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LHC Hits an Energy of 3.5TeV 149

Posted by kdawson
from the do-not-look-directly-into-beam-with-your-remaining-eye dept.
Inovaovao writes "As announced on Twitter by the CMS experiment, the LHC has finally accelerated both beams to 3.5 TeV for the first time. It thus broke the previous energy record of 1.18 TeV it had set last fall, about a month since operations started again this year. It'll be a while yet before we see stable beams and collisions at 3.5 TeV. You won't get much of a clue to the timetable by reading the General Manager's pompous announcements. If you want to follow what's going on, look at the Status Ops."
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LHC Hits an Energy of 3.5TeV

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  • by Bananenrepublik (49759) on Friday March 19, 2010 @02:10PM (#31541354)

    The press release you called 'pompous' is one week old -- when the record energy hadn't yet been reached. Apparently going to CERN's front page is too much effort for slashdot's editors. Anyway, here's the current press release [web.cern.ch]

    • by bucky0 (229117) on Friday March 19, 2010 @02:22PM (#31541518)

      Also, IIRC the general director's first language isn't english, so I think the "pompous" the submitter saw was just stemming from that. From what I've heard, he's a nice guy.

      • by MRe_nl (306212) on Friday March 19, 2010 @02:34PM (#31541676)

        That's not pompous, that's just German thoughts translated into English ;).

        • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

          by Anonymous Coward

          That's not pompous, that's just German thoughts translated into English ;).

          You seem to have confused country and language. Those are Swiss thoughts translated into English.

          (Most) Americans speak English (granted, a bastardized form thereof). But that does not make them Her Majesty's subjects ;)

          • That's not pompous, that's just German thoughts translated into English ;).

            You seem to have confused country and language. Those are Swiss thoughts translated into English.

            (Most) Americans speak English (granted, a bastardized form thereof). But that does not make them Her Majesty's subjects ;)

            It's funny how the English think that their language originated from their little island.

          • Re: (Score:3, Funny)

            by K. S. Kyosuke (729550)

            That's not pompous, that's just German thoughts translated into English ;).

            You seem to have confused country and language. Those are Swiss thoughts translated into English

            Schwyzer Duetsch? Make it twice pompous!

          • by MRe_nl (306212)

            Rolf-Dieter Heuer (born 1948) is a German particle physicist and the Director General of CERN.

            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolf-Dieter_Heuer [wikipedia.org]

            Why would he have Swiss thoughts? Other than the usual (Hmmm, molten cheese and chocolate...)

            Granted, i don't know if he wrote the txt, or just signed it.

        • by mzs (595629)

          Exactly, if you want to call anyone pompous it's not Heuer. One of his predecessors on the other hand...

        • by Chris Burke (6130)

          Well that's good, because in the article he says that they hope to have an "inverse femtobarn" of data. Femto is 10^-15, so an inverse femtobarn would be 10^15 barns full of data.

          Which, okay, is a lot of data, but I still wouldn't be acting too pompous if I kept my data in a barn instead of a library like civilized people. I mean what if your sheep eat the data, huh?

          Though it makes me wonder if the German Parliament has their own barn, and if its the largest data barn in

          • by nneonneo (911150)

            Particle physicists have their own terminology for things. The inverse femtobarn [wikipedia.org] is a particular unit of measurement related to data collection on collisions.

            • by Chris Burke (6130)

              Wha? You mean physicists don't REALLY measure data in terms of books stacked up in a barn, and Germans don't use barns as libraries? I never would have guessed that I was actually just making a "How many Libraries of Congress is that?" joke!

    • by kiehlster (844523) on Friday March 19, 2010 @02:30PM (#31541614) Homepage
      Actually, the press release came out today when they reach 3.5 TeV, which is when they actually breached the space-time continuum, thus sending their PR department back in time one week resulting in this back-dated press release.
    • by ceoyoyo (59147) on Friday March 19, 2010 @03:04PM (#31542124)

      The release wasn't pompous anyway. It was clear, outlined what their goals are and put their (nearly) current status in perspective.

      Doesn't Slashdot have editors to turn crappy submissions into reasonable summaries?

      All right, I just exceeded my sarcasm quota for the day in a single statement.

      • I think Slashdot has noticed more people comment when they inject editorials into stories. If the past is any indication, it'll be a year or two before this settles down.

      • by Chousuke (1425315)

        Doesn't Slashdot have editors to turn crappy submissions into reasonable summaries?

        Maybe in Soviet Russia

  • by Mekkah (1651935)
    1.21 gigawatts? 1.21 gigawatts? Great Scott!
    • Re: (Score:3, Funny)

      by JWSmythe (446288)

          I'd explain it all to you, but we don't have time! Well, time is very relative. When it reaches 3.6 TeV, it will open a rift in time that will launch the entire planet back in time. Most likely none of us will ever remember it, so we'll let it happen over and over until ...

          [LHC reaches 3.6 TeV, and the loop begins again....]

      • Most likely none of us will ever remember it, so we'll let it happen over and over until ...

        Yeah, where is Lt.Cmdr. Data when you need him...

        • by JWSmythe (446288)

          I wish you'd stop saying that. I don't know how many times I've read that comment.

              oh...

              shit...

      • ...after the purple pterodactyl drops a scone into a random 2mm wide tube which serves as an exhaust port for a tragically-placed air conditioning unit near the accelerator ring.
        • by JWSmythe (446288)

          Like I told you before, there haven't been Pterodactyls in this or any parallel universe for over 65 million years. This has already been proven through examining the far side of Einstein-Rosen bridges and exchanging information with our peers on on the other sides that we've discussed the matter.

          Don't you remember the loop where the operations at Area 51 were made public. It did shut up the alien conspiracy folks, at least until the LHC got up to speed again at ....

  • Meh. Wake me up when they hit 4.7.
  • Not pompous, (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday March 19, 2010 @02:41PM (#31541788)

    It's pretty outrageous calling the Director General's web update pompous. Someone clearly has an axe to grind. His web page seemed like quite a reasonable summary for the time it was posted. Part of his job is to promote the value of the billions of Euros being spent on CERN.

    • by OzPeter (195038) on Friday March 19, 2010 @02:45PM (#31541838)

      It's pretty outrageous calling the Director General's web update pompous.

      I'd say you were new around here (as kdawson is not known for his intellectual musings), but damn it Anonymous Coward, you've been posting here for longer than I have - so you should know better than to write crap like that.

      • by youn (1516637)

        >but damn it Anonymous Coward, you've been posting here for longer than I have - so you should know better than to write crap like that.

        rofl... that was hilarious :)

    • Probably a Fermilab fanboy.

    • by Em Emalb (452530)

      1024.

    • by mcgrew (92797) *

      Turn in your nerd card; "libraries of congress" refers to computer storage space. TeV is trillions of electron volts. 3.5 is three and a half, which ain't five and ain't two, neither.

  • by hexghost (444585) on Friday March 19, 2010 @02:51PM (#31541916) Homepage

    What I want to know is - when will kdawson not be such a tool?

    • Re: (Score:1, Offtopic)

      by pz (113803)

      What I want to know is - when will kdawson not be such a tool?

      Worst Slashdot editor, ever. There's no hope, other than to stop reading Slashdot when he's approving submissions.
       

      • by Jeng (926980)

        You can go into your account settings and set it to not show you his submissions.

        I would not be surprised if they keep a metric of who has been blocked the most.

        • by pz (113803)

          You can go into your account settings and set it to not show you his submissions.

          I would not be surprised if they keep a metric of who has been blocked the most.

          Perfect, thanks! Ah, the quality of Slashdot just went up.

    • by sa1lnr (669048)

      When Europe disappears into a black hole?

    • What I want to know is - when will kdawson not be such a tool?

      When you learn to use Slashdot's preferences system.

  • Because the world will come to an end as a Higgs Boson Particle is created and all the mass fo the earth is sucked into space equal to the size of a small pea.....

    • Wait when the world is ending and all the matter is being sucked into a black hole your really going to need somone to call you and tell you its happening?
    • Yo Way oh.....

      No one, not even the many Nerds here got the reference......

      Guess I will go back top my job as a security guard class 4....

  • by OzPeter (195038) on Friday March 19, 2010 @02:53PM (#31541934)
    The Press Release tells me what they have achieved in terms of goals, and what goals they hope to achieve over the next year or so. On the other hand the all Status Ops tell me is whether or not the LHC was plugged in over the last 12 hours. Both datasets have their place and both tell me something that the other doesn't or can't.
  • About 3 1/2 mosquitoes. I had no idea how tiny the amounts of energy they are using. http://public.web.cern.ch/Public/en/Science/Glossary-en.php#E [web.cern.ch]
  • 3.5TeV, did the earth move for you honey!?
  • It'll be a while yet before we see stable beams...

    From the CMS e-commentary ."..the beams were extremely stable during this period and had a very long lifetime."

    • by chtephan (460303)

      From the CMS e-commentary ."..the beams were extremely stable
      during this period and had a very long lifetime."

      Yes, but only for about two minutes, then they were dumped because the protection system was acting up. That's a major PITA when running such machines. The protection system is overly sensitive and needs to be carefully tuned to safely detect "safe" conditions and only report minor deviations. Since it has never been run at that energy with beam it it, there are still a few things to sort out, which needs a bit of time (and a certain amount of trial and error). Well, better safe than sorry.

      And, by the w

  • by Low Ranked Craig (1327799) on Friday March 19, 2010 @03:11PM (#31542212)

    Does that make the collision 7 TeV? Serious question - I'm not sure I completely understand the physics. OK. I almost completely don't understand them. I have read that the LHC produced collisions of 14TeV, here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronvolt [wikipedia.org] and that the most energetic cosmic rays are 10^8 TeV. If all that it true, doesn't it completely and totally kill the whole "LHC will destroy the world" bullshit?

    • by Werthless5 (1116649) on Friday March 19, 2010 @03:24PM (#31542360)

      LHC physicist checking in - yes, that will make the collisions 7 TeV. Note that there are no collisions yet, we're still doing work to make sure that the beams are stable and focused properly. Once we have collisions, we'll run at this energy for about a year and a half before shutting down for a year to perform maintenance.

      The LHC never produced 14 TeV collisions, the highest collision it will perform this year is 7 TeV. It is designed to produce 14 TeV collisions, and it will hopefully do that after we finish taking data at 7 TeV. It is true, however, that cosmic ray collisions completely kill the "LHC will destroy the world" bullshit.

      • by Clueless Moron (548336) on Friday March 19, 2010 @03:49PM (#31542672)

        It is true, however, that cosmic ray collisions completely kill the "LHC will destroy the world" bullshit.

        Ah, but you forget that cosmics ray hadrons are natural and organically grown, unlike those nasty synthetic LHC ones which cause obesity, cancer and black holes. Plus they don't taste as good.

        • I think you'll find that if you get hit by the beams from the LHC, you won't have to worry about obesity or cancer. And the only black hole you'll notice is the one that is the entry into your body where it hit you.

      • What is lost on most people is that the luminosity will be relatively low and that while 7 TeV CM is impressive, its not all that matters. Fermilab is down, but not quite out yet!

        • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

          by rminsk (831757)
          In past and present colliders the luminosity culminates around L = 10^32c^-2 s^-1, in the LHC it will reach L = 10^34cm^-2 s^-1. This will be achieved by filling each of the two rings with 2835 bunches of 10^11 particles each.
          • my point was that this has not yet happened, has it? and IIRC most colliders have taken some period of time to meet their initially designed luminosities.

      • Obligatory - http://www.hasthelhcdestroyedtheearth.com/ [hasthelhcd...eearth.com]
      • by QuantumG (50515) *

        Hey, maybe you could answer this question for me.. how much shielding do you think manned spacecraft need from galactic cosmic rays? I've heard people say that the best thing you can do with galactic comic radiation is let it hit you.. of course that's a little hard if you're already shielding for solar radiation.

    • Re: (Score:1, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward

      From their press release:

      "The first attempt to collide beams at 7 TeV (3.5 TeV per beam) will follow on a date to be announced in the near future."

      Source: http://press.web.cern.ch/press/PressReleases/Releases2010/PR05.10E.html

    • by Hurricane78 (562437) <deleted AT slashdot DOT org> on Friday March 19, 2010 @03:45PM (#31542614)

      If all that it true, doesn't it completely and totally kill the whole "LHC will destroy the world".

      You are exactly right. And it’s the failure of every “expert” interviewed who didn’t mention this, and of course of the media hype machine, that that is not well known to everyone.
      Oh, and of course mostly to the loonies who want to stay ignorant.

      and that the most energetic cosmic rays are 10^8 TeV.

      To imagine this: Those particles are so fast that they have the mass of an apple or orange. A subatomic particle! This gives you some feeling for the power.
      And yes, that does mean that they create those tiny black holes all the time in our atmosphere.
      If this would create black holes, earth would have never existed.

      • And yes, that does mean that they create those tiny black holes all the time in our atmosphere.
        If this would create black holes, earth would have never existed.

        Potentially, but we haven't yet proven that micro black holes can be created by particle collisions. If it turns out they can be created however, it would certainly imply that they are not a risk to the planet.

        • by Tablizer (95088)

          Potentially, but we haven't yet proven that micro black holes can be created by particle collisions. If it turns out they can be created however, [cosmic ray-created blackholes] would certainly imply that they are not a risk to the planet.

          Maybe the core of the Earth *is* full of mini-blackholes and the Earth would be a few thousand miles larger in volume if not for them. We always assumed the weight was due to an iron core, but maybe it's mostly holes instead.

          • No. On earth the (a-)holes live on the surface. And nowadays they easily can outweigh an iron core. ;)

  • http://www.everything2.com/title/Stop+killing+me+now [everything2.com]

    Requires some knowledge of the many worlds interpretation or the anthropic principle though.

    • http://www.everything2.com/title/Stop+killing+me+now [everything2.com]

      Requires some knowledge of the many worlds interpretation or the anthropic principle though.

      Of course, according to MWI, you are killed all the time even without the LHC. After all, if it can happen, and be it with absurdly low probability, then it will happen in some world. There are worlds where the whole earth collapses into a black hole not because of some LHC experiment, but just due to an unusually large quantum fluctuation. There are worlds where is just happens that no oxygen molecule finds its way into your nose for several minutes, and you suffocate. There are worlds where the nucleons i

    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by Hurricane78 (562437)

      The whole text is based on the arrogant, ignorant and retarded Fermi “paradox”.
      It is arrogant and ignorant because it states that we don’t see any aliens, so there must be no aliens, so where is everybody?? Which is just as retarded as a blind man going “i don’t see humans, so there must be no humans, so where is everybody??”
      Or your doc going “There is no cure to this disease.”. When in reality he should say “I don’t know a cure to this disease.

  • Who cares? (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Schickeneder (1454639)

    I don't mean to offend anyone, but why is this even such a big deal? Sure it's a new record, but why is it posted seemingly every week. Tomorrow we can expect another headline reading 3.6TeV.

    Didn't they design this thing to run at much higher energy levels anyway?

    Perhaps considering the frequency of problems they have been experiencing, the merit here is that it is, for the time being, running without something else exploding, leaking or burning up.

    I'm more interested in the actual results of experiments wh

    • Re:Who cares? (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Steve Max (1235710) on Friday March 19, 2010 @04:17PM (#31543054) Journal

      Actually, this goes in steps. They went from ~1.18TeV (which was already the highest energy for a proton beam ever achieved in lab) to 3.5TeV. The experiments will run at 3.5TeV for some time, then another shutdown to get them to the design energy of 7TeV per beam (14 TeV per collision). All is happening as planned.

      The "problems" you mention happened with every single collider, ever. When you get to a new scale, you expect things to happen differently from your original idea; so you plan to allow time to solve problems. The accelerator itself is an experiment, and one that is going very well.

      You want hard results? ALICE [aliceinfo.cern.ch] published a science paper [arxiv.org] on collisions almost four months ago. You can see more from ALICE [stanford.edu], ATLAS [stanford.edu], CMS [stanford.edu] and LHCb [stanford.edu]. Lots of simulations, descriptions and detection methods, but at least the two "smaller" groups (LHCb and ALICE) have measurements already, at one sixth of the energy they were designed to work on. In fact, LHCb will only have actual b hadrons to see when they start colliding protons at 3.5TeV; but they still could find a meaningful result to publish, sooner than anticipated by anyone with even passing understanding of collider physics. Is that enough? Or do people actually believe things go like this [xkcd.com]?

  • I though the best way to get updates was to just hack into a computer at the LHC [bbc.co.uk].
  • Is 3.5 TeV enough to power my Delorian?

  • ...don't cross the beams!
  • be conservative in what you send, liberal in what you accept
  • LHC Webcam (Score:4, Funny)

    by Temujin_12 (832986) on Friday March 19, 2010 @04:53PM (#31543628)

    This is good news. Check out their webcam. [cyriak.co.uk]

  • pompous? (Score:2, Insightful)

    by vaderj (1035706)
    I would say the guy in charge of the largest and most expensive machine in the known universe has a right to be a little pompous
  • When it hit's 1.2 gigawatts you can go back in time!

    • by Sulphur (1548251)

      When it hit's 1.2 gigawatts you can go back in time!

      Back where, and in time for what?

  • All I hear is how they keep turning it on and shutting it down.
  • Is it just me, or does the good Dr. Rolf Heuer resemble a slightly shaggier Dr. Breen? Huh ...

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