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Posted
by
michael
from the tungsten-rods-dropped-from-500-miles-up dept.
anzha writes "Space.com is running an article on a RANDstudy about space based weapons and their potential effects on wars on more solid ground. Fascinating stuff."
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Space weapons have been debated intensely in the past. The latest instance of prominent debate is over their use for ballistic missile defense. But this is not the only possible role for space weapons, and that fact raises a further concern: What if an adversary were to develop such weapons? Could one? Why would it?
Considering the level of discussion on/., I have created this account to point out obvious things, hence the name. In a week of existence, I have learned that saying things that are blatantly obvious is a catalyst to getting modded up, in fact I am already at the karma cap (though falling fast of late).
I am on a broadband connection, so I doubt that I am also 56ker.
What I am afraid of is that there may be little strategic benifit to space weapons, or that alternatively, once the US has them, either everone will try to get some, or they will be used as a strategic threat for the USification of the world.
From the article: Then there are the thunder rods. Tossed down from orbit, these long and slender kinetic-energy devices use their own mass and very high velocity to create a destructive effect.
Lastly, for those looking for a celestial "big whopper" of a weapon, how about using natural meteoroids? Good-sized fireballs of metal could be sent to Earth, aimed at targets of choice. These impactors leave a nice crater.
so the only really reasonable weapons are basicly fancy hi tech names for dropping an anvil on the other guys head like they do in Looney Toons. Finally, my sig is appropriate;)
I had never considered the possibility that I may have a disabled signiture, perhaps I can apply for Social Security money. My signiture is an statement about the fragility of human identity, and the way we use the objects we posess, or the hat we wear to attempt to reinforce this fragile sham. Or, perhaps, it is funny cause I saw it on tv. I wonder if I should have my sig shot and sent to the dog food factory.
I have the right to retaliate to an attack to my sig. Do not make me get out my anvil, youngster.
Ok, now this is real off topic, but I must say, a real sig, when preceded by the hyphens, as you display yours, must have a space after the hyphens. Really. You can probably find that on google too.
Yeah, I didn't understand what they were talking about there. If you drop something while you're in orbit, it won't fall, it will just keep orbiting right beside you. If you throw it down, my guess is that it forms an eliptical orbit.
So the question is how fast do you have to throw it down so that the ellipse is narrow enough that it hits the earth?
Looney Tunes? Star Wars? Granted, although we never saw much in the way of orbit-to-surface weaponry in the movies. However, mention of these 'thunder rods' puts me in mind of one of my favorite and oh-so-hard-to-find-nowadays games:
Synidcate Wars.
Specifically, the weapon referred to therein as 'Satellite Rain'. Ah, memories...
Does this mean the electron maces, persuadertrons, graviton guns, and spider mechs are next? Cool!
Eric: *puff* so here we are again guys Fez: Hey hey, let's play that game...joo know...where we think about ways to annihilate ourselves from space! *puff* Kelso: Yeah! Annihilation! Cool! *puff* Hyde: *puff* Ok - check this out - what if we like put LASERS up on satellites, and like, shoot people from space. Like in Star Wars! Eric: Haha yeah! *puff* No no wait - what if we just toss junk down and let the kinetic energy gained through falling through earth's atmosphere yeild an inexpensive but highly destructive bomb! Kelso: Like bowling balls! Fez: Well, guys, what if we just divert asteroids that are already up there? You know not *all* of us have money for expensive space programs. Eric: *puff* But...wait...what if something happens to our satellites? Hyde: *puff* Like anti-satellites? Fez: Aye...we need like anti-anti-satellites! Kelso: I say we just drop conventional weapons - this sci fi stuff is too confusing. Donna: *snorkle* Hahahah...You said balls!
...is the use of orbital lasers for antiaircraft work (unless I just missed it). Reason being that if you can force an enemy airforce below 30k ft (9k m) you have an immense advantage in an airwar. (Below 30k feet the laser's beam tends to have too much in the way of atmospheric problems).
Another thing that startled me is that they are talking about using HF (hydrogen flouride) lasers. While definitely cheaper than DF (deuterium flouride), their atmospheric propogation sucks raw eggs.
Additionally, no mention of solid state lasers like the one [llnl.gov] Lawrence Livermore National Labs [llnl.gov] is developing for HELSTF [army.mil] is made. FEL's are, but they're slower going work than the SSL's seem to be.
Some questions (Score:2, Interesting)
- Rand
Re:Some questions (Score:1)
Re:Some questions (Score:1)
I am on a broadband connection, so I doubt that I am also 56ker.
Re:Some questions (Score:1)
Star Wars? Looney Toons more like it. (Score:2, Funny)
Then there are the thunder rods. Tossed down from orbit, these long and slender kinetic-energy devices use their own mass and very high velocity to create a destructive effect.
Lastly, for those looking for a celestial "big whopper" of a weapon, how about using natural meteoroids? Good-sized fireballs of metal could be sent to Earth, aimed at targets of choice. These impactors leave a nice crater.
so the only really reasonable weapons are basicly fancy hi tech names for dropping an anvil on the other guys head like they do in Looney Toons. Finally, my sig is appropriate
Re:NB s/guys/guy's (Score:1)
Re:Star Wars? Looney Toons more like it. (Score:1)
I had never considered the possibility that I may have a disabled signiture, perhaps I can apply for Social Security money. My signiture is an statement about the fragility of human identity, and the way we use the objects we posess, or the hat we wear to attempt to reinforce this fragile sham. Or, perhaps, it is funny cause I saw it on tv. I wonder if I should have my sig shot and sent to the dog food factory.
I have the right to retaliate to an attack to my sig. Do not make me get out my anvil, youngster.
attrocious spelling (Score:1)
s/hat/hats/
OT was Re:Star Wars? Looney Toons more like it. (Score:1)
This is a real sig.
Ok, now this is real off topic, but I must say, a real sig, when preceded by the hyphens, as you display yours, must have a space after the hyphens. Really. You can probably find that on google too.
Re:Star Wars? Looney Toons more like it. (Score:1)
So the question is how fast do you have to throw it down so that the ellipse is narrow enough that it hits the earth?
An old favorite... (Score:1)
Synidcate Wars.
Specifically, the weapon referred to therein as 'Satellite Rain'. Ah, memories...
Does this mean the electron maces, persuadertrons, graviton guns, and spider mechs are next? Cool!
The best weapon.. (Score:1)
Re:The best weapon.. (Score:2)
Re:The best weapon.. (Score:1)
In the basement at Rand headquarters (Score:3, Funny)
Fez: Hey hey, let's play that game...joo know...where we think about ways to annihilate ourselves from space! *puff*
Kelso: Yeah! Annihilation! Cool! *puff*
Hyde: *puff* Ok - check this out - what if we like put LASERS up on satellites, and like, shoot people from space. Like in Star Wars!
Eric: Haha yeah! *puff* No no wait - what if we just toss junk down and let the kinetic energy gained through falling through earth's atmosphere yeild an inexpensive but highly destructive bomb!
Kelso: Like bowling balls!
Fez: Well, guys, what if we just divert asteroids that are already up there? You know not *all* of us have money for expensive space programs.
Eric: *puff* But...wait...what if something happens to our satellites?
Hyde: *puff* Like anti-satellites?
Fez: Aye...we need like anti-anti-satellites!
Kelso: I say we just drop conventional weapons - this sci fi stuff is too confusing.
Donna: *snorkle* Hahahah...You said balls!
One area I am amazed they don't touch on... (Score:2)
Another thing that startled me is that they are talking about using HF (hydrogen flouride) lasers. While definitely cheaper than DF (deuterium flouride), their atmospheric propogation sucks raw eggs.
Additionally, no mention of solid state lasers like the one [llnl.gov] Lawrence Livermore National Labs [llnl.gov] is developing for HELSTF [army.mil] is made. FEL's are, but they're slower going work than the SSL's seem to be.
Links (Score:3, Informative)
lots of good pix here
6 5.htm [fas.org]
k . tml [osd.mil]
f fice/body.htm [af.mil] 1 2^2^12^40,FF.html [trw.com]
http://www.fas.org/spp/starwars/program/sbl.htm [fas.org]
a paper on SBL for missile defense
http://www.fas.org/spp/starwars/program/docs/98-1
SBL fact sheet (PDF)
http://www.acq.osd.mil/bmdo/bmdolink/pdf/sbl.pdf [osd.mil]
Missile Defense Agency homepage
http://www.acq.osd.mil/bmdo/bmdolink/html/bmdolin
other links
http://www.boeing.com/defense-space/space/md/sbl/ [boeing.com]
http://www.sbl.losangeles.af.mil/Divisions/FrontO
http://www.trw.com/presskits/detailinfo/0,1067,2_