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Space

Space Stations That Suck 168

Posted by timothy from the use-an-airstream-space-station dept.
beanerspace writes: "Move over Vincent Flanders. In an article on Ananova.com, it was reported that the International Space Station 'sucks'. Apparently, someone got their hands on some leaked documents that reveal astronauts having to deal with dozens of irritating problems aboard the International Space Station. Things got so miserable that Bill Shepherd, who commanded the outpost for five months, reportedly told ground controllers that life aboard 'basically sucks.'" I don't see why this would have to be 'leaked' -- 5 months in cramped quarters hurtling through the vacuum of space seems sucky on the face of it.
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Space Stations That Suck More

Space Stations That Suck

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  • What were people expecting (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward
    Given the nature of the exnvironment, I'm honestly surprised that things don't 'sucks' more up there. The space station is a very sophisticated piece of equipment and for some people to expect that some things aren't going to act up is a little odd. Give credit where credit is due. I could live with a few, heck even a lot, of sucky things just to be up there.

  • It's loud (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward

    Noisy is right. I work on a human factors research team (at a University, but it's NASA funded) and we've heard it's around 80dB, ambient, just from all the machinery (pumps, fans, computers, etc.) that's going all the time.

    That'd sure as heck drive me nuts pretty quick.

  • Somebody needs hit with a clue stick (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward

    The US government is Of the people, by the people, for the people. Why is our government keeping secrets from us?

    Great sarcasm, dude. We've devolved to a fascist government over the last several decades. We're approaching Hitlerian gun control (aka victim disarmament), Hillary is still pushing for the Mussolini health-care plan, the jack-booted thugs in the Gestapo - er, the Federal Law Enforcement Agencies (FLEAs) - have been given the authority to kill citizens that piss them off by the courts... face it, folks, there are a lot of deeper, darker secrets the Feds are keeping from us than the Space Station sucking. Anonymity on the web and private e-mails are fiction, so are most of our "constitutionally guaranteed rights." Get over it, say "Yeah boss" and stop asking questions, they don't like when you ask questions.

  • Obligatory Spaceballs Quote (Score:2)

    by Anonymous Coward
    "It's Megamaid! She's gone from suck to blow!!"

  • Re:Lots of people here... (Score:2)

    by Anonymous Coward
    I don't think he meant to have it posted on slashdot. He was probably having a bad day and made the comment to a ground controller thats all. I'm sure you whine to your friends/wife/girl whatever about your job on occasion. You just are lucky enough not to have the media watching you nonstop and posting about what a whiner you are when you let slip one complaint.
  • > If, after the five months in cramped quarters hurtling through the vaccuum of space were over, I were to look out the window and find myself in orbit around Mars in preparation for a landing, it wouldn't be sucky at all.

    I'm really glad there are people that think that! Because I want to see it happen!

    But you're still crazy. Sure, you'll be famous and get to go somewhere no one has gone before, but you'll be cramped into a capsule probably a fourth the size of the ISS (at best), recycle your own bodily waste, be stuck with the same 1-3 others to talk to, etc, etc, etc... And then there's the 5 months for the return trip. (Unless of course you started a permanent colony, which would be *somewhat* cooler.)

    So, for me, no thanks.

    I might consider a stint on the ISS for the novelty of it, but I'd rather just go somewhere remote on earth, like the Amundsen-Scott South Pole Station, or maybe a lunar colony....

    ---
  • I've also heard that Coke (the cola) also makes a good toilet cleaner.

    And that's probably the only good use for it. :-)

    ---
  • ...that Americans made about their life on Mir, we will hear the same about their own^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H"International" station... What about the idea that life in space is umm... hard? How about learning other languages? Who, can I guess, insisted on dragging some flimsy laptops with Windows and Outlook into space?
  • Back in the old days, when batteries would leak if left in something too long, we would use Coca-Cola to clean the corroded battery out of the device.
  • I recall reading in Yeager's bio about trouble they had with the windscreen of the X-1 fogging, then icing over. Nothing would work to keep it fog free. Then some old maintance guy decided to try...hair conditioner...I think it was. And that kept the wind screen fog and thus ice free.

    Later on when the USAF moved it's test command out there and things got...professional, someone came up with a glass treatment that cost 14 dollars an ounce, in 1956 dollars...and it didn't work to the pilot's satisfaction, so the boys on the flight line kept using the cheap but effective...whatever it was. I think it was conditioner or shampoo. My copy of the book is upstairs and I am too lazy to find it.

    Anyway...don't think that because it's a simple or juryrigged solution...that makes the people stupid or incompetant...it shows that you don't need to always reinvent the wheel.

  • Actually.

    I've been thinking that would be a good solution.

    I bet that HY-80 or 100 steel would be good against space debris.

  • Re:I guess 2001 - A space Odessey is out (Score:3)

    by Wyatt Earp ( 1029 ) on Friday July 13, 2001 @04:46AM (#88093)
    It's not all Russian built.

    Alot of it comes from Boeing. Later on there will be Japanese modules and ESA built modules. The big robot arm that doesn't work right is from Canada.

    In fact, it's delayed because of the Russian modules.

    It's not a Mir 2.
  • astronauts have always brought chili and pepper sauces into orbit, for one simple reason: taste buds lose a lot of functionality in zero-G. The chili sauces help, the strong flavors make it so they can taste something while they are eating their nuttritionally-guaranteed-but-tastes-like-ass foods.

    I'm just not sure how i'd feel about gobbing Tabasco on my freeze-dried ice cream, thank you.
  • or was it Tito Puente?

    LOL!

  • How about learning other languages?

    Actually, I believe that they had to learn at least some Russian.

  • Hate to break it to you, but newspapers aren't any better than TV or the web.
  • Look, the hostile environment, the cramped quarters, and even things breaking, are part of the deal. However, fuckups due to bureaucratic incompetence (for instance, incompatible power plugs and water purification systems) are just unnecessarily making the lives of those astronauts harder than they should be, and probably wasting a great deal of their time that they could be using to do science - which is, after all, the whole point of the ISS. Isn't it?

    If things are wrong, the astronauts shouldn't just lay back and think of the fact they are one of only a few hundred (?) people who've gone beyond earth's atmosphere. It is their duty to whinge, complain, and moan until the ISS works effectively.

    Did you ever bitch to your superior officers about some brain-damaged piece of equipment, or moronic procedural requirement, on your sub? Did things change for the better because of it?

    Go you big red fire engine!

  • Some American-made gadgets wouldn't fit Russian plugs

    All the shampoo stuff aside, does anyone find the above statement indiciative of a major screwup? How hard is it to agree on a power socket, and make sure all the stuff that gets sent up there (at a cost of thousands of dollars per kilogram and undoubtedly safety-inspected to the nth degree at a cost of thousands more) has the right friggin' power plugs?

    Go you big red fire engine!

  • The Russian medical labels worry me. Hopefully their Sharpie (tm) marker and a talk with ground crew got them outta that one.
    The plugs not being standardized, that just confuses me. But that isn't unlike real life, so what's a spaceman to do? ;-)

    Why don't they speak Russian? Do the Russians speak English? It's supposed to be the International Space Station.
  • Is it just me, or is something very *WRONG* with that? Speaking from a purely USian standpoint, I pay taxes. I'd like to know what my taxes are paying for, and if the things they paid for are actually working out. The US government is Of the people, by the people, for the people. Why is our government keeping secrets from us?

    What, are you kidding? You can't be told about how these things don't work as advertised. If you were, you might think about them and begin to formulate your own opinions on such things instead of just accepting whatever NASA thinks you need to know. And as a non-space-oriented-thingy-expert guy, how can you possibly have an opinion that matters? Christ, with that attitude, you might start to vote your "taxpayer" opinions, and NASA surely does not want that.

    Nope. Sorry, but your participation is to be limited to opening your wallet and bending over.

  • yeah, that must suck (Score:5)

    by irongull ( 9022 ) on Thursday July 12, 2001 @07:32PM (#88102)
    Oh boohoohoo - there's no shampoo, and the DVD screen is too small, and there's all this velcro...Dude! You may have lost sight of the fact that you are LIVING IN SPACE. I would donate my right nut to science to live in space for five months. Unfortunately, the market being what it is, spare nuts just aren't worth what they used to be. But the offer still stands.

    Have some perspective.
  • They probably reached the same point that makes the boys in the US military used Pepsi and Coca-Cola as floor wax remover/stripper...none of the crap supplied does the job right or nothing was supplied and you are making due with what ya got.

    Oh, and those sodas do a real good job stripping wax..so just think what it doing to your stomach.
  • The ISS apparently needs more funds, and according to a previous Slashdot article, the astronauts could use some more publicity. So why not have a future Big Brother be about the astronauts on the ISS? :-) Of course television would have to be given creative input into say the crew composition--more women! And the crew would have to understand the need to provide some titillation for ratings. Who knows, this could give a boost to proposals such as the Japanese were considering for sex tourism in space for couples. In short, instead of just sucking, the ISS needs more f*cking.
  • *pulls out bottle of Dave's Insanity Sauce*

    To quote the label:

    ``Great Cooking ingredient for sauces, soups and stews. Also, strips waxed floors and removes driveway grease stains.''

    There you have it.

    Jeff
  • Ahh... One of the reasons I liked U-571 (although not in space). When the Americans hop on the U-boat, and immediately get in a crunch, they're all frantic because they can't read the German labels on all the controls.

  • As a New Mexican, this topic is dear to my heart.

    Real chili sauce is the spice of the gods. I'm talking about sauce that is made from actual ground up ripened chili pods, not that stuff you get at Taco Bell. It's applications extend far beyond foods that contain refried beans. Try it on eggs, steak, etc. and you may be come dangerously addicted. It is one of the most delicious things in the world, and just thinking about it is making me start to drool.

    Anyway, the sauce itself doesn't make you fart (although it can have other painful consequences involving the anus if eaten in excess).


    ---
  • My father (U.S. Naval officer) told me when I was little that kool-aid makes great aircraft carrier deck cleaner, as well.

    This is, as far as I can tell, true. However, it's a cruel thing to tell your three year old..I still can't bring myself to drink the stuff!

    rark!
  • What's interesting is that the article doesn't investigate the science or engineering or even the economics of the station, but concentrates on the very shallow word of "sucks".

    I think everybody already knew that the science, engineering, and economics of the station suck. The news here is that we've got an overly expensive space station that is pretty much useless for doing science work, doesn't show the progress in space station design that one would expect in the 15 years since the first piece of Mir was put into orbit, AND isn't even a nice place to visit.

    Sometimes I think it would be cheaper for NASA to figure out a way to haul a nuclear submarine into orbit, and use that for a space station, than for them to continue to try to make the ISS work.



    --
  • But did they say which century?

    --

  • Re:the pattern repeats... (Score:3)

    by sharkey ( 16670 ) on Thursday July 12, 2001 @07:29PM (#88111)
    "I mean, my God, we have to use chili sauce!"

    --

  • Re:Chili != Cleaning Gel (Score:5)

    by sharkey ( 16670 ) on Thursday July 12, 2001 @07:35PM (#88112)
    Well, it cleans YOU out if you eat a lot, doesn't it?

    --
  • Whenever I travel and jet lag is a problem, I sleep with ear plugs.
    No big deal.
    (I use the little yellow foam ones shaped like a cylinder...)
    One time I recommended them to a co-worker who was complaining about his noisy neighbors.
    He came in 2 hours late the next day, because he didn't hear his alarm.

    MMDC Mobile Media [mmdc.net]

  • Ok, so go home then. (Score:4)

    by wirefarm ( 18470 ) <jim@mmdCOWc.net minus herbivore> on Thursday July 12, 2001 @07:54PM (#88114) Homepage
    If you think life is so bad up there, don't go.
    I mean, these guys are supposed to be great explorers? No shampoo? Shave your damn head, whiner.
    Too much velcro? Cover it with something.
    DVD player not working? God, I'm not even going to start on that one...
    I mean, for god's sake, you're in space, not a MiniVan on a ride to the mall.
    How about that Dennis Tito guy? (or was it Tito Puente?) That guy paid $20,000,000 of his own money for a short trip to space - I bet he wouldn't be whining that the station doesn't have enough cup holders and doesn't get ESPN2.
    How many people here would happily go up and promise never to whine about a little inconvenience?

    Whatever...


    MMDC Mobile Media [mmdc.net]

  • so what? (Score:2)

    by tap ( 18562 )
    Why does this surprise you? The media in other countries is exactly the same way.
  • No, warm/hot Coke is actually a pretty impressive cleaning agent. I was in Brazil several years ago, when the cops started putting tickets directly on windshields, using some kind of "super adhesive" that they'd use to take it off when you paid the ticket. We're talking full sheet of paper, dead-centered on the windshield.

    I'd gotten ticketed for something, and a local kid offered to get the ticket off for me, for about $5 equivalent: he just soaked it in Coca-Cola in the sun, and it came off without a trace in less than 10 minutes. . .

  • Re:Chili != Cleaning Gel (Score:3)

    by cruelworld ( 21187 ) on Thursday July 12, 2001 @09:11PM (#88117)
    this brings up the question:
    Just why did they bring chili sauce in the first place? Would you want to be in a cramped space station with your fellow astronauts eating bean burritos and chili sauce?

    great way to stress test the air filtration system I guess.
  • Kool-ade powder works really well as a toilet cleaner(the ascorbic acid?)

    ascorbic acid == vitamine c. Healthy toilet cleaner <g>

    ----------------------------------------------
  • but the Sahara is a dry heat.

    Cut to the scene from "Silk Stockings" where the three Russian agents are discussing the merits of Siberia (as they're about to be sent there):

    Agent1: There's no humidity there
    Agent2: Plenty of winter sports
    Agent3: Switzerland's like that - people pay money to go there.



    --
  • Out of curisoity, does anyone know if the ISS has an "offical" language?

    I've listened on the voice loops. The official language seems to be "acronym".
  • &ltHUMOR&gtAnother data point that dirtball civilians without long-term underway seagoing experience and all non-naval military types (e.g. Air Force) need not continue to apply for astronaut service. Too much evidence exists that they whine too much and just don't know what real hardship living conditions means.&lt/HUMOR&gt

    The NASA astro-naughts should "Adapt and overcome", "quit their whining", "calculate their happiness factors"

    No field day, no ORSE, no ROUGHTRAY/GITMO, no watchstanding, no biannual requal, pay .GT. minimum wage, no sea&anchor, no UNREP, no quasi-religious nuclear pre-startup ceremonies, no five-and-dime watch rotation ... what are they complaining about?

    Who would have thought that the Nuke Navy was better prep for space travel than anything else available???

    Can the NASA astro-naughts complain like Team FTN???
    From the Team FTN Homepage [geocities.com]: FTN is an attitude. We all have it. Before I (Trash_Man) say any more, I'd like to make a few things clear. We are not just a group of dirtball whiners. I have been in the Navy for 10 years and am in a supervisory position (over 30 people report to me). I have been awarded the Navy Achievement Medal and 16 other commendations for my performance. I have been selected as a "Sailor of the Quarter" and have always received high marks on my performance evaluations. The experiences of the other FTN members mirror my own. So don't discount our complaints as the ramblings of some disgruntled kids who couldn't handle the military. We've made many trips around the block, maybe too many.

    If you kick a dog long enough, eventually he's gonna bite. Well, that's the essence of FTN. We have seen too many examples of poor leadership, abuse of authority, and simple failures to consider the consequences of an action. There are MANY good leaders in the Navy (I consider myself one of 'em), but you shouldn't have to "get lucky" to be treated with common decency and respect. And even if you "got lucky" and have a great supervisor, too often his hands are tied. I am not talking about situations where the unique nature of military service (combat actions, diplomatic crises, hazardous duties/locations, etc...) make an authoritarian leadership method a necessity. I am talking about routine, non-critical situations.

    FTN means that we are tired of the BS. It means that we think that our families really do matter, regardless of what the Navy says. It means that we are tired of having professional respect demanded from above, yet not reciprocated. It means that we don't want use a shitty method of getting something done, just because it "has always been done that way". FTN means that there have been a couple more 100+ hour weeks than we care to contribute. [HELLO NASA ASTRO-NAUGHTS ;-)] It means that we have had it, we will continue to excel in our performance (because we take pride in our own work) but we refuse to suck up and say we like it. It means that we might just tell an officer, "That's f#ckin' stupid and I'm not gonna do it that way. I'll do it the correct way instead."

    There are many different reasons to say, "F#ck The Navy". Some are personal and others professional. The top reasons (for Trash_Man) are:

    1. Family separation (sometimes greater than 300 days in a year).[HELLO NASA ASTRO-NAUGHTS ;-)]
    2. Lack of professional respect.
    3. Low pay compared to equivalent civilian job.[HELLO NASA ASTRO-NAUGHTS ;-)]
    4. People with little concern for you have too much control over your life.
    5. Little opportunity for advancement (less than 3% of eligible people in my position are advanced each year).
  • Mod this puppy up, I laughed out loud... He just needed to add the "Buh dum ching"
    ...and I'm not sure we should trust this Kyle Sagan either.

  • 5 months in cramped quarters (Score:3)

    by QuantumG ( 50515 ) <qg@biodome.org> on Thursday July 12, 2001 @07:10PM (#88123) Homepage Journal
    5 months in cramped quarters hurtling through the vacuum of space seems sucky on the face of it.

    Reminds me of a job I had once.
  • > 5 months in cramped quarters hurtling through the vacuum of space seems sucky on the face of it.

    Depends on where you're going and what you do when you get there.

    If, after the five months in cramped quarters hurtling through the vaccuum of space were over, I were to look out the window and find myself in orbit around Mars in preparation for a landing, it wouldn't be sucky at all.

    If, however, after five months, I discovered that I'd done 2400 laps around the same blue planet where I started from -- five months flying in circles and going nowhere -- yeah, that might start to qualify as suckitude.

    (Given the chance, I'd still go, even if just to fly in circles. But I'd much rather go somewhere new.)

  • language barriers (Score:3)

    by mike_sucks ( 55259 ) on Thursday July 12, 2001 @07:17PM (#88125) Homepage
    Hmm, labels in Russian eh? Well I guess that's to be expected on an International space station. Especially if can't speak Russian. I wonder what the Russian guys think of life up there.

    Out of curisoity, does anyone know if the ISS has an "offical" language? I mean, how the hell do they expect people to know what's going on if there's, what, 5-10 languages being used up there.

  • How about YOU stop washing your hair for the next 5 months and tell me "Boohoo".

    It'll be fun! You'll be just like an astronaut!
  • have it so easy. back in my day, we couldn't even use duct tape [uoguelph.ca] to live in space.
  • From the article:

    ...a lack of shampoo left them at their wits' end.

    And:

    ...chilli sauce had to be used instead of a missing cleaning gel."

    Imagine the astronauts who used the substitute cleaning gel for the missing shampoo!
  • I still recall the day my 8th grade physics teacher told the class, "Science doesn't suck." In his honor, I feel I must inform you that a vacuum does not suck matter into it, rather the matter sort of pushes itself into the vacuum.

  • Re:I don't see that it's so bad... (Score:5)

    by Chris Brewer ( 66818 ) on Thursday July 12, 2001 @07:52PM (#88130) Journal
    Noisy Machinery? Try working in a factory. Or in a server room...

    In another article (tree form), it says that the machinery (carbon filter thingy to provide breathable air) is right next to the sleeping quarters and goes "ka-chunk!" every 10 minutes.

    No Shampoo? Aww... I really feel for ya buddy.

    They found that the soap was difficult to use in zero-g so they used the shampoo to clean themselves instead, so they ran out quicker. NASA refused to send up fresh supplies in the next cargo shipment.

    Velcro pads are supposed to stick to things.

    Yeah, but not food.

    There's other wonderful things like the detailed instructions for reattaching a panel are printed on the back of the said panel, service nooks that are inaccessable without breaking things, etc.

    I assume this extra info is published on New Scientist (who have the uncensored bits), but they've been /.ed...

    --
  • OMG, I love that stuff! Dave's salsa is pretty damn tastey, too. There's also the Jamaican Hot Sauce: Batch #114 - to quote the label "Pain is Good". :-)

  • Re:yeah, that must suck (Score:3)

    by rkent ( 73434 ) <rkent@post.ha r v a r d . edu> on Friday July 13, 2001 @09:50AM (#88132)
    and the DVD screen is too small

    Plus the United States DVDs probably didn't work in space... damn region encoding...

    ---

  • "alphasucks.com" isn't even registered? After the recent selloff, I half expected to see this:

    Registrant:
    Compaq Computer Corporation (COMPAQ-DOM)
    20555 State Highway 249, M020303
    Houston, TX 77070

    ;)
  • Funny how this is happening just when people are starting to think about space tourism...

    Don't come IT SUCKS! You won't be able to plug your hair drier on those russian plugs, and (worst of all) the TV screen is too small. Do not come, We repeat, Do NOT Come. Wait for the next station, it'll be much better, keep your 20 millions.

    It sucks. We swear.

    -
    lone

  • I remember reading about the russian made crew-module and how russians didn't quite follow nasa's wishes with regards to the sound proofing. Meaning that it is impossible to sleep without ear plugs. I can imagine that alone making it quite a hell. Original specs, if followed, would have provided a considerably better enviroment but then again russia never really though about their cosmonauts' comfort level as priority number one.

  • Just the MIR thought of it... (Score:4)

    by blackholebrain ( 90909 ) on Thursday July 12, 2001 @07:18PM (#88137) Homepage

    "5 months in cramped quarters hurtling through the vacuum of space seems sucky on the face of it"

    but is not as sucky as having 5 moderator points on slashdot, and only stories like this to moderate

    neverfuckingmind

  • Chili != Cleaning Gel (Score:5)

    by shiwala ( 93327 ) on Thursday July 12, 2001 @07:21PM (#88138)

    Some American-made gadgets wouldn't fit Russian plugs and chili sauce had to be used instead of a missing cleaning gel.
    I'm sorry, but at what point do you suddenly decide that chili sauce would make a great cleaning gel?! Maybe that same logic would explain why the cleaning gel was missing in the first place:

    "Damn, we're out of chili sauce. Wait a minute...is that cleaning gel I see over there? Cha-ching!"
  • May be NASA could increase their publicity by sending allowing the public to vote out on crew member every couple of weeks
  • I thought being in space automatically made you able to read foreign languages, especially on controls. Whenever I watch star trek, if they capture an alien ship, they automatically know how to pilot it, use the controls, eject the warp core etc. Even if this alien ship has never been seen before.
  • % whois

    No match for domain "ALPHASUCKS.COM".
  • The guy who mumbles "something something gotta end it something something" while floating near the airlocks.

    Yeah, that would definitely give the phrase "things generally suck" a literal meaning... Or would it be "things blow"? Either way, lots of air movement involved.


    --Fesh

  • Yeah, I'd agree that being cooped up with Pauly Shore for five months qualifies for the "sucks" award... Gah!

    (Yeah, I'm joking, but I noticed the email addy...)


    --Fesh

  • Hmm. The image of a "space tourist" going into an uncontrolled tumbling spin after turning on the hair dryer leaves me strangely amused...


    --Fesh

  • My first picture of a space station (in a Star Wars book about questions on Space - of all things) was a shot of that Giant wheel space station...you know...the one that spins and people use the gravity in the big wheel - just like on 2001.. I guess I won't see that baby in my lifetime...ah well...it was a nice dream. I still remember the one quote...the US hopes to have a permanent space station before the end of the century...guess we came pretty close, huh?
  • In fact, it's delayed because of the Russian modules.
    A lot of people who don't solely listen to NASA think there's plenty of blame to spread around. A lot of the US pieces have been late too, and the truth is not out there. Everybody has been playing "schedule chicken" and the blame game -- you know the "if you take 5 weeks to do X we'll need to slip 5 months" crap, not to mention "Look! They're having problems with XYZZY it's not ready! (and don't look at our plugh too much).

    The objective people (say Henry Spencer) on sci.space.history [sci.space.history] have been seeing this for years now.

    -dB

  • Hello? Did you get to the part of the article where it explicitly states that the section in his log where he said that life "sucks" on the station was censored? Yes, it was leaked. Or else it was made up. But it was not freely available from his log.

    The only "intuitive" interface is the nipple. After that, it's all learned.
  • If Nasa's not happy, then it's a damn good thing they're getting their funding cut! There's 6 billion people out there who have never gone into space, and if the priviledged dozen who do get to go aren't enjoying it, then it's time for them to step aside. Let some people who DO want to be there go.

    The only "intuitive" interface is the nipple. After that, it's all learned.
  • You can read the censored logs on NASA's website (link not provided due to karma cap). Basically, the ISS requires way too much assembly and maintenance. Some of the parts sent up for on-orbit assembly don't even fit. They do in fact have Windows on some laptops, and both wired and wireless LANs, which have all the usual sysadmin problems. The crew has been bitching about this for months.

    You'd think that each new section would come up fully assembled, like Skylab, but no. Rack-sized units have to be lugged into position, installed, and connected.

    And they haven't even reached the point yet that they have to start replacing stuff that's worn out.

    Incidentally, Slashdot website performance has really sucked for the last few weeks, and it seems to be getting worse. Ever since the last big layoff at VA Linux, it's been going downhill.

  • I read the new scientist article about this. It's even worse than you say. As well as different power sockets, the voltage is different.

    And drinking water - the americans use silver ions to keep it pure, but the russians use iodine. Accidentally mix the two and you get a precipitate of silver iodide, which can clog filters and valves.

    Jeff

  • Some American-made gadgets wouldn't fit Russian plugs and chilli sauce had to be used instead of a missing cleaning gel.

    Velcro pads stuck to everything they touched, the DVD player's screen was too small and the computer used to report breakdowns broke down.

    I would love some of the apollo pioneers to read this and give there opinions on the astronauts of today. Those guys where up there in thin walled tin cans that would have lost pressure if a spec of dust hit them. Now the worst complaint is that the DVD screen is to small?

  • Would give anything to trade places with that guy, and hes bitching? heh Life where I work/live sucks, do you see it making a headline on /. ?

  • Noisy Machinery? Try working in a factory. Or in a server room...
    No Shampoo? Aww... I really feel for ya buddy.
    Chili Sauce instead of cleaning gel? Unless that's for personal cleaning (ouch), I'd say hobbyists do this all the time (its called "Making Do With What Ya Got").
    Velcro pads are supposed to stick to things.
    The DVD player's screen is too small? Oh please dear God, someone phone 911 and help out!

    The Russian medical labels worry me. Hopefully their Sharpie (tm) marker and a talk with ground crew got them outta that one.
    The plugs not being standardized, that just confuses me. But that isn't unlike real life, so what's a spaceman to do? ;-)

    I don't blame the astronauts for putting this in their logs. I just blame the media companies for trying to make this out to be important when apart from the medical labels (which were easy to fix) it isn't. Anyone with a few brain cells to rub together can see from pictures space travel isn't a holiday!

    Next in the news: "Getting your tie caught in the photocopier 'sucks'"
  • One of the airlock outer doors on Mir was held closed with a C-clamp. Can you believe it? There's a great book called Dragonfly [amazon.com] that dishes out the inside scoop on Mir. Great reading.

  • Re:the pattern repeats... (Score:3)

    by saider ( 177166 ) on Friday July 13, 2001 @03:32AM (#88177)
    The problem is that the financial input does not exceed the financial output. It is a money loser. Sure we get some very interesting knowledge about our origins and future, but how the hell do you package that and sell it to the mass market. Only so many people are going to read about the origins of the universe or the effects of the solar wind on the martian atmosphere. Do you honestly think that if you start charging people to read those documents (read Intellectual Property) that you are going to be able to recover the 200+ million dollars it took to get a spacecraft to make those measurements?

    For profit science degrades the scientist because all they will end up pusuing are new products. If something cannot be incorporated, repackaged and distributed then it will not be investigated. Do you think that the income from selling teflon and Tang would pay for the Apollo missions? Would the royalties from pretty pictures of Saturn pay for the Cassini mission? I doubt it.

    Some science is a money loser. You do it for the warm fuzzy feeling of expanding human knowledge. It may not be practical ("In three billion years...") but it allows us to grow as a culture. I agree that some of NASA should be privately funded. The aerospace companies have much to gain in the R&D for advanced spaceplanes. Earth sciences is also an area for potential profit (mining, farming, etc). But planetary exploration will not have a payoff and if left to business, would not happen.

    So we can have some relativly untainted science at taxpayer expense or we can look forward to seeing the Microsoft logo superimposed on those pictures of Neptune from the "Texaco Planetary Explorer... improving life through exploration".

  • We think that life on the ISS might be great, but think about being up there for months with...

    The guy that farts all the time.
    The one guy that hums only from the soundtrack to Aladdin. All. Day. Long.
    The guy whose nose whistles.
    The guy who has nightmare fits while he sleeps during the shift you're trying to work in.
    The guy who never pees completely in the tube.
    The guy who always races down the module with arms extended ahead of him like Superman, rudely bumping everyone else out of the way.
    The one who always looks out the port window and yells "Aww gawd! NO! what is that?!? Nevermind."
    The one who thinks no one is watching when he masturbates in the dining module.
    The guy making rude racial comments every time they pass over the same part of the globe...dozens of times a day.
    The guy who mumbles "something something gotta end it something something" while floating near the airlocks.
    The guy who never thinks that it gets old to watch Jell-O float out of the pack into his mouth...and misses.
    Trying to tell ground controllers what you really think and then realising that school kids across the country might be watching NASA TV.
    The other two guys think you can't understand their language and constantly insult you in it.
    And, of course, having the guy from the opposite cold-war nationality constantly throwing stares at you.

    That might just suck, but the view has got to be killer.

  • Re:I guess 2001 - A space Odessey is out (Score:3)

    by HomerJS ( 192001 ) on Thursday July 12, 2001 @07:50PM (#88180)
    Hey, don't put down the label, It's responsible for holding together 3 components!
  • Your talk of adventure is rather inspiring, however when we spend all this money to send astronauts up into space, we need to be getting maximal bang for our buck, not some amazing space adventure. The less problems they have, the better they can work, the more science and engineering they can perform, and the more benefits we reap from their presence. IT is true that too often the worry about things they don't really need, however if you spend tens of thousands of dollars to have a DVD up there and it didn't work, you'd be pretty ticked off too.

    Morale up there is very important. Unlike the wild west, or the open sea, it's so small and cramped, no open areas whatsoever that the psychological effects can easily make someone's efficiency go down with time. And when you're in a station in what is perhaps the most dangerous part of the universe any man has ever been in, things breaking and running out of supplies are big deals, even if the things themselves are not. Their lives are at stake, and while I'm sure the structure is build better than some of their electronics/software they have up there, it's a sobering though to realize that one rip in the exterior and they'd all be sucking vaccuum. The adventure is there, it's a dangerous, deadly pit of fire they are being held over, diquised as a living room.

    I don't think they were complaining about the workload, but about all the things that just don't work. Sometimes it's not so much the lack of functionality, but the sheer stupidity on the part of those people who planned and made prepration (including the engineers who designed the stuff) that can be mind numbing.

    Basically I think we have to remember that the space station is more about science than exploration (we've been in orbit for half a century, not much new stuff there). It's about getting things done, and keeping the crew working optimally, not about seeing what kind of stories we can give the astronauts to tell their grandchildren ("back in my day, we were stuck in orbit in a pile of metal where even the CD player didn't work..."). It's about discovery and progress, both in science and technology. And when things suck like this, it takes time away from the science and tech they are supposed to be doing. So should they whine, yeah, but because of that and ONLY because of that. But I do have to agree with an earlier post that they should generally have a good attitude no matter what, it's an amazing adventure.

    Just my two and a half cents.
  • Pfft, youngsters. Back in my space exploration days, we didn't have these 'pressurized suits' while outside the ship for maintenance tasks. No, we expanded like hot freaking marshmallows and burned like, uh, hot... freaking... marshmallows until the job was done.

    And we liked it.

    ---

  • Re:Chili != Cleaning Gel (Score:4)

    by dweezle ( 200818 ) on Thursday July 12, 2001 @07:35PM (#88183)
    Actually it works very well to remove corrosion on metal. I would guess the vinegar base does that. We used to use Tobasco sauce to polish pipes back when I was riding submarines for a living. BTW Kool-ade powder works really well as a toilet cleaner(the ascorbic acid?) and leaves your loo smelling much better than before.

  • Well, actually, the space station has mainly lables in Russian on the Russian made components (and they are always augmented by English lables). Also, the main language for this space station is English, but US astronauts are taught Russian during their training time in Russia.

    At a seminar [usyd.edu.au] by one of the US astronauts who was my lecturer when I was at uni, which I attended a few months ago, he (Greg Chamitoff [nasa.gov]) mentioned the interaction between cultures on the ISS. He said that during training, they (American astronauts) spend time in Star City, Russia [msnbc.com] training with the Russian cosmonauts and equipment, and practicing Russian as well.

    The good thing is, the astronauts know it is still a station in development (appropriate name, alpha :-), and they also know that there will be a lot of interaction problems with other nationalities on this, but they see it as a learning exercise, and a challenge not an obstacle.

  • All the shampoo stuff aside, does anyone find the above statement indiciative of a major screwup? How hard is it to agree on a power socket, and make sure all the stuff that gets sent up there (at a cost of thousands of dollars per kilogram and undoubtedly safety-inspected to the nth degree at a cost of thousands more) has the right friggin' power plugs?

    it seems to be very hard for two governments to agree on anything, especially when committees are involved...

  • The question is (Score:3)

    by Rosco P. Coltrane ( 209368 ) on Thursday July 12, 2001 @07:39PM (#88192)
    Are the problems on the ISS more or less of a pain than the mold and smells [sightings.com], and the fires [165.248.121.95], and the toilet and sewage [exn.ca] problems that existed on MIR ? to my knowledge, there isn't an astronaut who has flown on both who could give an account on the life aboard the two stations, and objectively determine whether or not the ISS is an improvement or not.

    Somehow though, I suspect life on the ISS is a lot better than on MIR, but Bill Shepherd probably doesn't realize it, just like someone who has a broken air conditioning in Minnesota and has never experienced the Sahara desert in the dead of summer thinks life sucks.

  • Tito took it! (Score:5)

    by hedgefrog ( 215010 ) on Thursday July 12, 2001 @07:25PM (#88193)
    'a lack of shampoo'
    'missing cleaning gel'
    What did they expect hotel guests always take the soaps and shampoo? For 20 million bucks, I would have taken a bathrobe and a towel too.

  • Re:Depends on who's on board... (Score:3)

    by j_snare ( 220372 ) on Friday July 13, 2001 @07:06AM (#88194)
    The guy making rude racial comments every time they pass over the same part of the globe...dozens of times a day.

    It may not be racial comments, you know.. Could just be something else that would get on your nerves.

    "Look, kids! There's Big Ben!"
  • In summary, they ran out of shampoo, some russian stuff is incompatible with American stuff, they ran out of shampoo, their tv is too small, and one of their computers crashed at least once in a 5 month period. On the bright side they have plenty of chili sauce.

    Last week I ran out of shampoo, my math teacher only seems to speak Russian, I have no tv, my win98 computer crashed twice today. On the bright side, I have plenty of chili sauce.

    Conclusion: Life on Earth sucks.

  • Hello? Taco Bell Sauce! (Score:5)

    by BoarderPhreak ( 234086 ) on Thursday July 12, 2001 @07:36PM (#88201)
    Ever try Taco Bell hot sauce on metals? It works! It actually cleans tarnish and funk off of silver and such.

  • the pattern repeats... (Score:3)

    by lyapunov ( 241045 ) on Thursday July 12, 2001 @07:15PM (#88204)
    The news has recently reported that NASA is again in funding trouble. Since they already used "oh my god...there might be life on mars" ploy to get their last round of funding, they decided to go for a more believable ploy this time...

    "This space station sucks ass and as it is supposed to be an international hallmark do you think that you could fork over a few more billion so that we can get the kinks out..."
  • You might very well think that (I think I learned that phrase on PBS) but at least in Mir's case there's the "pride of ownership" argument.

    "Hey, we're a former superpower on our way to being a third world country, and yet WE, the mighty ROOSHIA, the FROZEN HEARTLAND OF EURASIA, are the only country in the universe able to continuously sustain human life in orbit. And THAT'S A FACT JACK."

    I think I'd be able to put up with a few sucky bits. And after a few months Shannon Lucid would start to look pretty sexy, hmm? Built strong, like Rooshian woman.

    Me, I feel vaguely used. Even though NASA managed to farm the Space Station out to pretty much every one of the fifty states, thereby insuring its political survival, we seem to have orbited a pretty crappy piece of hardware. Meanwhile all the cool stuff like the inflatable Spacehab module (I pity those poor bastards at Spacehab--why don't they just give up?!?!?) gets shot down, and NASA also thinks space tourism sucks. Whatever. Let's just go back to chipping arrowheads out of flint.

  • Of course it sucks (Score:4)

    by imipak ( 254310 ) on Thursday July 12, 2001 @07:27PM (#88207) Journal
    Space is a vacumn, innit?

    rimshot
    --
    "I'm not downloaded, I'm just loaded and down"

  • Tito said the same thing (Score:5)

    by perlchimp ( 263475 ) on Thursday July 12, 2001 @07:52PM (#88209)
    This article [cnn.com] about Dennis Tito points to the same thing. He says that life is pretty mundane and the astronauts get little done outside of all the things they need to do just to keep the space station running.

    And if there was going to be an objective eye about life on the space station, a 'non astronaut' is probably one of the best bets. His opinions aren't going to hurt his career.
  • Space station can be useful for researching living arrangements for a future Mars mission. I suppose Mir was too; this is what we have today though. That's an upside at least.
  • I don't suppose that it's much worse than life aboard an aircraft carrier. The Carrier (I'm on the USS John C. Stennis) isn't as cramped, but it's noisy, and smells like JP5 (yummy). The berthing is probably just as bad, since I believe we have an even smaller place to sleep. The heads (bathrooms) while fairly large, are usually made to accomodate 12 people at once when they need to accomodate about 30. Not to mention that gentle rock and rolling that puts you to sleep oh so well, but too well, as to not allow you to remember sleep at all, and have the days go by infinitely until the next port. I guess at least there's port, right?

  • Leaked? Try Again. (Score:4)

    by Xwild ( 308492 ) on Thursday July 12, 2001 @07:21PM (#88217)
    I doubt anything new was leaked, seeing as how a link to the Alpha Crew's logs were already posted on Slashdot once. [slashdot.org] NASA has been quite open in posting the logs, and is only removing small portions of the logs that they feel would keep the crew from givng their true feelings if they were to be posted for the public. Having read most of the logs, its very apparent that life aboard the ISS is not luxurious. But I also don't think that any of the astronauts heading up there were expecting maid service either.
  • to my knowledge, there isn't an astronaut who has flown on both who could give an account on the life aboard the two stations, and objectively determine whether or not the ISS is an improvement or not.

    Most of the Russians on ISS, as well as several NASA astronauts, were also crew on MIR.

    Now, actually getting an objective opinion out of them might be hard... I've seen a few clips with them 'oohing' and 'ahhing' about the spaciousness when the non-Russian modules were attached, but that's about it... and the Russian commander of the current team up there isn't keeping a log.
    --
    Convictions are more dangerous enemies of truth than lies.
  • Actually, I believe that if they were trying to gain funding, they would simply put up banners on their sites, proclaim that Linux sucks, and have several people submit the sites to Slashdot.

    Watch the ad revenue come rolling in...

  • Wait, let me get this straight. Your orbiting 200 miles above earth and the biggest problem is the lack of shampoo. It seems that if this is the worst you have to deal with, the station is doing a damn good job.

  • of course it sucks...but it's worth it (Score:3)

    by mlh1996 ( 446618 ) on Thursday July 12, 2001 @07:59PM (#88231)
    Until a couple years ago, I was a submariner. Five months of living in cramped quarters, things breaking all the time, floating around in a hostile environment, sounds awfully familiar to me.

    At the end of my first cruise, I conned the ship into La Maddelena at dawn. Sun coming up over the Med, glistening of the waves; biolumenescent plankton leaving a glowing green trail behind; the only sound is the water being pushed out of the way by the bow, with an occasional splash of a sea-bird landing or a fish jumping. All that beauty, juxtaposed with the realization that you're sitting on (commanding, in fact!) one of the world's most powerful warships. That moment (and others like it) made all the crap worth it.

    Of course, I eventually quit 'cause I was sick and tired of it and couldn't take another second. And I'm sure my friends and family got pretty tired of hearing me bitch once I got back. But looking back now, I don't remember much of the crap.

    Got a lot of good stories, though :)

  • Personally, I'm glad that it sucks a little. If you look at the great eras of exploration, it generally sucked a lot. Stale water, six month old bread full of bugs, salt pork and scurvey. Or a hell of a lot of walking hoping to find water over the next ridge. Or trying to re-weave your grass boat at least as fast as the storm shreds it.

    The big problem with our present age is that we are too worried about having to do without cleaning gel. We don't want to leave our home network, for fear of the roaming charges. We only want to go places that McDonalds has already collonized. We are afraid to have it suck even a little. And that sucks a lot.

    Because when you are really exerting yourself, it often sucks. That's how adventure works. And we need to adventure, since there are a lot of places you can't get to by sitting in your living room, no matter how good your graphics card is.

    We know where there are enough resources to make every single person on Earth as rich as Mr. Gates is at this moment, but most of us have gotten fat eating lotus leaves and we're afraid to go get it. I'm glad there are still a few nuts trying to launch themselves into space. And I'm glad there are people with more brains who actually manage to get into space, and go, even though it sucks a little.

    -- MarkusQ

  • 5 minutes until one of the Slashdot groupies yells "At least he didn't have to use Windows!" :) Get your bets in now.

  • The station may suck... (Score:5)

    by baumanj ( 459939 ) on Thursday July 12, 2001 @07:12PM (#88245) Homepage

    I'll bet outside the station probably sucks a whole lot more.

  • Big sucky spacestation news. (Score:4)

    by standards ( 461431 ) on Thursday July 12, 2001 @07:26PM (#88246)
    What's interesting is that the article doesn't investigate the science or engineering or even the economics of the station, but concentrates on the very shallow word of "sucks".

    Gee, no wonder why newspapers haven't been replaced by TV and the Web. It's likely because news on TV and the web, well, sucks.

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