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Space Science

MirCorp dumps Mir station 25

Posted by michael from the last-flites dept.
Chairboy writes "According to this press release, MirCorp (the company that was leasing space station Mir for commercial opportunities) is ending their involvement with Mir and concentrating on building a commercial lab module for the International Space Station. Looks like NASA's wish to get rid of legit competition in the station business has been answered.... This is unfortunate, Station Mir is a fully functional space station with more capabilities then the International Space Station at the moment. Because it's already there, lots of operations could have been done less expensively on Mir then the politically expedient ISS."
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MirCorp dumps Mir station More

MirCorp dumps Mir station

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  • What you say is probably right, however:
    1. There are _quite a bit_ more interested parties than just the russians in the SSA, which means not only the russians would have to sort through the technical and economic problems involved in reusing Mir for SSA.
    2. Of course im just guessing here, but it might just be cheaper (in terms both of money and time) to move and sanitize MIR a.o.t. building more modules/cubicles/whatever on SSA.
  • ...if you don't mind wading through fungus, patching walls with duct tape, and praying the power doesn't fail.
  • The only problem is (correct me if I'm wrong (and I usually am)) that Mir is not it a stable orbit. It is slowly spirailing into the earth.

    Now, if we could get it into a geophraphically stable orbit, you're got something. Completely depressurize it so you don't have to worry about explotion or fungus and let it drift until we can either use it or bring it back down to earth -- I'm talking in 80-100 years time. Like when seafarers would purposly sink old boats in shallow bays.. you never know.
  • I couldn't agree more with you.
    ---
  • Hmm, I think officially SkyLab would be the first. But Mir is certainly important in the history of Space.
  • The solution the ISS is using is to keep the modules warm enough that they don't get condensation on the outer walls. That's why they didn't open the new module until they had the power available to heat it. (Why they didn't just design the modules for solar heating is a mystery to me, it's not like they have too many cloudy days up there.)
    "
    / \ ASCII ribbon against e-mail
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  • It ain't over 'til the orbiter(s) come down.

    Oh, yeah, and first post.
  • Isn't Mir having a lot of troubles as it is, crumbling and near death?
  • When you reuse your old processors, it doesn't cost millions of dollars and risk people's lives.

    --
  • ...there goes my summer vacation.
  • Cuz they don't want nasty fungus in their nice new Alpha? Seriously, I think Mir is in such bad shape it'd be more trouble than it's worth.

    I'm all for the 'Viking Sendoff' approach, though. Strap on a booster and let 'er rip...

    --

  • Because a railway is far more efficent for some things than an airplane is. Its just not as quick, comfortable, shiny or new.
    Same thing with Mir. Its not as new or comfey, but its already there. I for one don't take a sledge hammer to my old Athalon (pardon the AMD plun) just because I'm getting a new one. I USE the old one for other tasks :)
  • First of all, this is historical value.

    Second, the cost of sending something in orbit is it's weight in gold. I don't know how much cash it represent that Mir station, but I would like to find it any other use that a killer firework.

    One of those could be send it in geostationary for later usage, or even why not send on lunar orbit that Mir?? Huge propultion costs, but somewhere some people could live.

    Maybe I'm only an Old Cracker Jack, but I definitively see future in space, starting by the moon.

    By the way, I was thinking about designing ipv10, with dynamic routing table based on interplanetary minimum distance and bandwidth, combined with redundancy, anyone?
  • MIR is now very fast getting to the point that it is unsafe for it to be used. It is not like a car or a boat if things go bad (and it has already several times) you can't just step out and wait for help. Also the cost of running it is getting to the point that it is cost ineffective. One mission wasted because of a broken system and the cost of another mission to fix it adds up fast. The only real argument to keep it is that is already up there. I hate to see it go, but a replacement is what's needed and what should have happened a long time ago. It is past its designed life.
  • I'm not really good with physics on the scale that is required here, so I'm wondering a few things, things like what mass, or an increase in mass, would do to/for the ISS. Would an increase in mass the size of Mir help the new station with maintaining orbit at all? It wouldn't even need to be powered on or environmentally connected to the new station, but if increased mass would help, and if it would make sense to spend the money now to move it instead of moving ISS several times later (assuming that mass would be a help), wouldn't it work?Br>
    Another thing that is somewhat worrying is the 'space fungus' problem that is mentioned. Is the cause or origin of the fungus known to be something we tracked up on a mission, or did it come from somewhere else? If we brought it up, wouldn't it be prudent to know how it affects systems, how it spreads, and how to potentially eradicate it? If people are going to be living in the station, and if they really don't want to have to evacuate for some really dumb reason, we're going to need to know this. It seems like it would be a good learning experience to try to remove the fungus from Mir, with the idea that if it works, we have a technique, and if it fails, well, we lost a piece of junk that was going to be abandoned anyway.

    One last thing that I wonder about is if Mir is still considered to be space-worthy in terms of mantaining atmospheric pressure and the like. If it is, or if it would be reasonable to make it such, wouldn't having it around for a backup plan be prudent? Assuming that it could be kept something like 100 meters away from ISS, wouldn't it be useful for such things as relatively hazardous materials (from/for experiments) storage, or emergency rations, or emergency fuel, or something? Turning Mir into a barge might be a little weird, but if the fungus doesn't eat everything and if the station doesn't depressurize, it could be useful to keep supplies around longer.


    "Titanic was 3hr and 17min long. They could have lost 3hr and 17min from that."
  • Why move out of the cave and build a house?
    Why start farming when we can continue hunting for food?
    Short-sighted? I say yes.
    With your argument why should we have ever left the cave. Do you have investments in some prime cave property?
  • Why would they destroy the first space station ever? Even if it can not be used anymore, it should stay in orbit. This is a monument. Why destroy it? Is someone feeling envious?
  • Yes, it's spiralling down, but it's not really a question of geography. Mir is in a *really* low orbit. Atmospheric drag is causing it to decay even further, in fact it was boosted up to a higher orbit earlier this year or else it would have probably come down by now. But even so, it won't last in the current orbit very long: the lower it gets, the higher the drag and the lower it gets, lather, rinse, repeat until the big burn. At this point they still have some control over it so I think they plan to try to de-orbit it someplace (relatively) safe, such as over the Pacific (pity that).

    Also, Mir is very heavy (ok, massive to be more exact), having acreted many pieces over its lifetime. To boost it into a higher orbit that would last any significant length of time would take a lot of energy (i.e., money) that would be better spent on ISS.
  • Actually, one of Mir's predecessors was first, Salyut 1.
  • That would be nice, but US export restrictions prevented the export of the electrodynamic tether (METS) that was bound for Mir. The tether could have increased Mir's orbit to a point where it wouldn't decay, but with the use of a tether, the fuel requirements are prohibitive.

  • It's absolutely terrible that the Mir would go unfunded. It almost burned down when we had Americans up there, it's becoming overrun by fungus, we hear American reports of a horrible musty smell throughout the station.

    It's so far beyond its expected service life, it isn't even funny. While once a testament to human ingenuity and engineering skills, it is now an example of pointless human nostalgia which is being carried out at dangerous levels. Certainly it is historic equipment. But the place for admiration is not where its inhabitants will die if they make a minor mistake, it is in a museum.

    Of course, if put on display, it should be decontaminated and aired out.

    As an American citizen, my opinion of the Russion space station means absolutely nothing. However, I do not think that Americans should be pushing to hold missions on that station. I do not want American lives put in danger, and as far as I'm concerned, the Mir is ready to come hurtling down.

    Thank you.

    I do not belong in the spam.redirect.de domain.

  • Mir + SSA = ? (Score:3)

    by Xunker ( 6905 ) on Tuesday December 12, 2000 @01:05PM (#564074) Homepage Journal
    I don't know where I heard it from (maybe here?) but a while back there was some talk about integrating Mir with Space Station Alpha (formerly the International Space Station). This seemed to me like a Good Idea(tm) -- Mir is fully functional if decaying. If they conjoined the two they could eliminate a lot of Mir's weak points (poor computer system, terrible propultion) and it would help the SSA. It could provide suplimentary power, communications, storage and serve as an emergency escape vehicle should something happen to the SSA.

    It's old, but valuable. YWe've got to remember that the Mir is one of only two working space stations currently in orbit, and the Mir has proved itself time and again.

  • Re:How About the Old Viking Sendoff? (Score:3)

    by Royster ( 16042 ) on Tuesday December 12, 2000 @01:36PM (#564075) Homepage
    I wonder if the MIR station can be reinforced to take small amounts of directed thrust? Could it's orbit be changed enough to break away from Earth?

    Helm, reroute the Emergency power and life support to thrusters. We need to get the space station out of this planet's gravity well.

    But, sir, there are hundereds of genetically mutated fungi onboard. We'd be spreading disease throughout the whole quadrant.

    Doctor, what can you tell me about the lifeforms aboard that craft?

    Dammit, I'm a doctor, Captain, not a mushroom farmer.

    Och, Captain, she's breaking up. She canna take much more of this.

    Screw it. Let it burn up on reentry.

  • Re:Mir + SSA = ? (Score:3)

    by tesserae ( 156984 ) on Tuesday December 12, 2000 @04:52PM (#564076)
    Even if desirable, it would be prohibitively expensive. The stations are in different orbital planes, and it's expensive (in terms of fuel) to change orbital planes. They're also at different altitudes, but that's much less of a problem.

    For what it would take to change planes and do a rendezvous with Alpha, the Russians could reboost Mir to prevent its reentry many, many times over. And they're unwilling to do that even once more.

    ---

  • How About the Old Viking Sendoff? (Score:3)

    by human bean ( 222811 ) on Tuesday December 12, 2000 @01:01PM (#564077)
    I wonder if the MIR station can be reinforced to take small amounts of directed thrust? Could it's orbit be changed enough to break away from Earth?

    Strap some thrusters on it, some simple reinforcement, redirect most electrical to thrust, and send the sucker off. Skip life support. Guidance not strictly required. Maybe we fill it with cultural memorabilia first, just so the folks that find it will know what we taste like.

    OTOH, maybe we could load the puppy up with biologics, frozen bacteria and algae ice cubes, and set Mir's course for the slow orbit to Mars, or Venus, or somewhere that life might stand a chance. Sure, it may take US another hundred years to get there, but it might be nice to have some kind of biosphere waiting.

    Maybe we should load it with radioactive waste and drop it in a crater on the Moon.

    I know, I know, I just hate to see waste...

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