Airspeed Velocity Of An Unladen Swallow 321
An anonymous reader writes "Finally, the question is answered: What is the airspeed velocity of an unladen swallow? A designer with too much time on his hands uses his new method for graphically representing Strouhal numbers to clarify a truly pressing question for all armchair zoologists (and a few Monty Python fans)."
Don't give the numbers... (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Don't give the numbers... (Score:2)
Re:Don't give the numbers... (Score:2)
Reverence for the Pythons!
Puts me in mind of, "His sandle," "No, his gourd!"
I have, many times, read the pedants on /. lecture about the correct application of the term "irony".
I beleive we now have a most stirling example!
To all of this, I say, "NNNNNNEEeeeeee!"
Re:Don't give the numbers... (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Don't give the numbers... (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Don't give the numbers... (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Don't give the numbers... (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Don't give the numbers... (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Don't give the numbers... (Score:5, Funny)
That's not the point. If seek out the most forgotten cave and you install there a switch with the inscription "Doomsday switch - Press here to destroy earth", it's only a matter of time till someone comes by and presses it.
Humans are curious like young cats. And the /.'ers
are the worst of all ;-).
Regards, Martin
A matter of time? (Score:2)
Re:A matter of time? (Score:3, Funny)
Probably you would be run over and beaten afterwards by people who would complain, that the switch doesn't work. If the switch worked, they would complain too (about lax security measures) if they still could.
Bye, Martin
Re:Don't give the numbers... (Score:2)
Had to be said... (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Had to be said... (Score:5, Funny)
WoW ! (Score:5, Funny)
54 years? That's amazing, i think I could copy that research with a shotgun, a measuring tool and a free sunday afternoon.
Entirely too ambiguous! (Score:4, Funny)
RTFA. European. :-) (Score:2)
Re:Entirely too ambiguous! (Score:2)
Re:Entirely too ambiguous! (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Entirely too ambiguous! (Score:2)
Re:It's not a question of where he grips it. (Score:2)
Well, it doesn't matter. Will you go and tell your master that Arthur from the Court of Camelot is here?
Re:It's not a question of where he grips it. (Score:2, Informative)
Will, will not.
Would, would not.
Do, do not.
May, may not.
Must, must not.
Can, can not.
Sure, 'cannot' is a (more) acceptable alternative spelling for that particular case, but not the only acceptable one.
see:
http://www.bartleby.com/68/4/1104.html
http://www.wsu.edu:8080/~brians/errors/cannot.htm
Ignobel awards (Score:5, Interesting)
Simon
Finally.. (Score:5, Funny)
Yes, finally someone had the balls to answer this question that has been wracking the minds of scientists for ages!
Someone get this man a nobel.
Re:Finally.. (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Finally.. (Score:2, Funny)
And now for something completely different (Score:5, Funny)
Re:And now for something completely different (Score:3, Funny)
Re:And now for something completely different (Score:2)
Oops, that was the wrong Dead * Sketch.
Already nominated him for an IgNobel (Score:2)
It's the European swallow (Score:5, Informative)
Re:It's the European swallow (Score:2, Funny)
Re:It's the European swallow (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:It's the European swallow (Score:5, Funny)
Re:It's the European swallow (Score:5, Funny)
Re:It's the European swallow (Score:2)
Re:It's the European swallow (Score:3, Informative)
Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government! Supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some farcical aquatic ceremony! You can't expect to wield supreme executive power just because some watery tart threw a sword at you! If I went around sayin' I was Emperor just because some moistened bint lobbed a scimitar at me, they'd put me away!"
Help, help, I'm being repressed!!! Come see the violence inherent in
Re:It's the European swallow (Score:2)
"You can't expect to weild supreme executive power just because some watery tart threw a sword at you!"
Re:It's the European swallow (Score:4, Funny)
He 'ent got shit ellover'im.
for some reason it doesn't sit well with me (Score:2, Funny)
No problem! (Score:5, Funny)
Re:for some reason it doesn't sit well with me (Score:3, Funny)
What does it mean? (Score:4, Informative)
The relevant pieces in the script :
A swallow carrying a coconut? [mwscomp.com] and The Bridge of Death [mwscomp.com]
Thank you, captain obvious! (Score:2, Funny)
Re:What does it mean? (Score:2)
BRIDGEKEEPER:
What... is the air-speed velocity of an unladen swallow?
ARTHUR:
What do you mean? An African or European swallow?
BRIDGEKEEPER:
Huh? I-- I don't know that. Auuuuuuuugh!
Re:What does it mean? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:What does it mean? (Score:2)
I couldn't give a damn how many pets you have named Eric.
How to lie with charts. (Score:4, Informative)
For this and other presentation crocks, read How to Lie with Charts [amazon.com], and its fore-runners, How to Lie with Statistics [amazon.com] and How to Lie with Maps [amazon.com].
Re:How to lie with charts. (Score:3, Funny)
But how big does our graph "need to be"? (Score:2)
Looks like the zebra finch data set was small, pushing the top of the y axis to three times the top Strouhal number for anything on it. I'd call this clumsy more than misleading, but you're right -- it does conveniently push everything down to the bottom, doesn't it? The whole "narrowness of the band" line of argument fits that a little too well...
A classic case
Re:Speaking of charts.... (Score:2)
I need to make graphs all the time, i would love to see what they used. Definitly not excel, GP3, matlab. Some how i want to think some special graphics tool was u
Okay, that's 2 questiones answered (Score:5, Funny)
It's right at the bottom of the page (Score:5, Funny)
Blue
Re:It's right at the bottom of the page (Score:5, Funny)
You know, the best thing about this article is that it's uncontaminated by cheese.
Re:It's right at the bottom of the page (Score:2)
Which cheese? [ironworks.com]
Re:It's right at the bottom of the page (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Okay, that's 2 questiones answered (Score:3, Funny)
The Far Side version (Score:2)
the air speed of an unladen swallow? 42 ft/sec! (Score:3, Funny)
Somehow it does not surprise me that Douglas Adams and the Monty Python crew are the secret masters of the universe.
If there was ever a day to RTFA.... (Score:4, Informative)
Re:If there was ever a day to RTFA.... (Score:2)
I assume the article was mostly just in good humor, but it still left me scratching my head in confusion.
Re:If there was ever a day to RTFA.... (Score:2)
Or a giant wooden rabbit...
Inside Knowledge... (Score:5, Funny)
"Actually, that's not correct."
If there were any chicks at these MP parties, I am sure it would go over well.
Those responsible ... (Score:5, Funny)
The site has now been mirrored by karma whores on numerous different hosts at great expense and at the last minute.
Bird size (Score:2)
I looked at the Strouhal numbers link, and what
immediately struck me is that there is no correction for bird size.
The wingspan (amplitude) is in the equation, but not for this (it is used as a factor to determine the thrust)
I'd expect the friction factor and a measure for the size of the bird (e.g. surface that is seen from the front) in there.
Air Speed Velocity Of An Unladen Spit? (Score:2)
I'll give it a try (Score:5, Funny)
*trumpets*
"Charts!"
"Charts!"
"It
"Shhh!"
Speed, not Velocity (Score:3)
Capital of Assyria (Score:2, Interesting)
The bonus question was, what's the capital of Assyria? One of the answers was Nineveh, which in the Bible is where God sent Jonah to warn the city's inhabitants of their impending destruction unless they repented of their evil ways. Jonah, who hated the Assyrians and didn't want Nineveh to have a chance to escape destruction, fled to Spain instead (about as far away as he could get), hoping God wouldn't be able to find him there. That obviously
Re:Capital of Assyria (Score:2)
Re:Capital of Assyria (Score:3, Informative)
http://www.grmi.org/renewal/Richard_Riss/evidence s
One of the interesting facts is that there are several documented cases of people swallowed alive by whales who lived to tell the story; and yes, there are historical documents according to the article that support this story, one of which is cited as being from the Babylonian historian Berosus.
The other bonus question and answer (Score:5, Funny)
Just consider the facts:
B: What causes earthquakes?
A: Sudden slippage along a fault line
B: Ah, but WHY does that cause earthquakes?
A: Because it's a lot of ground moving?
B: No, try again.
A: Because it doesn't slip smoothly?
B: Yes, that's right. So...logically...
A: We could prevent it if we got it to slip smoothly?
B: And what do you slip on all of the time?
A: Sheep urine?
B: Absolutely. And where do you find sheep urine?
A: Sheep bladders.
B: Therefore...
A: If we stick sheep bladders into a fault line, it'll prevent earthquakes!
A: Thank you, Bedevere. Good insight.
B: My pleasure, Oh King.
For the Monty Python Ignorant.... (Score:5, Funny)
ARTHUR: We found them.
GUARD #1: Found them? In Mercea? The coconut's tropical!
ARTHUR: What do you mean?
GUARD #1: Well, this is a temperate zone.
ARTHUR: The swallow may fly south with the sun or the house martin or the plumber may seek warmer climes in winter yet these are not strangers to our land.
GUARD #1: Are you suggesting coconuts are migratory?
ARTHUR: Not at all, they could be carried.
GUARD #1: What -- a swallow carrying a coconut?
ARTHUR: It could grip it by the husk!
GUARD #1: It's not a question of where he grips it! It's a simple question of weight ratios! A five ounce bird could not carry a 1 pound coconut.
ARTHUR: Well, it doesn't matter. Will you go and tell your master that Arthur from the Court of Camelot is here.
GUARD #1: Listen, in order to maintain air-speed velocity, a swallow needs to beat its wings 43 times every second, right?
ARTHUR: Please!
GUARD #1: Am I right?
ARTHUR: I'm not interested!
GUARD #2: It could be carried by an African swallow!
GUARD #1: Oh, yeah, an African swallow maybe, but not a European swallow, that's my point.
GUARD #2: Oh, yeah, I agree with that...
ARTHUR: Will you ask your master if he wants to join my court at Camelot?!
GUARD #1: But then of course African swallows are not migratory.
GUARD #2: Oh, yeah...
GUARD #1: So they couldn't bring a coconut back anyway...
GUARD #2: Wait a minute -- supposing two swallows carried it together?
GUARD #1: No, they'd have to have it on a line.
GUARD #2: Well, simple! They'd just use a standard creeper!
GUARD #1: What, held under the dorsal guiding feathers?
GUARD #2: Well, why not?
RFC 1149 (Score:2)
Of others news, (Score:2)
An awful lot of effort... (Score:2, Informative)
A) you can divide the distance traveled by the swallow by the time it took to travel that distance, or
B) you can use a radar gun to measure speed directly
(Especially when, if you read the article, there is mention that "wind tunnel tests" of swallows showed that their estimates were off (espeically on beat frequency). And they actually used speed measurements to validate their model. Hrm. Seems like an awful lot of work to me...)
My apologies. I'm a bit cynical
What?! Informative?! (Score:3, Funny)
NI!!!!
(damn you people, you're killing the moment!!!)
Air-speed velocity? (Score:2, Interesting)
Then again, I'm the kind who yells at the Scarecrow in the Wizard of Oz whenever he tells us [geocities.com]
"The sum of the square roots of any two sides of an isosceles triangle is equal to the square root of the remaining side."
JoAnn
Re:Air-speed velocity? (Score:2, Interesting)
velocity a vector).
Edward Tufte Award (Score:2)
Though, no, such an award does not yet exist.
Beautiful Plumage! (Score:2)
Funny premise, so I stuck with it, built off of physics 101 ideas of waves (amplitude, freq.), and GOOD LORD! I learned something!
MathML? Could it be? (Score:2)
Lemon Curry? (Score:2, Offtopic)
Just explain this... (Score:3, Funny)
Re:African or European? (Score:2)
Someone *did* say it -- the author of the article. It's the very first thing in the article actually. You read it, right?
Re:African or European? (Score:2)
Spit or swallow?
Re:African or European? (Score:2, Informative)
Verdict is still out on African(but is probably about the same). The eternal question still stands.
Other significant numbers (Score:2)
Although with a Beowulf cluster of Big Macs [slashdot.org], I'd like to take a shot at finding the question....
Re:easy money for scientists? (Score:5, Insightful)
In reality they have to bid and win for the money to do such things, against stiff competition. Just think of the talent, skill and dedication that went into convincing a biscuit manufacturer to fund such research. Can you imagine standing up in front of a review board and pitching that? The man's a genius.
I'm guessing that this swallow work was a personal project, but this also was a work of genius. After all, most of their research will go into a dry and dusty journal. Nobody will read it, nobody will notice. However this will be quoted for as long as some smartarse quotes Monty Python. The publicity and the (indirect) fame is well worth the small effort involved.
Getting your name known, and getting contacts and work as a result, is as much a part of science today as actually discovering new knowledge. This is just marketing, but without the dodgy haircuts and inflated salaries.
Mod parent up (Score:2, Informative)
In other words, in airscrew terms, the effective pitch of the blade* rpm is a very linear function of speed.
Everyone who did physics at school will know that the optimum speed for a momentum transfer device (eg a waterwheel) is a very simple ratio of the stream velocity.
Damn, I thought it was a pretty neat article, now you tell me it is a (very pretty) statement of the bleeding obvious.
Mod parent down (Score:5, Insightful)
But even if the discovery made wasn't surprising to you, it was interesting enough to make it into Nature. And the author of the style.org article on Strouhal numbers was clearly concerned not so much with the discovery as with the graphical representation of the information discovered. He is, after all, a designer.
In other words, you may benefit from spending a little more time trying to figure out what people are doing, and a little less time trying to show everyone how far ahead of them you are.
Re:Concise interpretation (Score:2)
But can we explain the variations? (Score:3, Interesting)
It would be interesting to understand not why Strouhal Numbers are constant, but why they vary. I would assum
Re:Follow on question (Score:2)
It's obviously a coconut.
Re:New Low (Score:2)
Re:I think... (Score:2)
Re:Obligatory.. (Score:2)
Re:Reality check: 14 beats per SECOND? (Score:2)
Anyone who actually watches swallows would realize that they don't beat their wings fast on average - they flap a few times then glide a lot. And even when they flap like crazy it isn't that fast either.
The article was a big waste of time in terms of answering or even dealing with the question.
I wonder if he spent more time on the graph and pictures than on actually figuring out things.
Re:Haven't seen this yet... so here goes (Score:2)
Re:Haven't seen this yet... so here goes (Score:2, Funny)