necro81 writes "The Mars Phoenix lander, built from the ashes of twoearlier Mars missions, successfully launched atop a Delta II rocket from Canaveral this morning. The mission takes the 350-kg lander to northern latitudes (comparable to Greenland or Siberia) to investigate subsurface ice for the chemical precursors of life. The lander should arrive on Mars on May 25, 2008. 'NASA has never attempted to land a spacecraft on Mars at such a high northern latitude. A lander intended for the red planet's South Pole went silent immediately upon arrival in 1999. That failure, combined with the loss of the companion Mars orbiter, prompted NASA to cancel a 2001 lander mission. The parts from that scrapped mission were used for Phoenix, thus its name, which alludes to the mythological bird that rises from its own ashes.'"
allude (-ld) intr.v. alluded, alluding, alludes To make an indirect reference: The candidate alluded to the recent war by saying, "We've all made sacrifices." [Latin alldere, to play with : ad-, ad- + ldere, to play (from ldus, game; see leid- in Indo-European roots).] Usage Note: Allude and allusion are often used where the more general terms refer and reference would be preferable. Allude and allusion normally apply to indirect references in which the source is not spec
The Canadian contribution to the mission is a meteorological station that includes a pressure sensor, three temperature sensors on a mast, a wind telltale, and a lidar (laser radar) system. The lidar will be used to obtain profiles of dust in the atmosphere, and uses a technique very similar to radar or sonar but using pulses of laser light instead. We use lidar systems here on Earth to profile aerosols, ozone, clouds, etc here on earth. The Can con will be complemented by other instruments for atmospheric measurements, including the Stereoscopic Surface Imager (SSI) which will take pictures of the sky through a variety of filters, and the MECA which will measure water vapour. You can read more about the Phoenix instruments at http://phoenix.lpl.arizona.edu/science05.php [arizona.edu].
This programme, as all space programmes are, is massively collaborative. It is a partnership between NASA, the Canadian Space Agency (CSA), and other international contributors. Peter Smith from the University of Arizona is the Science Team lead. On the Canadian side the Science Team is composed of researchers from York University, Dalhousie University, University of Alberta, and the Geological Survey of Canada. The meteorological station was built by MDA (who also built the Canadarm), Optech and Passat.
The launch this morning was quite a thrill. As someone else pointed out, the most challenging part is yet to come: the descent. The landing is very ambitious, with multiple stages including parachutes and retro-rockets. Good fun.
Yes, that's me. York is developing a nice space programme, which I am sure you are enjoying. I'm a York alumnus myself, and have collaborated with the Canadian lead on Phoenix (Jim Whiteway, York U) for a long time. I'm now at Dalhousie University, and you can read about our contribution to Phoenix at http://mars.dal.ca/ [mars.dal.ca].
Does any one know if on Mars the North Pole actually the south seeking pole (as on earth) or is it a real north seeking pole like we are used to in bar magnets etc?
The Marssian North Pole is in reference to the geographical north pole, not the magnetic. The Marssian magnetic field is so week as to be non existent.
The absence of a magnetic field on mars has some interesting consequences. Since Mars and Earth were formed from the same material, it is very surprising that Mars doesn't have oceans. One of the theories is that the solar wind of particles from the sun carried away the atmosphere, and so the oceans just evaporated away until it became so cold the remaining water froze into the polar ice caps. Recent estimates indicate that Mars loses some 100 tons of atmosphere every day.
The Earth is protected from the solar wind by its magnetosphere, which results from the magnetic field. Mars's magnetic field, on the other hand, disappeared some 4 Billion years ago when the planet's core cooled off.
"One of the theories is that the solar wind of particles from the sun carried away the atmosphere, and so the oceans just evaporated away until it became so cold the remaining water froze into the polar ice caps. Recent estimates indicate that Mars loses some 100 tons of atmosphere every day. The Earth is protected from the solar wind by its magnetosphere, which results from the magnetic field."
Hmmm... I have a question: Let's say that theory is correct. Would it be possible to pick a decent sized crate
Hmmm... I have a question: Let's say that theory is correct. Would it be possible to pick a decent sized crater on Mars, drop tons and tons and tons of breathable air in it, then artificially create a magnetic field around it to keep it from escaping?
Unfortunately, no. While a localized magnetic field might help to keep charged particles out, it wouldn't keep the atmosphere in. Some ideas to crate a breathable atmosphere include creating a biosphere dome [wikipedia.org] and terraforming [wikipedia.org] the planet, although a lot of
Puny humans! This one will go silent too! Not only you don't ask for permission to visit, but you also pollute our water supply with useless noisy junk!
It would be really cool if it found a frozen mammoth like this one [wikipedia.org]. Of course it also has an equal chance at drilling-through to the inner sanctuary of the Q Continuum [memory-alpha.org] while there on Mars.
The parts from that scrapped mission were used for Phoenix, thus its name, which alludes to the mythological bird that rises from its own ashes.'"
Likewise the AIM-54 Phoenix air-to-air missile, built on the technology developed for the AIM-47 which never went operational because the two aircraft it was designed for didn't either.
It seems like all the probes they send up are specifically not looking for life. NASA always says, "oh, we're looking for geological data and evidence of water, but not life", or now, "we're looking for organic compounds, and we're sending up a microscope, but we're really not looking for life". What's funny is the original Viking mission had a simple test for life. It produced a result that is controversial to this day. Surely in the 30 years since then, they could come up with version 2.0 of some life t
The Scout missions are actually small, "lower-cost" missions. All of the instruments riding on Phoenix are tiny. Take, for example, the lidar (laser radar) system. On Earth these systems weigh many hundreds of kilograms. The one going to Mars weighs only 6.5 kg. Fitting a capable instrument into such a small package was no small task!
One of the things that Phoenix will try to do is be the first to "taste the water". There are many indirect detections of water from radars, spectrometers and the like
The problem is that detecting life remotely has proven a difficult task. It is hard to rule out soil chemistry, and we don't know enough about potential Martian microbes to target their signs. Even if there was life, tests may create the same kind of controversies that Viking did. Only microscopic views of life wiggling around would be definitative evidence, but that would be an expensive mission, especially if microbes are small and sparse. (The left-right test has promise, but even that is not definative.
It has been discovered that there are microbes on earth that can survive in space.
It is possible that some of those microbes have been sent into space before we knew they could survive there. We've sent things to Mars for decades.
So, it is possible that there is life on Mars, but we put it there.
Space exploration is risky business, and there have been about as many successful missions to Mars as failures. An account of the fate of each mission to Mars is given in the hilarious Mars Scorecard [anl.gov]. Fortunately, all of the missions in the new millenium have been pretty successful, and so we are very hopeful for Phoenix.
With Mars, it seems that the arrival is a far more delicate maneuver, so we'll see what happens when it eventually gets there. Will this be another bull's eye? Splattttt!!! or a more dignified descent followed by the sounds of silence? or maybe, just maybe, it's going to work this time? More news in 9 months...
This animation [www.dal.ca] from Maas Digital shows that the planned landing of Phoenix is very ambitious. As the spacecraft enters the Martian atmosphere it is protected by a heat shield. Notice the ice cap on the northern pole, which was constructed from images from the Mars Global Surveyor. A parachute will be used to slow the descent, but because the atmosphere is so thin, it will still be going *very* fast. You can see clouds in the background, which were also seen from orbit by MGS.
A key event happens after the parachute and heat shield rip away: the landing gear deploys, and then the retro-rockets kick in. One problem with the ill-fated Mars Polar Lander was that the sequence of the last two events was reversed. An on-board sensor felt a jolt as when the landing gear locked in and assumed that the landing had taken place. The engines were shut off and the spacecraft plummeted to ground. So close...
It is very difficult to test landing procedures here on Earth. The gravity on Mars is only a third of what we have, and a simulation is never as good as testing in realistic conditions.
"A glass CD loaded with literary, visual and audio science fiction works about the red planet was strapped to NASA's Phoenix Mars Lander, the Planetary Society in Pasadena, Calif. said Friday." : "Inlcluded in the works are H.G. Wells' "War of the Worlds,"..." http://www.space.com/news/070804_phoenix_spacelibr ary.html [space.com]
Now THAT'S just going to give the Martian ideas... and they'll probably get their vaccinations before invading this time. Bad enough that we put road maps to Earth on Pioneer an
The summary mentions that the name is derived from the mythical phoenix, but this is only part of the story. The probe - the first to be launched as part of NASA's low cost "scout" program - was led by the University of Arizona. It's safe to guess that Phoenix also refers to the capital of the arid state. I wonder if I'm the only one who keeps confusing the leadership of this mission with the ubiquitous University of Phoenix.
For this and more information on the Phoenix mission, see the mission page [arizona.edu].
Think how many people could have been fed with this money.
$420 million. Enough to buy every person in the US 1 apple. Just one.
Think how many people have been fed with this money. The operative word you're looking for is jobs. Go get one. You might like it.
What I find most stupid about those fucking stupid "NASA money could have been spent better" comments is that NASA has a comparatively miniscule share of the US budget. Now look at the war against a phantom/abstract threat and THAT budget and we're talking about saving lives if spent better. And probably making less enemies too.
Think how many people could have been fed with this money.
Or we could replace just one bridge over the Mississippi River... quite frankly I'm glad they're spending it on Mars, but I'm not commuting to work in Minneapolis. I think space missions are getting cheaper relative to bridges, too.
The poor will always be with us.
If you feed them now, more of them will die worse later...
In short no good has ever resulted from wasting resources on feeding the poor. Finding them jobs is a much better idea.
Google: define allude (Score:1)
allude (-ld)
intr.v. alluded, alluding, alludes
To make an indirect reference: The candidate alluded to the recent war by saying, "We've all made sacrifices."
[Latin alldere, to play with : ad-, ad- + ldere, to play (from ldus, game; see leid- in Indo-European roots).]
Usage Note: Allude and allusion are often used where the more general terms refer and reference would be preferable. Allude and allusion normally apply to indirect references in which the source is not spec
Canadian Content (Score:5, Informative)
http://www.cbc.ca/technology/story/2007/08/04/mar
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Martain Skeptic: "I told you it was just a weather balloon!"
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North Pole? (Score:1)
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Re:North Pole? (Score:4, Informative)
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Re:North Pole? (Score:4, Interesting)
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Hmmm... I have a question: Let's say that theory is correct. Would it be possible to pick a decent sized crate
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Hmmm... I have a question: Let's say that theory is correct. Would it be possible to pick a decent sized crater on Mars, drop tons and tons and tons of breathable air in it, then artificially create a magnetic field around it to keep it from escaping?
Unfortunately, no. While a localized magnetic field might help to keep charged particles out, it wouldn't keep the atmosphere in. Some ideas to crate a breathable atmosphere include creating a biosphere dome [wikipedia.org] and terraforming [wikipedia.org] the planet, although a lot of
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The missing Mars Polar Lander... (Score:2, Funny)
- Heineken fanboi
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Unwelcome visitors! (Score:5, Funny)
This time, not even Tom Cruise will save you!
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Could you imagine... (Score:1)
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Phoenix (Score:3, Funny)
CBS coverage (Score:3, Insightful)
Seriously, if you are going to link to an Associated Press article, please link to a version that doesn't require registration to read.
Video of the launch (Score:2, Informative)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q0X1FoyLRGY [youtube.com]
Good stuff. Someday I have to see a launch in person, it's got to be impressive
Disappointed (Score:4, Insightful)
NASA Phoenix interview (Score:3, Informative)
Deja vu all over again (Score:3, Informative)
Likewise the AIM-54 Phoenix air-to-air missile, built on the technology developed for the AIM-47 which never went operational because the two aircraft it was designed for didn't either.
rj
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Not a very good omen, I think!
Why don't they send some probe to look for life? (Score:1, Insightful)
What's funny is the original Viking mission had a simple test for life. It produced a result that is controversial to this day. Surely in the 30 years since then, they could come up with version 2.0 of some life t
Re:Why don't they send some probe to look for life (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Why don't they send some probe to look for life (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Why don't they send some probe to look for life (Score:2)
It is possible that some of those microbes have been sent into space before we knew they could survive there. We've sent things to Mars for decades.
So, it is possible that there is life on Mars, but we put it there.
History of Mars Exploration (Score:2, Informative)
It is not the launch that is the problem... (Score:3, Informative)
Landing animation and commentary (Score:3, Interesting)
This animation [www.dal.ca] from Maas Digital shows that the planned landing of Phoenix is very ambitious. As the spacecraft enters the Martian atmosphere it is protected by a heat shield. Notice the ice cap on the northern pole, which was constructed from images from the Mars Global Surveyor. A parachute will be used to slow the descent, but because the atmosphere is so thin, it will still be going *very* fast. You can see clouds in the background, which were also seen from orbit by MGS.
A key event happens after the parachute and heat shield rip away: the landing gear deploys, and then the retro-rockets kick in. One problem with the ill-fated Mars Polar Lander was that the sequence of the last two events was reversed. An on-board sensor felt a jolt as when the landing gear locked in and assumed that the landing had taken place. The engines were shut off and the spacecraft plummeted to ground. So close...
It is very difficult to test landing procedures here on Earth. The gravity on Mars is only a third of what we have, and a simulation is never as good as testing in realistic conditions.
Misnamed (Score:1)
This is what worries me... (Score:2)
"Inlcluded in the works are H.G. Wells' "War of the Worlds,"..." http://www.space.com/news/070804_phoenix_spacelibr ary.html [space.com]
Now THAT'S just going to give the Martian ideas... and they'll probably get their vaccinations before invading this time. Bad enough that we put road maps to Earth on Pioneer an
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FYI (Score:2)
The name is a double entendre (Score:2, Interesting)
For this and more information on the Phoenix mission, see the mission page [arizona.edu].
Re:Great. Just great. (Score:5, Insightful)
$420 million. Enough to buy every person in the US 1 apple. Just one.
Think how many people have been fed with this money. The operative word you're looking for is jobs. Go get one. You might like it.
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The poverty gene (Score:2)
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Re:Great. Just great. (Score:5, Insightful)
Dangit, do you have to be so pessmistic ?
Think about how many guns and bombs and other things that actively make peoples lifes miserable will not be bought with this money.
There, you can start cheering now. I'm all for space exploration because it takes money that would otherwise most likely be used for killing people.
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Because The Government Is Immune To All Laws (Score:1, Insightful)