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How does this apply to ... (Score:2)
Why do we sleep? (Score:5, Interesting)
It's going to be a long time before we find out if regular modafinil users get early Alzheimer's.
P.S. It's been over an hour, and it still isn't possible to reply to this article. I'll post this when Slashdot works. I predict about 30 people claiming First Post.
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Re:Why do we sleep? (Score:4, Interesting)
Could delaying the inevitable onset of Alzheimer's be the biological function of sleep? Last I heard, the purpose of sleep wasn't entirely clear, and there were anecdotal reports of people basically eliminating it with drugs, sometimes with little ill-effect. I've long been of the opinion that if wakefullness promoting agents don't have short-term effects, there must be a longer-term negative impact, because if there weren't, the body would synthesise something similar, at least in people who are sufficiently well-fed not to mind the extra energy usage. Sleeping is basically a good chance to get eaten. It's going to be a long time before we find out if regular modafinil users get early Alzheimer's.
I'd credit your theory; however there has been some research that shows Caffeine can also act against Alzheimer's. When consumed regularly it appears to slow it's progress as well as somewhat mitigating the symptoms.
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OTOH, they're not without downsides. See, amphetamines work by increasing the catecholamine (particularly norepinephrine) levels in the brain. They push the catecholamines out of the storage vesicles into the synapses. (FWIW, cocaine works by preventing neurotransmitters from being absorbe
Re:Why do we sleep? (Score:5, Interesting)
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Sleeping is basically a good chance to get eaten.
I suspect sleeping has a higher level function as well, like getting rid of all the crap you accumulate in your head throughout the day. Maybe some (perhaps non-essential, just useful) chemicals in our brain tend to run out when awake, and sleep is needed to restock them.
However, awake is only one state of mind out of many, it'd be foolish to disregard most of them. (I don't consider "auto-pilot on the highway" awake, for example.)
Re:Why do we sleep? (Score:4, Insightful)
Sleeping is basically a good chance to get eaten.
Not necessarily. Wandering around in the open is probably a lot more dangerous than being holed up in a lair - especially if your sensory organs are optimized for night and it is day or vice versa. Plus, animals and people are very highly attuned to certain noises while asleep - basically if it sounds like something is approaching or entering the lair most animals will quickly transition from sleep to fully awake.
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Re:Why do we sleep? (Score:4, Interesting)
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Re:Why do we sleep? (Score:5, Informative)
Could delaying the inevitable onset of Alzheimer's be the biological function of sleep? Last I heard, the purpose of sleep wasn't entirely clear
What? No. There are at least two functions of sleep that I know of: one is cleaning up misshapen proteins that accumulate during the day (and may be what causes tiredness). The other is transcription of short-term memory into long-term memory. Evolutionarily speaking, nobody ever lived long enough to get Alzheimers. Those who did wandered off into the tundra and didn't burden the tribe any longer.
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Re:Why do we sleep? (Score:4, Interesting)
You first point is (seemingly) correct. Sleep is not evolution's way of preventing Alzheimer's Disease. Your second point is incorrect.
Healthy old folks are directly beneficial to social groups. They remember how to solve problems. They can take care of grandchildren while the parents are off gathering food. And many social groups had old folks. Sure, most people didn't live to get very old. But some did.
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Re:Why do we sleep? (Score:4, Insightful)
Healthy old folks are directly beneficial to social groups. They remember how to solve problems. They can take care of grandchildren while the parents are off gathering food. And many social groups had old folks. Sure, most people didn't live to get very old. But some did.
That's absolutely true of grandparents, but we're talking about great-great grandparents here, from a bio-evolutionary standpoint.
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Also linked to lyme disease... (Score:5, Interesting)
Through his research, and with the help of other leading researchers in the field of molecular and cellular biology, Dr. MacDonald is pioneering a broader understanding about the behavior of Borrelia burgdorferi, the bacteria that causes Lyme disease. He has appeared as an invited lecturer at Lyme symposia, including the ILADS National Scientific Meetings and Columbia University/Lyme Disease Association conferences in Philadelphia, PA, where he presents the findings from his explorations into the connection between Borrelia spirochetal infection and Alzheimer's disease.
Dr. Alan MacDonald: "Using the syphilis model, I began to study some autopsied brains, and found that I was able to identify spirochetes in autopsied brain tissue in the hippocampus, which is one of the areas that Alzheimer's disease tends to target in every patient. I was able to grow spirochetes from autopsied Alzheimer's brain tissue, and stain the spirochetes with special monochromal antibodies, through the techniques I learned and developed through the study of stillborn babies with Lyme disease. And those two positive results made me think even more strongly that some Alzheimer's might be like syphilis, a late manifestation of the bacterial infection in the brain, not to say that all Alzheimer's disease is related to Lyme disease, but some."
Not enough is known about Lyme Disease and its relation to Alzheimer's, ALS, MS, Fybromyalgia, etc. But, you can be sure Dr. MacDonald will be at the forefront.
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That'd be pretty great. the number of tickbites is certain to decrease, and, if it's identified as a major thread, can certainly be avoided almost entirely. But it's only been published in a single paper called "Medical Hypotheses" and there are a number of other diseases mentioned as possible causes: "In both AD and/or the tSEs, transmissible agents and infectious proteins have been postulated to be aetiological factors [4], [8], [11], [12] and [13]. These include bacteria such as Chlamydia pneumoniae [14]
Got an idea if you don't have time for sleep (Score:2, Funny)
I stayed up all night... (Score:5, Funny)
Implications for other Mental Diseases? (Score:4, Interesting)
Could this plaque, and its base cause of sleep deprivation also be the cause of some mental illnesses? I have heard that Alzheimer's Disease resembles both Schizophrenia and Bipolar. Maybe this might have implications for those tragic diseases.
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I do hope that only sleeping 3.5 hrs a day (on average) for my entire life won't have the detrimental payback of Alzheimer's. But, then again, there is a price to pay for everyth
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To amplify: They are sedative, but they are most assuredly not glorified sleeping pills - a benzodiazepine, a barbiturate, or a central anticholinergic would be what people think of as sleeping pills, and none of those would work.
They act as "mood stabilizer
Do Naps Count? (Score:3, Interesting)
I went 2-3 days w/out sleep in college, now(15 years later) I can hardly make it through the day without a nap.
7 hours a night is my minimum or I am definitely off my A Game that day. Some nights I need 10.
What happened to needing less sleep as we get older?
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I'm suspecting sleep apnea [sleepapnea.org] for myself. Sleepiness, brain fog, slow thinking, lack of willpower, even mild depression... all can be caused by it. I'm seeing a doctor about it next week. I wonder if it ties into Alzheimer's now. My grandfather had both.
Re:Do Naps Count? (Score:4, Interesting)
I had the same thing as you - in college, I could go more than a day without sleep. I'd definitely be dragging that second day, but I could do it. After college, and as time wore on, I found that I just needed more and more sleep. On weekends, I would sometimes get 12+ hours of sleep - and I'd still be tired!! I'd sometimes take naps on weekend afternoons.
For me, the problem was that I had obstructive sleep apnea. That's where you stop breathing when you fall asleep (your brain wakes you up just enough that you start breathing again, but not enough that you become aware that you woke up.) Most people who have sleep apnea aren't even aware they have a problem, they just assume you should be tired all the time.
I was finally diagnosed last year, and I did a sleep study**. They gave me a CPAP machine - I wear the mask whenever I sleep, and the CPAP machine pushes air into me. Effectively, it's inflating my airway so it doesn't close during the night. I'm a totally different person now! I don't need naps, and I sleep about 7-8 hours a night before I wake up normally.
If you're feeling the same way (naps during the day, needing more time every night to get rested) you might want to see a sleep specialist and ask for a sleep study.
My [twin] brother reported similar symptoms as you, and I eventually convinced him to see his doctor about it. Turns out, he also has apnea, got a CPAP, and is much better.
** For you fellow CPAP users out there, let's compare numbers: I had 57 sleep disruptions per hour, and my CPAP pressure is 14, no EPR.
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Re:Do Naps Count? (Score:5, Interesting)
With the old people I've talked to who need less sleep, it seems they are also at the same time not quite getting the exercise and proper nutrition they need to keep their body sustained. Sleeping is work for your body, it spends the time in repairs. If you don't have the right nutrients, it's harder.
Sometime try fasting for a couple days and see how it affects your sleep. Instead of skipping food completely, you can try going on a 900 calorie diet for a while. Pretty soon you will find that your don't sleep as long, but that you aren't as well rested either. The worst is when you sleep a full six hours, but find you feel as though you haven't slept at all.
If you don't eat all the nutrients you need, say you don't eat enough vegetables, the same thing will happen to you, but on a longer scale. It may take years for the lack of broccoli in your diet to show up in your body, but eventually it will, and you will feel it. That happens to a lot of old people.
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As a graduate student... (Score:4, Funny)
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You have a choice:
You can stop Grad school now and hope that the ill effects are mild or negligent.
You can continue Grad school, and forget it all immediately after.
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Cool discovery (Score:2)
I guess I can try for the fake-pretending-I-understand, "an increased amyloid-beta plaque load?? Why of course! The meta-prozoids all make sense now!!" OR vaguely humorous, "Why plaque? That only grows on teeth!!!"
Anyway, just saying that even though I don't always comment on these stories, that doesn't mean I don't find them interesting. Th
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Amyloid-beta Desposits != Dementia (Score:5, Interesting)
Alzheimer's suffers have amyloid-beta plaque deposits in their brains. Usually. Not always.
There are people who have amyloid-beta deposits in the brains. Some of them have dementia, including Alzheimer's. Not all.
Amyloid-beta plaque can be cleared from the brain by immunization. The dementia occurs anyway.: ...
AB42 Immunisation Clears Brain Plaques, Does Not Prevent Dementia
http://www.pslgroup.com/dg/225f1e.htm [pslgroup.com]
Thus, this article should read "Amyloid-Beta Plaque Desposition and Clearing Possibly Associated With Sleep", and any implied link to Alzheimer's saved until the discussion section at the end.
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Alzheimer's suffers have amyloid-beta plaque deposits in their brains. Usually. Not always.
There are people who have amyloid-beta deposits in the brains. Some of them have dementia, including Alzheimer's. Not all.
Amyloid-beta plaque can be cleared from the brain by immunization. The dementia occurs anyway.: ...
AB42 Immunisation Clears Brain Plaques, Does Not Prevent Dementia
http://www.pslgroup.com/dg/225f1e.htm [pslgroup.com]
Thus, this article should read "Amyloid-Beta Plaque Desposition and Clearing Possibly Associated With Sleep", and any implied link to Alzheimer's saved until the discussion section at the end.
There is a family of amyloids associated with Alzheimer's and dementia, of which AÃY42 is only one. While AÃY42 is typically the quickest to aggregate, AÃY40 can cause dementia just as easily (though it takes a lifetime to aggregate enough of it).
"... can cause dementia just as easily ..." implies a persistent belief in causation despite the reference providing evidence that one of the two obviously is not causative. What can be taken as adequately supported understanding of causation is the fact that Ab40 accumulation (by far the majority of plaque deposit) is seeded by the earlier accumulation of Ab42 (and 43) that forms tendrils much faster, attracting Ab40 out of 'diffuse plaque', the solution of non-tendrilled amyloid beta proteins with a hydro
But... But... But... (Score:3, Funny)
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holtzman effect (Score:2)
Did anyone else think it odd that this had nothing to do with Dune? This wasn't the Holtzman Effect I was looking for.
I was going to comment.. (Score:2)
..but I'm too tired, and I forgot what I was going to say.
Sorry, nothing to see here... (Score:2)
I was going to post something insightful, (Score:2)
Woohoo! (Score:2)
Enjoy your dementia, overachievers!
Sleep Deprivation = Possible Link to *Everything* (Score:2)
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