Scientists Who Failed to Warn of Quake Found Guilty of Manslaughter 459
An anonymous reader notes that the BBC reports "Six Italian scientists and an ex-government official have been sentenced to six years in prison over the 2009 deadly earthquake in L'Aquila. A regional court found them guilty of multiple manslaughter. Prosecutors said the defendants gave a falsely reassuring statement before the quake, while the defence maintained there was no way to predict major quakes. The 6.3 magnitude quake devastated the city and killed 309 people." The scientists were first charged more than two years ago.
Re:Misleading summary (Score:5, Interesting)
And if no earthquake had happened, they would have inevitably been accused of causin a panic. The lesson here is don't be a geologist in Italy.
Accountability (Score:5, Interesting)
Where does it start and end?
As a professional engineer, accountability starts the moment you have a license number in your state.
Any opinion you give on any project makes you liable.
The problem is that too many people are giving opinions on subjects that affect other people's lives and have zero accountability. this trial is a precursor to what may eventually become the norm.
Picture these so-called experts on TV talking about this and that and if they are found wrong and someone was affected by it, then they can be held accountable.
The same will be applied to lawyers and politicians and before you know it, people will be better off if we hold people with some sort of power (over other people) accountable.
Re:Misleading summary (Score:5, Interesting)
So you're saying that there are seismologists who CAN predict a likely earthquake a week ahead of time? Interesting. Could you perhaps, provide any evidence these people exist? And tell us why they're not being used to predict earthquakes all over the world in hotspots to save lives?
Re:Moral of the Story (Score:5, Interesting)
I work quite a lot with scientists from Italy in my area (astrophysics). They are among the most dedicated scientists I know and are doing world leading science. They are also among the least well paid - which shows their dedication to science.
The former Italian government (under Berlusconi) tried for years to marginalize science and research in Italy and this is yet another blow to the scientific system in Italy. The result will be disastrous and lead to an even larger brain drain of highly qualified people from Italy than what Italy has already experienced in the past 10-20 years. Everybody can imagine what this means for the long-term future of Italy as a place of innovation and science, which has already been damaged badly.
Re:Misleading summary (Score:5, Interesting)
And if no earthquake had happened, they would have inevitably been accused of causin a panic. The lesson here is don't be a geologist in Italy.
Golly, guess what happened WRT THIS VERY SAME EARTHQUAKE?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_L'Aquila_earthquake#Prior_warning_controversy [wikipedia.org]
Basically A predicted a quake would strike based on multiple measurements, and got a judicial gag order and police breathing down his neck. Its bad for tourism, you know?
B was used as a weapon against A
Quake happens.
A writes papers, makes presentations, gets his gag order lifted, turns out he was correct after all. Whoops.
B gets a sound spanking today.
The real crooks are the cops and civil defense people, not the peons they used as weapons against the guy who correctly predicted the quakes. But they're above the law, so the peons get jail time instead.
In the end, too many people died, therefore either these guys were going to jail or Giuliani was going to jail. All things considered, they probably made the least wrong choice by sending these guys to jail.
As that radio dude used to say "... and now you know the rest of the story"
Re:Moral of the Story (Score:0, Interesting)
Maybe you work with scientists from Italy, but not in Italy. You should educate yourself about academic researchers in Italy. Italian Academia is considered one of the least productive in the developed world by all accounts. They rarely release scientific papers, with the average being a bit less than two in a work lifetime. Now, the ones that leave Italy, like most emigrants, have selected themselves and have a tendency to be the cream of the crop. And without the shackles of decrepit institutions such as Italian ones, they thrive. Go figure.
Re:Misleading summary (Score:2, Interesting)
Have you ever personally visited Italy?
Paid attention to the types of things that happen there?
Read about it's recent (100 years) history?
IMHO Italy is first world by it's economy ONLY. A friend and I visited Rome last year, and we couldn't stand all the things wrong with the place, things that wouldn't be allowed to occur in any other modern Western country.
I wasn't surprised that they were charged. I'm not surprised they were convicted.
The only other country that Italy reminds me of, is Australia's policies with regards to technology (evil) privacy (not) and intellectual policy (raep).
Re:Misleading summary (Score:4, Interesting)
It's not a logical fallacy to state a fact. "You're so fucking ignorant you don't know how this is a bad thing" in this context is actually just a true statement ... ShanghaiBill is either trolling or he is really honestly so fucking ignorant he doesn't know how this is a bad thing. If he doesn't know, he doesn't know ... pointing out a true fact that someone lacks some knowledge is not a logical fallacy.
Re:Misleading summary (Score:4, Interesting)
If I, as an engineer, certify that a plant is safe when it may be not, I can be jailed. I can't see why the same can't apply to this case.
That would be because are not among those who replaced the term "God" with "Science". It's amusing how many on Slashdot scorn the "backwards bible-thumpers" who blindly stick to their faith, yet employ that same blindness because someone happens to be a diploma-carrying scientist. In essence, they have become that which they hate.
To clarify, the problem isn't "God" or "Science", the problem is willful blindness.
Re:Misleading summary (Score:2, Interesting)
Indeed. One of my favorite guilty pleasure authors Douglas Preston moved to Italy and has some interesting stories about it. He became interested in a local case, dubbed The Monster of Florence and was subsequently interrogated by the same prosecutor in charge of the Knox case. The guy asked him repeatedly about satanic sects and a host of other bizarre questions after he criticized the prosecutions evidence against her.
Re:Misleading summary (Score:5, Interesting)
No, we just wont have scientists studying earthquakes anymore because they don't want the liability. This is something we call "shooting the messenger".
Re:Misleading summary (Score:2, Interesting)
The lesson here is don't be a scientist in Italy
TFTFY.
Any scientist makes predictions of one sort or another, and now it seems pretty clear that they can be prosecuted for being wrong. And if they can be jailed, they can surely be sued.
Meteorologists ought to be running for the exits about now. Physicians can't be too far behind. Poincare will be held in detention until he can prove his conjecture.