into the atmosphere.
Beyond The Mind's Eye (Score:2)
What's the big deal (Score:4, Funny)
Blistering Barnacles... (Score:3, Funny)
Will space barnacles and space weed slow a space ship down? Maybe if it gets stuck in the subspace propeller, or fouls the plasma intake manifold...
Two weeks is nothing (Score:5, Insightful)
http://science.nasa.gov/newhome/headlines/ast01se
panspermia, evolution (Score:4, Interesting)
Photos from Mars show patches of greenish-brown and blue-green on rocks, cliffs and in low-lying (higher pressure) regions. The Deep Impact mission showed almost 1/3rd the mass of the comet as carbonaceous material, the researchers claim it is prebiotic. Photos from both Viking I (Gil Levin photo) and both MER rovers show "fuzzy" greenish rocks and fine filamented structures. If lichen survive in open space, they would be that much more at home in a fluffy growing medium that contains lots of water, and with a few archaea in the mix would produce exactly the compounds found in comet Tempel 1.
I've always agreed with the tenets of panspermia, the last few months of space science has convinced me. There is life out there, and a lot of it.
Josh
Fun note: the craft that flew the BIOPAN experiment is a Foton capsule, a direct decendant of the capsule Yuri Gagarin flew in. It is a round metal ball with a donut of equipment on the back and some antennae, same layout with somewhat newer gear.
This proves Intelligent Design (Score:3, Funny)
Only an intelligent designer could have calculated the trajectories and orbits necessary to spread life between planets. Especially given the limited computers available at the time of creation.
Intelligent Design (Score:3)
I'm so confused!
Re:15 days? (Score:2)
not a week.
Re:15 days? (Score:2)
Re:15 days? (Score:2)
Re:What next? (Score:2)
The similarities between lichen and scum are only superficial. Still, I'm in favour of the experiment. As a control subject, let's also send up Cheney.
You want to see if... (Score:3, Informative)
Now that we know lichens can survive exposed to the harsh conditions of space, how about we try it with Karl Rove?
You want to see if the lichens can survive exposed to the harsh conditions of Karl Rove? That's just mean... to the lichens.
PS Eeewwww.
Re:Evolution (Score:2)
No kidding. Some people just can't accept God was actually a Reeses Monkey, and the Soddom and Gammorah were really destroyed by a massive rain of terds.