'Mind Doping' Becoming More Common

runamock writes "The Los Angeles Times is running a story on the growing use of 'mind drugs': 'Forget sports doping. The next frontier is brain doping. ... Despite the potential side effects, academics, classical musicians, corporate executives, students and even professional poker players have embraced the drugs to clarify their minds, improve their concentration or control their emotions. Unlike the anabolic steroids, human growth hormone and blood-oxygen boosters that plague athletic competitions, the brain drugs haven't provoked similar outrage. People who take them say the drugs aren't giving them an unfair advantage but merely allow them to make the most of their hard-earned skills.'" There's an interesting comment on this topic in Fresh Air's top cultural trends of 2007 broadcast.

The proper term is...

[kimanaw]

nootropics [wikipedia.org]

Interesting the term never surfaced in the article...perhaps the author needs some. OTOH, the number of misspelled, grammatically flawed entries here would indicate many of us could use a little mental boost.

Re:aren't these amphetamine like effects?

[nxtw]

A lot of the drugs *are* amphetamines, including Adderall (generic form - mixed amphetamine salts) and Desoxyn (methamphetamine).

Others (Ritalin, Concerta & generics) are methylphenidate, which is very similar to amphetamine.

First hand experiences

[jago25_98]

I have experimented with Nootropil.

It worked, in a subtle way. And bear in mind the down is bigger than the up, useful for getting out of a dopey mood. Could be a lifesaver if you had to perform. However, you should be able to make yourself alert without drugs.

However:

- it doesn't fix confidence, just the ability to think quick if you want it
- you can still feel sleepy or lazy. If at a party it just prevents that mind freeze
- the next day I felt as dopey as I felt alert before; i.e. the low is a little greater than the high so you have to be prepared for this
- it creates dependency. You notice the times of not being on it more, obviously, the drugs don't work

I now keep just a few half tabs in case I need to drive back from somewhere for work / prevent getting stranded and for emergencies.

That's my experience on the subject.

Re:Semantics

[nxtw]

There is a difference, mainly in operation.

These stimulants (Adderall, Ritalin, other amphetamine/amphetamine-like drugs) have an effect as soon as the chemicals reach your brain. Much like caffeine or nicotine, the effects last for awhile and taper off. They can be consumed whenever without any withdrawal (at normal doses). For example, someone might take these drugs twice a year for finals.

Prozac and other antidepressants tend to take a few weeks before results are felt at all. Those kinds of drugs rely on altering brain chemistry and generally must be taken on a schedule to remain effective, and can even have negative effects if you miss a dose. You can't just take them whenever you're feeling upset and get an effect 20 minutes later.

The List of Drugs

[ukemike]

The medicine cabinet of so-called cognitive enhancers also includes Ritalin, commonly given to schoolchildren for attention deficit hyperactivity disorder, and beta blockers, such as the heart drug Inderal. Researchers have been investigating the drug Aricept, which is normally used to slow the decline of Alzheimer's patients.

Sharon Morein-Zamir, a psychologist at Cambridge University who writes about the ethics of brain enhancement, said her interest in the medications was largely academic. But when someone she knew who had been taking Provigil for a neurological condition offered her some pills, Morein-Zamir's curiosity was piqued.
"I knew the literature and wondered what it felt like," she said.
The drug helped her focus as she worked at her computer for hours straight. But she wondered if it was a placebo effect.

Prescriptions for Inderal and other beta blockers can be readily obtained from physicians. Tuck said some doctors had told her they used the drugs themselves to calm their own nerves before making presentations at medical meetings. Musicians say their drug use is all aboveboard.

and finally a few comments on negative side effects...

But cosmetic neurology, as some call it, has risks. Ritalin, Adderall and other ADHD drugs can cause headaches, insomnia and loss of appetite. Provigil can make users nervous or anxious and bring on headaches, while beta blockers can cause drowsiness, fatigue and wheezing.

One Stanford University study found that low doses of Aricept improved the performance of healthy pilots as they tried to master new skills in a flight stimulator, but the side effects -- dizziness and vomiting -- were less than desirable in a pilot.

Adderall and Inderal on the same page?

[pentlappy]

Stimulants (amphetamines, modafinil) can be addictive (or have potential to be--modafinil is Schedule IV), beta-blockers (Inderal, aka propanolol) cannot. There is a huge, huge difference between the two. Beta-blockers have long been indicated for anxiety and are well tolerated in most patients, your grandfather is probably on beta-blockers, I'm not really sure what relevance they have to TFA. I guess the journalist here doesn't know the difference or just doesn't care.

(Not a doctor, not a pharm anything, just an ordinary medical student speaking. Merry Christmas!)

Re:speed

[gambolt]

It's the impurities resulting from home manufacturing methods that cause most of the problems you hear about. Plus, the therapeutic doses used in psychiatry are hundreds of times smaller than those used recreationaly. Speaking as someone who has taken Dexedrine every day for ADD for fifteen years, I can tell you that I get more of a buzz and more side effects from a double espresso. If i were to snort a whole month's worth at a time, on the other hand, I'd probably have some nasty side effects.

There is a world of difference between responsible use of stimulants for psychiatric purposes or even for cognitive enhancement and abusing them to get fucked up. At small doses cognitive functioning is enhanced and high doses it's inebriating. It's the difference between a cup of coffee and a box of no-doze.

Musicians

[Nautical Insanity]

Mind doping is becoming more common? I'm a music performance major in college. For years classical musicians have been taking beta blockers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beta_blockers [wikipedia.org]) to alleviate nervous tension and the shakes that come with high-pressure situations such as auditions and recitals. When you and a hundred other people each have fifteen minutes to perform the most difficult orchestral literature ever written in front of a jury that is searching for the most nanoscopic flaw in your playing just to make their lives easier, many people will do anything to get an inch of edge. Even for university ensemble auditions there are students who use them.

Granted, not every classical musician you see on stage is taking pills. But there are a number who will not go on stage without them. Personally, I subscribe to the banana method. Large quantities of bananas eaten for a week before a high-pressure situation is a common "natural" practice amongst my peers as well.

But mind doping something new? Bah! This practice has been going on for a long time in the music world.

Re:That word does not mean what you think it does

[xouumalperxe]

They can be euphoric depending on the user.

The canonical example is of course good old alcohol.

Re:Awesome

[Klaus_1250]

If we are going to hand out tips, here are a few: - Stay away from bright lightsources one or two hours before going to bed; e.g. dim the lights and don't sit behind a computer. - Try a herb like Valerian. It can help, but for some it also has the opposite effect. Start out slow and see if it works for you. - Do some physical workout an hour or half hour before going to bed. I don't get tired mentally (at least not on a 24 hour rotation), but physical tiredness can help you sleep. - Figure out your biological clock. Not everyone can live on a 24 hour rotation, in fact, there are some known sleep-disorders caused by having a biological clock running at 26 or even 30 hours. Mine isn't working at 24 hours either. Not easy to adjust your life to, but depending on your job, it might be doable. - Make sure you wake up properly. Alarm clocks do more harm than good, something like a wake-up light helps people wake up better and go to bed more easily. - If it becomes are serious problem, seek help of a professional, but be careful with meds. Some have serious side-effects in the long run.

Re:One word that we can all relate to;

[lysergic.acid]

it's said that Paul Erdos was a habitual coffee drinking and user of amphetamines and was one of the most prolific mathematicians of his time because of it. however, you can't just expect to use stimulants to automatically make yourself smarter--just ask all the burnt out meth/crack addicts at NA meetings.

stimulants are definitely proven to improve one's general cognitive abilities, but only if used correctly. while moderate amounts of CNS stimulation can improve one's thinking, after a certain point you reach the point of over-stimulation and productivity drops dramatically with the increase of stimulation.

so if you're using meth to get high you're probably not going to gain the positive cognitive effects of stimulant use. but if you're drinking 1-2 cups of a coffee a day, then it probably does help increase your productivity. but then there are still other trade-offs, such as hypertension/insomnia/dependency. for some people it's hard to strike the perfect balance, and it may be easier to just go the natural route altogether.

Re:Flashback!

[Mike89]

Want the audience to feel sad? In goes some depressants

Despite the name, depressants don't make you sad, they just 'depress' the nervous system (AFAIK..)

Re:speed

[Puff Daddy]

Adderal is a terrible plague afflicting the youth of this country, but it IS NOT methamphetamine. Not even a little bit, not a chance. Also, from what I've seen, shooting meth DOES cause skin lesions. It's debatable whether that's a direct effect or a result of the user picking at his face, but it is real. It does not rot teeth; it does cause the user to grind their teeth, potentially causing damage. This is exactly the same effect that ecstasy has - ever seen an E-tard with a pacifier? That's why. Both adderal and meth cause decreased hunger and, as such, can contribute to anorexia. As for permanent brain damage, one use isn't going to give you Parkinson's, but it's not helping. In short, giving kids adderal is bad, but giving them meth would be much, much worse. In fact, the worst damage I've seen adderal cause is the mindset that meth is a drug with similar risks.

Re:speed

[Anonymous Coward]

There is no methamphetamine nor benzedrine in adderall.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adderall#Chemistry [wikipedia.org]