Magpies Are Self-Aware 591
FireStormZ writes "Magpies can recognize themselves in a mirror, confounding the notion that self-awareness is the exclusive preserve of humans and a few higher mammals. It had been thought only four species of apes, bottlenose dolphins, and Asian elephants shared the human ability to recognize their own bodies in a mirror. But German scientists reported on Tuesday that magpies, a species with a brain structure very different from mammals, could also identify themselves. It had been thought that the neocortex brain area found in mammals was crucial to self-recognition. Yet birds, which last shared a common ancestor with mammals 300 million years ago, don't have a neocortex, suggesting that higher cognitive skills can develop in other ways."
Crows, for one (Score:5, Informative)
Crows have been observed making tools [sciencemag.org] and using them.
Birds are in general a lot smarter than we've given them credit for. It might be time to rethink the term 'bird brain'.
Re:Magpies are evil. (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Roadside magpies (Score:1, Informative)
Most pheasants are not wild - at least here in the UK. They're reared then released as shotgun fodder. This might explain why they seem stupid.
No experience of the outside world.
Re:Crows, for one (Score:4, Informative)
Re:I knew magpies are quite "smart" (Score:3, Informative)
Artificial neural networks bear little to no resemblance to biological ones. Modeling a brain is a bit more difficult than training a system of artificial 'neurons' to approximate a (possibly unknown) function.
Biological neural networks are comprised of many more units of much higher complexity and containing much more variety than we could hope to simulate even on a tiny scale yet, even if we had a list of all the types of neurons and connections required. Add to this that the cells themselves exist in a chemical environment where oxygen, hormones and surrounding cells play a key role in the whole system and our efforts to digitise ourselves are, with the present state of technology, totally and utterly feeble.
Simulating an avian brain is going to be no easier - we still need all the knowledge about brain structure that we simply don't have. We are probably in fact closer to being able to simulate our own brains - a lot more research has gone in to our brains than those of Magpies.
Re:Problems with the mirror mark test (Score:2, Informative)
European vs Australian magpies? (Score:3, Informative)
Magpies also have been known to kick the shit out of people. Some of them even going so far as to attack just a single person over and over again.
I had a lady friend who was in Cann River, OZ and before visiting she'd had a magpie attack and beat the hell out of her head.
This is not meant to be a excerpt from "The Holy Grail", but you aren't confusing Australian and European magpies are you? They are completely different birds. European magpies aren't the aggressive b***ers that Aussie ones are during the breeding season.
Re:Crows, for one (Score:3, Informative)
I don't think you understand what he's talking about. It's not about soul, it's about rationalising excuses to treat others badly.
Re:Crows, for one (Score:3, Informative)
Herons (and other birds) have also been known to learn to fish with bait. Since this is not a common behaviour, it is supposed that each bird has to figure it out for itself, possibly by watching what happens when people throw bread into duckponds.
Can't be bothered to post a link. Google 'heron bread fish' for more details.
Re:Crows, for one (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Magpies are evil. (Score:3, Informative)
These are probably not the same as the Magpies talked about in this story. These are European magpies, which are a completely different family of birds. The European version are a lot smaller.
Re:Cheeping Weasel... (Score:2, Informative)
As to the Self Aware Magpies, I think they're great. I have all their album.
Re:Crows, for one (Score:3, Informative)
My "automatic vision systems" teacher gave an interesting lecture about research on hens. Hens are awfully dumb.
It's well known that chickens are stupid. Any animal kept in captivity and inbred for generations for food and raised on steroids can't be that bright. Turkeys are also colossally stupid.
Re:Roadside magpies (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Crows, for one (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Looping behaviour (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Crows, for one (Score:2, Informative)
Actually, survival of the fittest only removes traits that are likely to cause death prior to breeding. If it does not prevent breeding, then it will not go away, whether it's used or not. Just the same, it doesn't inspire new mutations that add or remove parts. All that we can really suppose on this, is that the dumb chickens breed more than the smart chickens.
Seriously. We're talking about a creature whose behavior fails to change, after its head has been removed.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ATz3AdbjyRI [youtube.com]
http://www.miketheheadlesschicken.org/story.html [mikethehea...hicken.org]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_the_Headless_Chicken [wikipedia.org]
Re:Crows, for one (Score:2, Informative)
I've seen a video of a crow fashioning a hook out of a piece of wire and using it to snare something from the bottom of a glass beaker which exceeded the length of the crow's beak.
Here's the video you saw [ted.com] and here's more about the research about crow intelligence [wireless.is].