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Comments: 131 +-   Honeybees Might Prompt Faster Internet Server Technology on Monday November 19 2007, @03:20AM

Posted by Zonk on Monday November 19 2007, @03:20AM
from the heard-the-buzz-about-it dept.
internet
science
technology
coondoggie writes "The Georgia Institute of Technology is working on the theory that honeybees can give us hints about how to improve the speed and efficiency of Internet servers. Honeybees somehow manage to efficiently collect a lot of nectar with limited resources and no central command. Such swarm intelligence of these amazingly organized bees can also be used to improve the efficiency of Internet servers faced with similar challenges." This has some similarities to the rules of the swarm discussion we had last week.
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The Rules of the Swarm 166 comments
Submission: Honeybees prompt faster Internet server technology by coondoggie (973519)
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  • Oblig (Score:4, Funny)

    by crowbarsarefornerdyg (1021537) on Monday November 19 2007, @03:22AM (#21404867)
    I for one welcome our new swarming server overlords!

  • clusters ? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by jacquesm (154384) <j.ww@com> on Monday November 19 2007, @03:28AM (#21404915) Homepage
    I think bees (or ants) should get the all-time patent rights to clustering a number of not so intelligent nodes into something that exhibits a higher degree of intelligence.

    It's still quite hard to come up with stuff that is not in some way already present in nature. If you are prepared to accept a certain level of metaphor.

    • See: MUTE (Score:5, Interesting)

      by trawg (308495) on Monday November 19 2007, @04:19AM (#21405183) Homepage
      MUTE is a privacy-protecting p2p application: MUTE's routing mechanism is inspired by ant behavior. [sourceforge.net]

    • I think bees (or ants) should get the all-time patent rights to clustering a number of not so intelligent nodes into something that exhibits a higher degree of intelligence.
      The human brain is by far the best example of that.

       
    • I used an ACO algorithm in a system to direct cow corpse recovery trucks. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ant_colony_optimization [wikipedia.org]

      I wonder if the people at the The Georgia Institute of Technology (git?) has nightmares with bees running through a series of tubes as I had about giant cow-corpse-eating zombie ants.
    • "I think bees (or ants) should get the all-time patent rights to clustering a number of not so intelligent nodes into something that exhibits a higher degree of intelligence."

      Actually I think their "higher intelligence" isn't actually higher, I think it is combined by sheer "raw ability" of each individual bee to optimally find the correct path along a geometry. In my mind it's actually a function of little minds, navigating a geometric space optimally.

    • Re:clusters ? (Score:5, Funny)

      by poot_rootbeer (188613) on Monday November 19 2007, @09:57AM (#21407045)
      I think bees (or ants) should get the all-time patent rights to clustering a number of not so intelligent nodes into something that exhibits a higher degree of intelligence.

      Which is not to say that there isn't any room for improvement. There's a lot to be learned from wolves, for example, where each member of the pack serves a unique and important role.

      It's quite likely that by combining aspects of many of these ecologies, we could create a system even more efficient than any individual one.

      Imagine a Bee-Wolf cluster...

    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by daem0n1x (748565)
      Very much the opposite of humans who are very intelligent but, as a crowd, behave in a very stupid way.

  • Compulsory Comcast comment (Score:5, Funny)

    by BestNicksRTaken (582194) on Monday November 19 2007, @03:35AM (#21404957)
    Its not good making a new internet protocol, Comcast will only block it!
  • Combining them is now called a virtual dance floor. Either that or I don't get this article.

  • Nanny nanny boo boo. (Score:4, Funny)

    by rice_burners_suck (243660) on Monday November 19 2007, @03:38AM (#21404983)
    heh heh. This so-called "swarm intelligence" will do nothing to teach us how to make efficient web servers. The hive and the swarm of bees operate efficiently but not because they have some sort of innate intelligence that allows them to do so. They operate in this manner because they are programmed to do so. The actions of each bee are based on something akin to a computer program. This program is designed in such a manner that when many units are executing it in parallel, with each unit operating on its own timer, so that statistically all parts of the program are being executed simultaneously across the bees in the swarm, the result is the efficient overall operation that we witness. However the point is that the individual program is designed so that the overall program will execute efficiently, regardless of where any particular instance of the individual program might be in its program code. Who did this programming? God. And the crazy thing is that beehives are only one tiny part of it. The overall program encompasses the entire universe. So ha ha ha... cuz you can study those bees all day long and it won't make you a better web programmer.

    • Re:Nanny nanny boo boo. (Score:5, Funny)

      by stranger_to_himself (1132241) on Monday November 19 2007, @04:34AM (#21405237) Journal

      cuz you can study those bees all day long and it won't make you a better web programmer.

      No, but you'll be a web programmer who knows a lot about bees. Think of the possibilities!

    • Re:Nanny nanny boo boo. (Score:5, Funny)

      by arevos (659374) on Monday November 19 2007, @07:16AM (#21406001) Homepage

      Who did this programming? God. And the crazy thing is that beehives are only one tiny part of it. The overall program encompasses the entire universe. So ha ha ha... cuz you can study those bees all day long and it won't make you a better web programmer.
      I'll say. This God character has put together something pretty impressive in only a week, but it's all indecipherable spaghetti code. Where are the comments? The well-named functions? The bloody documentation? We're stuck with this system, and working out what the hell is does is pretty much a full time job for millions of experts. You think you've seen bad COBOL systems? Take a look at Universe 1.0; it's got so many quirks and undocumented features that it'll make your head spin just trying to understand what the hell it's doing half the time. I mean, sure, maybe quantum superposition made sense as an optimization feature at the time, but some, any, documentation on it might help!

      • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

        by McD (209994)

        This God character has put together something pretty impressive in only a week, but it's all indecipherable spaghetti code.

        In Lisp or Perl? [xkcd.com]

        I have a theory: As time goes on, the odds of any slashdot thread becoming an XKCD comic, or vice-versa, approaches one.

      • "I'll say. This God character has put together something pretty impressive in only a week, but it's all indecipherable spaghetti code."

        Actually, if (hypothetically) a god exists, we all know it's not the christian god. If the universe is spaghetti code, (indistinguishable, not distinct, not equal to anything) then it can't exist. Even if the code is "bad" you cannot judge if the code is bad if you are inside the simulation because you don't have access to the code.
          • Actually yes, the Christian god makes a claim he cannot lie, if he falsifies that claim to have that attribute, then he doesn't exist. An unintelligible communication means an unintelligable definition, and anything that cannot be defined distinctly cannot exist. Therefore the existence of the "Christian god" is not intelligible.

            Either way, a god that gets his facts wrong (i.e. creation in 7 days vs billions of years), cannot be a god, since a god would KNOW that the universe is old. His godhood is condi

      • spaghetti code (Score:4, Funny)

        by jefu (53450) on Monday November 19 2007, @09:57AM (#21407037) Homepage Journal

        Obviously if the universe is mostly spaghetti code, it is a clear indication that the Creator must have been somehow involved in, well, spaghetti. Like say the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Talk about Occam's Razor - there is no simpler hypothesis available. Pasta -> Pasta. QED.

      • was following you until the 'god' bit... somehow that is a turn-off for me in any argument.
        Doesn't believe in science you see... Observations aren't relevant to him...

        So ha ha ha... cuz you can study those bees all day long and it won't make you a better web programmer.
        Even though the results of science keep smacking him round the head every day.

         

  • no central command ? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by permaculture (567540) on Monday November 19 2007, @03:41AM (#21404997) Homepage Journal
    Don't tell that to the queen.

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward
      I know that's supposed to be funny, but lest someone take it seriously, the queen isn't supposed to (and she doesn't) command anyone or anything - she exists for reproduction purposes only. The workers seem to "serve" her because of her unique function on the colony, that is necessary for the colony continued existence. After all, the workers are just doing their part for the survival of the colony, as much as the queen is. There's no such thing as an hierarchy on a colony, everyone works for everyone.
  • Honeybee method? Now that's a good buzzword.

  • After all... (Score:5, Funny)

    by Burpmaster (598437) on Monday November 19 2007, @03:50AM (#21405037)
    The Internet is basically a series of bees.
    • Forced through tubes? So basically too many bee's cause the tubes to jam up? So bascally what we are trying to avoid is bees in swarms entirely? Because as far as I can tell I've avoided contact with swarms of bees due to a healthy regard for my own well being...

  • Almost historical concept ... (Score:3, Interesting)

    by foobsr (693224) on Monday November 19 2007, @03:57AM (#21405073) Homepage Journal
    Quote [wikipedia.org] (Lem, The Invincible, paraphrased):
    "A powerful military space ship a "second-class cruiser" called Invincible, lands on the planet Regis III to investigate the loss of sister ship, Condor. During the investigation, the crew finds evidence of a new form of life, born through evolution of autonomous, self-replicating machines. The evolution was controlled by "robot wars", and the only form that survived were swarms of minuscule, insect-like machines. Individually, or in small groups, they are quite harmless to humans and capable of only very simple behavior. However, when bothered, they can assemble into huge swarms displaying complex behavior arising from self-organization, and are able to defeat an intruder by--what could have been called today--a powerful surge of EMI. Some members of the spacecraft crew suffered a complete memory wipe-out as consequence. The angered crew attempts to fight the enemy, but eventually recognizes the meaninglessness of their efforts in the most direct sense of the word." (emphasis mine)

    Hint for a scientific career; Revive old stuff!

    CC.

  • Not going to work outside of individual systems (Score:5, Insightful)

    by vux984 (928602) on Monday November 19 2007, @04:03AM (#21405093)
    Honeybees, and swarm intelligence in general assumes that the other members are working towards the good of the swarm. That is the polar opposite of what we need for a robust internet.

    Rogue nodes would be able to disrupt the swarm in the same way that scientists are able to wreak havoc on hives, ants, and other 'swarms' by deliberately injecting fake disruptive markers/signals etc.

    This technology sounds about as bright as cooperative multitasking. Suitable for a closed system (e.g. a single application) but an utter disaster if applied in an environment where some threads are just defective, or worse, hostile.
    • the individuals don't necessarily need to work toward the good of the swarm. In fact they usually just act selfish, but the resulting emergent behavior is good for the whole swarm. For example, when huge locust swarms run out of food, they begin to eat each other. The effect is that each bird tries to fly away from its followers and eat the one flying before him, which results in the whole swarm moving to a new area where they can find more food.
    • All you need is giant Bee Overseers to police the workers, and kill off any rouge nodes. The actual implementation of the killings is left as an exercise for the reader.

  • Obligatory (Score:3, Funny)

    by sw155kn1f3 (600118) on Monday November 19 2007, @04:21AM (#21405193)
    So it's a lot like beowulf cluster of bees, right?
  • Given the current problems ( mentioned on /. somewhere previously ) with bee colonies mysteriously disappearing I'm not sure its a good idea to base something as serious as web servers on their behaviour. It's all well and good whilst they behave themselves and work away as they should but what happens when they decide to mysteriously vanish ? What then ?

    I say that nature and technology do not mix and only disaster awaits for mankinds foolish attempts to dally in that which it cannot understand.

  • Company Intelligence (Score:5, Insightful)

    by zaydana (729943) on Monday November 19 2007, @05:10AM (#21405369)

    This sounds like the opposite to today's corporate culture, where a whole lot of smart people are part of a swarm, and the end product is utter stupidity...

    "None of us is as stupid as all of us".

  • Sometimes swarm behavior is inefficient (Score:3, Interesting)

    by MichaelCrawford (610140) on Monday November 19 2007, @05:28AM (#21405457) Homepage Journal
    Several times I've seen flocks of birds flying in circles. One time I watched this for several minutes. The birds were flying really fast but going nowhere.

    • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

      by TheGoodSteven (1178459)
      Those birds you speak of are doing something called "updrafting". Basically, they find a spot where warm air is rising from the ground and glide around in circles in order to attain a higher altitude using much less energy. You might see this over highways quite often, since the black pavement sometimes causes warm air drafts. I think the best demonstration of inefficient swarm behavior is when it arises in humans.

  • Honeybees somehow manage to efficiently collect a lot of nectar with limited resources and no central command.
    This sounds good also in applications other than internet and datacenters. Like politcs and economy.
    Maybe someday we'll get ruled by bees or ants.
  • Could this process be accelerated by allowing the bees to shoot from the mouths of barking dogs?
  • Then again, honeybees unexpectedly disappeared/died this year in large quantities, an event that I would not like to see our servers duplicate.
  • ...that the school whose mascot is Buzz [wikipedia.org] would think bees might be the solution for, well, anything...

    -Proud Georgia Tech alum
  • ...that tell you why bee swarm-sourcing works and human swarm-sourcing never will:

    Bees Don't Lie.

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