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Patents Science

Cancer Mouse Not Patentable in Canada 420

Proaxiom writes "The Globe and Mail is reporting the Supreme Court of Canada ruled today that OncoMouse, the so-called 'Harvard Mouse' that is especially prone to cancer, cannot be patented under Canadian law. The hapless rodent still enjoys patent protection in the U.S., Japan and much of Europe. So there is at least one place where higher life forms cannot be patented, but I am not familiar enough with the intricacies of international intellectual property treaties to figure out the consequences of the discrepancy. I'm sure countless IANAL's will be willing to offer opinions."
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Cancer Mouse Not Patentable in Canada

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  • Does this mean that smuggling OncoMice across the border to Canadian medical researchers will become the new Hot Item on the black market?
    • by WetCat ( 558132 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @01:53PM (#4819999)
      Hmm... it seems to me they can smuggle itself! Just put a large box with the mice on one side of a bordes, a large piece of cheese on another, and open the box.
      Mice will go to another border and IANAL, but its seems to me that it's perfectly legal - they will just migrate!
    • by fobbman ( 131816 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @01:57PM (#4820055) Homepage
      What's Richard Gere been doing lately?

    • No, actually it means the opposite, unless someone sues someone else... like always.

      If the mice are not patentable in Canada, then anyone can genetically produce them, or however they feel like it. This would lead to lower costs of cancer prone mice... so Canada could have many exported to the U.S.... If they don't die of cancer first.
      • Re:Mouse Smuggling (Score:3, Informative)

        by Anonymous Coward
        can't export them to the U.S.

        As they violate a U.S. patent.

        So, companies can do research with them cheaper in Canada and the results CAN be used in the U.S.

        But the mice cannot be exported to ny country where the patent stands.
        • I would be interested to know: if these mice have been produced, then the likelihood is that they have either been genetically modified, or more likely (and arguablly, also geneticaly modified) selectively bred to produce a sort of "anti-Darwin" mouse. The gene sequence, whether it is a cancer-causing DNA sequence or a lack of cancer-protecting DNA, has been patented.

          If someone in the US breeds mice, and by accident a strain happens to have similar or identical DNA sequences which give it the big C then is this a violation of patent? And what if the genes have never been sequenced, it's just known that they get cancer and are sold for research? If retrospectively we find out that they violate patents, it would see a bit stupid that the mice breeding (under only some human control and with the inbuilt unpredictability of fertilisation and DNA replication) could be illegal.

          Patenting nature just seems very wrong to me. Just because I decode some of nature's best work shouldn't mean that I own it.

    • by Anne_Nonymous ( 313852 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @02:00PM (#4820090) Homepage Journal
      Researchers in the US are also smuggling in tax-free cigarettes for the mice to smoke during the studies.
    • Does this mean that smuggling OncoMice across the border to Canadian medical researchers will become the new Hot Item on the black market?

      A bigger question- can I patent the process of smuggling OncoMice across the border?

    • The QOTD that loaded for me at the bottom of this article was:

      I feel better about world problems now!

      My karma for QOTD must be well in focus today, because I loaded up the Will Shatner interview and then Wil Wheaton's profile [slashdot.org] and on both of them, I got:

      He's dead, Jim.

  • Any relation to Danger Mouse?
  • by FortKnox ( 169099 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @01:49PM (#4819958) Homepage Journal
    the so-called 'Harvard Mouse' that is especially prone to cancer...So there is at least one place where higher life forms cannot be patented

    Prone to Cancer = higher life form? You're views are ass backward, friend.
  • Cool (Score:4, Interesting)

    by MacAndrew ( 463832 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @01:49PM (#4819962) Homepage
    You can wander through the legalisms, but basically I've been uncomfortable with the overlap between the doman of patent law and, well, God (and/or whatever evolutionary variant one subscribes to -- I'm on the science side of the fence, but "God" is a heck of a lot more poetic).

    I wonder if this could cause U.S.-Canadian tensions? The IP people in the states are riding high these days.
    • and, well, God (and/or whatever evolutionary variant one subscribes to -- I'm on the science side of the fence, but "God" is a heck of a lot more poetic)

      But this is what a "God" is: a simplified explanation of things we don't understand -- the lazy man's way of saying "I don't know".
      • a simplified explanation of things we don't understand -- the lazy man's way of saying "I don't know"
        I thought that was what science was. Engineering, by the way, is "I don't know, but I bet I can use it anyway."
        • a simplified explanation of things we don't understand -- the lazy man's way of saying "I don't know"

          I thought it was politics? Hmm, maybe this is a common tactic.
      • Re:Cool (Score:2, Insightful)

        by FosterSJC ( 466265 )
        I know this is slashdot and we're all a bunch of godless heathens, etc, but come on.

        This is just disrespectful and ignorant. First, God doesn't own intellectual property. There are certainly ethical problems with the IP of any living being, but it is not because God had the idea first. Second, God is NOT the lazy man's anything. He is not the explanation of things we don't understand. Admittedly, it is impossible to wholly (homophonic pun) know or understand God, but he is made known to many through providence. Faith is not laziness, and God and Science are not mutually exclusive.

        Sorry for the diatribe, but it is only hapless clarification.
    • Re:Cool (Score:4, Funny)

      by Telastyn ( 206146 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @03:25PM (#4820872)
      US-Canadian tensions? The US has a vast nuclear arsenal. Canada has a vast number of Quebecoi. Advantage: Canada
    • Re:Cool (Score:4, Interesting)

      by thirty-seven ( 568076 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @04:49PM (#4821549)
      I wonder if this could cause U.S.-Canadian tensions?

      I think you meant to say more tensions.

      The US puts tarrifs on Canada's softwood lumber and talks about doing the same to its wheat. Sure they signed free trade agreements with Canada, but that doesn't mean they can't violate them whenever its convenient for them. And what can Canada do about this? Nothing, really. Especially since Bush is far more concerned about Mexico than he is with the USA's biggest trading partner, Canada.

      Immediately after 9/11 Canadian firefighters, resue workers, ambulance crews, etc went to Manhatten to help. And Canada sent troops to help in Afghanistan, four of whom were killed because of the criminal negligence of two US pilots (according to the findings of both Canadian and US inquiries). Was any of this reported in the US? Not really, except for an American governor's fund raisers to help out the poor scape-goated American pilots. I wouldn't be complaining about this lack of recognition in the US for this good, neighbourly help provided by Canada, expect for the way that American officials and their media are more than willing to pounce on the smallest (or even non-existant) negative things. For example, after 9/11 a lot was made by top US officials about how lax Canadian security was and how this allowed the terrorists to enter the US via Canada, in spite of the fact that there was no evidence that any of the terrorists in fact entered from Canada. I fear to think what the reaction would be if some terrorists do enter the US via Canada and do complete a horrible attack - the Americans will have their proof of Canada's irresponsibly lax security, even though terrorists are clearly just as able to enter the US directly.

      Also, consider the recent case of a non-elected Canadian government person, just a PR person for the Prime Minister, who in a private conversation with a reporter called President Bush "a moron". This comment got published, and within a few days CNN was talking about it with the caption "Canada: A threat?" on the screen while making much of the remark of a "senior official in the Canadian government".

      I guess my point in all this is that, yes, if the US government doesn't like this patent decision to a sufficent degree, than you can expect to hear a lot in the US media about Canada's 'policy of flagrently disregarding US patent law'. Most likely you just won't hear anything about this in the US media, since most people won't care about this patent law/biology type of news.

  • by binaryDigit ( 557647 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @01:50PM (#4819971)
    So there is at least one place where higher life forms cannot be patented

    Mainly because there are no higher forms of life there.

    Sorry, had to say it, but I actually love Canada.
  • by Slashdolt ( 166321 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @01:50PM (#4819973)
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that this is the same country in which the farmer was sued for using seeds from last year's canola crop, rather than buying them (again) from Monsanto.
    • Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that this is the same country in which the farmer was sued for using seeds from last year's canola crop, rather than buying them (again) from Monsanto.

      These are two entirely different things... Harvard doesn't have near as much money as Monsanto!
      • Actually harvard probably has a significant amount more money than monsanto does. Harvard's endowment is around $18 billion- I don't know how much cash monsanto has on hand but I know it's not anywhere close to that.
    • by jaeson ( 563206 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @02:12PM (#4820229) Homepage
      Actually he didn't buy anything from Monsanto. His argument was that his rapeseed(canola) crop was cross pollinated by Genetically Modified variants in neighboring fields. Monsanto argued that since they owned the copyright on the GM rapeseed, that the farmer was in violation of their copyright. Amazingly enough Monsanto won the case.

      Monsanto is being counter-sued for contaminating his crop. If there is any justice, they will have to cough up some big $$$ for it.

      I too thought the Canadian justice system wouldn't be as bad as our own, but it goes to show you how fscked up any government can be when idiots are making the decisions (Go USA!!!)
      • by mindstrm ( 20013 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @02:25PM (#4820351)
        It was a patent issue.

        And it's not that far fetched that they won; it wasn't an "accident". The guy KNEW it was monsanto's seed. It wasn't forced on him. He knew they had a patent on it as well. He took the gamble.

        What you have to realize is that the legal system is not as convoluted in Canada. Though this time, the guy might have been found to be doing something wrong, under slightly different circumstances, monsanto would lose (say, if the guy really had no idea it had happened).

        You can't just compare one ruling and declare the Canadian justice system to be as screwed up as the US. Remember, we have 10x less population, over a larger area, and a system that is *FAR* more flexible and less complex than the US system. Not everything is Black & White in the Canadian legal system, nor do we pretend it is.

        • Yes, he "purposefully" planted what he knew to be seeds accidentally bread with monsanto genes. The reason he did it is that he could not afford not to plant a crop. Farmers may gross hundreds of thousands of dollars, but they don't net anymore then you or me. Most can't afford to go a year without a mainstay crop like canola. The point was that this farmer couldn't go out of his way to protect monsanto's patent. He needed a crop. Period.
          • Yes, he "purposefully" planted what he knew to be seeds accidentally bread with monsanto genes.

            The arguement is that they weren't accidentally bred, and he used the particular characteristics of the genetic modification to his benefits (special pesticides).

            I think his defense would have been much stronger if he grew the canola as normal canola, and didn't take advantage of the GM properties.
        • by DunbarTheInept ( 764 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @03:34PM (#4820936) Homepage

          The guy KNEW it was monsanto's seed. It wasn't forced on him.

          Yes it was. Whether he was aware of the way in which his plants had been changed is irrelevant. He didn't ASK to have them changed. It happened through the actions of other forces not under his control (his neighbors, the wind, and Monsanto. The plants in question were HIS OWN. Monsanto ended up vandalizing his crop, so to speak.

          If I steal a can of spray paint and use it to spray grafitti on your house, you shouldn't be obligated to pay the store for the paint should you choose to keep the grafitti in place.


          Remember, we have 10x less population, over a larger area,

          "10x less population" would only make mathematical sense if it was possible for Canada to have a negative population. (With Canada having negative 9x as many people as the US.) I'm not even sure what a negative population would mean (people made of antimatter?) I think you meant "One tenth the population", which isn't the same thing.

          And the population density has nothing to do with why Canada's legal system has more grey areas. Canada's legal system is more grey because it is more directly derived from the British system, which is more grey than the US system. And Britain most certainly isn't less densely populated than the US.

        • It was a patent issue.

          The disagreement wasn't over the patent, the disagreement was over a fact. The judge felt the defendant was lying. Again, the defendant didn't lose because of a legal technicality -- He lost because the judge thought he was lying.

          "...Justice MacKay concluded that Mr. Schmeiser's arguments were implausible. "
          http://www.seedquest.com/News/releases/2002/may/44 76.htm [seedquest.com]

        • by Interrobang ( 245315 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @04:17PM (#4821246) Journal
          Go read his website [percyschmeiser.com]. He didn't know it was "Monsanto's seed," he never bought seed from Monsanto (preferring to breed his own for the last half-century or so, and he certainly didn't steal anything from Monsanto. In fact, he only found out about the cross-polination when he was trying to eliminate "volunteer" canola growing where he didn't want it and used Roundup.

          Experts in the subject already insist that it's virtually if not utterly impossible to find canola, corn, and soybean seed without traces of (patented) genetically-modified genes in them. Monsanto, however, is the big offender, in that it ruthlessly goes after people who wind up with "their" proprietary genes in crops. It's also totally possible to find ultra-hybridized varieties of seed containing more than one company's proprietary genes. That comes from natural cross-polination, and other forms of non-crossbreeding contamination, not theft.

          All of which just blatantly shows why this Supreme Court decision is a good idea, and why Mr. Schmeiser should get Monsanto to pay through the nose for wrecking his organic hybrid canola variant with their genetically modified strain. I wonder if this court case will help?
    • by HiThere ( 15173 ) <charleshixsn.earthlink@net> on Thursday December 05, 2002 @02:22PM (#4820316)
      Right. Probably a different court, though.

      The unpleasant thing about the Monsanto case was that there was no evidence that the farmer had done anything wrong. It could have been pollen drifting in from the neighbors fields. (A bit unlikely, but not disproven.) The hypothesis that justified the ruling was that some seed had spilled by the roadside, and that he had planted that. Could be.

      But it was a civil suit, and if Canada is like the US, then civil suits are decided on the perponderance of the evidence. And it was reasonable that he had reason to believe that his grain was the Monsanto variation. What isn't reasonable was that his claim that his own strain had been corrupted by foreign pollen wasn't considered relevant. He hadn't been intending to sell the strain, so it was given a value of nothing, even though he had been selecting it for decades.

      Well, officially it was decided on the basis of (I think) patent law. But I think what really happened was that the judge decided that he swiped some seed, and looked for a reason to find him at fault.

      • >The unpleasant thing about the Monsanto case was >that there was no evidence that the farmer had >done anything wrong.

        I don't know that I'd agree with "no evidence". The farmer himself testified that when he suspected there was glyphosate resistant canola growing in part of one of his fields, he then went and sprayed a larger area with glyphosate. He then took the seeds from the plants that survived the spraying and planted his entire next year's crop with them. This established that the presence of the genetically modified canola growing in his fields the next year -- which is the crop that was found to infringe the patent, not the crop from the previous year -- was planted deliberately and with full knowledge of its glyphosate resistant properties. I can't see how one could put any construction on the farmer's behaviour, as he himself described it, other than that he wanted to farm the genetically modified canola but didn't want to pay the licence fees.

        • by DunbarTheInept ( 764 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @03:47PM (#4821051) Homepage
          So you're saying the right course of action would have been for the farmer to cull his OWN CROP of the plants that had been accidentally contaminated, and deliberately choose to only use those seeds that had not come from Monsanto-contaminated pollination? Bull. Keep in mind that the plants that produced the seed were his OWN CROP on his OWN PROPERTY that had been forced to produce the patented seed through no action of his own. So now Monsanto has the right to say any plants that YOU paid for, that YOU cared for, that are on YOUR land that just happen to get cross-pollinated by your neighbor's Monsanto crop are no longer your own plants that you can do with what you will.

          If you agree that that's right, then you are agreeing that it's okay for Monsanto to steal ownership ofa portion of a farmer's crop.
  • by puppetman ( 131489 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @01:51PM (#4819981) Homepage
    but the biochemical method for manipulating the genese of the mouse to create the Harvard mouse is.
    • by AndyMan! ( 31066 ) <chicagoandy@nosPAM.gmail.com> on Thursday December 05, 2002 @02:01PM (#4820107)
      but the biochemical method for manipulating the genese of the mouse to create the Harvard mouse is.

      Actually, the mouse is. Specifically, the patent covers the offspring of the mice as well. Indeed, it ALSO covers the offspring of other animals that were bred with the mice.

      Read the article.

      _Am
      • New purpose in life.

        1) Create and patent gene.
        2) Introduce gene into DNA of patent lawyers world-wide for the next 60 years.
        3) ???
        4) Profit!
      • The patent is rejected here in Canada. Mainly, I think, to set precedent against (and continuing with precedent of) patenting the "higher life forms", as was mentioned.

        If you want, you can also look here [mybc.com] for a local article on the topic. The methodologies etc are patentable, the life form is not (in Canada).

        Really, it should be this way in the rest of the world too, patenting the methologies and general process (not the lifeform) should be quite enough to prevent against scientific pilfering.
  • by sleeperservice ( 62645 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @01:51PM (#4819983)
    Patent law tends to be highly compartmentalized between nation-states and as such the Canadian ruling will probably have little direct effect on the patents held in other countries.

    The most it may do would be to keep alive the debate over whether higher life forms can actually be patented. And then, of course, there's the possibility of companies moving research in this area to Canada to avoid licensing costs.

    All of that said, I feel sorry for the mouse. :(
  • by seldolivaw ( 179178 ) <me AT seldo DOT com> on Thursday December 05, 2002 @01:52PM (#4819994) Homepage
    Do they have to pay a royalty?

    "Congratulations, it's a boy! That'll be $1.50."
  • Oh boy! (Score:5, Funny)

    by RandyF ( 588707 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @01:52PM (#4819996) Journal
    Does this mean we can all move to Canada and have a bunch of sickly mouse pets to play with? Oh what joy. ;>
  • Rah Rah! (Score:2, Insightful)

    I am not a lawyer, (nor do I play one on TV), but I am a Canadian. Perhaps our attitude towards such things as health care may explain this mouse ruling. Americans tend to mock our system as left-wing and socialist, but given a choice between being sick (or being a patentable mouse) in Canada or the U.S., my choice is clear.

    Warning: The contents of this post are non-flamable.
    • I know Americans mocked as a bunch of greedbags, perhaps not unfairly, but a "new" mouse also costs $$$ (US or Canadian) to develop. In the classic IP paradigm, will there be money to develop new mice if money can't be made from them? The sick humans potentially lose.

      Gene research is still pricy. Eventually scientists will just dial what they need into the Mouse-o-matic(TM) to get what they want -- and ironically Canada will give it a patent -- but for now, I don't know. (I said way up top that patenting animals weirds me out.)

      My personal preference would be gov't funding for this sort of thing, but with great caution so we don't turn it into a big socialist mess like in... never mind. Anyway, it comes down to money one way or another.
  • by FreeLinux ( 555387 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @01:53PM (#4820005)
    You see, if this mouse is not patentable in Canada, it means that any and every Canadian can produce these cancerous mice.

    Imagine what it will be like when the world is flooded with cancerous Canadian mice. They'll be dirt cheap and there isn't likely to be any quality control so, you might get stuck with a non-cancerous mouse, after paying for a cancerous mouse.

    I telling you, you are much better off getting your cancerous mice from the Patent licensed sources like Glaxo Welcom. Cheap Canadian cancerous mice will be your undoing!
  • Were they patenting the mouse itself ("thou shalt not make any cancer prone mice no matter how you did it without paying us") or their method for making a cancer-prone mouse ("thou shalt not use this novel and new method for creating a mouse prone to cancer without paying us for the next 20 years")?

    If its the former, I agree. If its the latter, I'm not so sure.

    But hell, sure is nice for my country not to act 'me too!!' on the issue.
    • Read the article.
      The cancer prone mouse patent was denied.
      The method for making the cancer prone mouse was granted.
    • by Citizen of Earth ( 569446 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @02:07PM (#4820171)
      Were they patenting the mouse itself ("thou shalt not make any cancer prone mice no matter how you did it without paying us") or their method for making a cancer-prone mouse

      It is a decision about the mouse itself. The method of producing the (first?) mouse still may be patentable in Canada, as, perhaps, it should be. However, the normal process of producing a new mouse from a pair of existing mice is not and should not be patentable anywhere, because it is a natural process, and if you (or your patent office) read the fine print of various patent laws, they specifically exclude natural processes. The Supreme Court of Canada is merely affirming the law that other country's patent offices have ignored.
  • by the_rev_matt ( 239420 ) <slashbot AT revmatt DOT com> on Thursday December 05, 2002 @01:55PM (#4820026) Homepage
    From the headline, I assumed Cancer Mouse was some bizarre cartoon character. It made much more sense once I read the article.
  • by Spencerian ( 465343 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @01:55PM (#4820031) Homepage Journal
    "What are we doing tonight, Brain?"

    "The same thing we do every night, Pinky...trying not to get sick from our chemo."

  • This ruling makes a lot of sense. A mouse that is prone to cancer is far too nonspecific for a workable patent. A mouse, for example, cannot be patented in itself (the question of who has invention rights to that is larger than any patent office can easily decide!). A likelihood of developing something, in the absence of any particulars, would also be silly to patent.

    When I read this, I thought, "Gee, I know some families who are very prone to cancer (presumably due to shared genes and shared environment). So can Harvard researchers patent the Joneses?" I sure as hell don't think so. Of course, for the US patent office, these sorts of patents are just par for the course.
  • Onco Mouse, Cancer Mouse, and Harvard Mouse...

    I don't think Disney has a thing to worry about.

  • I'm sure the IP happy 4 letter Orgs are talking with Bush right now. Watch for an invasion force to start massing on the US northern border with the intent of bringing these terrorists to justice!
  • If someone has successfully patented a living organism, then the whole patent system needs to be revisited. If living organims are patentable, then every new breed of dog or cat sould be patentable, and clearly they haven't been. Why am I not patented?

    I understand that some researchers spent a lot of time in creating that mouse, whether through selective breeding, gene therapy or whatever. However, what we have now is a self-replicating organism. The patent process was never intended nor should it ever be used to prevent organisms from self-replicating.

    I don't know what the right solution is to encourage future developments in this field, but to say that anyone or anything owns the genetic code of an organism goes into dangerous terrority. It isn't like they created the genes, they just studied them and noted an interesting characteristic.
  • Does this mean anyone in Canada will be able to make those stupid smoking mouse commercials?
    • Does this mean anyone in Canada will be able to make those stupid smoking mouse commercials?

      What?! as if cigarettes weren't bad enough now canada has to worry about kids smoking mice?!
  • From the decision text: The word "manufacture" ("fabrication"), in the context of the Act, is commonly understood to denote a non-living mechanistic product or process, not a higher life form.

    This interpretation potentially disallows all patents on future gene therapies, potentially genetically modified crops, and even down to the level of bacterial engineering for anything from drug production to oil eating bacteria to scavenge oil spills. My guess is that this myopic interpretation is going to cause lots of legal problems for many companies big and small and will eventually get reversed when they can get either a lawyer or an consultant to properly brief the court on why "manufacture" can apply to bioengineering and genetics.

  • by dgerman ( 78602 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @02:01PM (#4820109) Homepage
    From the ruling:

    "Although Parliament enacted special legislation for the protection of plant breeders, it did not address other higher life forms. Moreover, the passage of the Plant Breeders' Rights Act demonstrates that mechanisms other than the Patent Act may be used to encourage inventors to undertake innovative activity in the field of biotechnology.[...] If a special legislative scheme was needed to protect plant varieties, a subset of higher life forms, a similar scheme may also be necessary to deal with the patenting of higher life forms in general. It is beyond the competence of this Court to address in a comprehensive fashion the issues associated with the patentability of higher life forms."

    In other words, patents related to plants have their own set of laws. They were not meant to include animals and the Supreme Cort does not want to take the responsibility of something that Parliament should do.

    At least, that is my interpretation :)
  • I'm sure countless IANAL's will be willing to offer opinions.


    No comment.
  • The issue is sticky, because the researchers also pushed to patent the offspring of the mouse, which carry similar genes, as well as other mammals exhibiting similar traits.

    The issue was sticky enough. Then they had to push it further by trying to patent other animals with similar traits? No wonder it was denied (at least in Canada). As a result, a media-storm ensued, and I'm sure that helped to influence the courts.

    --

    Patented Sex Method [tilegarden.com]
  • IP treaty law (Score:4, Informative)

    by watchful.babbler ( 621535 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @02:14PM (#4820251) Homepage Journal
    The main focus of most international patent treaties is the normalization of laws between nations. In this case, NAFTA Article 1709 (3) is probably controlling vis a vis the United States:
    A Party may exclude from patentability inventions if preventing in its territory the commercial exploitation of the inventions is necessary to protect
    ordre public or morality * * * provided that the exclusion is not based solely on the ground that the Party prohibits commercial exploitation in its territory of the subject matter of the patent.
    NAFTA (and WTO/TRIPS) explicitly include only microorganisms and plants in their patentability requirements, so technically Canada is free to deny patent coverage to the oncomouse. However, if I were corporate (or industry) counsel, I'd bring suit in the NAFTA tribunal on the grounds that Canada is violating 1709(3) by effectively prohibiting the exploitation of biotechnology by ruling that bio-engineered animals don't qualify for invention protection. It's a questionable argument at best, but cases have been won at the tribunals with far less.

    This will become an issue as biotech organisms start appearing en masse (whenever that might be). Right now, there's no real incentive to produce, in Canada, nonpatented oncomice, simply because most of the countries to which you'd export (e.g., the U.S., Japan) would allow infringement suits. As the suite of gengineered organisms expands, however, expect a great deal of political and legal pressure for Canada to fall in line with the other states.

    • expect a great deal of political and legal pressure for Canada to fall in line with the other states.

      Is it just me, or does that sound like "fall into like with the other (United) states" as opposed to "the other (International) states"? I'm a paranoid Canadian, I know. But I get sick of my country being joked about as "the 51st state". Maybe I'm just being too sensitive, eh?

    • There is an incentive to relocate million-mouse research programs to Canada, however. A technically advanced country where you can get good workers and not have to pay the developer.
    • Could Canada possibly be adopting Britan's pragmatic approach to biotechnology, with an "open source" twist?

      Canada could become a hotbed of bio research if they didn't honor the patents of any bioengineered products worldwide. I hope they do this.

      Genes, just like information, wants to be free.

  • I anal, but not with mice... gerbils are favorite, wtf is Timothy thinking?

    Takes all kinds I guess.
  • by daemonc ( 145175 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @02:15PM (#4820261)
    and keep them from reproducing without my permission?
  • This ruling effectively throws the issue back into the laps of the politicians, who will undoubtedly be lobbied strongly by industry. Canadians who agree with this ruling need to lobby back. I recall the existance of a number of areas where medical progress has been held back in the US due to patents on higher life forms, but do not recall the details. Can anybody pass on pointers to these cases, so they can be used as arguments against a policy change by our elected officials?
  • if they patented mouse cancer, could they sue for infringement.

    I wonder if I can patent greed.
  • by squarefish ( 561836 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @02:22PM (#4820323)
    Walt Disney must be spinning in his grave!
  • A car that breaks down every day.
    Software that is full of bugs.
    Moldy Cheese
    Broken Dishes
    Pen with no ink
    Pre-Coastered CD-R's
    Computers made by Packard Bell
    Paypal
    IBM Deskstar HDs
    Burnt out light bulbs
    Candy Wrappers
    Vanilla Ice
    Bottled Sewer Water
    Slashdot Spellchecker.

    Thanks, I *am* available as a consultant.

  • by praksys ( 246544 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @02:25PM (#4820346)
    One of the key features of existing international treaties over intellectual property is the idea of "national treatment". Roughly speaking the idea is that nations have to treat non-nationals the same as nationals. For example, if Candian law grants Candian authors a copyright in their works for life + 50 years, then Candian law should grant the same sort of copyright, for the same term, to non-Candian authors. So national treatment is a pretty weak requirement - it allows nations to have any sort of intellectual property law they like, so long as that law does not discriminate between nationals and non-nationals.

    As far as the national treatement requirement goes, the only constraint on Candian law in this case is that, if Canadian courts reject such patent claims made by US citizens/corportations, then they must reject similar claims made by Canadian citizens/corportations.

    In addition to the national treatment requirement, treaties have also tried to establish certain standards concerning the nature and terms of intellectual property rights, but these IP standards do not get down to the details of what can or cannot be patented. In general these IP standards have been designed to avoid all the really difficult questions about intellectual property, and they tend to be weakly enforced in any case.

    So, as far as these additional IP standards go, it is highly unlikely that this Candian court ruling will conflict with any of them.

    However, the fact that Canadian courts have now taken up a position against this sort of patent makes it less likely that this sort of patent will ever make it into the IP standards established by *future* international treaties.
  • Of course they can't patent it, there is prior art! [toonopedia.com]

    With thanks to Al Fago
  • by gi-tux ( 309771 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @02:34PM (#4820438) Homepage
    All this patent and IP stuff must have come from Egypt. I now know why we don't know how the pyramids were built. The folks that owned the companies doing the work patented and copyrighted everything. They punished anyone that spoke of it with the DMCA (Digging and Movers Copyright Act) and thus soon the technology was forgotten.

    This is probably why we don't have any of the music or movies from that era as well. They were covered by the MPAA (Movies and Pyramids Acrhitects Association) and the RIAA (Ra Is An Artist).

    If this stuff keeps up, it won't be too many years until everything here will be forgotten as well, due to the fact that no one can say anything, do anything, or even think about anything.

  • by photon317 ( 208409 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @02:38PM (#4820465)

    I'm a big fan of the notion that there's a distinct if somewhat grey line between Invention and Discovery, and that only Invention should be patentable. Discovering a new species of mouse in the wild does not give one the right to patent it. Inventing a new species of mouse through genetic manipulation does, although it raises ethical questions, especially if applied to a more emotionally developed mammal like a dolphin, a dog, or a human.
  • by saskboy ( 600063 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @02:46PM (#4820544) Homepage Journal
    Canada is very unfriendly to some rodents, yet worships others. We have Wiarton Willie our groundhog in Ontario, the beaver as our national animal and on our nickel, Gainer the gopher [lovable SK Roughriders CFL mascot], yet in Alberta we have outlawed rats! Now we've outlawed patented mice! This tramples on rodent rights!

    CBC's version of events [www.cbc.ca]

    The mouse genome project - A success! [cbc.ca]
  • Let's Sing! (Score:5, Funny)

    by The Turd Report ( 527733 ) <the_turd_report@hotmail.com> on Thursday December 05, 2002 @02:50PM (#4820578) Homepage Journal
    Whose the tumor riddled rat that isn't patentable at all?
    C-A-N C-E-R M-O-U-S-E. Cancer Mouse! CancerMouse.
    We treat him with drugs and hope he doesn't die, die, die.
  • by vorwerk ( 543034 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @02:58PM (#4820663)
    FYI, in Canada:

    1) Medical procedures are not patentable. This is basically to prevent the formation of a monopoly on a life-saving procedure. (e.g., If someone invented a procedure to repair spinal cords, she couldn't patent it and charge a zillion dollars, because that would limit poor people's access to the technique.)

    2) A life-saving drug (e.g., cure for cancer), if they're the only such life-saving drug available, is not patentable.

    3) Some drug patents and trademarks seem to be quickly lost in Canada (while others are not). In the U.S., the trademark "Aspirin" has been lost to common use, so any generic manufacturer can claim that they make aspirin. Not so in Canada -- only Bayer can claim this trademark. In terms of patents, we have lots of generic drugs being manufactured that I don't think they can offer in generic form in the U.S. yet (e.g., generic forms of Reactine & Allegra). Not that I'm complaining -- our drugs are dirt cheap in comparison to what U.S. citizens pay (e.g., a month's supply of Claritin in the U.S. costs over $90 USD according to a recent Reuters article, but costs me only about $18 CAD -- this is due, in part of course, to the fact that it has been available over the counter here for some time ... but you get the drift).

    For more comparisons of patent law differences:

    http://www.dww.com/articles/how_do_you.htm

    -kris
  • Maybe Canadians just have a thing against rats.

    The province of Alberta has a full-time Rat Patrol team [gov.ab.ca] who go around the provinces and kill rats. Alberta is rat free, and these guys drive around the borders with poison, .22s etc. to keep it that way.

    Some days I think this would be the perfect job.

  • Bacteria? Plants? Insects? Lobsters? Lizards? Sparrows?

    Or can we define it as "having the capability to scream [guntheranderson.com]"?

  • by paiute ( 550198 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @03:05PM (#4820731)
    Screw the OncoMouse. How many people are going to buy one? Science geeks and Poindexters is all. I told DuPont (when they had the rights to it) that the big bucks would be in OncoHamster, OncoRabbit, OncoKitty, and OncoPuppy. Every parent would buy a small mammal for the kids if they were guaranteed that in six months - once the kid stopped feeding it and playing with it and was generally bored with the whole ownership thing, the animal would go off to the big pet shop in the sky.
  • by blate ( 532322 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @03:39PM (#4820982)
    It makes me really uncomfortable that companies are applying for and the Federal Government is issuing patents for genes and all sorts of life forms.

    I understand the motivation for this: companies who develop these "products" want to protect and insure a return on their investments. I think that it's OK to patent the *procedure* or *process* used to generate these things, but I don't like the precident set by corporations or individuals patenting what are essentially naturally-occuring things.

    Think about it... suppose Glaxo finds a "cancer gene" which, perhaps, can be used to predict that someone with the gene will develop a particular form of cancer (I know that such things may already have been discovered). Suppose that I possess the gene. Now, if Glaxo patents this gene, they are essentially asserting intellectual property rights on part of my body, on my DNA. I really don't like even the idea of that. The ramifications and implications of this area of law, in my opinion, are still unclear and potentially frightening.

    On a more general note, patent law is supposed to encourage innovation and development. However, increasingly, it's being used to enforce monopolies (look at Microsoft or Gemstar). And, in the area of health care and medicine, it often has the negative side-effect of pricing many people out of life-saving or even life-enhancing treatments and procedures.

    In my humble lay-opinion, our (the US's) intellectual property laws are in dire need of some revision and rethinking, particularly in the biomedicine and information technologies realms. Patents should be issued more judiciously and circumspectly and should carry much shorter expiration dates. Once a company has earned back their development costs and made a modest profit, they should yield their technology to the public to encourage further development and growth and, particularly with respect to medical technology, to make their products accessible to people in a larger number of income and class brackets.

    I'm not a socialist, and I generally don't approve of the government interfering in the private sector. On the other hand, I do believe that government should encourage personal and corporate responsibility. Biotech companies, obstensively, exist not to make billions of dollars in profits, but to save and improve lives. Intellectual Property laws can and should be used to encourage a greater balance between profit and public benefit.

As you will see, I told them, in no uncertain terms, to see Figure one. -- Dave "First Strike" Pare

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