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Development of OS Satellite Image Processing/Mapping 36

Ken Melero writes "ImageLinks, in collaboration with Federal Agencies and Florida Tech is developing Open Source software for satellite image processing and mapping. The Open Source Software Image Map (OSSIM) experiment will be hosted on RemoteSensing.org and will demonstrate the application of open source software development techniques in meeting government requirements. See the press release for more information. " Looks cool - GPL as the license.
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Development of OS Satellite Image Processing/Mapping

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  • Will it include instructions to connect to satelites and get pictures?

  • by tcd004 ( 134130 ) on Tuesday May 30, 2000 @05:43AM (#1037899) Homepage
    Heres are some great consequences of high-res, remote satellite imaging links, (the results of which are only compounded by OS'ing the technology.)

    www.spaceimaging.com [spaceimaging.com] (the first ones to sell commercial high-res imagery, very cool site with sat photo dowonloads)

    A report by the Carnegie Endownment For Internatinal Peace
    on the effects of commercial High-res.
    Secrets for Sale [ceip.org]

    An abstract is posted online with the full report available for download.

    tcd004 Here's my Microsoft Parody [lostbrain.com], where's yours.

  • In several years of working in physics/programming with satellite tracking data, I found out just how bad the documentation and standards were for the various formats for data on and from satelites. The images were often fine, being compressed versions of standard formats, but what we'll be looking at here, it seems, would require additionally the exact positional data for the satellite body. Here's hoping the open source approach leads to better standards and documentation of data formats for time, position relative to the earth (and orientation), and so forth.

    From experience, it will more likely result in filters of resolutions with a tremendous range, both in granularity and depth, being interpolated and patched together. I'm not sure I believe that OS will get around the traditional bailing wire and duct tape aproach of engineers in the field...
  • by Proteus ( 1926 ) on Tuesday May 30, 2000 @05:47AM (#1037901) Homepage Journal
    This is a very interesting use of the Open Source community. I applaud the effort.

    That said, I have to express a mixture of excitement and concern over what the success of this project could mean. On the one hand, it could mean that corporate culture will begin (slowly) to adapt to the Open Source model. On the other, it could mean that corporations will glean the hard work of Open Source developers and cash in, doing very little actual work themselves.

    In the first case, I am happy on two counts: changing corporate culture is difficult, and if the Open Source Movement succeeds, it will be a big "feather" in our collective hat; and, corporate adaptation means that more companies are likely to open hardware specs for Linux support, and software specs for cross-platform ports.

    In the second case, I have mixed feelings: having a corporate infrastructure to market and distribute Open Source works has the makings of a rather sound business model -- however, the less ethical companies out there (which, IMHO are a vast majority) may abuse the model so thoroughly that Open Source developers are alienated.

    However, I cannot decide whether Open Source would be hurt, or if developers would just move thier resources to the more ethical companies. The concern is that even if the latter, the "evil" orgs can still get the work -- possibly with even less effort.

    Anyone see a way around that mess?

    --

  • If we all could have our own satellites..

    -motardo
  • If companies took Open Source and made it less open, then I doubt they'd get many developers. And if they took Open Source and exploited the free software without doing a lot of the development themselves, then, hey, what's wrong with that? Isn't that sort of what companies that distribute Linux do?
  • It is a nice project and it does have application in the corporate world. Yes, I agree, it is a good. But . . .

    what the open source world needs to push it over the "edge" is a project that everyone would want to have, a killer app if you would.

    if, say, the open source world got together and built an openDoc office suite, then that would be worth talking about . . . 'til then, well, we'll see.

  • The OSSIM project will not address issues of satellite downlinks. However there is a interesting project under way where you can build an inexpensive downlink station for processing NOAA (weather satellite data). It is also hosted on www.remotesensing.org, and more information can be found at:

    http://www.tmcsys.com/ssi/ssifaq.html [tmcsys.com] I am not sure how evolved this is yet.

  • ...was impossible to trace by following the links. Assuming that the US government is involved, it is wrong.

    Think about it. Tax dollars come from the people and from corporations. That includes MS employees and other software companies. They are using tax dollars to fund software written under a license that effectively tends to nationalize an industry, without any consent from the people.

    This is just symptomatic of the whole leftist Clinton/Gore/Judge Jackson mentality that pervades this administration.

    Once again, I have no problem if private organizations want to collectivize themselves, but when my government gets involved, warning bells start to go off. Karma to burn lately, so mod all you want.

  • by zorgon ( 66258 ) on Tuesday May 30, 2000 @06:39AM (#1037907) Homepage Journal
    The Image Processing Workbench (IPW) [ucsb.edu] of UCSB has been open source and freely available for years, and recent ports include Linux. Very powerful collection of command line Unix utilities written in C that can be pipelined together. It's specifically designed to work with remote sensing data although it does not incorporate image projection (mapping) and navigation functions. There is still a need for freely available OS tools for mapping and navigation.
  • But is this "satellite-related data" which requires an ITAR license [wired.com] for export?
  • What are you talking about? No really, your post seems to be missing a subject.

    Assuming you are talking about OSS; If tax dollars are involved how would a propriatary liscense be better? or are you saying it should be public domain? If tax money is involved, all the taxpayers should get equal access.

    Seriously, this makes no sense. It seems to be an excuse for a diatribe against the current administration. Judge Jackson, a registered Republican and Reagan apointee, is a leftist!?... yea, and I'm a Chinese jet pilot. Hell, calling Clinton and Gore leftists is a stretch... but I guess when you contrast them with the far right screwheads they could be seen as such.

  • There is also GRASS (Geographic Resources Analysis Support System), which being a raster geographic information system can do some image processing. When maintained by the US Army Corps of Engineers, it was public domain. It is now maintained at Baylor University [baylor.edu] and is GPLed.
  • If it's government funded, it should be public domain. The government shouldn't be developing proprietary software either.

    Emphasis is on the word developing

  • by zorgon ( 66258 )
    Great, yes! I forgot about GRASS. I don't think about GIS much when thinking about remote sensing data, although some raster GISes do well with RS data sets and they do have mapping tools and so forth built in. I think the original posting is a red herring, there are a lot of relevant tools available already.
  • by Anonymous Coward
    Another victim of the lethal GPL virus.

    R.I.P.
  • Yea, satelites, with high-resolution, realtime cameras and gigawatt lasers. I'll control it all from my secret base in the dormant volcano.
  • and take photographs of CmdrTaco in his underpants! hurrah! brilliant idea!
  • if, say, the open source world got together and built an openDoc office suite, then that would be worth talking about

    I don't guess you've heard of KOffice? Check out www.kde.org and bring your C++ skills. Hackers are needed. If you don't want to hack on it, then use it. Try it out and submit bug reports.

  • 'Boy, is sure is cloudy today!'

    I wonder what percentage of the sky would be darkened if anyone were allowed (and could afford) to put things into orbit...

  • A couple of thoughts:

    This is a very interesting use of the Open Source community.
    IMO I think exploitation may be a more accurate term.

    . On the one hand, it could mean that corporate culture will begin (slowly) to adapt to the Open Source model.
    To a small degree possibly, if nothing else the open source methodology is getting some press.

    On the other, it could mean that corporations will glean the hard work of Open Source developers and cash in, doing very little actual work themselves.
    Ding! Ding! Ding! Correct sir!. This is exactly what it looks like to me, in this instance anyway. This smells of exploitation pure and simple. It's too bad really because the end product seems pretty cool and could have some real application for both federal and corporate use. It's a real setback to see this happen the way it has as outlined in the article. The open source community seems to be winning the battle of understanding that open does not mean free. This article illustrates how quickly that message gets changed to suit any purpose the spin artists need.

    Hopefully this will not become a trend, maybe with bigger companies like IBM etc. that have their own spinmiesters and who apparently do "get it" will balance the scales to allow the unknowing phb's and corporations to make up their own minds and not use cases like this as precident for how to get software and environments built, ported, expanded, whatever, for a hugely reduced cost and at a massive development savings, all by only exploiting the open source development community.

  • A lot of this work has already been done by amateur radio operators (Hams). See http://www.arrl.org/ and search for "satellite". They hava a back issue article which is a primer on how to access a satellite. OSCAR 34(Orbital Satellite Carrying Amateur Radio) has cameras aboard, and the June issue of QST magazine has an article on how to access/download high-resolution photos.
  • "Free" remote sensing software has been floating around the academic community for decades. Its the image data that cost big bucks. Academic software isn't as polished as industry maintained stuff.

  • makes me wonder how many Bill Gates has in space...
    -motardo
  • by Proteus ( 1926 ) on Tuesday May 30, 2000 @10:24AM (#1037922) Homepage Journal
    If companies took Open Source and made it less open, then I doubt they'd get many developers. And if they took Open Source and exploited the free software without doing a lot of the development themselves, then, hey, what's wrong with that? Isn't that sort of what companies that distribute Linux do?

    I'm not terribly concerned that anyone will make Open software less open (though the GPL has yet to be thoroughly tested in court), or that companies will make money selling support for free products like Linux distros do.

    My concern is that companies will start saying "hey, we have this idea, lets give it to the Open Source community, and they'll write it for us." Then they simply obfuscate the open source nature of the product and pack it up. Now, to geeks and programmers who keep tabs and *shock* read licenses, this probably would have little effect. But the mass populace won't know the difference. That's a Bad Thing because it really doesn't further the goals of Open Source -- the availability of Free Software to whomever wants it.

    --

  • What?!?

    You have a problem with the government spending tax dollars on GPL'ed software? Tax dollars should be spent to get the most bang for the buck, and to do the best thing for the American people. The GPL seems like a great way to do that. Would you rather they spent the money on some proprietary software? Am I being trolled, here?

    This way, every person or corporation who pays taxes (or not) gets the source code! That's obviously a whole lot better than paying taxes and not getting the source code. Or worse, paying the taxes, having the development go over budget and over schedule, and not even getting usable software at all (a common government software spending pattern!)

    And what do you mean the GPL "effectively tends to nationalize an industry". You have some evidence for that?

    I mean, the Linux kernel, and Apache, and the GIMP, and SAMBA, and OpenSSH, and Gnome are written by developers all over the world. By "nationalize", you must mean something different from the natural meaning of the word.

    Can you explain what you meant, or are you just an anti-GPL troll?

    Torrey Hoffman (Azog)
  • There is now a vast amount of remote sense data floating about the world.
    The major types are satellite data ('photographic' and multiband), aerial ( photographic / geophysical ) and seismic ( marine / land ), with a plethora of 'spot' readings of various types.
    The stages of data use are:
    1) Aquisition - downlink from sat, fly plane & aquire, send ship out & measure, etc.
    2) Georeference - correct perspective distortion / grid raw data , etc.
    3) Delivery - Fat data over thin wire problem.
    4) Process / Enhance / Interact with / Use.

    In the world outside of mineral exploration / military use, the big news has been the Ikonos sat. & the explosion of much cheaper & higher resolution air photo mosaic's.
    ( One of the local councils has a 25cm air mosaic several Gigs in size & amoungst other uses, roofing tilers are grabbing the data to target people with tiles missing off their roofs )

    One of the current hot topics is how to deliver terrabytes of raster/vector data over inet connections for people to use at home or in the office.

    My current URL ( http://www.earthetc.com/ )( nope - I don't work for them, although friends do ) has a pretty impressive demo of zomming and panning over the net.

    The OS community is looking at catching up with about thirty years of commercial / military software development stemming from USGS code, GRASS, GMT etc. Various components such as orthorectification have have dedicated commercial packages ( Halava , ermapper ) worth several thousand dollars.

    An interesting tack for the OS movement to tack would be to leapfrog the aquisition & georeferencing stages, assume the existence of large georeferenced mosaiced data sets, and focus on the issues of delivery and end user tools, ( smart street directories, hand held's with 200Gb drives for use in co-ordinating emergency response teams etc.( requires integration with 'live' GPS data)).

    It's a pretty interesting field ...
  • the resolutions would require new sattelites. The Continuous feeds would require either Geostationary sattelites or recieving towers spread out over the earth in a grid covering EVERYTHING... oceans and all.

    Pat
    (FIT Student)
  • To get that sort of resolution you would need enormous sats in orbit. Lots of sats. I don't think your voyeuristic tendancies are worth that much money.
  • I can never stop laughing any time someone from the US calls politicians 'left', who would almost be called 'rightwing fundamentalists' in the Netherlands.

    //rdj
  • I don't guess you've heard of openDoc [tudelft.nl] then? openDoc is a document centric way of looking at data, rather than a process centric way. We would build a document that would contain those items we want, with out having to launch separate applications for each component. All the program aspects are transparent to the user. I want a table, I just pick a table. I want to extract data from a DB and place it inside my document I can do that without having to launch the DB. I want to display my document as a presentation, I just click on "presentation" and whamo! there it is.

    IBM first introduced this amazing product into OS/2 with version 2.2. At that point they made openDoc fully integrated into the Presentation Manager. This meant that for apps that supported it, you could just drag the appropriate part of the document from one app to another. Formating was largely automatic. Very nice and very killer.

    Unfortunately, IBM has become a slave to MicroSlob and well, you can see for yourself where OS/2 is.

    KOffice is probably going to be a "nice" office collection, but it will be just another office app. Nothing special, unless . . .

    BTW: I don't do C++, I do objective C.

  • I know what OpenDoc is. I have the OpenDoc programmer's reference and the example book with CDs on my shelf. Since Apple basically stopped supporting it, it is basically dead. Since OS/2 is practically dead, OpenDoc is practically buried.

    BTW, KParts are intended to work like OpenDoc parts. May even be compatible, I'd have to check the docs again.

    Actually, all of KDE is heading that way with embeddable KParts. You really need to check it out.
  • Maybe old news for you, but this is the first I've heard of IPW (thanks for the link) and I try to keep an eye on these things. RS.org also hosts LIMP [207.178.22.52] - Large Image Manipulation Project - which is not to be confused with LIMP - the Linux Montage Project [remotepoint.com]. GRASS has already been mentioned, and there is also SPRING, TOPOG (almost but not quite Free Software) and OpenMap.

    Another good place in addition to remotesensing.org [remotesensing.org] to keep an eye on Libre RS/GIS software development and data is freegis.org [freegis.org].

  • GRASS IS GPLed for years now

    Minor correction: version 5 of GRASS [lakeheadu.ca] was released under the GPL last November (1999). GRASS v0 - 4.x is public domain (still under minor development, mostly bug fixing).
  • You're welcome. Hope it helps! Old but good.

    My title/comment was inspired by grumpiness brought on by yet another "wow look what I discovered, isn't it shiny and new and gosh aren't we important" thing from /. posters. It's hard for them to remember sometimes that 90% of geek history occurred before they discovered the Web ... ;)
    cheers

  • KParts . . . I'm having a closer look now. Thanks.

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