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Science

The Future of Leap Seconds 429

@10u8 writes "Since 1972 precision clocks around the world have ticked using atomic seconds, but earth rotation is slowing down. Leap seconds have been inserted in order to keep noon happening at noon, but they upset some timekeepers. Recent discussions have considered discontinuing leap seconds in UTC, and a colloquium in Torino next month will present results. It is a matter of international significance."
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The Future of Leap Seconds

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  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 18, 2003 @06:53PM (#5762548)
    "So, what do you do?"

    "I am a keeper of the time."

  • I hope... (Score:5, Funny)

    by MoonshineKid ( 615121 ) <pogo118@earthlinCOWk.net minus herbivore> on Friday April 18, 2003 @06:53PM (#5762553)
    I hope this means we get an extra second of February every four years. I love February.
  • by lightspawn ( 155347 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @06:54PM (#5762557) Homepage
    Considering that some programmers (of commercial software, no less) have no idea HOW TO CHECK IF A YEAR IS A LEAR YEAR, I fear this is going to be no less catastrophic than Y2K, perhaps even a cataclysm of Y2038 proportions!

    Excuse me while I stock up on food, medicine and ammo.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 18, 2003 @06:54PM (#5762558)
    Februray will lose 1 day and a few seconds. Whats the big deal? Wait slower...that means I have to work longer. NOW THAT SUCKS!!!

  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 18, 2003 @06:55PM (#5762570)

    Lear years rock!!!! Also, you are dumb.
  • by dobedobedew ( 663137 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @06:57PM (#5762574)
    We don't even do Daylight Savings Time here in Indiana. Whatever the rest of the world decides, we will resist - I can't wait to see our citizens and politicians get in an uproar over this!
  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 18, 2003 @07:00PM (#5762587)
    Who cares. Why are we bickering over a LEAP-SECOND. Put your energy into more important matters... Seriously.

    Yeah, let's bicker over whether we should be bickering over leap seconds. Much more productive.
  • by Zerbey ( 15536 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @07:01PM (#5762596) Homepage Journal
    Time is an Illusion. Lunchtime doubly so.
  • by Eric_Cartman_South_P ( 594330 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @07:01PM (#5762599)
    I've said this before, but I think Maxtor Hard Drive MTBF rates and Iomega tape drive MTBF rates are good, consistent, short time measuerments (both very shitty products that fail reliably).

    Me: Wanna go have sex?
    Hot Girl: OK! When?
    Me: I'm on lunch break in 3 Maxtors and a Tape.
    Hot Girl: I'll pay for the Hotel room.

  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 18, 2003 @07:02PM (#5762602)
    Let's just make a law that all planes must take off to the west.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 18, 2003 @07:03PM (#5762608)
    You better keep Feb 29th, I don't wanna die at the age of 6!
  • by happyhippy ( 526970 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @07:05PM (#5762615)
    SPEED UP THE EARTH!

    I propose we keep the earth spinning at a constant rate by detonating thousands of nukes at certain places once every four years. This will produce a Catherine Wheel effect and the earth will speed back to its original spin rate.

    I am going to patent this idea but I fear itll be 500 years before I get it processed.

  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 18, 2003 @07:09PM (#5762634)
    Just have everyone run west at the same time for a while on the whole planet. Duh!
  • by lightspawn ( 155347 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @07:09PM (#5762636) Homepage
    1. Sorry about the typo; I apologize.

    2. I'm actually rather smart, but sometimes instead of a word's last letter I type the next word's last letter. You may classify it as mild dyslexia; it's mostly not a problem since most people can understand what I meant from context.

    3. The person sitting next to me right now has been using excessive amounts of glue for the last few minutes; I'm not sure what its purpose was, but some of you CSI fans can no doubt explain how certain types of industrial-strength glue can cause synapses to misfire.

    4. Again, I apologize for any inconveniece. As a token of good will, please accept this coupon, good for ignoring one (1) typo or grammar error in any future slashdot posting. Expires 6/18/2003.
  • by Znonymous Coward ( 615009 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @07:16PM (#5762671) Journal
    Hi Time Keeper, I'm am the Gate Keeper... Have you see the Key Master anywhere?
  • by rrkap ( 634128 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @07:25PM (#5762701) Homepage
    A slashdot reader having sex with a hot girl????????

    Either the poster's definition of hot, girl or sex is seriously out of whack.
  • by Tackhead ( 54550 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @07:28PM (#5762711)
    > Thus, they're debating about doing away with leap seconds altogether. One possible substitute is a 'leap hour' every thousand years.

    Why not?

    Asshats from the Industrial Revolution days make us do a frickin' "leap hour" twice a year anyways, one of which violates causality. Fuckin' Daylight Savings Time.

    What drooling asshat decided that it'd be a good idea if, every year, there was one day when everyone's heart/respiration rates slowed down to one beat/breath per hour, and about six months later, these same people should be able to start a 20 minute download that finishes 40 minutes before it started?

    Fine if you've got a black hole nearby for the former, and fine if you can travel faster than light for the latter.

    The day we have those technologies, fine. Until then, no, no, no, no, no, these are bad, bad, bad, bad, bad ideas.

  • Re:Why? (Score:2, Funny)

    by aztektum ( 170569 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @07:29PM (#5762715)
    I don't get why being that anal about time keeping is so important anyway. I guess with all the high dollar electronic transactions that go on these days there and what not, but for the average chump going about day to day... if the sun is in the sky it's day time, if it's not, it's night. If it looks like it's in the middle of the sky it's time for lunch.

    What's the big deal? Can someone enlighten me?
  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 18, 2003 @07:29PM (#5762718)
    They vetoed the leap second, didn't they?
  • by tap ( 18562 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @07:31PM (#5762725) Homepage
    Actually, you do use daylight savings time in Indiana [mccsc.edu]. There are eleven counties that are on central time and use DST, five counties that are eastern time and use DST and 76 counties that are eastern time and don't use DST. So Indiana has no less than three different time zones. At least they don't have multiple timezones per county.

    Given Indiana's history with keeping time, probably half the counties will participate and half won't. And some will just switch to the Mayan calander and be done with it.

  • Umm.. yeah. (Score:2, Funny)

    by blenderfish ( 156901 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @07:43PM (#5762781)
    Hmmm..

    "matter of international significance"

    Hmmm... I know!

    echo "matter of international significance" | perl -p -e 's/t..n[^s]+//';

    Ahh. Now *THATS* more like it.
  • by buyo-kun ( 664999 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @07:43PM (#5762785)
    A bird, a plane, No SUPERMAN

    When he messed around with the Earth's rotation to save Lois Lane, he got lazy and messed it up by a tiny bit. Now look whats happened, we're off by a couple seconds now.

    This is what happens when you get an alien to do a human's job.
  • by smartfart ( 215944 ) <joey AT joeykelly DOT net> on Friday April 18, 2003 @07:45PM (#5762789) Homepage Journal
    "It is a matter of international significance."

    It's about time someone did something to correct these errors.

    /me runs off before he gets thwapped.

    (it's funny, go ahead and laugh, willya?)

  • by panaceaa ( 205396 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @07:53PM (#5762816) Homepage Journal
    No, we should constantly redefine 'a second' so there's always 24*60*60 of them a day. This would benefit hardware manufacturers greatly.

    You know your 25 MHz computer from 10 years ago? Guess what, now that days are longer, it's 25.001 MHz!!!
  • Re:Why? (Score:5, Funny)

    by Okonomiyaki ( 662220 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @07:59PM (#5762838) Homepage
    Interesting. So is there any way that we can use a similar technique to get Nov 2004 to arrive a little sooner? Please?
  • by Bob McCown ( 8411 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @08:00PM (#5762841)
    "We're going to need a piece of your brain for analysys"

    "ok..."

  • by grammar fascist ( 239789 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @08:05PM (#5762861) Homepage
    Dudi, w knoy exactle where you'rg cominm frot. The samg thins happeno te md, anm I'e thr GRAMMAT FASCISR fog cryint oud loud.
  • by the eric conspiracy ( 20178 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @08:06PM (#5762863)

    It seems to me that we should get rid of the concept of seconds altogether. The second was devised in the Sumerian culture, along with such bizarre ideas as a circle having 360 degrees.

    The French of course stole the concept of decimalization from Thomas Jefferson and applied it to a variety of measurements, but failed to carry it to a good conclusion by decimalizing time (it seems everything French starts off well but is never really completed).

    It seems to me that real progress should be made by dividing the day up into decimal units of time, and the circle into decimal units of arc, thus eliminating the second as a unit of measure.

  • by Noren ( 605012 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @08:06PM (#5762864)
    In college we had the tradition of the 'Negative time Tommy's run'. Tommy's was a hamburger joint open all night. We'd leave at, say, 2:30 AM, go eat supfast (or whatever a meal eaten at that time is called) and return to campus before we left, at 2:20 AM.

    Might as well make an event out of our nonsensical system of labelling the current time.

  • by Bob McCown ( 8411 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @08:09PM (#5762875)
    Gotta love Hitch Hiker stuff

    Except when the guy you just stopped for hasnt showered for a week...

  • by Guppy06 ( 410832 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @08:28PM (#5762936)
    "With the increasing amount of precision in today's timekeepers these problems seem to be cropping up more and more."

    What's this "today's precision" bullshit? We've been having this problem for thousands of years.

    For centuries, peoples dickered back and forth about how many 28-day lunar cycles ("months") were in a year. Some said 12, some said 13. The concept of fractions apparently escaped these simple folk.

    Then the Romans came along. Not to be daunted by silly things like "reality," they declared that the lunar cycle was really 30 days, and that there were exactly 10 of those months in a year. While they were at it, they delcared pi to be exactly 3.125. To make things work out a little better, they threw in some extra days between a few months whenver they felt the need. The Latin names for these periods translates roughly to "Not really a month."

    That got real old real fast so they threw in two more "real" months, and juggled around the lengths of the months just because they could (They're Romans, they ruled the world, yadda yadda yadda).

    That one actually lasted a few centuries, at which point they started to admit that things were still screwy (in the sweltering heat of January), which was also the same time when some guy named after a salad was thinking he was Alexander the Great. The Senate told saladm boy to go fix things (apparently smacking cheese-eating surrender monkeys around qualifies one to make a calendar). Lo and behold he did, declaring that a year was 365.25 days long (ie. every fourth year had a full extra day). Ever humble, he took the time to re-name a month after himself. Feeling insufficient in some department, he also shifted around some days so that his own personal month was longer than most.

    For a group of people that had no concept of zero, this system worked pretty well for a millenium or so, when it became obvious that things were getting screwy again. This time, the folks in Rome asked some guy with a funny white hat named Greg to help sort things out. Apparently not as experienced in invading France as salad boy was, he decided he had to plagiarize somebody else's work. He found some insane scribblings from some Poloc kook who figured out that a year was "really" 365.2425. Because the Poloc was loony (he said the earth went around the sun, of all things!), Greg felt comfortable with taking that number without admitting where he found it.

    The system work, but the folks Greg worked with had a bit of a bad reputation at the time. To the west, there were a bunch of political crackpots who called themselves "Complainers" or something like that, and to the east there were a bunch of people in even funnier hats than Greg's who all spoke Greek. So it took a little bit of time for "Greg's Nifty Calendar" (why name a month after yourself when you can rename the whole damned calendar?) to catch on, which is why nobody can figure out when Washington's birthday is and why the October Revolution took place in September.

    And even now there are all sorts of people from Newton to Einstein that say that even that calendar is screwed up! Greg's plagiarized number was off by 0.0003 days! That's almost 26 seconds! Heck, after a few thousand years that's a hole big enough to drive a Mack truck through, and then where will we be?

    "With our global economy (weather we like it or not) times need to be synced across the world."

    Between the Greek-speaking folks still thinking Greg was the anti-Christ and two groups of people blowing themselves up in the Middle East still trying to make the whole lunar cycle thing work out, we can't even agree on what day it is!

    Leap second, no leap second, it doesn't really matter to me. I'll always have NTP.
  • by pyrrho ( 167252 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @08:28PM (#5762938) Journal
    "all please stand witness, you will be amazed.

    watch while I move the SUN ITSELF BACK in the sky, ONE HOUR!

    there, done!"

    "hey, he didn't move the sun, I saw him, he just change the time setting on the clock!"

    "did not"

    "yes you did"

    "not at all, the sun is now in the wrong place, a full HOUR different from where it was yesterday at this time."

    "It is not."

    "is too"

    and so forth.
  • Big Deal (Score:5, Funny)

    by teslatug ( 543527 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @08:33PM (#5762951)
    OK, we can slashdot a webiste, surely we can fix this. Ok, on 3 let's all start running west. 1...2...3...

    running though is not so popular among this crowd...
  • by Wanker ( 17907 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @08:41PM (#5762980)
    The problem is he's finished in only half a Maxtor...
  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 18, 2003 @08:47PM (#5763007)
    OK, so the clock people don't want to have to calculate when leap seconds have or will happen when figuring out the time from A to B. And they also want noon to happen when the sun is highest in the sky, and summer to happen on June 20/21.

    There is a simple solution:

    Build a pair of giant rocket to control the rotational speed of the earth. Then just give it a 'kick' every now and then to do stuff like countering tidal drag and such. You could even get rid of leap years if they were powerful enough!!
    NASA isn't even using its last Saturn Vs anyway.... Might as well put them to good use. Or, if that's not enough, we have like 10,000 nukes ready to go.
    What's the point of a massive, bloated arms race if you aren't going to use it to impact the rotation of Earth itself??
  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 18, 2003 @08:59PM (#5763048)
    I don't know about everywhere. I'd like to see the cruiseship that could hit Idaho
  • I'm divided (Score:2, Funny)

    by Progman3K ( 515744 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @09:38PM (#5763154)
    On the one side, I don't like the idea of time being shifted around like that because it could upset my schedule, what with a tenth of a microsecond popping up like that every year, but on the other hand, if we wait until there is a full second accumulated, it could be really hard to decide what to do with it...
    I mean, do I go on vacation, read a book, learn a new language? What to do with the extra time is just too huge a responsibility.
  • by telstar ( 236404 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @10:18PM (#5763276)
    Leap year, leap seconds, leap minutes, daylight savings time ... change all of this stuff so that it cuts a year/seconds/minute/hour out of my workday, and you'll get my vote. Losing an hour of sleep overnight on a Tuesday does nothing for me, but skipping that mid-Monday meeting would be a God-send.
  • by istartedi ( 132515 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @10:20PM (#5763288) Journal

    America is to blame! We are only 5% of the Earth's population, but we use 80% of the angular momentum. Scientists have warned us for years about global slowing, but big business Republicans, and Democrats with large angular momentum consuming projects in their districts refuse to address the issue. The only viable solution is to make papier mache puppets and parade them down Pennsylvania Avenue.

  • Leap leaps (Score:3, Funny)

    by gad_zuki! ( 70830 ) on Friday April 18, 2003 @11:54PM (#5763692)
    > SPEED UP THE EARTH!

    I wholeheartedly agree. We can shed some mass temporarily and help the earth spin faster by "leaping for leaps." Every few months or so everyone on a given continent will jump up at the same time. I'm sure it'll all work out just fine. Organize a "leaps for leaps" chapter in your town today.
  • by GuyMannDude ( 574364 ) on Saturday April 19, 2003 @01:21AM (#5763893) Journal

    I wouldn't be so quick to suggest tampering with the earth's rotation. I recently saw a very intellectual documentary about what can happen if the earth's core ever stops rotating. Birds would fall from the sky, people with pacemakers would keel over dead, and entire football stadiums would be electrocuted by superstorms. All sorts of crazy shit that you wouldn't expect happens when crazy scientists start messing around with the earth's rotation.

    GMD

  • by zackeller ( 653801 ) on Saturday April 19, 2003 @01:22AM (#5763897)
    No! If they get rid of leap seconds, that'll cut my sex time in half!
  • by grolim13 ( 110441 ) on Saturday April 19, 2003 @02:59AM (#5764031) Homepage
    Wasn't the razor invented by a French woman?

    I thought it was William of Occam...

  • by merlyn ( 9918 ) on Saturday April 19, 2003 @06:47AM (#5764160) Homepage Journal
    Wow. I didn't realize we had advanced to the point where we had an international coalition just to keep the earth spinning!

    Is France a member?

    Do they take requests? ("I'd like an extra long sunset this Friday night... I have a date!")

  • Why do I find this wildly humourous considering your run stonehenge.com... ...just move the rocks around a bit.
  • Great news! (Score:3, Funny)

    by kavau ( 554682 ) on Saturday April 19, 2003 @03:42PM (#5765332) Homepage
    ...but earth rotation is slowing down.

    This is the best news I've heard in a very long time! I'm sure I'm not the only one who thinks that both day and night are way too short. How long do we have to wait until the day will be 25 hours? Aaaahh... I'm looking forward to that extra hour of sleep!

  • by Idarubicin ( 579475 ) on Saturday April 19, 2003 @03:48PM (#5765353) Journal
    America is to blame! We are only 5% of the Earth's population, but we use 80% of the angular momentum.

    It's the failure of the world's industrialized nations to use renewable power sources. By drilling for oil, millions of tons of heavy crude are removed from the the depths of the earth and brought to ground level. Since angular momentum is conserved, the earth's rotation slows slightly to compensate for the now-larger moment of inertia. Extraction of metals from mines also contributes to the problem.

    Granted, we have in part compensated by dumping large amounts of waste into deep parts of the ocean, and cutting down trees--but it's not enough! We need to begin a massive campaign to raze the forests and dump mercury and lead into oceanic trenches. Hopefully, we will one day be able to restore the Earth's rotation.

The optimum committee has no members. -- Norman Augustine

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