Ecuadorian Navy Rescues Bezos After Kidney Stone Attack 190
Posted
by
samzenpus
from the fly-me-away dept.
from the fly-me-away dept.
theodp writes "While vacationing aboard a cruise ship in the Galapagos Islands, where the State Department warns the quality of medical facilities and services are 'generally well below U.S. standards', Gawker reports that Jeff Bezos was rescued by the Ecuadorian Navy so he could receive treatment for a kidney stone attack on New Year's Day. The Ecuadorian Navy confirmed Bezos' rescue, which involved taking Bezos by Navy helicopter from Academy Bay in Santa Cruz Island to his private jet stationed on Baltra Island."
Wait What? (Score:2, Funny)
I thought the US had the worst medical system in the world. Whats this? A Socialist country (actually half of the politicians in Ecuador are communists) has worse medical treatment? That just doesn't seem right. State run medical facilities are ALWAYS better, or so I was told by the NYT.
LOL. I love these stories where reality just smacks the left in the face.
Re:Wait What? (Score:5, Insightful)
I thought the US had the worst medical system in the world. Whats this? A Socialist country (actually half of the politicians in Ecuador are communists) has worse medical treatment? That just doesn't seem right.
Generally speaking, the rule of thumb is, if you are looking for the best medical system for your population as a whole, it will look somewhat socialist. On the other hand, the US is well known to have one of the very best medical systems in the world -- if you have a lot of money. And then when you start talking about money, you start talking about medical insurance rather than medical skill or medical facilities, or the amount of money that doctors or drug manufacturers should earn for providing the care, and then suddenly we're talking politics and not where to find the right doctors.
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also talking about money in the us you can get X10-X100+ markup on costs as well.
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Now, medical equipment manufacturers are profiteers. For example, a 1L bag of sterile IV saline solution costs $300 - that's literally 100x markup. And I'm not kidding - I have it in my medical bill from my stay in a hospital a couple of months ago. Drugs are even worse: oral vancomycin costs $500 per one dose - it can be bought for $5
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Somewhere, some people are taking too much profit, I'm sure, just I don't know who they are, or how to find out who they are, and I don't know how to change the system without changing a big part of American society in the process.
Just about everybody, except for those in care of actually doing the medicine (doctors, nurses, technicians, pharmacists... and janitors, who really shouldn't do the medicine, but need to be paid more). It's a deep bureaucracy where middlemen abound. Insurance companies take a huge cut, execs get paid way too much. Some rockstar surgeons get paid a cool half million a year... and they deserve every penny of that. Hospital C*Os shouldn't make anywhere near that. But they control the budget... so that'll
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In social australia doctors get paid about the same as they do in usa and over all costs are much lower and most people are covered (at a lower cost to them then people pay in the usa)
Re:Wait What? (Score:5, Informative)
Aussie here. Its weird how expensive things can be in the US. I know US people here in Melbourne who flew back to Aus for treatment because they didn't have medical insurance while on a visit to the US. Its also funny how the best serious treatment is in the public system here. The private system will get your nose job faster but on the spot life saving surgury will be in a public hospital.
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As a Canadian, the US system fill me with dread. It's just plain WIERD to think that, were I American, I'd have had to actually think about whether or not to get my gall bladder out. It would have been an economic decision. That's not right.
Well, for the 2/3rds of Americans who have functional insurance it isn't a hard decision at all. If I needed my gall bladder out it would cost me a $500 deductible, and then 20% of the marked-down costs until I hit about $2500 (the $500 already spent counts towards that), and then the rest would be free. Oh, and the marked-down costs are fairly reasonable - probably more expensive than Canada but not the figures you see in the news. The way it works is that I'd get a bill from the hospital for $100k. Th
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Here's good place to start. DME providers for CPAP supplies. Work your way up from there.
Heck, just look at buying contact lenses or glasses. That's just the CPAP mess at 1/10th scale or so.
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What you say is true, but there's no good reason why all those costs should be an order of magnitude greater than they are in, say, France or Britain.
Re:Wait What? (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Wait What? (Score:5, Informative)
If you are in the sea, the US coast guard would gladly do that. They will usually bill you for it, though it is likely covered by your insurance for medical evacuation.
Irrelevant flamebait article (Score:2)
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Re:Wait What? (Score:5, Insightful)
for the best medical system for your population as a whole
Medical needs occur individually. We do no show up at the clinic "as a whole" for a flu shot. Socialized medicine is the ecological fallacy [wikipedia.org] writ large & tragic.
That is one of the few examples where your comment is completely false -- vaccines, after all, only work if a large percentage of the population gets them. Broken legs, okay, that's individual.
Still, I don't see what's wrong with socialized anything... it seems to me that people are still throwing around the world as code for communist, without saying what they actually mean. To start in the beginning, how about that Ron Paul debate question: poor person shows up at the ER, no insurance, is going to die -- you treat them for free, or let them die? The first one seems "socialist", and the second one seems inhumane.
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Market based systems don't work where there is a high barrier to entry. If absolutely any US person could become a health care provider (as they could become a food grower) then the current market based system would be much cheaper. As it is, the government regulates entry into the health services market, and the businesses in the market use that fact to take huge profits.
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Doctors are constantly breaking the law by poisoning people, keeping them drugged, causing grievious bodily harm. The barrier of entry is no
Re:Wait What? (Score:5, Informative)
I thought the US had the worst medical system in the world. Whats this? A Socialist country (actually half of the politicians in Ecuador are communists) has worse medical treatment? That just doesn't seem right. State run medical facilities are ALWAYS better, or so I was told by the NYT.
LOL. I love these stories where reality just smacks the left in the face.
Right, you'd think that an island chain with an immense population of 25,000 people would have top-rate medical care, it must be the politics that's getting in the way.
How to fail at lying (Score:4, Funny)
This sentence is fal.... is fa-a-a...
Hmph. Fine.
This sentence is true.
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A typical example. It took my wife 9 months to get a NMR after a concussion -- the conversation with the doc was
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I think Canada must be suffering from proximity to the US. Here in Australia I have never seen a wait of more than a week for an MRI and a head injury case would go in within a few hours.
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Neat, I'm also in Canada and when I had head trauma they observed me and because it looked at least somewhat risky I got a CT scan within a half hour of walking into the hospital. Then when I started showing additional symptoms and the CT was reviewed I got an MRI, also within a very short period of time. The bleed ended up stopping itself.
In the year after that I had another MRI because of some continuing symptoms, in that cases there wasn't an emergency so I had to wait a while, and that's fair enough.
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Just sounds to me like in this case it was not an emergency, and the doctor had poor communication skills. That happens everywhere, and isn't the system's fault. If you have a hangnail and ask your doctor what is the worst case, the worst case is that it gets infected and you die.
http://www.aarp.org/politics-society/government-elections/info-03-2012/myths-canada-health-care.html [aarp.org]
Re:Wait What? (Score:5, Informative)
If you're as rich as Bezos, health care in the U.S. isn't so bad. If you're poor, it is no better than what he was rescued from. You'll lie on the floor in your home in agony hoping the stone passes soon.
I had a kidney stone while travelling last month (Score:5, Interesting)
I had a kidney stone while travelling last month in South Africa. The pain developed over a day until I was doubled over on the floor, unable to concentrate on anything. At that point I realized I needed to go the hospital.
I went to the ER and was admitted within about 15 minutes. They did blood and urine tests, gave me morphine (I assume it was morphine, it took the pain away completely) and IV fluids, then did a CT scan. A doctor saw me, and I was discharged in about five hours with a filter cup and antibiotics. The stone had made it through the ureter and was small enough to pass without issue.
I paid for everything out of pocket. The total cost of ER admission, doctor's fee, CT scan + radiologist report, blood and urine tests, and IV fluids was USD $550. As far as I can tell, they did not charge me for the morphine, the antibiotics, or the filter cup. Also they gave me copies of my test results and a CD with my CT scan images, and I did not even have to ask for them.
From what I hear, a CT scan alone can cost thousands of dollars in the U.S. In some ways I am glad that this happened when I was travelling... my co-pays back in the U.S. might have exceeded the entire cost in South Africa. I probably could have flown there, gone to the hospital, and flown home while still spending less than what it would have cost in the U.S. I really see why people do medical tourism. It could make sense even if you have insurance.
I should note that this was a private hospital in Cape Town. The hospital was not fancy like we are used to seeing in the U.S., but the staff were professional and knowledgeable, and the quality of care was first rate.
Re:I had a kidney stone while travelling last mont (Score:5, Informative)
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The hospital was not fancy like we are used to seeing in the U.S., but the staff were professional and knowledgeable, and the quality of care was first rate.
Exactly the opposite here in the US (nice hospitals, asshole doctors that want antibiotics to fix everything), that's why it's so damn expensive.
Bozos is a pussy (Score:2)
I have had 5 kidney stone episodes in the last 30 years. The first one is scary because you have no idea what is happening. The rest are routine, more or less.
Urine sample to check for blood and a simple x-ray ( CT Scan? Really?) and they send you home with Vicodin and tell you to drink lots of water. Hell, he could have gotten the RX and continued the cruise if he wanted.
What a wus.
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( CT Scan? Really?)
That's a perfect example of the problems in American medicine. We have a fairly inexpensive decades old technology that provides the needed information but it languishes in the corner so they can use the much more expensive (but not more useful for simple cases) technology even though it exposes the patient to considerably more radiation. Even so, a CT shouldn't cost nearly as much as it does.
Re: Bozos is a pussy (Score:2)
Yeah...too much soda, not enough water.
Take heed everyone.
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I'm pretty sure I understand that sitting at home hoping it goes away works about the same anywhere.
Re: Wait What? (Score:2)
Actually, that's pretty much the standard treatment once they confirm it. Pain control, lots of water, and wait for it to pass.
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That pain control part is where it gets interesting in the U.S. if you can't afford a doctor. The government wastes billions making sure you don't get any.
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Unless they're too big. Like you, I've had multiple occasions of having them, but the last time they were too big to pass and had to be broken up over multiple procedures after they put stents in. And God help you if you have staghorn stones.
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Are you really that stupid?
A RICH MAN'S KIDNEY IS WORLD NEWS (Score:3)
Well I hear you went up to Saratoga
And your horse naturally won
Then you flew your Lear jet up to Nova Scotia
To see the total eclipse of the sun
Re:A RICH MAN'S KIDNEY IS WORLD NEWS (Score:5, Funny)
I bet you think this post is about you.
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Well, his horse naturally won, after all.
Coming soon Amazon MD (Score:5, Funny)
He has Amazon Prime! I'm sure a drone has already been dispatched with his new kidney and a qualified surgeon.
Your Wish is My Bad Paintbrush Command (Score:2)
Amazon Prime Air Kidney Unboxing [staticflickr.com] :-)
Not a bad idea: Amazon MD (Score:2)
Ecuador Military: 7500 people
Amazon employees: 110,000 people.
its great to be king (Score:5, Informative)
Hes got the cash to be treated like that, so more power to him. I don't really see how this is 'news', unless its more stoking fires of the 'class war' that is going on.
Re:its great to be king (Score:5, Informative)
Ordinary people get treated like that too.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:ALNW-USCG.jpg [wikipedia.org]
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Then even less of a non-story.
I guess its a slow news day.
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It's a story because celebrity.
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Huh huh. heh heh. You said "logging accident".
The fires don't really need much stoking (Score:3)
Re:its great to be king (Score:5, Informative)
Airlifting people with medical emergencies from the Galapagos Islands to the Ecuadorian mainland is part of the Equadorian Navy's job description. You'd have received the same treatment and so would I.
Now, the quality of the medical care you receive afterwards might be affected by your wealth or influence, but the airlift is something they do for anybody who needs it, and it happens all the time. The only reason this is "news" is because of the notoriety of the patient, not because of the airlift.
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I don't really see how this is 'news'
It's not, the submitter just wanted to say:
to try to paint Bezos as some dolt who should have just listened to the government. As if nobody visits the Galapagos and humans never suffer from sudden, acute kidney stones.
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Insurance (Score:2)
International Travel Insurance (Score:4, Informative)
You can get international travel insurance that will cover the cost of emergency medical evacuation back to the USA. You don't have to be a billionaire to afford it. I used to do a lot of international travel and would purchase a policy that covered me for one year. As I recall, the cost was only around $350.
Re:International Travel Insurance (Score:4, Interesting)
http://www.travelguard.com/travelinsurance/international.asp?intcmp=clc-001-Nav-2-International [travelguard.com]
Very interesting, thanks.
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See where it came from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/This_too_shall_pass [wikipedia.org]
There is an old fable that a king had his wise men figure out what phrase could be said under all circumstances. They supposedly came up with this.
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Constipation?
Pity they didn't have xkcd [xkcd.com] back then.
Darwin: Survival of the Financially Fittest (Score:2)
"Jeeves, bring around the Dassault Falcon 900EX [geekwire.com]. This hurts like HELL."
Not such a big deal (Score:5, Informative)
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He has a private jet. He's also the CEO of a billion dollar company. You're right, people need to get on with their lives and stop reacting every time someone is in the news because they used the wealth they've managed to acquire. FWIW, my employers travel insurance and healthcare plan would get me to a local hospital for trauma treatment then have me put on a commercial airliner back to the U.S.
My employers travel insurance is a little special as it covers war zones, Somalia, disaster areas that I enter after the disaster etc.
My personal travel insurance costs about $100 a year. The u.s.a add on doubles the price. It covers a private medical flight back home if need be, forget commercial travel. Also covers lost bags, stolen property, and delayed flights.
The u.s. Seems weird in that it doesn't generally "do" travel insurance.
Sounds like a Standard Evac Insurance Policy (Score:5, Insightful)
Business people who travel the world usually have global medical plans. Most of those plans include evacuation coverage. Medical transfers off a ship are customarily handled by a coast guard. I'm sure the insurance company had to pay for the service.
If anything the insurance company saved a little money because Bezos already had the private jet in position and that saved them the cost of an airline ticket.
Re:Sounds like a Standard Evac Insurance Policy (Score:5, Insightful)
The tone and substance of this story is more than a little suspect. The hospital at Peurto Aoyra (the biggest one) is used to transporting people off island for various problems although kidney stones are usually just treated with morphine and fluids initially. They certainly could handle that. The place is sparse, but clean. The docs there are mostly military (the military, such as it is has a large presence on the island) the commercial airline is owned by the military, and, at least at Baltra (the main airport) there is no evidence of anything else but military aircraft (a grey 737 and a helicopter when I was there).
So, the story line that the "Navy" "rescued" Bezos is a bit overdone. They shipped him to the mainland on a helicopter because that's pretty much the only way to get him to the mainland short of firing up a bigger aircraft. Like pretty much anybody else.
Must be International Drama Queen Day or something.
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The tone and substance of this story is more than a little suspect. The hospital at Peurto Aoyra (the biggest one) is used to transporting people off island for various problems although kidney stones are usually just treated with morphine and fluids initially. They certainly could handle that. The place is sparse, but clean. The docs there are mostly military (the military, such as it is has a large presence on the island) the commercial airline is owned by the military, and, at least at Baltra (the main airport) there is no evidence of anything else but military aircraft (a grey 737 and a helicopter when I was there).
So, the story line that the "Navy" "rescued" Bezos is a bit overdone. They shipped him to the mainland on a helicopter because that's pretty much the only way to get him to the mainland short of firing up a bigger aircraft. Like pretty much anybody else.
Must be International Drama Queen Day or something.
Standard for island communities, Women in labour in the Isles of Scilly off the Cornish Coast get airlifted to hospital on the mainland by the RAF. For free of course, it's a civilised country.
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Business people who travel the world usually have global medical plans. Most of those plans include evacuation coverage. Medical transfers off a ship are customarily handled by a coast guard. I'm sure the insurance company had to pay for the service.
If anything the insurance company saved a little money because Bezos already had the private jet in position and that saved them the cost of an airline ticket.
Personal travel insurance in the real world covers all that, and pretty much anyone in my country travelling internationally has it. Medical is not a cheap $5k plane ticket, a 4000 mile evac will easily cost 6 figures, in some cases 7 figures.
Jeff, people with your medical history (Score:5, Funny)
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http://www.amazon.com/Whole-World-Botanicals-Bladder-Support/dp/B0027E884M
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Re:Jeff, people with your medical history (Score:5, Funny)
"Sorry, the kidney you have in your cart is no longer available from the seller you selected."
I don't see what the problem is? (Score:2)
Everyone I know gets the Navy to come to their rescue for Medical problems.
Why are people upset, I don't understand.
-Hack
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They're upset because they said there was a location that had worse medical care than the US. Obviously this isn't true.
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Everyone I know gets the Navy to come to their rescue for Medical problems. Why are people upset, I don't understand.
Apparently you don't. It turns out that in most moderately civilized countries - and also in the United States - if you need urgent medical care while on an isolated island and there aren't any other good transportation options then the government pitches in. In the U.S., the Coast Guard maintains a substantial fleet of search and rescue ships and aircraft which are frequently used for medical evacuations of patients from remote locations. If you Google using keywords like "medevac" and "coast guard', y
Rescued? (Score:3)
It's bullshit the navy rescued anyone here. Transported, helped - many verbs would have fitted better.
Kidney stones supposedly hurt like hell (no personal experience here), but it's not something people generally die from.
Re:Rescued? (Score:5, Informative)
Kidney stones supposedly hurt like hell (no personal experience here), but it's not something people generally die from.
They sure can be fatal. I would have died from a kidney stone if it weren't for modern medical technology. A stone which is too large to pass obstructs the ureter, which prevents the kidney from draining urine into the bladder. A kidney that can't drain will be permanently damaged and fail within a day or two. Worse, stones can become infected (as mine did), resulting in a kidney infection which will rapidly cause permanent damage and will progress to sepsis and death within days.
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They sure can be fatal. I would have died from a kidney stone if it weren't for modern medical technology. A stone which is too large to pass obstructs the ureter, which prevents the kidney from draining urine into the bladder.
Yep. Kidney stones are scary as hell, I was pissing myself in terror before realizing it was a relief.
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Not to be too picky, but stones can't get infected... they are just mineral deposits. (seemed like you exagerated for effect) But your point was made.
Actually, the stones DO get infected. They are lovely little hiding places for the bacteria because they don't have any blood flow (they are in the ureter) and if the stone blocks the flow of urine (as apparently happened to mpoulton) it sets up conditions where the occasional bacterium can hide and grow and cause a clinically apparent infection.
That said, although an infected stone can be life threatening, the afflicted individual can be temporized by giving them antibiotics and pain killers until he or s
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Re: Rescued? (Score:2)
A kidney stone attack can have very similar symptoms to an acute appendicitis (searing pain around the abdominal area, vomiting) which qualifies as an emergency. It is possible that an accurate diagnosis could not be performed on site.
Other than that, kidney stones are among the most painful afflictions there are. Patients are best brought to a place where windows can't be opened as some may decide to jump out on the spot. They will do anything to get the pain to stop, and a guy like Bezos just happens to h
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The pain is similar for peritonitis, which is also supposed to be worse than childbirth.... It's so intense that memories of it have the intellectual knowledge "I was in pain"rather than any sensory memory -- I've heard that's the reason that most women are willing to give birth more than once.
My main memory of having peritonitis at 9 and 13 is of remaining totally motionless on my side and trying to will my body to stop breathing so I'd die. On the bright side, when the surgeon told me that the second inf
Kidney Stones (Score:4, Insightful)
The general "treatment" for kidney stones to to fill the patient full of pain killers and/or smooth muscle relaxants and wait. Later an ultrasound would be done to see if other measures need to be taken. Kidney stones [wikipedia.org] are rarely if ever life threatening; They are just very painful.
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The general "treatment" for kidney stones to to fill the patient full of pain killers and/or smooth muscle relaxants and wait. Later an ultrasound would be done to see if other measures need to be taken. Kidney stones [wikipedia.org] are rarely if ever life threatening; They are just very painful.
Yep, also FlowMax [drugs.com] also works wonders on stones once they hit the bladder.
Below US standards (Score:2)
I expect (Score:3)
That the kidney stone will serve a life sentence for this unprovoked attack on one of the world's most respected businessmen and all-around asshole?
what an awesome non story (Score:2)
everyone who gives a shit and thinks this is news worthy raise your hand..
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everyone who gives a shit and thinks this is news worthy raise your hand..
Yep. I don't have any stock in Amazon or its competitors. It's about as tech related as Steve Jobs' health or lack thereof. I mean, it would be as relevant to tech news as, say, if Steve Ballmer was possibly Microsoft, or if Google CEOs were saying terrifying things about privacy. Absolutely no consequence whatsoever. I mean really. Next thing you know they'll be listing news about video games I don't play or, alternate operating systems I don't use, or political rights online I haven't had since the 8
Everyone is missing the REAL story (Score:3)
Jeff Bezos went on a cruise? Did he suddenly turn 80 or something?
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Doc Wagon (Score:2)
Obviously he can afford the Doc Wagon evacuation plan.
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Setting aside all the blather, I hope Jeff is doing 'ok'.
In the UK today 220 people were admitted to hospital with kidney stones. Extrapolating globally thats 30,000. Today. 30,000 tomorrow and 30,000 yesterday. That's one every 3 seconds.
I hope you hope all these people are doing ok too? I expect 30,000 replies from you, one for each person with kidney stones.