The Worst Jobs in Science: The Sequel

flyingtoaster writes "For the second year in a row, Popular Science published their annual countdown of the worst jobs in science. This year's list includes Anal-Wart Researcher, Iraqi Archaeologist and Landfill Monitor. And you think your job's bad?" We also linked to last year's list.

Nurse is on the list, thats really really BAD!

[BrookHarty]

Anyone find it funny the most common job on there is Nursing? The nursing role has changed from working with patients to Medical Assistants. They hire 10-15 MA's to 1 Nurse in most clinics. And then to top it off, they dont pay the Nurses for the years in school, and hard work, and they get no respect for managing the MA's ontop of normal nurses duties.

What a shame.

In our Internet-based summons for readers to top (bottom?) last year's "Worst Jobs" list, nurses nominated themselves in droves: "Still a no-respect profession. Doctors treat you like slaves." "The pay is substandard for all the training." "Just look at the current shortage." Indeed, the government estimates that we're short 110,000 nurses, and that by 2008 we'll need half a million more.

Numerous studies echo the dissatisfaction of our nurse readers. Nurses are fleeing the profession because of stress, long hours, low pay and lack of advancement opportunities. The cost? A recent University of Pennsylvania study found that surgical patients at hospitals with the worst nurse-staffing levels (ergo the most overworked nurses) have a 31 percent greater chance of dying. If this trend doesn't improve, we might soon find "patient" topping our list.

Last year's list

[quizwedge]

The link mentioned in the previous slashdot article no longer works. Compliments of the WayBackMachine [archive.org]

Re:Grossed out

[oexeo]

yes

Re:Bush on "science"

[tsunamifirestorm]

Well they have a Congressional Science Fellow listed on there if you RTFA (or RTF Magazine). In both jobs most of your efforts will go to waste, but I'm sure if you were the President's Advisor, I'm sure you'd at least be paid better.

Re:Tampon Squeezer

[sysadmn]

Why, free tampons?
Perhaps you meant in vivo CONDOM tester. Big difference...

Re:Nurse is on the list, thats really really BAD!

[Lareya]

Just to clarify, all those "other" nursing specialized cares does mean more than 2 year grad. If you want management, or nurse practitioner, you MUST have a higher degree. Minimally masters. Also, the nurse practitioner don't make much more money than floor nursing. The only nurse that actually makes a lot more money are the nurse anesthetists. Also, the required call also makes nurses make more money, but it is more than a 40 hour week.

And, yes I am a nurse.

Re:Nurse is on the list, thats really really BAD!

[MmmDee]

And, yes I am a nurse.

Then thank you for the job you do.

The "other" nursing specialties do require more training and that's part of their career path (like everyone else). Primary Care Nurse Practioners make on national average $69K [salary.com]. I dated a NP for 7 years (she was a "floor RN" for four of those years), she now makes $85K and a friend of hers is a NP for a hospital specialty department and makes $100K. The friend has no call and the former gf gets paid extra for each weekend she works ($1500 for Fri to Sun--double that if it's a holiday). The median salary for a CRNA is $118K [salary.com].

Unlike many 9-5 jobs (or 7-3), many jobs in the medical profession are not 40-hour weeks. Many are much more (especially if you count call nights/weekends). When I was a resident, an 80-hour week was considered short (this was of course before resident hour limitations initiated in New York).

Re:Grad student

[the gnat]

And compared to people in biology, we get paid a lot; I know someone who gets $12,000 a year.

Ummmm. . . I'm in biology, and I get $24,500 starting out - more this semester because I'm also teaching. This is about the most any school pays, actually, but the top biology programs are all pretty comparable. For a single 20-something, it's good money, even if I took a large pay cut to go back to school. Students on external fellowships make even more: the NSF now pays upwards of $30,000 a year, and more if you teach.

Frankly, I couldn't be happier with my position, despite the attempts of our local grad student union to convince us that we're oppressed. However, after I graduate I can either go consult (shitloads of $$, but no science or fame), work for a biotech or big pharma (good $$, okay science, probably no fame), or become a perma-postdoc (no $$, awesome science, probably no fame). I could get all three as a faculty member at a good university, but there are vastly fewer jobs available than candidates, and you have to be some combination of brilliant, extremeley focused, well-connected, and just plain lucky. I'm well-connected, but only reasonably intelligent, and I can't focus worth shit, so unless I get really lucky I'm not getting one of those jobs. Sort of depressing, but at least I like the work I'm doing.

Re:Consequences of Bush's Iraq War

[cold fjord]

Things are a litte more complex than that little blurb in the article suggests. Saddam's interest in archaeology tended to be self-serving, such has when Saddam rebuilt Babylon [about.com]:

In 1982, Saddam's workers began reconstructing Babylon's most imposing building, the 600-room palace of King Nebuchadnezzar II. Archaeologists were horrified. Many said that to rebuild on top of ancient artifacts does not preserve history, but disfigures it. The original bricks, which rise two or three feet from the ground, bear ancient inscriptions praising Nebuchadnezzar. Above these, Saddam Hussein's workers laid more than 60-million sand-colored bricks inscribed with the words, "In the era of Saddam Hussein, protector of Iraq, who rebuilt civilization and rebuilt Babylon." The new bricks began to crack after only ten years.

The problems in Iraq aren't new. Many of the problems in Iraq date back to at least Saddams invasion of Kuwait and the 1991 Gulf War [umd.edu].

Prior to the Persian Gulf War, archaeologists working in Iraq were forced to close down excavations when Iraq's August invasion of Kuwait made the situation to dangerous to continue....

And following the war, looting of archaeological sites increased dramatically as Iraq's impoverished citizens used sometimes desperate means to make money in light of the economic sanctions placed on Iraq by the western world.

Saddam's military made a practice of stationing military units by antiquities to protect them from attack [opinionjournal.com]. There are many recorded instances, including these gems:

...In early February 1991, for example, Saddam parked MiG fighter jets at a Babylonian ziggurat at Ur to deter coalition forces from disabling them during the Gulf War. By Nineveh, the ancient capital of the Assyrian empire, he built air bases and weapons factories. According to archaeological scholars from the University of Chicago, an 80-foot mound containing many ruins of ancient Nineveh also housed an oil storage tank. During the Iran-Iraq war, Saddam used the site for anti-aircraft batteries because it was the most elevated spot in the area....

In contrast, at the height of the bombing campaign the Pentagon produced aerial photographs of the Al-Basrah mosque. They showed clearly that the Iraqis had destroyed the mosque for propaganda purposes. While coalition forces had bombed a target some 100 yards away, leaving the mosque unscathed, Iraqi engineers sliced off the dome in the hope of duping journalists that the U.S. had been responsible for the destruction.

The desecrations of burial grounds in Iraq aren't anything new. They happened to burial grounds [bbc.co.uk]after the first Gulf War too.

The looting of the museums was also overstated [globalsecurity.org] as well.

FWIW: In Afghanistan, the Taliban was destroying priceless cultural artifiacts [bbc.co.uk] as being anti-Islamic. The US intervention in Afghanistan stopped that, and the new government is committed to preserving such artifacts.

Were famous!

[Stone316]

I grew up in St. John's, Newfoundland and its a beautiful place and i'm hoping to move back there (if I can find a job since the economy isn't the best..) The last time I visited was over 2 years ago but I still remember the smell of the harbour and picture the bubbling sewage, along with flocks of Seagulls like they were at a feast.

I heard if you fall in you have to get a ton of shots.

Some links of interest:
http://www.ozfm.com/skycam.htm [ozfm.com] for a live webcame of the downtown core.
http://www.stjohns.ca/cityservices/environment/har bour/cleanup.jsp [stjohns.ca] The Harbour Cleanup Project website.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St._John's,_Newfoundl and_and_Labrador [wikipedia.org] A post on /. wouldn't be complete with a a wikipedia reference.

Re:Religious radicals?

[connorbd]

Please look at talkorigins.org. No legitimate scientist doubts that evolution happens; it's how it happens that gets debated.

Re:Religious radicals?

[Anonymous Coward]

Use your brain and tell me where the fucking dinosaurs are in the bible.

Job 40:15-24, 41:1-34. And before you say that the first is an elephant or a hippopotamus, ask yourself how many of those have tails like cedar trees... (vs17).

Re:Religious radicals?

[Anonymous Coward]

Actually, the Bible I have in front of ME says it is an Elephant. But it also says "that I made along with you" Dinosuars died out way before humans walked the earth. Nice try. Thanks for playing.

Re:Nurse is on the list, thats really really BAD!

[hrvatska]

The big crisis in nursing is going to come in 5 to 10 years. There's a significant bubble of nurses in the 45 to 55 year age range who will be retiring. This retirement bubble, in conjunction with the aging US population, will likely lead to an even larger nursing shortage in the next decade.

My wife has been an RN for nearly 30 years, and has experience nursing in 5 states and 8 hospitals. She obtained her BS degree in nursing in 1975. She's worked in a range of hospitals. From advanced medical centers to small rural hospitals. Everything I know about nursing I learned from listening to her and her fellow nurses vent over the years. From my wife's perspective, nursing is a lot more stressful now than it used to be. A lot of this has to do with the increase in administrivia that RNs have to attend to. Some of it is driven by the legal climate surrounding health care in the US. I'm a software engineer, and I wonder how many of my colleagues would be willing to stay in the profession if they could be sued and prosecuted for decisions on the job. Especially when those decisions involve snap decisions in sudden and critical situations.

Aside from the original degree and license exam, my wife is required to periodically re-take and pass an extensive exam in her specialty. She is required to have a minimum amount of education every year. She has to be educated on all the new medications she administers. Like any other profession that deals with advanced technology, regular education is critical to staying competent.

The federal and state governments may want to consider taking steps to reduce the size of the shortage. Here are some possibilities.

• Help colleges increase the number of available slots in nursing schools, especially community colleges. Associate degree nurses are every bit as qualified as BS degree nurses for the day-to-day things that most RNs have to do. They have to pass the same exams after school to get their licenses, and most Associate degree programs give just as much hands on training as BS degree programs. BS degree programs tend to be heavier on the theory side of nursing. This stuff is okay if you're going to be going into administration, but really doesn't matter much on the job. My wife's perception is that Associate degree nurses are more likely to be willing to 'get their hands dirty' from day one. Periodically, there's talk of requiring RNs to obtain BS degrees in order to be licensed as RNs. Bad idea. I suspect this gets pushed by advanced degree nurses who never spent much time on the floor nursing, having spent the majority of their careers in the hospital and state bureaucracies. These would be the PHBs of nursing and health care.
• College loan deferment or forgiveness programs aimed at nursing students.
• Better pay for nursing aides. One of the real hassles for RNs is the high turnover rate for aides. It's even higher than the turnover rate for RNs. This is in large part due to the abysmal pay of aides. Higher pay would attract better people, and act as an incentive for them to stay in their jobs. Good aides make a nurses job a lot easier. New and inexperienced aides require more attention from RNs, which leaves less time for the skilled tasks that the RN should be spending time on. Good aides frequently decide to go into nursing, so attracting more qualified and motivated people could help in more ways than one.
• Help hospitals implement better IT systems. A good hospital IT system reduces the amount of time RNs have to spend doing paperwork, and increases the amount of time they spend with patients. It also indirectly reduces medication and other errors.
• Medicare and medicaid are one of the largest funding channels for hospitals. Perhaps paying a higher rate to hospitals that meet certain minimum staffing criteria would encourage hospitals to find and implement creative solutions to recruit and retain nurses. I think better staffing would lead to better care, which would in turn lead to be

Re:job interview out of college

[Anonymous Coward]

And the most dangerous part of the system? One random moron who slips through the screening process. I come from a smelter town, and the smelter's HR screen can't have been very good since they had far more than their share. My favorite?

There's a stage in the process where an enormous bucket carries molten lead from one area to the next. For some reason, things slowed down and a bucket sat around long enough for the surface of the lead to harden and it wouldn't pour. So what did the moron operator do? He took a metal rod, walked out onto the hardened lead and bashed at the crust with the rod. At least when being dipped in lead was used as a Medieval torture it wasn't self-inflicted.

Re:hypocrite

[metlin]

The parent's sig is designed to seek attention.

See this thread [slashdot.org].

Gee, and you fell for it.

K-25 demolition

[deblau]

I grew up in Oak Ridge. If you think that a building dripping with radiation is bad, check out the Secret City scenic railway [southernap...way.museum]. Doesn't seem unusual, until you discover where the station [techscribes.com] is. For some real giggles, here's an excerpt from the bottom of the page:

Note: Due to additional security procedures following the events of September 11, 2001, the Secret City Scenic Excursion Train is currently boarding at the back gate of the East Tennessee Technology Park (ETTP), formerly known as the K-25 facility. This situation will continue until we are advised otherwise by security officials at ETTP.

Yes, folks, due to heightened security, we're having Joe Public board the train right next to the abandoned nuclear facility. You know, the one with radioactive barrels filled with Uranium scattered willy-nilly out in front.

Scary as all that sounds, I've actually been on the train ride. It's very pleasant, the rail cars are antiques, and the tour guide's history of Oak Ridge during WWII was interesting. (Checks rad badge again. No problems.)

It's a shame to see the old girl go down, really. She's done a lot [childrenof...roject.org] in her time in "Happy Valley". K-25 was at one time the world's largest building [childrenof...roject.org]. (For a sense of scale, have a look at the two-story townhouses at the bottom of the pic. If you look carefully, you'll see that the two buildings in the center are actually just one building.)

Re:eeeeeeeew

[LarsWestergren]

"We can't show pictures or even really talk about these diseases," says parasitologist Eric Ottesen of Emory University. "Society just isn't ready for it."

I hope no one tells him about the internet:
Worms [cdfound.to.it]
Scroll down to see the stuff described in the article if you are curious. NOT for the faint of heart obviously. If you thought it sounded fun to get a huge scrotum, look at that poor guy.

Re:Religious radicals?

[Bush Pig]

Okay - I may be misjudging you somewhat, as you haven't made your position completely clear, but I'm assuming you believe in creation "science", or at least that you reject any theories of evolution.

The thing is, I'm not sure how you can claim that evolution hasn't been experimentally tested (and I'm not just talking about fruitflies). There is a fossil record (admittedly incomplete) which indicates the mutability of species over millions of years. In just the case of primates, there's strong indications of a direct line from lemur-like creatures to us, through the great apes. I'm not a biologist, so I don't have reams of facts at my fingertips, or a very deep knowledge of evolution, but I still find it far more believable than the folk-tales of people who (to paraphrase Harry Harrison) didn't even understand the mechanism of a rainbow, because there is _absolutely_ _no_ independant, verifiable evidence of the absolute truth of those fairytales. I'm also pretty sure that there is experimental evidence of evolution (as in: The theory predicts this, but we've not found evidence of it yet. Oh, look, here's that evidence. Notch up another win for Occam's Razor.) but I must admit I'm unable to recall a specific instance. Go and talk to a bioligist. Maybe they'll be able to remember the stuff I can't right now.

Re:Television Meteorologist

[Tiram]

On NRK, one of our national TV channels (Norway), the weather is actually presented by real meteorologists, usually seniors from the Meteorologic Institute [met.no], which means it's mostly men well into their forties or more. They are definitively not weather bunnies:)

Re:Religious radicals?

[jester22c]

As far as religeous texts go, there are more intact (and consistent) greek manuscripts of the Bible than any other religeous book. Yet somehow the Bible gets all the flak because it is/was so widely translated. If you compare the originals to todays 'interpretations' they are definately agreeable enough (and I have compared them) and most of the mistranslations are menial compared to the big picture. The problem is that the vernacular had definitive words for each interpretation while our modern English language interchanges words like crazy.