Amazon's Jeff Bezos Sets His Sights on the Stars 123
An anonymous reader writes "Yahoo News is reporting that Amazon.com founder Jeff Bezos is looking to open a 'rocket-ship complex' for his new startup Blue Origin early next year. From the article: 'Blue Origin has released few details about the project. But a Texas newspaper editor who interviewed Bezos earlier this year said the billionaire talked [about] sending a spaceship into orbit that launches and lands vertically, like a rocket, and eventually building spaceships that can orbit the Earth -- possibly leading to permanent colonies in space.'"
heheh (Score:1, Funny)
Re:heheh (Score:3, Interesting)
ok (Score:3, Funny)
Re:ok (Score:1)
Exactly, see the difference between smart rich people like Gates, Jobs and these fortune by accident machos Allen and Bezos. They focus on investments that really matters or are very helpfull (Gates medicine/health money). Jobs made Pixar so big that even Disney was beggin for mercy.
Space exploration is not even close with the current state of technology. We will go to space easily with better tech in the future but not now. I am shorting Bezos and his company at the fi
Re:ok (Score:2)
Re:ok (Score:2)
Paul Allen is probably completely unknown amongst most people. And most people look at Gates as "the richest man in the world" or "that guy who gave like, a billion dollars to fight AIDS in Africa" if they know who he is.
There are over 6 billion people in the world - most of them have likely never heard of either one, but if they have,
Re:ok (Score:4, Insightful)
Quite the condradiction, don't you think? I mean, how are you supposed to figure out what kinda tech you need for space flight unless you go and try it? And are we just supposed to casually develop tech for this? Much like the power industry is so focused on alternative power? (not!).
The simply truth is, necessity is the mother of invention. This seems like a chicken and the egg problem, but it isn't really. We need to get out there and look around, explore, experiment. Once we start doing this, we'll start solving problems. Once we start solving problems, things start to roll. Think about the evolution of boats.
There were probably civilizations full of people who completely disagreed with some of the people designing (bigger, faster, sturdier) boats thousands of years ago. Thinking there was no useful purpose of them, the naysays just sat around and bitched about how useless the boat-builders actions were. The same thing with the horseless carriage - we already have everything we want with horses - what possible good could the work you're doing be?
It's true that people like you need to exist statistically - the ones that bitch and point out all of the flaws in the useless shit dreamers talk about - so they probably don't even listen to you naysayers anymore - and for good reason. If people like you ran society, we probably wouldn't even have wheels because we've got enough people to haul those stone blocks the 80km they need to travel.
Fortunately for us, some people have imaginations.
Re:ok (Score:1)
You aren't a technician are you? Do you think that any of modern craft is built by "try and error"? All new commercial jets, cars and of course space crafts are designed and precisely tested on computers, before any part is assembled. You can simulate pretty much everything today, even dynamical models like fluid and air motion and all kinds of material interaction.
What we are lacking is a new technolo
Re:ok (Score:1)
Look on extreme cost of shuttle parts, reliablity and longevity of these.. Look at tons of inefficient fue
...and that's the point. (Score:2)
Really, $10k/minute rocket rides and "space hotels?" Sure, there's a market for rocketing the egos of billionaires into orbit (arguably, they're already there, so why all the fuss?) and perhaps we can lower that to mere mortal millionaires being blasted into orbiting space hotels... but, necessity? Sure, there's something
Patented Interface (Score:5, Funny)
Free Shipping? (Score:1)
Re:Patented Interface (Score:1)
And curse /. for not letting me post it in all caps =[
Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:5, Informative)
> wondering if anyone knew specifically how far national borders
> extend vertically.
100km.
>
> geosynchronous orbit over the U.S at all times?
What a wonky idea! In any case, it is not possible for anything to be in geosynchronous orbit over the US.
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:1, Informative)
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:1)
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:1, Informative)
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:1)
>>> geosynchronous orbit over the U.S at all times?
>> What a wonky idea! In any case, it is not possible for anything to be in geosynchronous orbit over the US.
> for more info go here.
I think the GP wanted to say a geostationary orbit, witch is not possible over the US. From your link:
It should also be clear that it is not possible to orbit a satellite which is stationary over a point which is not on the equato
Re: (Score:2)
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:2)
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:2)
For some reason I always thought that we could put a satellite in a geostationary orbit above any point on the Earth's surface. Now I'm left wondering why only above the Equator.
No doubt it's something to do with gravity only stretching out far enough at the Equator to keep a grip on an object at the kind of distances required for such an orbit.
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:2)
An easy way to visualize this is to tie a weight to the end of a string a
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:2)
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:2)
I imagine a blob of stuff with the consistancy of very stiffly whipped cream, but with the elasticity of Silly Putty, dolloped all over the Earth completely covering.
I then set the Earth spinning very fast on its axis until the bulk of the stuff starts to sag down towards equator, stretching out into a flying saucer shape while getting very thin at the poles.
I can then stick a satellite somewhere on the "rim" and imagine that the stuff isn't there.
I could put the satellite som
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:2)
Try this: imagine a yo-yo on a string. Now, if you swing the yo-yo in a circle, the center of it's swing will be your hand. Now imagine trying to make the yo-yo swing around a different center, say a position six inches *above* your hand. You can't do it. Why? Because the pull of the string will always cause the yo-yo to swing about your hand. Now, replace your hand with the earth, the string w
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:2)
BTW, for observers, I realize this isn't technically true (eg, elliptical orbits), but for this discussion it's a reasonable simplification.
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:2)
I can now imagine the kind of forces that would force the satellite to keep on an equatorially aligned orbit.
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:1)
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:2)
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:1)
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:1)
That's such a great point, I had to go looking for a loop hole. It wouldn't be perfectly geostationary, but from what I understand, geostat orbits are usually small figure 8's straddling the equator. I think they could set one up so that the northern loop of the 8 passed just south of Baker Island [answers.com] and stayed within the US' contiguous zone [wikipedia.org].
Baker Island is 13 minutes (lattitude, not time) north of the equator. That's just unde
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:1)
If you are in space or international waters or any unclaimed region, the captain should adhere to the laws thereof- but whether he does or not doesn't matter to you because you have no say and no authority. Consider each vessel a floating country unto itself, to get an idea of what it's abo
Dear passengers, the space station is now entering (Score:2, Offtopic)
Would the ladies please cover their face and the men pray. We will be leaving Iranian outer space in 6 minutes and will enter the Turkish outer space, where you will receive instructions and the proper customs forms.
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:1)
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:2)
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:1, Funny)
Guess it's time for us to liberate South America.
Re:Foreign airspace (spacespace?) (Score:1)
Private funding of space travel is more ethical (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Private funding of space travel is more ethical (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Private funding of space travel is more ethical (Score:1)
private == for-proft + non-profit groups (Score:5, Interesting)
I disagree. Air transporation and food production are also quite important, and yet we seem to be doing fine with them being handled by private industry. Of course, there's government interference in those industries, but whether or not such interference is necessary is an argument for another day.
You, like many others, also seem to be making an assumption that all private groups are also for-profit, which is false. Non-profit groups engage in research and exploration as well, and I hope we'll see them engage in more space exploration as launch prices decrease.
For example, AMSAT [amsat.org] has launched a number of amateur radio satellites. The Planetary Society (attempted) to launch the first solar sail, funded by member donations. Elon Musk [wikipedia.org] started up a self-funded project to put an experimental greenhouse on Mars, but decided it would be better for now to focus on reducing launch costs via his SpaceX company -- hopefully he'll pursue the greenhouse project again in the future.
If there was a privtely owned space station in orbit instead of the ISS, would they be doing science, or giving trips to rich tourists?
That depends on whoever owns the space station. If it's owned by Richard Branson, it'll probably be for tourism. If it's owned by the Howard Hughes Institute, they'll probably be doing medical research. In the past, Bigelow Aerospace [wikipedia.org] has stated that they'll sell their space station modules to pretty much whoever for $100 million each, and they should be up and running in the next few years.
Re:private == for-proft + non-profit groups (Score:1)
Re:Private funding of space travel is more ethical (Score:2)
Exactly how much science is being done on the ISS now? And how many rich tourists have been flown there?
Re:Private funding of space travel is more ethical (Score:2)
Substitute "powerful tourists" for rich ones and you have our program as it stands. The current incarnation of NASA is a large, bureaucratic publicity stunt.
I say this as a NASA enthusiast who has watched the agency grind away my hopes and dreams. I used the be a free-marketer in every area but this one. Really, my concern was that there was too much capital investment required to achieve risky profits after a very long runway. I felt that coerced funding from the government was the only way to buil
Re:Private funding of space travel is more ethical (Score:2)
Both. If you are going to maintain a space station and make frequent trips to it, you can as well carry automated instrument with you to and from orbit. Since the trips are going to be frequent, the scientists on Earth can simply analyze the results and hand you a new automated mini-laboratory for the next trip.
Furthermore, if you plan on making this station a kind of
why do we bother? (Score:2)
Get your lazy ass out there and start participating in our democracy; don't give us this bullshit about how you are "coerced".
Wait for Google (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Wait for Google (Score:1)
Re:Wait for Google (Score:2)
Re:Wait for Google (Score:2)
Re:Wait for Google (Score:1)
If you don't mind the ship being in beta.
More info (Score:3, Informative)
If you're interested, you can find more info on the topic at this web [slashdot.org].
--
Superb hosting [tinyurl.com] 2400MB Storage, 120GB bandwidth, ssh, $7.95
Re: (Score:1)
Computers, then space (Score:1)
Jeff Bezos and John Carmack (Score:4, Informative)
Considering that Carmack's Armadillo Aerospace and Bezos's Blue Origin are both operating in Texas and are both developing suborbital reusable VTOL spacecraft, I wouldn't be surprised to see them engage in some sort of collaboration.
Carmack's been having hardware issues, but being Carmack, probably has top-notch software. I'm betting he would benefit greatly from collaborating with Blue Origin's rocket engineers, and Blue Origin would benefit from his programming godhood.
Bezos has apparently met with SpaceX's Elon Musk, who's built (and is preparing to launch) a private orbital rocket. Here's a quote from a recent press conference with Musk:
http://michaelbelfiore.com/blog/2005/11/spacex-pr
On Blue Origin, Jeff Bezos' space program
Musk: "I met with Jeff Bezos a couple of times and had dinner. His motivations in doing Blue origin are identical to mine in forming spacex. There's a good chance we'll work collaboratively at some point."
--Update-- (presumably elaborating on motivations)
Musk: The expansion of life on earth to other places is arguably the most important thing to happen to life on earth, if it happens. Life has the duty to expand. And we're the representatives of life with the ability to do so.
Fame forever (Score:4, Interesting)
We need DOGS not CATS! (Score:2, Interesting)
http://www.space-frontier.org/Projects/CatsPrize/ [space-frontier.org]
various legislative pushes and at least a couple of billionaires (including Jeff Bezos of
Amazon.com) putting a lot of money into this (perhaps as businesses, but
essentially still billionaire hobbies). While I wish them well, I think
this approach towards space settlement is misguided. Let's work the
numbers.
The USA has about two million millionaires. There are many more
He said teleoperation not teleportation. (Score:1)
Miami 1982 (Score:1)
Stars? (Score:2)
Why vertical landing? Why not parachutes? (Score:4, Interesting)
Parachutes, on the other hand, are lighter, much cheaper and a lot safer.
Keep it simple.
Re:Why vertical landing? Why not parachutes? (Score:1)
Control? (Score:3, Interesting)
Plus, even a VTOL design can use 'c
Re:Control? (Score:2)
You forgot to mention that the Delta Clipper exploded while trying to land. A landing strut failed, causing it to tip over, busting a fuel tank open. The ball of flame was quite large.
When you land with a parachute, the tanks are empty.
Re:Control? (Score:1)
Re:Control? (Score:2)
A Wise Man Once Said... (Score:2)
Orbiting before it's time? (Score:1)
So the plan is to launch ships into orbit before building ships that can orbit? This doesn't seem wise.
Somebody needs to work on his article writing skills.
Chemical Engines Are Useless (Score:1)
Re:Chemical Engines Are Useless (Score:3, Insightful)
Concern over the use of nuclear energy isn't inherently stupid, though. I have to object every time I hear someone call it "clean". The waste is extremely nasty, but can contain it rather than (barring accidents) spewing it out into the environment. I still haven't seen any convincing
billionaire? Curious'm (Score:1)
Forbes says he's worth $4.3 billion (Score:2)
As for the money Bezos has in Amazon stock - Amazon had sales of over $8 billion last year, is turning a profit, and is growing at 30% a year. Owning a sizeable chunk of that action is about as "real" as it gets.
Re:Forbes says he's worth $4.3 billion (Score:1)
Re:Forbes says he's worth $4.3 billion (Score:2)
if you are saying his wealth is in his stock, I dont think this is a realistic measurement.
Why isn't it a realistic measurement? If I bought $100,000 of Amazon stock, would you say that I wasn't worth $100,000? To put it simply: Jeff Bezos has stuff that he can easily convert into billions of dollars. That makes him a billionaire.
Most of Bill Gate's wealth is in Microsoft, but at the moment that is pretty r
Re:Forbes says he's worth $4.3 billion (Score:1)
Where do I donate? (Score:1)
Where do I sign?
Suggestions for PERMANENT space colonists (Score:1)
Limbuagh
Rumsfeld
Cheney
Oh no.... (Score:1)
When is Allen going to run out of money (Score:1)
Re:Sounds Good (Score:4, Informative)
That said, the real problem with your post is that most of the energy is used up accellerating to >7 km/s. When landing, all of that energy goes into the atmosphere, so vertical/horizontal landing really doesn't change the energy requirements really. Detailed analysis is inconclusive as to which one is better - wings for horizontal landing tend to weigh the same as rocket fuel for vertical landing - and there are many other variables that could go either way, ie: reentry sheilding of wings is hard, but better reentry wings may not need as much shielding, etc.
Re:Sounds Good (Score:1)
whaaaat?
Re:Sounds Good (Score:2)
Of course, we normally use big honking rockets to take off, and expend an obscene amount of energy to do it - but tha
Re:Sounds not so Good (Score:1)
Re:Sounds not so Good (Score:2)
As you say, it does take energy to set up something like this, but no energy to maintain it.
Re:Sounds not so Good (Score:1)
Re:Sounds not so Good (Score:2)
Energy is force times velocity times time. Rockets have a very high exhaust velocity, so they use a lot of energy. Balloons are slow, so they use very little energ
Re:Sounds not so Good (Score:1)
Re:Sounds not so Good (Score:2)
BTW, remember that balloons can't get you to orbit - orbit is a velocity, not an altitude. Ther
Re:Sounds Good (Score:2)
Re:Sounds Good (Score:2)
Re:Sounds Good (Score:2)
You also can't get into orbit, or even on a suborbital path with balloons. It takes a certain amount of energy to get into orbit. Nothing you do will change that. All you can do is figure out the most efficient way of transferring that energy to your ship.
Re:Sounds Good (Score:2)
As for why would you - rockets are much more efficient starting from a higher altitude, an engine failure right off the pad kills everyone (altitude launch opens more abort options), and a rocket uses a lot of energy fighting gravity and the atmosphere in the first par
What happens when rocket quits? (Score:2)
The main problem I have with rocket-thrust landing in the manner of the DC-X is what happens if a rocket engine conks out? Also, when you are coming in for a landing, the aero resistance of your nearly empty fuel tank and light weight means your terminal velocity is low, but to save on fuel, you can't be hovering on engine thrust for very
Re:What happens when rocket quits? (Score:2)
Re:Sounds Good (Score:3, Interesting)
Yes we have. Remember the Roton project?
http://www.spacefuture.com/archive/the_roton_conc
Re:Sounds Good (Score:2)
From your article:
the augmented rocket specific impulse (Isp) will be over 1500 seconds
From the Roton SSTO Wikipedia entry [wikipedia.org]:
Calculations showed that the helicopter blades modestly increased the Specific Impulse (Isp) by about 20-30 seconds, which essentially carried the blades into orbit "for free". Thus, there was no overall gain from this method during ascent. However, the blades could be used to soft land the vehicle.
Who's right?
I know. (Score:1)