It's All About the Ununpentium

spitefulcrow writes "The New York Times is reporting that elements 113 and 115 have been created by a joint team of Russian and American scientists. The temporary names are ununtrium and ununpentium until the experiment has been duplicated and verified in another lab. According to the article, speculation has been made that 'Rather than being round, nuclei in that region and beyond could contain bubbles and have strange doughnut-like shapes'."

Yeah, Yeah

[Naked Chef]

This is like the 3rd time we've heard this, and again the article says "pending verification" from other labs' experiment. I wish they'd hold off on the story until it really is verified independently, and we can all bask in the glory of the new elements... :)

What's the point ?

[vlad_petric]

I'll start by saying that I am not a physicist (by far).

They create heavy elements, which are so unstable that they decay as quickly as they were created.

So I'm wondering - what's the point ? Just getting your name associated with an element in the periodic table ? It seems to me that the money would be better spent in doing stuff with real applications (like producing cheaper anti-matter or getting closer to controlled fusion)

Re:Science Today

[tobechar]

Who is to say that when element 139 or 155 is discovered, it wont be stable and useful?

If there is even the slightest possibility of a new element being useful, the reasearch must go on. What if the next element found turns out to be a safe efficient fuel source? Anything is possible.

Re:Science Today

[Tango42]

If the article is right about them being strangely shaped, then there could be new physics to be discovered, which could lead to all sorts of useful things. Maybe Uranium can be made strangely shaped, and therefore safer to use in reactors, who knows?

Re:Science Today

[Anonymous Coward]

It costs millions, and has no possible direct benefits to the taxpayers who are paying for it. There is even no remote long term benefit from this activity. It's just welfare for white guys with science degrees.

Fuck the taxpayers. They are too dumb to even understand what an element or a state of matter is, anyway. These idiots should work like slaves so the smart people can learn how the universe works. That's what average joes are made for.

Re:Science Today

[zeux]

Many people were claiming the exact same thing when mathematicians started to work on the binary system in the 19th century.

Re:What's the point ?

[Cappy Red]

Seconded... sort of. Slightly less accusatively, I hope.

I don't begrudge them researching superheavy elements... trying to force a scientist who speciallizes in those to research something else is like trying to force a writer to be a dancer -- neither pretty nor effective. I'm just wondering what they can do with the knowledge and theoretical stable atoms they develop.

So... what might we learn, or what might we be able to make?

*honk*

Re:What's the point ?

[jpflip]

As other posters have said, the point is that we learn more about the nucleus - we find out exactly what the half-lives of these nuclei are, etc. This info could have applications to reactors, weapons, energy sources, etc. But the main point is that we know more about the universe. And one never knows where applications will come from. Sometimes a seemingly pointless discovery has a lot of real-world consequences - superconductors, for example, have revolutionized sensor technology for medical scanners and such (though we still don't have them for power lines). Other times, the big result is the spinoffs you come up with along the way - the internet was invented as a way to coordinate particle physics experiments.

Re:Science Today

[TapTapTheChisler]

If it takes millions of dollars (in electricity bills) just to make a few atoms of Element 155, I don't think it will be a new energy source.

Re:Purpose

[FredGray]

Heavy elements provide additional data points that let us test our understanding of nuclear structure and the interactions that hold the protons and neutrons together. The universe is basically powered by nuclear processes, so what we learn about nuclear structure is then related to astrophysics and cosmology.

Take the case of a neutron star--it's made of extremely dense nuclear matter. As elements get heavier and heavier, they become better approximations of the environment of a neutron star.

Re:Protective alright...

[dpilot]

The movie was only rated PG-13, and the bandageware protected it from getting an R. Even two very brief scenes in less didn't up the rating.

(5th Element is one of my favorites, because like Brazil, it strives to attain a 50's view of the future.)