Smarter Teens Have Less Sex 1285
Tech.Luver writes "Gene Expression reports,
"Tyler Cowen quotes from a new study testing the relationship between grades and delayed sexual activity.
Last December I passed a paper along to Razib showing that high-school age adolescents with higher IQs and extremely low IQs were less likely to have had first intercourse than those with average to below average intelligence. (i.e. for males with IQs under 70, 63.3% were still virgins, for those with IQs between 70-90 only 50.2% were virgin, 58.6% were virgins with IQs between 90-110, and 70.3% with IQs over 110 were virgins)
In fact, a more detailed study from 2000 is devoted strictly to this topic, and finds the same thing: Smart Teens Don't Have Sex (or Kiss Much Either). ""
I think a more interesting study... (Score:2, Interesting)
Only proves which kids will *say* they've had sex (Score:5, Interesting)
Worse than it used to be (Score:5, Interesting)
Man, I wish I was born in the Victorian era. Sigh.
Peter
Take this data with a large grain of salt. (Score:2, Interesting)
Re: Smarter Teens Have Less Sex (Score:4, Interesting)
Could be true (Score:5, Interesting)
To Quote... (Score:5, Interesting)
Now if I could only remember who said that...
Re: Smarter Teens Have Less Sex (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:That's 'cause... (Score:3, Interesting)
Sounds About Right to Me (Score:5, Interesting)
I live in the UK, but the answer in my case is all of the people I could think of scarily. I caught up with a few people from High School not long ago, and the stuff that's happened to many of the people from school who concentrated on sex and immature relationships is shocking. It's a tale of divorce, single motherhood, poverty and immaturity. These people also tend to be extremely crap at romantic and sexual relationships when they're older, as well as pretty immature. Taking one example, how many people in their late twenties think that getting married to someone you only met six months ago, divorcing that person a few years later, getting back together with an ex a few months after said divorce and having a baby with that person after only a few weeks or months of being together is mature? They still act like 15 year olds, and in some cases, worse.
As for me, I have a good job with good money, working with people who I like and get on with, I have a lovely girlfriend and I'm still as horny as hell from all that High School abstinence
Seriously though, looking around from my own personal experience, scarily, I think a whole social underclass is being created. I also think this is largely responsible for the increase in divorce, the increase in single motherhood and the inevitable problems for their children that has brought with it. Those having sex in High School generally just aren't mature enough to handle sex, and that's setting them up for life.
Re:I'm sorry, but so what? (Score:3, Interesting)
I'm in my thirties. I've got to tell you, the 20s were pretty darn good. And if you're a teenager who realizes his limitations and is willing to have fun, despite the awkwardness, you have fun too -- no matter what you're doing.
It seems to me that you're the kind of person who blooms late because he's not ready to have fun before he's comfortable, and if that's the case, learning how to be comfortable takes a very long time. Throughout life, the more you question your own boundaries, the more fun you have. Of course, when you're 30 and older, the more you question your physical boundaries, the more you wonder why the next morning. The mantra of the 30s is "Wow, that's gonna hurt tomorrow".
Re:Idiocracy (Score:3, Interesting)
Populations wouldn't get smarter or dumber, just remain average. In the pure Darwinian sense, the population average is the optimum number, for whatever reason, and this study just confirms it.
Although it's interesting that girls would pick boys dumber than they are to have sex (the male data is highly dependent on how the girls pick them).
God Damn it, I sound like a college professor.
Re: Smarter Teens Have Less Sex (Score:5, Interesting)
I'm not quite sure what grades are a good measure of. Being able to color inside the lines? Following instructions and memorizing facts? Rarely they can measure understanding and creativity, but that's highly dependent on the skill of the instructor creating the assignments.
Not quite (Score:4, Interesting)
If groups with different IQs have different sex habits, and I learn about your sex habits, then by using Bayes' theorem I can also make inferences about your IQ. Obviously just statistical inferences ("he has less sex, therefore, he is more likely to be smart"), but still.
Except that the change happens in both directions away from the average, so the most you can make is a statistical inference about how far from the norm they probably are, rather than in which direction.
Re:I Believe... (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Probably a couple of factors... (Score:2, Interesting)
Sex is grand, grander for some than others (clearly). You should seek to understand the origin of your prejudices before wielding them as a sword.
Re:I Believe... (Score:3, Interesting)
What you know and your IQ actually tend to hurt your chances.
I hate to burst the geek bubble but it's truth.
want proof? WOZ is a rich geek but never was upper management.
Gates was never a geek, he was a poser and the face man. (sorry gate's early code is horrible and first year quality) he had business sense and knew people as well as has social skills in a bizzare way.
Jobs = Face man he is the guy that makes you like him so much you will sell him your stuff at cost or buy his product by standing in a line outside for hours when there is no supply problems.
If you are a geek and high IQ I STRONGLY suggest taking etiquette classes, social interaction classes and do everything in your power to have the knowledge to fake being good at party socializing. You have to be the guy that everyone loves in the first 15 minutes of meeting them. Speak eloquently, be good at faking that you really are interested in how well her pedicure went and how that CEO of that company had a horrifying day because he had to way 30 minutes for road service to show up and fix his flat tire.
Crack the code of socalizing, get that one done and you will become upper management.
Re:Queue Slashdot Reader Love Life Jokes (Score:1, Interesting)
Re:Queue Slashdot Reader Love Life Jokes (Score:3, Interesting)
How do you know God didn't want your loins to drive you? Maybe god wanted you to use your brain to get as many women into the sack as possible.
God made both parts...you are just choosing which should be important. They probably are equally important.
What I took from the study is that smart or dumb people find it hard to relate to the average person. Or more likely that the average person has a problem handling the very smart or very dumb.
What I'd like to see is a smart guy with a smart girl & a ton of dumb girls on the side to raise the IQ of their next generation.
Re:Queue Slashdot Reader Love Life Jokes (Score:1, Interesting)
If you have sex all day, of course you don't have time to think stuff, so your average IQ is lower. Even if you genetically are smarter than other, if you don't use your brain, then it becomes dumber.
Therefore people who study a lot do it because they don't go to parties to know people, because their experience have showed they don't succeed (they don't make out) because they are ugleeee, therefore they tend to concentrate on what they can do best: Think!
Once they get old enough they get the best chicks, because they have the luxury cars and they live in the best parts of the city. Of course not all of them do the same, but most do.
Their children then become more beautiful and more intelligent, so they can decide if they are going to study or have lots of sex. Usually it is safer for girls to have lots of sex while guys tend to study. A few chosen guys have to please the ladies (usually the ones doing sports, because they need bigger and stronger bodies to resist the stress of sex and to attract the ladies) while all the rest study and compete, and some of them get the good marks, go to college, get a well paying job, get a luxury car and the thing starts over again.
Good looking gals on their part have to able to have sex with as many guys as possible without anyone knowing, because the sperma is good for their bodies (it is energy anyway). That is why women who have sex regularly look so good. This is the preparation they need to find a mate who lives in the expensive side of the city and who drives a luxury car, so that they can please him enough for him to be willing to marry her.
So goes life over and over again.
Re:Queue Slashdot Reader Love Life Jokes (Score:5, Interesting)
I have a case of asperger's syndrome (And before anyone accuses me of being self-diagnosed, I'd not even heard of it until a therapist diagnosed me).
And, not to sound egotistical, but I like to think that I have above-average intelligence. I'm not a genius, nor a whiz at anything, nor do I have Mensa begging for me to enroll, but I do feel I have sufficient evidence to suggest I'm smarter (using a definition akin to "able to interpret, recall, and use information) than the average 20 year old.
Do I even need to add that I'm a complete virgin? I've never gotten to second base. Or first base. Hell, I didn't get up to bat. I'm not even a benchwarmer. (I just used up all my sports analogies.)
My social skills have improved since grade school, and I'm nowhere near as shy as I used to be (But then again, it's no substitute for real interaction, but spend years online and you do tend to develop a tolerance to mockery and jerks.)
But I've still never had a girlfriend. Not even close. I feel this is due to both a lack of interest, a lack of experience, well below-average social skills, and a lack of eligible bachelorettes (see: Engineering major).
Quite frankly, in my free time between classes at my college I go to the lounge, where I meet a vast number of different people. Most of the females are:
A: taken
B: incompatible with my nature (I don't mind someone having different interests and ideas than me, but SOME common ground is nice.)
C: Bat-shit crazy demons I wouldn't touch with a 39 and a half foot pole, let alone my bare hands.Many of these, in particular, I strongly suspect, are carrying a multitude of STDs, given how much they broadcast the sex they have.
On top of all this lies a series of moral dilemmas, such as giving in to carnal desires when I know the risks, the necessity of intimacy, the risks of getting caught... It just seems too complicated and risky to be worth the effort, especially outside of a relationship. (Not to mention how DISGUSTING sex is, when you REALLY think about it. I mean considering the biological processes involved. Though I'm sure this is lost "in the heat of the moment," it doesn't really make me any more disposed to seeking it out)
On the other hand, take my brother. Bless his soul for all the hard manual labor he does, and helping my father with his business so we didn't go OUT of business when he was injured, etc. But I use more brain power before 6am than he does all day. He admits proudly that he HATES to think and just acts. He's gone through girlfriends like candy and I'm sure has gotten laid more than a few times.
Ultimately, it seems to me that love and sex are purely animalistic and primal desires with little to no logic to them. Thus, those prone to analyzing their actions OVER analyze these things and have less success or less desire or both.
That, and my brother is currently out doing things. I'm on slashdot and going to go play City of Heroes in a while. That may have something to do with it, too.
Re:Queue Slashdot Reader Love Life Jokes (Score:3, Interesting)
I hear you. I am 27 years old, and I am still a virgin. Not because I haven't had opportunities to have sex (I'm reasonably sure that if I wanted to, I could have gotten laid), but because I made the conscious choice to wait for the right person. Which, somewhat coincidentally with the timing of this story, I am getting married next week.
I'll admit that I have a religious upbringing. But while the religious teachings I have received have given me a point of reference for my choices, I feel that it is a cop out to say "I don't do that because it is against my religion." Religion has simply taught me the reasons why promiscuous sex is not a good idea. The risk of pregnancy and STDs is obvious and I don't think I need to go into that. The other main reason is that the level of intimacy that sex entails should really be reserved for someone with whom you already have a deep emotional and spiritual connection. IE, love.
When my fiancee and I started dating, we barely touched each other. The occasional hug was it. This allowed us to build a relationship based on friendship and trust, and eventually love. Yes, our relationship has gotten more physical as we've gotten closer to marriage, but sex will wait until we are actually married. It is a decision that we both made years ago, long before we ever met. And yes, we are both looking forward to it.
I am grateful that I have waited. I am glad that my first time will be with someone whom I care deeply about. And I look forward to building a solid marriage with my wife, a relationship based not on sex, but trust, understanding, and love; where good sex is the icing on the cake.
Re:Queue Slashdot Reader Love Life Jokes (Score:4, Interesting)
Looking back- I would say the 29 to 44 were the best ages.
The female brains were now interested in sex. Their bodies were working correctly. Younger girls- you can often do the right things but the wires just are not hooked up yet. A lot of them are trying to just have their first orgasm much less a g-spot or multi.
Most older women can have at three kinds of orgasms (C, G, X) almost constantly for a couple hours.
Some can have six kinds (C, G, Xl, Xr, X, A). So they really like sex and appreciate it. Younger females think they are doing you a favor (which is why you have to do cocky, funny, bust them instead of flattering them to break through that attitude) when they really have a lot more to get out of it than the guy does. And for most guys- it is 15 minutes of male pleasure when the female can have so much more. Guys you can do better- you can easily train yourself over an hour. Just look at it like a journey rather than a destination.
A few bits of advice- Jelqing works so look it up. Tantra works so learn it. Male multi-orgasm is possible and works tho it's bloody difficult and after a couple years it still doesn't work all the time (then again I'm getting older than most of you young pups).
Re:That explains... (Score:3, Interesting)
Apparently you believe that paying taxes entitles you to judge the lives of others. From their perspective life may look rich and varied -- and life may look more rich and varied to those who do not just perceive worth in purely financial terms.
But for most of these people (especially those who reproduce while on welfare), they stay a drain permanently, so they are indeed "worthless" or worse.
People cannot stay on welfare for more than five years in most cases, following the welfare reform of the mid-1990s [urban.org]. Rants that treat welfare as it was 15 years ago make little sense.
If you think these people are so wonderful, why aren't you donating your entire income to them so they can continue with their unproductive lives?
You create a false dichotomy by saying that I either have to agree you with about "these people" (which people?) or want to donate my entire income to "them." If you read my grandparent post, you'll note that I pointed out some of the historical and other problems of the great-grandparent post.
Re:As someone... (Score:3, Interesting)
Also, once you've got the attention of the hottie du jour, you're probably not going to want to take her to the local meat market, I mean, bar. You won't be able to hear each other, she's going to get hit on incessantly, and that will not help your confidence. I used to have a canned first date that worked like a charm. It started at a local comedy club. Chicks like to laugh, and if you go to a comedy club (before you tell me how lame this is, remember it was years ago), you can make her laugh without even having a sense of humor. And since it's improv, you have 800 topics of conversation at your fingertips for the rest of the night. Hint: pick the dirty ones.
The secret to chicks: confidence. There is a fine line between ego and confidence. Cross it every once in a while.
The secret to hot chicks: stand out. They get hit on every minute of every day by the very "frat boys" you deplore. You're not one of them. Don't try to be one, because even if you succeed, you will be just another "frat boy" to be cycled and recycled through.
Chasing tail is a lot like applying to ivy league schools. Because they get so many applicants, your acceptance and rejection comes across as totally arbitrary, so you had better apply to a dozen schools. You just never know what a particular girl will be into, so it pays to shop around.
Also, remember that being rich is less important now than it was years ago. Chicks have their own money and no longer need yours. I know a lot of women (my age, granted) who make six figure salaries. What kind of cash do you intend to impress them with?
In retrospect, I had a great time in college and a great time in high school. Don't bide your time until you graduate--the game only moves up to the next level. Figure out how to make it work today. You have nothing to lose.
Go make some memories so you'll have something to get all nostalgic about when you're old like me.
P.S. Do not bitch about how difficult it is to date in college/high school/the workplace/whatever. Girls really, really hate that--it is the exact opposite of confidence.
Good luck!
Germans knew this for a long time... (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Queue Slashdot Reader Love Life Jokes (Score:3, Interesting)
As a family doctor, the sex life of people is something I am quite familiar with. And, as opposed to "studies", I don't get answers from people ticking boxes "for fun" or "to impress the questioner", but a glimpse into what happens in the real world in average and not-so-average people.
I have patients in their eighties who still enjoy an active sex life. My wife is in her mid-forties and I consider her at least as attractive as she was as a teen (we have been together for 27 years now, and no, she does not read slashdot), and have many patients in their fifties who are every little bit as attractive as teens.
See, it is a question of how you keep your body and mind. There are fat pimply teens and beautiful ones, and likewise there are many versions of elderly bodies. Just takes some effort to keep attractive, but it is doable (my wife for example belly dances and jogs 10km every day). Likewise it takes some effort to retain sexual stamina and ability, but it is doable. If someone has smoked for 20 years, he will most likely be impotent because he has destroyed the delicate microcirculation in his perineum. But somebody taking care of his/her body, why, they can enjoy sex as often and as long as in their teens at nearly any age.
Re:Queue Slashdot Reader Love Life Jokes (Score:3, Interesting)
Really? If it's a chicken I consider it dinner. If it's a tumor I consider it medicine. I think an unwanted fetus has a lot more in common with a tumor than it does with you or me.
The legal definition of murder defines it to involve the killing of a human.
Just because it has human DNA doesn't mean it's "human". I shed millions of human cells every day and don't shed a tear. No humanity is something deeper than that.
There is no alien that turns into a human magically at the time of birth.
Of course not, it's a slow process of development and maturation.
Really, I understand your reasoning. Killing humans is wrong. A fetus is human. Therefore killing fetus's is wrong. It's a simple syllogism. But look deeper. Why is killing humans wrong? Think about that hard. Now, do those reasons apply to fetuses?
Re:Queue Slashdot Reader Love Life Jokes (Score:3, Interesting)
I was one of that 70% until college, but that had very little to do with the pregnancy and STD bogeymen that only Americans worry about (Seriously... Have you ever, EVER heard of anyone you know with an STD?). Both are easy to avoid. The main reason I didn't have sex when I was an adolescent is my ridiculous religious upbringing. My brother, however, did not get good grades, did not follow the indoctrination, and had a lot of sex. However, he has a higher IQ than I do (he's well into the genius range).
So what's happening here? Why don't smart people have sex, unless they do?
My suggestion would be that those who are more likely to strive to get good grades in school are also more likely to strive to follow religious nonsense and are therefore more likely to have less time or drive to do more self-centered things like get drunk and get laid. They are people who are worried about how they are perceived by authority, and that has a chilling effect on social relations, especially during their teens. Our society says sex is bad (saying one thing and doing another) and getting good grades is good, and so people who do the latter are likely not to do the former.
Furthermore, I don't know about all of you, but I was damned busy in high school with studying and extracurricular stuff. I literally didn't have time for dating. Good grades don't come for free. However, I regret a lot of that now.
I agree that teens should be having sex. Lots and lots of sex. No one ever tells you when you're growing up that you are going to start feeling actually middle aged around 25. Nobody tells you that your sex drive is going to tank. Nobody tells you that even good-looking people in their 30s and 40s don't look very good with their clothes off, and won't do much to stir passion in their intendeds. They just tell you sex is bad; don't do it.
It's a crime to waste all that energy and drive. To expect people not to have sex during the part of their lives they want it the most. It's sick. It's sadistic. Sex is not dangerous. Sex is not bad. We run around in America, terrified of fucking, but what is it? It's one of the most basic social and bodily functions there is! We refer to "losing" virginity. Why?? Do we feel a tinge of sadness--or even horror--when someone goes to school and "loses" their ignorance? Why would you want to "keep" your inexperience?
I'm in my 30s now. I started having sex when I was 19, and I gotta tell ya: It isn't anywhere near as good now as it was then. I can't go as long, I don't want to go as long, I certainly can't go more than once a day (if that!)... When I think about that, and about how great it was when I started, and how I could have been having that for years before I started, and what positive effects that would have had on my personal and social development, it makes me want to lock up all the evil evangelicals and health teachers who tell young people to feel BAD all the time, and do the equivalent of holding in their shit and wait until they're married to take a dump. It's insane.
Humans reach sexual maturity at 13ish. That is the natural time to start having sex. That's about the age people used to get married, not even too long ago. We now have a society that isn't set up for people of that age to be getting married or getting pregnant, but that doesn't mean that they shouldn't be having sex. Our sex rules were in place to be sure of inheritance rights, but we now have laws and medical procedures that render such brute-force methods of reproductive control moot.
13 and horny? Fuck away, says I. Just use a condom and don't be a dick about it. It's not going to hurt you, and you'll probably learn a lot about your body, yourself, and the human condition. And it'll be fun and exciting (for the next few years, anyway). Carpe diem and all that. Enjoy it now, because in not too many years, you'll find posting on Slashdot more interesting, and you will know that you have become very old.
Granted, I don