Become a fan of Slashdot on Facebook

 


Forgot your password?
Close
typodupeerror
×
Science Technology

Molecular Gastronomy, The Science of Cooking 341

Posted by ScuttleMonkey from the frozen-pizzas-just-don't-cut-it-anymore dept.
Roland Piquepaille writes "The Art of Cooking is evolving fast in this 21st century. New food products are being designed with the help of molecular technology, genetic discoveries or space research before arriving in our kitchens. For example, here is a Pravda article which says that NASA is preparing sandwiches which will still be edible after seven years. Companies like Kraft are also using nanotechnology to create food products tailored to users' needs. This is a booming market and, according to Associated Press, dozens of universities in the U.S. are offering degrees in culinology, attracting creative students in their food and science programs."
This discussion has been archived. No new comments can be posted.

Molecular Gastronomy, The Science of Cooking More

Molecular Gastronomy, The Science of Cooking

Comments Filter:

  • loads of oils, creams, butter and mayo (Score:4, Interesting)

    by mfh ( 56 ) on Monday August 29, 2005 @04:38PM (#13430391) Homepage Journal
    New food products are being designed with the help of molecular technology, genetic discoveries or space research before arriving in our kitchens.

    This is good because eventually we will all want to have food that is chemically efficient for us to digest, without any of the wrong ingredients, but I question the health side of chemical/altered foods.

    I was talking to a chef about a month ago who was complaining about having to put loads of oils, creams, butter and mayo in foods to achieve the taste that the consumer wants, at the expense of their health. "We're paid to kill people," was his complaint, and sadly I think he's right. This same chef was saying how it would be nice if there were alternatives to bad food, that would not jeopardize someone's health. I think that new advancements in science would be the right approach to solving the obesity problem, as long as people are protected from any negative side effects. Natural replacements seem to top this chef's list. He said that the natural foods are the very best for you, so he had little faith in chemicals or engineered food as being healthy for us.

    I've stayed away from garbage food for only a short period and lost nearly 40 pounds of flubber! It's really simple, actually. Most people have a small breakfast, a bigger lunch and a huge dinner. I have a huge breakfast, a smaller lunch and a much smaller dinner (before 6pm usually). I eat from each of the four food groups every day.

    This one cool salad the chef told me about is:
    • Veggies (whatever you want)
    • Salt & Pepper (loads of it unless you have a heart condition)
    • Squeezed Lemon
    The salad tastes like fish & chips with vinegar and salt, so I'm kinda tricking my body into thinking it is getting a load of grease (which all of our bodies crave, because they are stupid bags of carbon and mostly water -- and we all know how well oil and water gets along, don't we?).

    I stay away from oils because they can ruin your whole system, and I think they reinforce our current fatty deposits, by feeding it somehow (it's not that much of a mystery). Once a week I have fat with meat, because the chef said that new fat kills old fat. New fat apparently replaces old fat, and then doesn't congreal as quickly if it's in turn replaced a week later. That doesn't mean overdo it... just a little will do. Apparently people who have been overweight for a long time have very dense fat that must be replaced in order for them to empty fatty deposits eventually.

    My portions are smaller, and I'm not always hungry. I drink as much water as I can every day too, and it helps. I drink tea & coffee, and smoke regularly. I might not be the picture of health, but I am trying. ;-)

    Now if we could only get some fat and tar eating nanoprobes... then we'd really be in business.

    • Re:loads of oils, creams, butter and mayo (Score:5, Informative)

      by Lumpy ( 12016 ) on Monday August 29, 2005 @04:47PM (#13430478) Homepage
      suggestion.

      talk to a Nutritionist and not some chef that has a wacked idea on how things work.

      Once a week I have fat with meat, because the chef said that new fat kills old fat.
        that alone is the most bizzare thing I have ever heard.

      guess what, you either need to reduce your caloric intake or do some of the extreme diets to lose weight.

      Atkins works as it thows your body into ketosis, vegan works as you have almost zero fat intake,
      simply being active, eating healthy and lowering your calorie intake works the best in the long run.

      no matter what a life style change is required. What you do to lose weight you have to live with forever and ever.

      a chef knows nothing compared to a dietician and nutritionist.

      Please get real advice from someone that can explain it in real terms instead of made up mumbo-jumbo like new fat destroys old fat.
      • You should still consult some knowledgeable chef, because nutritionist just want us to eat soy meat and carrots, and nothing of the stuff that actually tastes well (because, it probably it is bad for us).

      • Re:loads of oils, creams, butter and mayo (Score:5, Insightful)

        by Hurricane78 ( 562437 ) <deleted @ s l a s h dot.org> on Monday August 29, 2005 @05:37PM (#13430939)

        > Atkins works as it thows your body into ketosis, vegan works as you have almost zero fat intake, simply being active, eating healthy and lowering your calorie intake works the best in the long run.

        Atkins and vegan diets kill you for the very same reason that unhealty food does: it's unhealty!

        I had many many different diets, and i can tell you that the whole concept of a "diet" is a huge load of crap!

        Do you know what it takes to bekome healty and thin?

        1. Eat only when you're really hungry! not when you just want to eat now. (to force you to a normal eating behaviour. try taping a "H?" above your fridge to remember yourself.)
        2. Eat in smaller amounts and more often (to get your stomach to a normal size again and to not fall into a ravenous appetite).
        3. Move your ass and do some sport.
        4. And most important: never ever stop doing point 1-3 for the rest of your life!

        That's really all you have to do. Nothing more... But as with all addictions, it depents on your willpower to do it. (Tip: A psychologist can help you more than you may think with that problem.)

      • guess what, you either need to reduce your caloric intake or do some of the extreme diets to lose weight.

        I've lost some weight recently, and while it won't sell any books, the solution is really simple:

        1) Eat less. Seriously. Lots of people are shocked when they realize just how much a "portion" of something is. For instance, that "small" 12 oz steak is actually 3 servings of meat.

        2) Eat healthier. Eat lots of fruits and vegetables, stay away from processed or prepared foods, and get the vitamins and mi

    • Absurd (Score:5, Interesting)

      by GuyMannDude ( 574364 ) on Monday August 29, 2005 @04:54PM (#13430551) Journal

      I was talking to a chef about a month ago who was complaining about having to put loads of oils, creams, butter and mayo in foods to achieve the taste that the consumer wants, at the expense of their health. "We're paid to kill people," was his complaint, and sadly I think he's right.

      What a rediculous statement. It's fine to eat something unhealthy every once in awhile as long as you don't make a habit of it. Eating well 28 days a month will render whatever you do the remaining 2 or 3 days pretty much irrelevant. Avoiding being stabbed 28 days won't help you to much if you are getting stabbed 2 or 3 days a month.

      If your buddy really felt that he was getting paid to kill people, he would quit so obviously he himself realizes his statement is rediculous.

      This same chef was saying how it would be nice if there were alternatives to bad food, that would not jeopardize someone's health.

      There are. They are called vegetables. Again, you eat plenty of vegies and you can get away with eating all sorts of nasty stuff occasionally.

      Your theories on fat murdering other fat are interesting to say the least. You might want to pick up a copy of Fats That Heal, Fats That Kill by Udo Erasmus [udoerasmus.com] for a slightly more scientific explanation of how fats operate inside your body.

      When I go out to eat, I don't worry about how healthy the food is and my cholesterol numbers kick holy ass. How do I do it? Because I don't go out to eat very much and when I eat at home I'm very, very healthy. There's no need for genetically engineered superfoods. Just eat right 95% of the time and live a little the reminaing 5%.

      GMD

      • It's fine to eat something unhealthy every once in awhile as long as you don't make a habit of it.

        I think that was the point with the GP post. He used to eat all that fat DAILY. What the chef did was to fool his tongue (not his stomach) so he would enjoy the taste of something fatty without actually eating that fat. (Just in case, remember carbohydrates BECOME fat after digested - evolution at work)

        The salad? A good replacement that will make you feel "full" due to the high content in fibers.
        Water? 2 liters

    • Re:loads of oils, creams, butter and mayo (Score:5, Insightful)

      by John Seminal ( 698722 ) on Monday August 29, 2005 @04:56PM (#13430573) Journal
      I was talking to a chef about a month ago who was complaining about having to put loads of oils, creams, butter and mayo in foods to achieve the taste that the consumer wants, at the expense of their health. "We're paid to kill people," was his complaint, and sadly I think he's right.

      The French eat more oil and fat than Americans, but the French have less than half the heart disease. Why is that? Could it be the fat is not as bad as the stress Americans have? The French get two hours for lunch. Many stores close their doors during the lunch time so they can go to cafe's, sit down with friends, and enjoy life. They also get government to gaurentee 5 weeks of vacation a year no matter what the job. That means the janitor gets 5 paid weeks of vacation, just like his boss.

      And if you will eat fat, how about eating healthy fat? Eat butter instead of margirine. Eat natural olive oil instead of processed oils. The problem is not fat, the problem is companies like McDonalds, to save a few pennies, are using crappy oils that are manufactured and not natural. Plus, we only have 30 minutes to make it from the office, to the fast food joint, and back to the office again. Hope there is enough time to push the sandwich down the throat with one hand while honking the horn to get the asshole in front of us out of the way with the other hand.

      And then, just as lunch is over, I am back at my desk with my heart pumping and head dripping of sweat, just in time to make some sales calls. God, I hope I don't get any more bitch secretaries to screen calls for their bosses.

      What will kill people is all the new manufactured foods, that are filled with chemicals our bodies can't expell. They will fill cells with toxic substances that will cause cancer.

      • This is true. The French not only have less heart disease they also have far less obesity.

        The reason for this has been explained in many ways including the use of oils not containing transfats, drinking wine, and more exercise. Personally, I think all of that has something to do with it. However, I think it's mostly that people in the US simply eat too damn much. We're fucking gluttons.

        I started watching what I eat from the perspective of quantity only. I made almost no changes as far as what kinds of

      • Eat natural olive oil instead of processed oils.

        With the exception of hydrogenated fats which are dangerous because they are (a) trans and (b) saturated, all edible oils are natural. Canola, peanut, corn... yup, natural.

        Unless there's a big trend in the food industry that I'm not aware of to use mineral oil.

        What will kill people is all the new manufactured foods, that are filled with chemicals our bodies can't expell. They will fill cells with toxic substances that will cause cancer.

        This stateme

      • Re:loads of oils, creams, butter and mayo (Score:5, Interesting)

        by nido ( 102070 ) <nido56@noSPAm.yahoo.com> on Monday August 29, 2005 @05:58PM (#13431111) Homepage
        And if you will eat fat, how about eating healthy fat? Eat butter instead of margirine. Eat natural olive oil instead of processed oils. The problem is not fat, the problem is companies like McDonalds, to save a few pennies, are using crappy oils that are manufactured and not natural.

        Actually, the primary motivator in McDonald's & other manufactured food providers' switch to partially-hydrogenated polyunsaturated oils (from tallow/lard and coconut/palm oil)was a misguided Holy War by the vegetarian-run Center for Science in the Public Interest, starting in 1984.

        All based on fraud and lies. See the Mary Enig's The Tragic Legacy of CSPI [westonaprice.org]:

        CSPI's well publicized campaign against "saturated" frying fats, especially those used by fast-food restaurants, was launched in 1984 and was continued in 1986 when CSPI added the "tropical oils" to their list of supposed villains in the American diet.

        The whitewash of trans fatty acids began in 1987 with an article by Elaine Blume, published in CSPI's Nutrition Action newsletter. Wrote Blume: "From margarine to Tater Tots, partially hydrogenated vegetable oils play a major role in our food supply. ... In fact, hydrogenated oils don't post a dire threat to health. ... Improving on Nature. ... Manufacturers hydrogenate... these vegetable oils so they won't become rancid while they sit on shelves, or during frying. ... it seems unlikely that hydrogenation contributes much to our burden of heart disease... The fact that hydrogenated oils appear to be relatively benign is cause for thanks, because these fats are everywhere."

        In 1988, CSPI published a booklet called Saturated Fat Attack, which defended trans fatty acids and partially hydrogenated vegetable oils and called for pejorative labeling of "saturated" fats. The booklet contained a section called "Biochemistry 101," which claimed that only tropical oils were dangerous when hydrogenated. "Hydrogenated (or partially hydrogenated) fats are widely used in foods and cause untold consternation among consumers... [they] start out as plain old liquid vegetable oils (usually soybean), which are then reacted with hydrogen... converting much of the polyunsaturated fatty acids to monounsaturated fatty acids... [with]... small amounts... converted to saturated fatty acids... [e.g.], stearic acid, which seems to have no effect on blood cholesterol levels.

        "Overall, hydrogenated fats don't pose a significant risk... exceptions are hydrogenated [tropical oils, which are made]... even worse after hydrogenation."

        Obviously, the individuals writing the booklet were completely ignorant (or pretended to be ignorant) of lipid science. Modern hydrogenation methods create trans fatty acids rather than monounsaturated fatty acids, and very few saturated fatty acids. By 1988, the adverse effects of trans fats were well known. The article points out that stearic acid has no effect on blood cholesterol levels, yet CSPI continued to accuse beef tallow, which is rich in stearic acid, of "raising cholesterol and increasing the risk of heart disease." As for the tropical oils, they do not need to be hydrogenated!

        Blume was at it again in March 1988 with another article, "The Truth About Trans ." "Hydrogenated oils aren't guilty as charged. ... All told, the charges against trans fat just don't stand up. And by extension, hydrogenated oils seem relatively innocent.. ... As for processed foods, you're better off choosing products made with hydrogenated soybean, corn, or cottonseed oil..." This article was widely disseminated; Michael Jacobson provided it as a handout to members of the Maryland Legislature during hearings when the University of Maryland group tried to introduce labeling of trans fatty acids in the State.

        But by 1990, CSPI could no longer defend the indefensible.

    • I work at a large cooking school where there is some emphasis on nutrition but the curriculum teaches classic cooking--meaning French.

      Rich sauces and meats are essential to learning how to be a chef. In fact, the chef-instructors get pissed off when they get a student who's a vegetarian or health nut who refuses to try sauces and meat.

      I had one French chef come to me one day--he was furious because he had several vegetarians in his class and said "goddammit what the hell are zey doing at a cooking zch

      • Re:loads of oils, creams, butter and mayo (Score:3, Funny)

        by Anonymous Coward

        I had one French chef come to me one day--he was furious because he had several vegetarians in his class and said "goddammit what the hell are zey doing at a cooking zchool and they don't eat ze fucking meat? How ze hell are zey going to be ze goddamn chef?"

        Bah, your French chef friend just hates our freedoms. I salute these patriots and I have a feeling that their their democracy-loving Freedom Cuisine will be the newest rage.

      • You just made my day. How funny!

    • Hm. The right approach to solving the obesity problem is: exercise. Ever been to Spain or France? I have not, but everyone I know who has notices the distinct lack of obese people, unlike the United States. Cities in Spain and France tend to be more walkable. It is common to walk everywhere, occasionally taking a train. Every place I have lived in the United States, it is common to drive everywhere.

      As for natural foods being superior to processed foods, that seems like a no brainer. Humans evolved to

      • As someone who lives both in Germany and USA I notice the same things.

        Not just a lack of obese people but that the obese people there would merely be called chubby here.

        But it's not just the cities - but the rural areas where the driving everywhere problem is much worse - Germany has bike paths/sidewalks everywhere. And not bike paths/trails where you have to drive to likely to be right by your front door. And the bikepaths/sidewalks often follow the major roads out of town. A lot of the farmer's fields

    • I stay away from oils because they can ruin your whole system, and I think they reinforce our current fatty deposits, by feeding it somehow (it's not that much of a mystery).

      You actually DO need some fats in your diet. If you cook for yourself you can control not only what kind of fats but how much you get.

      A good salad with a nice olive oil base is delicious and by far not that dangerous.

      The mistake many people make is eating out, all the food is so heavily modified and machined that there is no taste left,

    • Re:loads of oils, creams, butter and mayo (Score:5, Informative)

      by techno-vampire ( 666512 ) on Monday August 29, 2005 @05:43PM (#13430998) Homepage
      I stay away from oils because they can ruin your whole system...

      Such as acting as transport mechanism for Vitamins A, D and E, which are fat soluble. You have to have some fats and oils in your diet daily, unless you don't care about proper nutrition.

  • Spice things up? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by _Sharp'r_ ( 649297 ) <sharper@@@booksunderreview...com> on Monday August 29, 2005 @04:39PM (#13430394) Homepage Journal
    Does this mean we might actually get some good new spices, once they start playing around with modifying existing ones somewhat gastronomically scientifically?

    • *don't* kick it up a notch! (Score:5, Insightful)

      by beacher ( 82033 ) on Monday August 29, 2005 @05:15PM (#13430748) Homepage
      disclaimer- My wife's a chef at a 5-diamond restaurent and she spices her food appropriately and everything rocks. I think that us americans over spice and generally go crazy with trying to add too much flavor. Lighten up a bit on the spice ( here comes the "lips acquire stains" jokes) and try detecting subtle flavors or better combinations.
      I don't know why people insist on nuking foods with cayenne or pouring texas pete on everything.
      -B
      • Interesting. I've seen many chefs say that americans are too tentitive with their spicing, and seem to *under* spice much of their food.

        Of course, 'texas pete' is not a spice or herb. It's some crappy added on hot sauce, that you use to obliterate the taste of bland food.

        Try indian, or thai, or chinese, or japanese, or korean (etc, etc,etc) and you can have plenty of spice, and it taste great.

        I may not be a chef, but my friends prefer my home cooked meals to resteraunts in town (and I live in Boston - we
    • Not if its up to companies like Kraft... their goal is to make food that sells well to the general population. You know, the people who eat fast food and boxed, processed crap.

      I think the only new "spice" this will bring us will be an even *more extreme* ranch flavor.
  • Hah! I can make sandwiches that are edible RIGHT NOW!

    I better put that in my resume... brb.
    • in a similar vein..

      "The Art of Cooking is evolving fast in this 21st century. New food products are being designed with the help of molecular technology, genetic discoveries or space research before arriving in our kitchens. For example, here is a Pravda article which says that NASA is preparing sandwiches which will still be edible after seven years. "

      Wow! A sandwich that is edible for seven years! The way cooking is rapidly evolving, it'll probably be obsolete by then! This is technohype marketing waiting

  • ... when Wonder Bread became healthy [newstarget.com].

  • 7 Year Old Sandwich (Score:4, Funny)

    by bigtallmofo ( 695287 ) on Monday August 29, 2005 @04:42PM (#13430420)
    Be careful eating old sandwiches. Homer tried that once and got so sick he couldn't go to Duff Gardens.

  • Should read: NASA is preparing sandwiches... (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday August 29, 2005 @04:42PM (#13430425)
    NASA is preparing sandwiches which will still be inedible after seven years. And they borrowed this technology from my local high school. They should coat the shuttle with these monstrosities.

  • Good for seven years (Score:3, Funny)

    by javamann ( 410973 ) on Monday August 29, 2005 @04:42PM (#13430427)
    Good for seven years? Does that mean the developed a twinkie sandwich?
    • The trick is to liberally mix some hashish into the sandwich so the more of the twinkie sandwich one eats, the more like a good idea it seems.
    • Good for seven years? Does that mean the developed a twinkie sandwich?

      If NASA trully wanted to be innovative, they would have made MRE's and not sandwiches that can last only 7 years. What is 7 years? That is not even long enough to make it to Pluto. And they are the space expolration agency? Look at our Army, they are serving troops with MRE's that have a shelf life of over 30 years. And yes, many of your favorites are there too. Eggs! Omlets! Ham! Fries! And more!!! I guess the Army is more realistic o

    • The real question is the definition of "edible."

      From TFA: "Techniques that are used include high-pressure treatment, pulsing electric fields, and high frequency sterilization. A sandwich prepared in this way turned out to be edible in seven years. The results can prove useful during the mission to Mars (although it seems that nobody dares to taste this sandwich yet)."

      "Edible," as in "will be nutritious and non-toxic to humans," is significantly different from "edible," i.e., "palatable."

    • You ever *see* a 7-year-old twinkee? (Score:5, Funny)

      by schon ( 31600 ) on Monday August 29, 2005 @05:25PM (#13430835)
      I worked at a convenience store when I was younger - on one of the shelves we discovered a twinkee that was 6 years old. Still wrapped in plastic, the thing was as hard as a rock (literally.)

      We threw it as hard as we could at the arborite countertop. The arborite chipped, but the twinkee was unscathed.

      We hit it with a hammer. Repeatedly. It wouldn't break.

      We debated selling them to the military as a new armor-piercing shell.
  • You can do scientific analysis on any number of disciplines, but when it comes to good taste, cooking is an art, not a science.
    • but when it comes to good taste, cooking is an art, not a science

      I remember a Discovery documentary about foods whose molecular structure was very similar, and they tasted well combined. Like white chocolate and certain cheese. Darn, if I could only remember the show name... scientific cooking or something...
    • Read Harold McGee's Book "On food and cooking - the science and lore of the kitchen".

      Then, season your foot. You're gonna have to make it tasty to get it all down.
  • "What's that black cracker?"
    "A tomato." (crunch)

  • 7 year old sandwiches... (Score:5, Funny)

    by cwest ( 66027 ) on Monday August 29, 2005 @04:46PM (#13430463)
    this is obviously based on failed experiments by the airlines.

  • Designing food is not cooking (Score:5, Insightful)

    by MKalus ( 72765 ) <mkalus@@@gmail...com> on Monday August 29, 2005 @04:46PM (#13430464) Homepage
    Seriously.

    I wouldn't call what Kraft & Co are spitting out 'cooking'.

    It is a designer meal replacement that resembles cooked food.

    Maybe I am old fashined, but anything that gets made in huge vats by machines and then packaged in plastic may be something that keeps me alive, but it DEFINETLY is not cooked.

    • Re:Designing food is not cooking (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Red Flayer ( 890720 ) on Monday August 29, 2005 @05:02PM (#13430623) Journal
      Just look at Velveeta, for example (a Kraft trademark).

      Velveeta was originally "invented" by a researcher at Rutgers College of Pharmacy. The research was attempting to find a good formula for a skin product that could be used for drug delivery.

      Turns out, what is good for drug delivery is also good for coloring and flavorant delivery. A couple phone calls by an astute professor with a cheese fetish, and Kraft gives us Velveeta.

      • Turns out, what is good for drug delivery is also good for coloring and flavorant delivery. A couple phone calls by an astute professor with a cheese fetish, and Kraft gives us Velveeta.


        I'd call that a lot of things, but not cheese....

        I think "eadible oil by product" is probably the closest I would go with it.
    • This is what I think. What Kraft, McDonalds, and the like do is process engineering. They take existing product and figure out how to mass manufacture and market the product cheaply and efficiently. There is nothing wrong with it but what one ends up with is hardly food. As soon as one manufactures food one sacrifices nutrition and basic taste for things like shelf life, color and texture. Flavor is added in with salt and fat. And is it just not manufactured food. One can get a pretty apple, but not

      • I think that chefs sometimes fall into the same catagory. If one uses real food massive amounts of butter are not neccesary. However, if your food comes from the local food parts facility, then there is little to do but cover up the lack of quality with grease.

        I think a way bigger issue is that a lot of people don't even KNOW anymore how food is supposed to taste.

        Eat a carrot without dip? "ugh".
        Eat a grape? "sour"

        etc. etc.

        I think we really have surrendered our tastebuds to the industry and shouldn't be too

  • The real money will be made here (Score:4, Funny)

    by zymurgy_cat ( 627260 ) on Monday August 29, 2005 @04:47PM (#13430490) Homepage
    This won't take off until the following products are available:
    • "Viagra" steaks that enchance sexual response
    • "No pain" beer and pizza that lets you drink and eat all night at age 35 without waking up with a hangover and the runs
    • Caffinated bacon

  • Fry ate one of these sandwiches .. (Score:4, Funny)

    by RedLaggedTeut ( 216304 ) on Monday August 29, 2005 @04:48PM (#13430498) Homepage Journal
    In Futurama, Fry eats one of these sandwiches ..

    I suppose this is were the nanotechnology comes into play..

  • Science gone amuck again (Score:4, Insightful)

    by John Seminal ( 698722 ) on Monday August 29, 2005 @04:48PM (#13430504) Journal
    I don't want science genetically engineering my food, I don't want them making meals that can be served 7 years later. I don't want the cancer or other diseases that come with it.

    The world has done very well without scientists mucking up our food sources. How many thousands of years have people lived off what the earth grows?

    I now see in my grocery store "organic milk", it is priced twice as expensive as the gallon of regular milk. The same thing is in produce, they have organic vegitables. What is this? 20 years ago everything was organic, now only the rich can get normal food. The rest of us must eat crap that has been genetically modified.

    • The world has done very well without scientists mucking up our food sources. How many thousands of years have people lived off what the earth grows?
      Errrr... Errr.... Err... Err... We have been mucking up our food sources for thousands of years. It's just been in differnt ways. We created all farm animals today.
    • Gawd, more fake food. Don't we get that already from McDonalds, Kraft, Budweiser et al? This junk is not good for you and long-term health effects are only partially known.

      I strongly recommend the page-turner _Fast Food Nation_. If you're more hard core, read Marion Nestle's _Food Politics_. Also worthwhile (and sadly funny) is the movie _Super Size Me_.

      The opposite of this tech-no-food is the Slow Food movement; seek out the farmers, stores and restaurants that support there ideals.

      And fercrissakes, st
      • And fercrissakes, start cooking with real ingredients instead of buying processed transfat salt licks made by chemical plants in New Jersey.

        I believe you misspelled 'Whitecastle'. ;)

      • Gawd, more fake food. Don't we get that already from McDonalds, Kraft, Budweiser et al? This junk is not good for you and long-term health effects are only partially known.

        What really makes me sad is that discussions like this always wave the health argument around, because health is not what this is about. This stuff is bad for you even if it is good: Slow Food is not about Health Food (be sure that Kraft has its departments to cover those consumer demands as well), it is about the culture of food. Appar

    • > How many thousands of years have people lived off what the earth grows?

      We can not support 6.5 billion people using traditional faming methods. By 2020 we will have to support 8 billion...

    • Re:Science gone amuck again (Score:5, Informative)

      by kfg ( 145172 ) on Monday August 29, 2005 @05:19PM (#13430781)
      Abandon the idea that baby food is somehow necessary for adult health (let alone the baby food of another species). That solves the price of milk problem.

      Start growing your own "Heritage" food. See the book "Sailing the Farm" for how this can be done on even a small sailboat, a living space far smaller and disadvantaged than even a metropolitan studio apartment. There are tons of newer books on container gardening.

      If you've got even as little as 16 square feet of dirt, see the book "Square Foot Gardening."

      You might well be surprised at how much you can produce from how little, all without using any of the modern industrial farming techniques.

      It's a matter of scale. The modern industrial approach to farming may be needed to generate the largest profit (not food, profit) from huuuuuuge. . .tracts of land, but have nothing to do with producing enough tomatoes for yourself, by yourself.

      KFG
    • I don't want science genetically engineering my food, I don't want them making meals that can be served 7 years later. I don't want the cancer or other diseases that come with it.

      you don't get cancer from genetically engineered food. to think so betrays a profound lack of education about the slightest bit of what you are talking about

      The world has done very well without scientists mucking up our food sources. How many thousands of years have people lived off what the earth grows?

      actually agriculture is nothing but selecting food crops based on various genetic qualities. we've been genetically engineering foods for tens of thousands of years. there is absolutely nothing natural about an ear of corn or a grain of rice or a shaft of wheat or a potato. they are freakishly huge by natural standards. were these plants released in the wild, they would quicky perish. your "organic" foodstuffs are wholly human creations, and are utterly, in every sense of the word, genetically modified freaks of nature.

      just like dogs. do you love your dog? you're dog is a genetically modified wolf, warped by mankind into something wholly unnatural.

      I now see in my grocery store "organic milk", it is priced twice as expensive as the gallon of regular milk. The same thing is in produce, they have organic vegitables. What is this? 20 years ago everything was organic, now only the rich can get normal food. The rest of us must eat crap that has been genetically modified.

      i assume you live in the west. you are already fabulously rich by world standards. and you are correct: genetically modified foods, that grow in the desert or have vitamin a genes inserted into them, can save thousands of poor people from blindness and starvation.

      but silly me, the hysterical worries of an uneduated propagandized western child is more important than any of that.

      people talk about frankenfoods all the time as a threat to us.

      and i think that is a fitting allegory.

      because if you recall from the story of frankenstein, the hysterical uneducated ignorant peasants were out to burn a creature that only wanted to help them.
    • Yeah, we really should go back to periodic famines and 40-year lifespans, like in the good old days before science.

      Basically, look at all the suffering in Africa. That was what the world was like way back then.

    • What is this? 20 years ago everything was organic, now only the rich can get normal food. The rest of us must eat crap that has been genetically modified.


      More like 50. The "Green Revolution [wikipedia.org]" took care of that AND made food more affordable (okay, it just shifted the cost but still).

  • The science of cooking (Score:5, Funny)

    by GillBates0 ( 664202 ) on Monday August 29, 2005 @04:50PM (#13430519) Homepage Journal
    Roland Piquepaille with Herbed Tomato Sauce

    INGREDIENTS:

    250 pounds Roland Piquepaille
    1 cup article excerpts
    1/8 teaspoon finely chopped original contributions.
    1 primidi.com blog
    1 popular techie website

    PREPARATION:

    Wash Roland Piquepaille; pat dry. Season with 1 cup copy pasted excerpts from article. Mix in 1/8th teaspoon finely chopped original comments. Heat 3 tablespoons oil in a large skillet or Dutch oven and cook until evenly brown. Link to blog and submit to popular techie website.

    Best served hot. Serves ~90,000.
  • Try thousand year old eggs [google.com]. Those will put feathers on your chest ;-)
  • Just the other day I was eating a late lunch in my car, on the drive home from work. 2/3rds of the way through the delicious honey-basted turkey sandwich with Marble Jack cheese, I paused from driving to behold what I was eating, only to realize I had just bitten into turkey lunchmeat that was so old it had turned blue. I quickly rolled down my window and spewed out my mouth's contents as quickly as possible.

    True story.

  • Seven years isn't all that new (Score:4, Interesting)

    by danamania ( 540950 ) on Monday August 29, 2005 @04:53PM (#13430542)
    For example, here is a Pravda article which says that NASA is preparing sandwiches which will still be edible after seven years.

    In around mid 1998, I cleaned my car out and found, among the other rubbish in the back seat, an obviously forgotten McDonalds paper bag, one either me or one of my passengers had bought & forgotten about. It contained a Quarter Pounder and Fries that had been sitting there, dried out for who knows how long. I honestly couldn't remember the last time I'd been to McDonalds when i was doing the cleaning, so I'm guessing it had been there at least six months to a year.

    The fries looked OK. they'd been kept inside the bag & never exposed to the air so no bugs had managed to crawl in. The real surprise was the quarter pounder - I unwrapped it and found a perfectly preserved edible looking and smelling burger. To look at and sniff, it was no different to a brand new fresh one, it was just rock hard and dried out.

    I gave it to my niece who kicked it around for a couple of days in the back yard - it didn't look much worse for wear after that either.

    Judging by the condition of that quarter pounder, I wouldn't be surprised if it would have lasted through to today if I'd kept it in the bag.
  • If something doesn't break down after seven years, what chance does my digestive system have? I can't even imagine the horrible farts a shelf-stable egg salad sandwich could create.
  • before the Americans get all scientific about cooking, how about recognising and developing local cuisine and cooking talent.

    I'm sorry to say this, but for world leaders, Americans might just have the poorest gastonimical sense on this planet...

    Everything's not about science...

    • Nice troll. America is home to some of the best restaurants in the world. Sure, most of the culinary styles here are not unique -- but then again, most of our population is not indigenous.

      I'll agree that a subset of the population doesn't have "developed" culinary tastes. The same is true for France, for Italy, for anywhere. Just because YOUR experience of American cuisine doesn't meet your standards, doesn't mean that others' experiences are not different.

      I, for one, have a plethora of cuisines to
      • I couldn't agree with you more. I have lived in Japan and Germany, and the one thing I REALLY missed about the US was the food. One can only take so much udon and schnitzel(yeah, stereotypical foods but you get the point) before you just want something different. Do you know how hard it is to find a Chinese restaurant in rural Germany? Not to mention the whole "water isn't free, and we don't have refills" policy :P Great beer though...but of course you can get the beer imported in America.
        Maybe if the
    • I'm sorry to say this, but for world leaders, Americans might just have the poorest gastonimical sense on this planet...

      I can tell you've never visited England...

  • Coïncidental (anti-Kraft Flash) (Score:3, Funny)

    by ZeroExistenZ ( 721849 ) on Monday August 29, 2005 @05:05PM (#13430660)
    GEFAC [krafty.org]
  • after 7 years. Even after 40 million years of storage you can still eat dirt [about.com].

    Doesn't mean it tastes good or is healthy for you..

    People do stupid things.
    I have no burning desire to eat a 7 year old sandwhich.
        Or dirt...

  • March of the Machines. (Score:2, Interesting)

    by torpor ( 458 )

    i had an egg mcmuffin today which, i noted, was pulled out of a blister pack before being stuffed into a machine. it was a singularly borg-like experience .. i don't think i'll have another one, ever.

    the best food is home-grown. after that, it is all down-hill. i hope we build better machines that make it possible for humans to grow their own food.

    in fact, i'd be just as happy if we stopped making multi-millionaire momsanto executives, and threw all that money at proper programs to manage growth and water

  • *sigh* This "news" from Roland is nothing new. (Score:3, Informative)

    by CapsaicinBoy ( 208973 ) on Monday August 29, 2005 @05:10PM (#13430702)
    This so-called news from Rolland is nothing new.

    In fact, I have a BS and MS in Food Science from Cornell.

    http://www.foodsci.cornell.edu/ [cornell.edu]

    Nor am I the only one. There are over 40 Food Science programs in the US. This is a non-story.

    http://www.ift.org/cms/?pid=1000624 [ift.org]

  • Humankind has been developing new ways of preparing foods for millenia.

    So what if now we design foods from the ground up, instead of by trial and error?

    Any great modern chef will understand the chemistry and physics behind their cooking. I know that yeast is only "happy" at a certain pH range, and adjust my bread recipes to account for this. Ditto for leavening agents such as baking soda and baking powder.

    Great cooking is taking those same rules of physics and chemistry, and using them to create a m
  • For years margarine were touted as a healthy alternative to butter. Decades later we find out that trans-fats in margarine is the main cause of several endemic conditions that, ironically, people were told butter caused.

    Now the salient point here is to see why people thought margarine was safe; the ingredients used were already known to be safe food products. What they didn't know was that a chemical can be atom-for-atom the same as another, but its shape and chirality (handedness) can make them react di
    • For years margarine were touted as a healthy alternative to butter. Decades later we find out that trans-fats in margarine is the main cause of several endemic conditions that, ironically, people were told butter caused.


      Actually that depends on what Margerine you're using. if you use the "hard" variety yes, then you have a problem, the soft one is fine though, no transfats.
    • So, buy non-hydrogenated margarine. They are usually made from plant oils without the hydrogenation and so result in a softer consistency, and is healthier than hydrogenated margarine or butter.

  • The Fat Duck (Score:4, Informative)

    by Hogwash McFly ( 678207 ) on Monday August 29, 2005 @05:13PM (#13430728)
    The head chef of the Fat Duck (a British restaurant voted the best in the world this year - jokes about British cuisine now null and void), Heston Blumenthal, is what you might call a 'molecular gastronomist'. By breaking cooking down to the basical levels and using the principles of chemistry to determine good combinations of food one can offer up delights such as bacon 'n' egg ice cream and snail porridge; two of the most famous dishes served at the Fat Duck.

    I read a fascinating article on Blumenthal in The Sunday Times a good few months ago, and also learned of another restaurant (the name and location of which escapes me, although I think it was in Spain) which offered up similar food. The menu for this particular restaurant was something like 17 courses and several hundred euros a head. The writer for the ST (who was lucky to beat a three-odd year waiting list) was amazed at the combinations of ingredients and even the consistencies of the dishes that were comepletely unexpected. One particular serving that stuck in my mind was a kind of 'orange froth' that practically disappeared immediately in your mouth but was full of flavour. The journalist detailed how strange it felt eating froth for dinner. The cover of the supplement I was reading featured pictures from a handful of the courses and the presentation was astonishing. There was a square chocolate lollipop (I forget what wacky ingredient was coupled with it) which was so thin in the middle it was all wispy and translucent and webbed. Delicious.

    Anyone for baconated grapefruit?

  • On Food and Cooking (Score:3, Insightful)

    by espressojim ( 224775 ) <eris@NOsPam.tarogue.net> on Monday August 29, 2005 @05:15PM (#13430741)
    So, someone's finally gotten around to reading all of Harold McGee's "On Food and Cooking the science and lore of the kitchen".

    This is a book about food stuffs through history, and their chemical and physical reactions to different processes used in cooking. The book has ~70 pages on milk, about about ~60-70 pages on eggs alone.

    You get a chance to understand how your food works, at the molecular level. You can read about what protiens are in eggs, and how they change due to heat, acidity, etc. How whipped cream supports air, and how the fat molecules wrap around air (including pictures with a scanning electron microscope!)

    Good stuff for cooks, and very much the science of cooking.

    However, this book was originally written 20 years ago, so this isn't as new as it's played out to be...Now Pravda is just supplementing the story with a bit of 'wouldn't it be cool if we used technology to make things better?'
  • Ever since I started eating more naturally (getting away from salt/fat, sweet snacks), I don't think I've encountered a food that tastes better when processed in any way - canned, frozen, concentrated, deep fried as in finished potato chips, dried, etcetera - that tasted better than it's natural or freshly cooked counterpart. Not to mention the benefits of fresh fruits/vegetables.

    Or in the case of velveta, other airspray cheeses made of oil/water instead of a milk - any that tasted better than the traditio
  • Tea, Earl Grey, hot

    (can't believe nobody said it yet :P)

  • You reference Pravda? Bwahahahahaha!!! (Score:3, Informative)

    by FredThompson ( 183335 ) <fredthompson&mindspring,com> on Monday August 29, 2005 @08:37PM (#13432047)
    Where did you find this article? Was it between the monkey boy bites man and pyramid power articles or the ones which describe perpetual motion machines from space aliens?

    Really, quoting Pravda is worse than treating the National Enquirer as a legitmate news source.

    The current headlines at http://english.pravda.ru/ [pravda.ru] includes this:

    Brazil, Russia, India and China to outdo Europe and the US - 08/29/2005 13:29

    The main economic analysts of today share their thoughts of tomorrow
    The world is changing so quickly that the human mind is unable to keep up. Experts from Deutsche Bank and other analysts decided to take a look at the future. The role of the EU becomes less and less important while developing countries boost their economic growth. Experts do not consider the USA a motive power in the economic progress. China and other rapidly developing countries are more important in the accelerating of world economy.

    Uh..ok, the situation is changing so fast that the human mind can't comprehend but Deutsche Bank "experts" can predict the future. Uh...right. No contradiciton here, just accept what Pravda says.

    Never mind that they are raising funds by selling Pravda-branded merchandise through Cafe Express...an American commercial site.

    Click on the "Science and Health" sub-category and you will see 3 main areas: Discoveries (which includes a story titled, "Ageing and dying is just a freak" about nanotech to let people live forever because science fiction authors think about it, UFOs, and Technologies. That 3rd category includes articles about how every living creature on earth will be given a unique barcode, indispensable Russian Navy submersibles (if only they would learn the difference between nets and hammocks) and the story about food which will last forever.

    Yeah, Pravda, the science reference for those without grounding in reality.

Slashdot Top Deals

UNIX was not designed to stop you from doing stupid things, because that would also stop you from doing clever things. -- Doug Gwyn

Close