ISS Crew Stuck In Orbit While Russia Assesses Rocket

astroengine sends word that the astronauts aboard the International Space Station will be staying up there longer than expected while engineers for Russia's space program try to figure out if it's safe to launch more rockets. The recent Russian cargo mission that spun out of control and eventually fell back into the atmosphere sparked worries that a vessel sent to retrieve the astronauts wouldn't make it all the way to the ISS's orbit. Roscosmos and NASA said the next rocket launch will be postponed at least two months. Even though the Russian cargo ship failed to reach the ISS, they have plenty of food, water, and air to last them to the next scheduled supply run — a SpaceX launch in late June.

Re:Elon Musk to the rescue once again

[TWX]

Apparently he can't land a rocket on a barge intact, but they're working on that.

Re:Elon Musk to the rescue once again

[peragrin]

Considering that no one else has tried and succeeded means he is closer than everyone else.

Now when he builds his own moon base can we call him an evil mastermind ?

Re:

[TWX]

I was under the impression that once they had permission to land on terrain, the barge was not going to be needed anymore. He could park it off the coast of Baja and use it as a lair...

Re:Elon Musk to the rescue once again

[cjameshuff]

The drone platforms (there's one being built for the west coast too) will still be used for situations where the core doesn't have enough propellant to return to land. Especially the center core of Falcon Heavy launches that need to make a large plane change, as the cross-fed center core goes much further and faster than the side cores.

Re:

[putaro]

Only if he builds a giant "laser" and calls it the "Alan Parsons Project" - or maybe Operation Bananarama

Re:

[NotDrWho]

Build a car that anyone outside of the upper class can actually afford?

Re:

[Ralph Wiggam]

That's coming in 2017.

Re: Elon Musk to the rescue once again

[John Howell]

That's because tesla is in the market of milking the 1% to provide battery technology for the 99%, and profit for the 0.1%

Re:

[Dunbal]

Yep and when they get really hungry they can draw lots and eat each other's legs.

Re:

[disposable60]

I can't draw lots!
I don't know what they look like.

Re:They can just drink sewage like in California

[__aaclcg7560]

The ISS is recycling California sewage in space? No wonder my sewage bill was so expensive in Silicon Valley.

Get SpaceX crew-rated soon.

[jpellino]

They're the closest next best backup for the Russian flights. Also they're not run by a government with a national leader who does bizarre things even by national leader standards. Yes, I understand that's not a tremendously high bar, but it's worth a look.

Re:Get SpaceX crew-rated soon.

[Dunbal]

While I am not an astronaut, the Kerbals have taught me that the tricky part of manned spaceflight is mostly the getting there. Coming back is pretty routine - in fact with just the tiniest amount of delta-v, it's unavoidable! I was under the impression that there is an "emergency" Soyuz capsule permanently docked at the ISS anyway for just this sort of contingency. But surely a "crew rating" would not be necessary to get an empty capsule using tried and tested tech (mercury, gemini, Apollo) up to them to ride back in. Oh, and GO KERBALS!

Re:Get SpaceX crew-rated soon.

[ColdWetDog]

Yes, they can get back on man rated Soyez. No booster required. But then the can't bring another crew up until the rescue capsule is replaced by - wait for it - another Russian booster.

Re:

[matfud]

They do know how to make the russian engines...sort of. They have the plans and even licenses to do so. It was cheaper to buy them from Russia and it would only take a couple of years (5 to 10) to manufacture them in the US.

Why buy the rights to manufacture if you have no intention of doing so? That is above your pay grade.

Re:

[MachineShedFred]

I think I heard somewhere that it was part of a government launch contract that they needed to own the design so that they could second-source the motors if necessary. By licensing it and having the schematic, they probably checked whatever box that some bureaucrat was looking to check. They probably never intended to actually manufacture the things - just comply with some contractual requirement in the least useful way.

Re:

[matfud]

I was only being slightly sarcastic. There are many reasons to own the blueprints and have a license to manufacture (second source being only one). But even with all those there is a lot of knowledge not written down. If money is no object and you have cooperation then a replica could be build in months (look at how fast american Packard built RR Merlin engines for the British and for the P-51)

Re:Get SpaceX crew-rated soon.

[gstoddart]

Coming back is pretty routine - in fact with just the tiniest amount of delta-v, it's unavoidable!

Sure, but presumably people mean safely.

Any clown can crash into the surface of the Earth in a spectacular fireball. I should think it's the keeping them alive part that's the tricky part.

Re:

[Dunbal]

Considering the first Russian cosmonauts actually bailed out of their capsules and floated down to earth with regular parachutes, it's pretty low tech. Lots of industrial processes use some form of ablative heat protection and the aerodynamics for keeping a re-entry vessel oriented in the "right" direction all by itself aren't too complex for today. Putting something that can survive re-entry together can't be too hard. The landing part - which can be trickier - can be circumvented in the above manner, by u

Re:

[matfud]

It is not simple but it is well tested. move away from the space station. Do the hokey cokey dance stuff to wibble around. Wait a long time. Do a hard burn for deorbit. Pop the top off. Rotate so you are the correct way up and pretty much hang on to your hat cos you have little control from that point on. Land. Point gun at bears while waiting for helicopters (if they can find you and you did not sink in a lake)

Simple.

Re:

[matfud]

What ever happened to the concept individual person escape sheild/capsule things?

Re:

[sjames]

They do have a lifeboat they can use to evacuate the station. However, ISS is not really meant to be left unmanned for an extended time, so that presents it's own problems.

Re: Get SpaceX crew-rated soon.

[WindBourne]

And yet, dragon 2 could be used in an emergency right now to bring astronauts down. In addition, it could be fully vetted in under 3 months, if NASA wanted the vetting.

Re:

[beelsebob]

Bear in mind that KSP doesn't model several important aspects of returning to the earth (or Kerbal). It doesn't cover keeping the thing pointing in the right direction so that you don't die in a fireball. It doesn't cover keeping the thing from entering the atmosphere too steeply so that you don't die in a fireball. It doesn't cover keeping the thing from (not) entering the atmosphere too shallowly so that you don't die in the frozen wastes of space.

Aside from these basics of getting the thing flying the

Re:

[MachineShedFred]

It actually does, now. They just reworked the aero and heating so that parts will explode if you expose them to too much air friction. Unless you use stability control or keep your heat shield pointing in the right direction manually, it will tumble and conceivably tear itself apart / burn to a cinder. If you come in too shallow, you will aerobrake and head back out to space in a lower orbit where you may lose power - Kerbals don't eat or drink without an addon, so electrical power is the biggest concern

Re:

[umghhh]

Which leader do you exactly mean? I think you should clearly call them as all leaders of major countries possibly involved in this discussion (i.e. about space travel) did and continue doing bizarre things. Each one in one's own little way of course but still.

Re:

[Narishma]

So, what bizarre thing has Obama done recently?

Re:

[ClickOnThis]

So, what bizarre thing has Obama done recently?

I think the reference was to Putin, not Obama.

Re: Get SpaceX crew-rated soon.

[WindBourne]

Yes but narishma is one of those types that would take Stalin or Putin over a black president .

Re:

[monkeyxpress]

Actually I hope SpaceX don't get distracted by this. They are doing some incredible things, and pushing a lot of boundaries, which is not easy to do for a high profile company. At this stage they could likely bounce back from a launch failure, but lose a crew and it is all over. Best leave it to the Russians until SpaceX has got a reusable first stage sorted out. There may be more rocket explosions in that development process and at the moment the media seems to have settled down about these being ''failure

Re:

[khallow]

At this stage they could likely bounce back from a launch failure, but lose a crew and it is all over.

Sorry, it's not that big a deal though they may well lose their commercial contract with NASA which would be a significant setback.

Re:

[l0n3s0m3phr34k]

well, if NASA suddenly told SpaceX "their stranded, this is an emergency" and we HAD to use an "non-man rated" Dragon to get them back...even if it didn't work right and crashed this isn't SpaceX's fault. It's Congress's / NASA's fault for screwing up so badly that there was no other choice...at least there is a chance to get them down if Russia can't.

Re: Get SpaceX crew-rated soon.

[WindBourne]

Lol. F9R would have nothing to do with manned launch until it was vetted.

Re:

[Megane]

If they had to take "stranded" astronauts down in an emergency, the launch vehicle wouldn't matter at all. Just fit a Dragon capsule with some Soyuz seats (so that they can use their custom-fitted seat cushions) and some O2 tanks and CO2 scrubbers, and send it up.

I'm not sure if the hatch door can be properly shut from the capsule side, or if it can be un-berthed without using the arm. Maybe they could undock the capsule and have everyone suit up and EVA to it, after docking it first to install seat cushio

Progress tumbling...

[Crash24]

...looks like something out of Kerbal Space Program. [youtube.com]

Re:

[TWX]

Heh. The monchrome graphics, the 40x25 font overlaid... I think that my 8088 with a CGA monitor could have displayed that content.

Come to think of it I had an Indy-500 car racing game whose graphics were better than this, and would play on that computer.

Re:

[Crash24]

Considering that there exist cheap ICs that handle analog video overlays [sparkfun.com] that really only need a serial input...yes, your 8088 could at least render the overlay with less than $100 of extra hardware.
As for the video on CGA...I guess that's possible too. [oldskool.org]

Not stuck in orbit!

[hackertourist]

They have a Soyuz attached to the station and can use that to return to Earth if they need to.
They're just postponing a scheduled crew change, which is possible because despite the Progress failure, they still have enough supplies to last them until the next scheduled supply run.

honey, where'd you hide the spare key?

[Thud457]

If they vacate the premises, they might have to worry about squatters.

Full disclosure, I see no downside with Elon turning space pirate.

Re:

[NotDrWho]

And not just regular squatters either.....SPACE squatters!

Coming this fall on TLC!!!!

[sconeu]

Space Squatters... The reality show that follows a bunch of ragtag astronauts who occupy the ISS and won't leave, as no evicting authority has jurisdiction!!

Fridays at 8, this fall on TLC!!!

Re:

[sjames]

Illegal aliens, no doubt.

Re:

[penguinoid]

And not just regular squatters either.....SPACE squatters!

Sounds like an empty threat.

Re: honey, where'd you hide the spare key?

[WindBourne]

That would be the Chinese. Does not matter. They are likely getting the classified information in other means.

Re:

[peragrin]

Even so the the crew would use the Soyuz the exist crew will use to return to earth is up there. New crews keep their capsules. So the capsules rotate.

Re:

[BlackPignouf]

Also, they could just swim to Hubble.
Source : http://www.imdb.com/title/tt14... [imdb.com]

Re:Always have a redundancy

[TWX]

Wasn't one of the SpaceX Dragon capsules sent up as a supply ship to the station actually fully equipped with the necessary seating and everything? They're not certified for a crew yet, but I suspect if it came down to it, that certification could be obtained relatively quickly if the Russians suddenly proved incapable of ferrying passengers to the station.

Re:

[AikonMGB]

No, Cargo Dragon is a different thing than Crew Dragon. Cargo Dragon has been making routine trips to the ISS to deliver supplies and bring back waste. Crew Dragon recently did a pad abort test, but that's the farthest it's been.

Re: Always have a redundancy

[John Howell]

Actually, bring back waste just far enough for it to incinerated on re entry. They don't reuse those cargo capsules.

Re:

[AikonMGB]

They don't re-use those (yet), but they don't burn up on re-entry, they parachute-drop in the ocean. Every Crew Dragon flight gives them valuable engineering data and experience on their heat shields.

Re:

[hackertourist]

Nothing I've seen indicates this, and I've been following them quite closely.
For one, the launch abort system is a required part of a manned Dragon that has been missing from all Dragon flights so far.

Re:

[Thelasko]

I'm not aware of any seats on a CRS Dragon. However, I do remember an astronaut stating that a human stowaway would make it safely to earth aboard one. It certainly has some life support systems, because it carries mice to ISS. [wikipedia.org]

I think since the Space Shuttle program, NASA has become much more concerned with safety. Therefore, a Dragon 1 with seats won't do. They want redundancy, specifically abort capability from the launch pad to orbit. [wikipedia.org] Which is something the Space Shuttle never had. [wikipedia.org] Before Challe

Re:

[l0n3s0m3phr34k]

if the choice was between "using a cargo return Dragon" or "slowly suffocating on the ISS", the choice is pretty clear. Clamp down those helmets and hang on...

Re:

[turp182]

This does not appear to be so. Dragon V2 is the manned version and isn't set for flight testing until late 2015, per Wikipedia (there is more info, and marketing, on Space X's website):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D... [wikipedia.org]

As well, for pure cargo missions maximizing cargo is the goal, especially for critical missions.

Re: Always have a redundancy

[WindBourne]

No. All of the V1 have been full cargo. It would have been expensive to waste that volume with seats since the dragon is volume constrained. However, the first couple had windows and all have life support.

Assuming the next supply run makes it

[grimJester]

Independent failures that pile up can be bad. Of course, just checking the safety for two months is far different from being unable to retrieve them.

Just like commercial airline delays

[Tablizer]

Houston Control: "...and, uh, your luggage went to Mars."

Re:

[Tablizer]

Who would have guessed that over time our capabilities to leave Earth's gravity well with people aboard would have decreased? Shameful.

Recession, terrorism, wars, political budget fights, change of focus (moon vs. non-moon) have all caused this.

When other things are on people's minds, "space toys" gets the least priority.

It could also be argued that manned space flight is a waste of resources until other technologies catch up, but that's another long and involved debate.

Re: Just like commercial airline delays

[WindBourne]

NASA is not the one to blame. The GOP have forced NASA to be an underfunded jobs program for themselves.

Re:

[WindBourne]

Oh, the dems have done a GREAT job on pork.
However, it is the GOP that have continued to gut the new space programs. They killed off COTS-D, and keep trying to kill CCxDev. Oddly, they scream about using Russian launches, while they are the ones that force us on them.

What about the poo ?

[vikingpower]

Where does the shit go ? Do they have a place for two more months' worth of crap ? I mean - seriously...

Re:What about the poo ?

[ColdWetDog]

Space is big. You just won't believe how vastly, hugely, mind-bogglingly big it is. I mean, you may think it's a long way down the road to the drug store, but that's just peanuts to space.

Douglas Adams

Re:

[Anonymous Coward]

Chemist! DNA would never say drug store.

Re:

[umghhh]

Their shit goes kaboom [wikipedia.org] - so it is us who should worry.

There's no reason for them to panic yet

[fustakrakich]

The coffeemaker still works.... right?

What do the astronauts think when this happens?

[RevWaldo]

"Another month in outer space? (sigh) Oh, darn... (smirk)" or "Man, this is bullshit!"

.

Re:

[Talderas]

No, Waldo, I do believe that is manshit.

Let's dedicate a song to them

[wyattstorch516]

I suggest Space Oddity

Gee another NASA fail

[p51d007]

For not having their own "capsule" system, they shelved in the 70's. Should have NEVER stopped upgrading Apollo.

Re:

[SpaceCommander]

I'm with you. The shuttle was a huge waste.

Re: Gee another NASA fail; nope.

[WindBourne]

NASA did not choose that. Nixon did.

They should send them cheesy movies

[donkwich]

The worst they can find.

*sigh*

[jpellino]

The program was cancelled by the Bush II administration in 2004. The last flight happened while Obama was president, following a 1 year funding extension of funding authorized by congress in 2009 that made the last flight in 2011 rather than the originally scheduled 2010. If enough Americans told their senators and reps "I'll only vote for you if you get us another crew vehicle" we would have one in less than six years.

Re: ISS Crew Stuck in Space ... THANKS OBAMA

[WindBourne]

Actually, you can thank idiots, like yourself. W killed the shuttle and stopped all manufacturing lines by 2007. Had O restarted the shuttle program, at a cost of half of NASA's budget, the very first flight MIGHT have been this year.

OTOH, had the neo-cons not killed off cots-d , we would have had manned flights back in 2013 or earlier.