Causes of Death Linked To Weight 385
An anonymous reader writes to mention that while a couple of years ago researchers found that overweight people have a lower death rate than people with a normal weight, it may be more complicated than that. "Now, investigating further, they found out which diseases are more likely to lead to death in each weight group. Linking, for the first time, causes of death to specific weights, they report that overweight people have a lower death rate because they are much less likely to die from a grab bag of diseases that includes Alzheimer's and Parkinson's, infections and lung disease. And that lower risk is not counteracted by increased risks of dying from any other disease, including cancer, diabetes or heart disease."
I'm not... (Score:5, Funny)
Brilliant!
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People goto the gym to work out with weights to get the benifit of carrying around weight. When a person is over weight but not to a point that they cannot do anything (I'm 325 pounds and can keep up with most a
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Re:I'm not... (Score:5, Interesting)
Hmm, what about accidents? It seems like extremely overweight people tend to spend more time at home which probably lowers their risks from car / skydiving / whatever accidents. My guess is the low weight stay at home people probably live longer than fat stay at home people. Wonder if I could get a grant to study this...
Re:I'm not... (Score:5, Informative)
Dunno if there is a correlation between home accidents and weight, though.
You may be "informative" but you're also wrong (Score:3, Informative)
Cars are EXTREMELY dangerous, and that we let all of us idiots drive such powerful death machines with such little regulation is frightening.
If you want some pseudomath - the insurance company premiums are directly related to their costs, at least if you assume a semicompetitive market. Housing insurance is annually lower than car insurance - even with extr
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It's also a measure of number of people your house interacts with compared with your car. Insurance on places business costs a lot more than home insurance for two reasons: 1. Most people who visit someone's home are friends, and for the most part people don't sue their friends. 2. The number of random strangers who interact with your home on a daily basis is fairly limited.
Put another way, I guarantee you that house insurance would cost every bit as much as automobile insurance if everyone drove their
Re:I'm not... (Score:4, Funny)
So, where more people die at home going underwater cave diving still increases your risk.
PS: You can see the reduction in accident related deaths on the first link's chart.
Re:I'm not... (Score:5, Interesting)
also, women across all societies live longer than men. i think that while women tend to be smaller overall (than men), they tend to have higher BMIs, correct - in the sense that women carry more fat than men in general.
i also read somewhere - and never was able to find it again - that death rates decreased in general the closer one's body mass got to 55kg. man, if i can find that link i'll post it.
when i was a kid, i was undersized for a while - and there was an old lady who lived next door who saw me frustrated about not being big enough to ride the bike i'd gotten. i told her my frustration about being small and she said, "look at hte bright side. if you're small, you'll probably live a long time." Apparently there is some anecdote about living longer if you are smaller.
not that anecdotal evidence means anything, but the japanese population is not an insignificant sample size. interestingly enough, on a biological level longevity is inversely associated with fertility (another factoid i read somehweree that i cannot substantiate at all - no flames please) - and the japanese have one of the lowest birth rates in the first world.
again, no flames as i cannot substantiate these assertions and don't have the time to. But the japanese thing and the woman thing are pretty much documented as regards longevity.
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Re:I'm not... (Score:5, Insightful)
Something's obviously missing in this study, because there is a positive correlation between average lifespan and obesity rates, both when comparing countries around the world and when comparing historical rates within this country. The simple fact is that all else being equal, the fatter a population is, the shorter its average lifespan. The United States, for example, ranks 42nd in world life expectancy - Japan, with much lower rates obesity and average weight, ranks #2. (Behind Andorra.)
Not to even mention other studies (like this one [medicalnewstoday.com], for example) that show that being even moderately overweight can increase your risk of heart disease by more than 30% - and that's our nation's #1 killer. That's to say nothing of diabetes.
I'll take my chances on being thin, thanks. One study that appears to contradict all scientific knowledge we've accumulated to this point isn't going to change my mind.
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Re:I'm not... (Score:5, Funny)
It's thin people like you, who clearly are too lazy to put in the effort to get obese, that fat asses like me are paying for with my medical insurance. It truly sickens me.
Wow - I can see why thin people shout that kind of thing so often; it really is an ego kick, the superiority thing. It is nice to have a study to kinda wave around and get all preachy about - if only I could still raise my arm.
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The simple fact is that all else being equal, the fatter a population is, the shorter its average lifespan.
That was the myth -- the fact (or, rather, the theory that seems to fall out of this study) is that the longevity seems to be more like a bell curve -- If you're intensely underweight, you're more likely to die, and if you're intensely overweight, you're more likely to die.
The other proposal that seems to fall out of these stats is that the proper 'healthy' weight appears to be higher than what's being suggested right now.
I'm willing to bet that the 'correct' weights were promulgated based upon an (inc
overweight vs obese vs underweight (Score:5, Informative)
1. underweight
2. at weight
3. overweight
4. obese
The article seems to indicate that the best categories to be in are 2 or 3, which shouldn't be that surprising. Being obese is horrible for your health, but there is a fairly wide range of weight around normal weight which remains healthy.
One thing that the article makes clear is that being *underweight* is pretty bad for you, and has much more problems associated with it than being overweight (but not obese). Again, this shouldn't be surprising. Being overweight just means that you are carrying around some excess fat, but is not an indication of malnutrition. Being underweight means that your body is nutrition deprived enough that it hasn't been able to build up a fat store. It also means, that since you don't have a significant fat store, your body starts to cannibalize muscle tissue whenever you go for a while without eating.
In general, good nutrition is the key thing. Either overeating *or* dieting when you don't need to will damage your body and lower your life span. Remember, also you need some fat on your body for doing things like cushioning your heart, and for when you go a while without eating anything nutritious, which many people do without realizing it.
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The overweight category is a bit sketchy. BMI is a really simple measurement and it's perfectly possible (even likely) for a fit person to get slotted into the overweight category simply due to muscle mass.
It's been shown that a better metric than BMI is waist to hip ratio. The beer belly is also where the more dangerous fat that builds up around internal organs tends to show up mo
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it aint complicated (Score:2, Interesting)
Smokers eat less. Smokers die of cancer. Cancer kills more people than obesity.
Wow.
There's an even simpler explanation (Score:2)
you're a freakin genius (Score:3, Insightful)
Obviously, you, and only you, have noticed this awful, systematic flaw in this study that obviously didn't have to pass an kind of rigorous review process to get published in JAMA.
Praise be, we've found a new Einstein!
Well, he's smarter than you. (Score:3, Insightful)
For example, note the huge fraction of reduced deaths among the overweight that is attributed to lung and respirato
I take offense! (Score:3, Funny)
Re:it aint complicated (Score:5, Interesting)
Oh, yes, I *actually do* biostatistics and know what I am talking about.
Now, you are *correct* that there is no cause and effect established here!
It's entirely possible that genes-which-make-you-thin are also genes-which-give-you-alzheimers, or that they are proxies for such genes.
For example: being white makes you much more likely to have Cystic Fibrosis. This does not mean that getting a tan prevents CF.
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Aspartame: Legal in Canada & US Sucralose: Legal in Canada & US Acesulfame Potassium: Legal in Canada & US Cyclamate: Legal in Canada, banned in the US Saccharin: Legal in the US, banned in Canada, but tastes like crap anywhere.
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And obese people also smoke.
I think it's a little more complicated than that.
duh (Score:2, Insightful)
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Okay ... so ... (Score:2)
Of course not.
They kill starved people.
Lower death rate? (Score:5, Funny)
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Re:Lower death rate? (Score:4, Funny)
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I, for one, welcome our new big boned undead overlords.
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Yes - assuming you define the death rate as no. deaths/no. births then it will be less than 100% and will remain so while the population is above zero. To define it otherwise is to assume that everyone alive now will die which, while likely, is not yet proven. Afterall I think I speak for most of the human race when I say that we all want to live forever, or at least die trying!
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Body Mass Index Not a Measure of Obesity (Score:5, Informative)
I lift weights, and I'm at the higher side of the BMI because I've got a bit more muscle mass. Yet, according to that study, I'd be "fat". And I'm not even particularly big. If you got a man who was lifting since their teens into middle age, he could easily have 20 - 40 pounds more muscle than the average joe.
It's wrong to teach BMI in schools. It's wrong to use it as a measure. If you want to know fat, break out the calipers. Anything less, is wrong, and anything based on it, is absurd.
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BMI has limited use, and is used to get an overview of a large population.
But, you need to be very muscular for it to tag you as obese.
If you are competing, you should be concerned.
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Obese isn't really a problem; but it might be overly affecting the overweight spread, which is the grouping that seems to faring the best in this report.
What if overweight started at 27 BMI instead of 25 BMI?
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"Danny, stop running around with them, you're going to poke someone's eyes out!"
"NO, LIZ!! You're not supposed to use them on your private area!! STOP IT NOW!!"
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I know what you mean. When I was in junior in college, I was in absolutely fantastic shape. And yet according to that stupid BMI chart, I would have still been classified as "overweight", even for a forty-year-old. The only way I could have weighed any less would have been to stop all strenuous exercise and also stop eating. I wonder how many teenagers that chart has
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Re:Body Mass Index Not a Measure of Obesity (Score:5, Interesting)
BMI combined with a shred of common sense is a perfectly fine approximation of obesity. There are two Unix admins here with scary-high BMIs, and you don't need calipers to know which one is obese and which one is just on steroids.
Re:Body Mass Index Not a Measure of Obesity (Score:5, Insightful)
Maybe it's common sense that needs to be taught in schools then.
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BMI, as a measurement of fatness, gives a really good combination of coverage, it's accurate for the majority of westerners, it's very easy to check and it's easy to explain to people.
Sure, it breaks down when applied to fit people, but works a charm when applied to fatties or anorexics. I honestly can't believe that anyone who was fit enough to be over BMI 25 with muscle would ever think the scale has any application to them.
So, it's technically wrong but practi
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The whole study is a joke because it assumes that body mass index is a valid measure of obesity, and it isn't. The only real way to tell how fat you are is to measure your body fat percentage, usually with calipers although some new scales claim to be able to do it electrically.
Bingo. Also most people get weighed at their doctors office with crap in their pockets, heavy shoes, etc. I weigh in at 198 in the morning when I wake up. By the time I eat breakfast and get dressed, I weigh in at 210-ish at the doctor's office. I'm 5'11, so my BMI at 198 is a slightly overweight 27.6. Once dressed and fed, I'm a 29.3, almost obese.
Oh and I run 3x or more a week, lift 1-2x a week and make a close watch of what I eat - wheat wraps with specifically sized portions of lowfat mayo, l
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I didn't see anything about when they BMI'd these individuals. Did they weigh them a few weeks before, a year before, after? Furthermore, what about the
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Yes, and also sensationalist (Score:2, Insightful)
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Now I'm still borderline obese, but it's slightly more deserved. Not entirely, but definitely more so than before.
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Re:Body Mass Index Not a Measure of Obesity (Score:4, Insightful)
First of all, I'd rather be physically fit even if doing so shortened my life a bit. The increased quality of life would still be worth it to me.
But you're very correct that BMI is a useless indicator of fitness.
I'm a tad over 40 years old. 4 months ago I was diagnosed as pre-diabetic. I drank 4-5 liters of Pepsi per day. I looked like a big blob of partially hydrogenated whale blubber, marinated in high fructose corn syrup made from genetically modified corn. I couldn't climb 2 flights of stairs, bench-press half my weight, or even take what I now consider to be a deep breath.
Knowing either it was this or insulin, I decided to hit the gym, and to give up the Pepsi. It's worked out very well for me. I've more than doubled my strength, and probably improved my cardiovascular endurance tenfold (I couldn't walk half a mile before; now I can power-walk for over an hour, although I still can't jog or run because the weight is too hard on my legs).
I feel infinitely better, and even look somewhat better.
Yet my weight only dropped slightly during this whole time, by about 10 pounds (from 215 to 205). Thus my BMI also changed only slightly. I've gained significant muscle mass, and thus lost significantly more than 10 pounds of fat. The increased muscle mass should, with any luck, help increase my metabolism, making it easier to burn the remaining excess fat. The BMI reflects none of this. According to the BMI, I was obese before, and only slightly less obese now. But I sure as hell do feel better, and it seems pretty certain that I will have a far better quality and quantity of life, assuming I keep up the present level of exercise (and don't get hit by a bus), than if I did not.
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(This is all approximate, of course, but so's the BMI in general. The bottom line is that a single BMI for all heights is the cleanest public health message,
also, not all fat is equal (Score:2)
But to add to your comment, I believe a further limitation of the BMI is that people of appropriate weight often have an unhealthy amount of fat nevertheless. The reason is probably because modern humans normally achieve a lower weight by eating less, but not by eating better, or by more exercise. S
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The Times They Are A-Changin' ... (Score:5, Informative)
http://www.nih.gov/news/pr/mar2005/nia-16.htm
Besides, being underweight, I don't buy into it anyway.
CC.
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Look, we all understand about denial. But this is your health we're talking about; there's no room for self-deception. Now go on. Eat that triple-burger and super-size fries. I know you can do it.
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I drink plenty of (Belgian) beer, can eat half a pizza by myself, entire packages of bacon with breakfast, and just about anything else that comes anywhere near me. I don't gain any weight.
I lost weight when I started to work out a bit. I stopped working out after my gym membership ended.
I must be in denial, and I should prolly put myself on a diet. There's no bacon like PLENTY of bac
i remember reading somewhere (Score:2)
however, at all other times in your life, being any kind of overweight begins the inevitable accumulation of damage due to extra fats in the system, extra sugars, extra inflammatory agents, etc.
so i think the best idea would be to remain t
Is there a link to Chinese traditional medicine? (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Is there a link to Chinese traditional medicine (Score:2)
Nice trick, if you can pull it off... (Score:4, Insightful)
Personally, with my current health state, I don't want to live forever. And yes, I live in what most believe to be the most technologically advanced society on the planet, however, medical technology ain't cheap. What good is top-notch health care if you can't afford it?
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Personally, yeah, sign me up for that 'won't die of old age' treatment.
Wisdom from an old lady: (Score:3, Interesting)
She died in 2003 just short of her hundredth birthday.
-mcgrew
That's great, but... (Score:2, Funny)
That's great, but there's still that whole 'death' thing.
Wake me up when they work that one out. If I'm alive.
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not weight--waist (Score:4, Interesting)
If your waist circumference is less than 50% of your height, you are at a low risk for fat-related diseases. If it is more than 50%, get to the gym, stat!
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There's my problem, I'm too short!
Other factors may be skewing the results... (Score:4, Interesting)
So, even if smoking isn't actually a major factor int he result, one has to look at the lifestyles that each weight group is likely to lead in order to determine what the important relationships are. Causations are what's important, not correlations.
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Bogusness abounds!
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Weight Loss is a Symptom, not a Cause (Score:3, Interesting)
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Less EXCESS Deaths (Score:5, Funny)
Why do we read medical studies (Score:4, Interesting)
Here's why... (Score:2)
Dr. Gail, though, had some advice, which, he said, is his personal opinion as a physician and researcher: "If you are in the pink and feeling well and getting a good amount of exercise and if your doctor is very happy with your lab values and other test results, then I am not sure there is any urgency to change your weight."
I don't know about you, but when I'm "in the pink and getting a good amount of exercise" I feel friggin FANTASTIC. Now I have a medical study that documents sex being good for me, thus I support this research wholeheartedly.
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Weighed Before or After Illness? (Score:3, Insightful)
Now THAT'S food for thought... (Score:2)
What's next? Scientists discover an inverse relationship between resistance to being struck by lighting the more body hair the would-be struckee has?
I for one (Score:2)
Useful data (Score:2)
"You weigh 330 pounds and will die when your heart explodes next Thursday at 3pm".
Recent Studies Stating the Opposite? (Score:2)
I haven't been able to find the link for the study in Canada, but here is the British: http://www.cbc.ca/health/story/2007/11/07/uk-cancerstudy.html [www.cbc.ca]
Linking ... causes of death to specific weights (Score:3, Funny)
Causes of death linked to EVERYTHING!!!! (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Interesting! (Score:5, Interesting)
At 6'4" I take this personally as a bad sign.
On the other hand, there's some guy who's trying to achieve longevity through calorie restriction. Only problem is that he's cut his diet back so far that he doesn't have the energy to enjoy normal activities. He may live a long time, but he won't have much fun doing so. I'd like to live as long as I can live well, and so far in my 50's I can do all of the things I enjoy.
Re:Interesting! (Score:4, Insightful)
I bet you the average height of men 80 or older has gone up at least 3 inches in the last 30-40 years. By the time you'd be 80, who knows where it will be?
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You haven't met my grandmother. She's getting there.
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Just saying.
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Sure you will. Susceptibility to various diseases is an artifact of diet, genetics and overall lifestyle. Some people's bodies can withstand decades-long biochemical assaults (unhealthy food, smoking, alcohol, illicit drugs, etc.) with little or no ill effect, whereas others suffer horribly and die early. It's a crapshoot, any way you look at it. Take a walk around your average nursing home or assisted-living center. Plenty of the residents are in the 80-90 age gr
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-mcgrew
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Also, the article summary is misleading because it fails to mention that obesity is still a huge health risk in most cases.