Deciphering the Brain's Love Map 255
victor7 writes "Business Week Online is running a story about a new entrant into the online dating service market called Chemistry.com which has a unique approach to trying to match up subscribers. The goal is to try to programmatically decipher the subscriber's brain's 'love map' which they believe represents that chemistry that people have with each other." From the article: "There are other personality types as well that are based on chemistry. There are questions that tell us if you are good at abstract thinking, or quick to make decisions and act on them. It's not exactly like I'm going to light a fire between the two of you. It just raises the chances. Most people fall in love because they have shared values, but they stay in love because their personalities mesh. We're trying to increase the changes of finding that spark and joy and excitement you feel when personalities mesh."
not sure one CAN predict by formula (Score:4, Interesting)
From the slashdot article:
I remember, but can't cite, an article or study that pretty much shows the odds of people staying together are pretty much the same in marriages where couples fall in love (e.g., in the United States), or in arranged marriages (many cultures), even in arranged marriages where the betrothed are extremely young (sometimes as young as 12 or 13), and even in arranged marriages with large age disparities.
First, does anyone else remember any similar studies? I've found "staying together" seems to have much to do with chemistry, and little observable similarities and tastes correlate. Just curious. What are others' observations?
Re: not sure one CAN predict by formula (Score:5, Funny)
If they want something else more, then they may eventually choose that thing over staying together. And they'll split up.
I think I cracked the code on relationship longevity. Anyone want to buy my book? It'll say basically the same thing, but it'll be 200 pages and it'll cost you $15.
Re: not sure one CAN predict by formula (Score:4, Insightful)
Or they each feel that it's too much work to go out and start over in a relationship.
Re: not sure one CAN predict by formula (Score:3, Funny)
That's why the book is 200 pages.
Nonstrictly speaking, though, I'm sure a lot of
That's why you need to pay me $15.
Comment removed (Score:5, Interesting)
Respect. (Score:2)
I'd suspect that it has to do with people recognizing the inherent good and worth (no, not financially) in
yes but (Score:5, Insightful)
As I understand in India there is or at least has historically been a very strong taboo on divorce. This might account for why as many of these folks stay together as those conjoined by "love marriages." But anyway I think the numbers for arranged marriages staying together are much, much higher due to the near impossibility of obtaining a divorce.
A 13-year old betrothed to a 60-year old cannot actually be thought to have the same opportunity for divorce as a rich Manhattan female attorney.
Re:yes but (Score:2)
That said, I'll reserve judgement eitherways until I read the actual article the GP was talking about.
Re:yes but (Score:2, Interesting)
No offence meant, but divorce has been taboo in most other civilisations too (including western ones). The difference is, in western civ, until a couple of hundred years back, the groom could divorce the bride and not feel any consequences. The bride's life was pretty much ruined.
At least the taboos in India weren't gender biased.
A 13-year old betrothed to a 60-year old cannot actually be thought to hav
How the hell (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:How the hell (Score:2)
Re:How the hell (Score:3, Informative)
It was bought out.
Re:How the hell (Score:3, Funny)
The only thing missing was the animated GIF of the letter going into the mailbox.
Oh and the rainbow gradient horizontal divider line.
programatic (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:programatic (Score:5, Funny)
Which is precicely why you're just friends. =)
Re:programatic (Score:2)
It seems that there is SOMETHING there. I think if a person can learn to "match" people with greater then average success, we ought to be able to program a computer to do the same. The real trick is explicitly figuring out what the matchmaker doesn't
Re:programatic (Score:2)
I have to wonder, barring major secret advances in psychology, what chemistry.com knows that others in psychology don't know about love. Eharmony (sp?) also purports to test "31 dimensions of love for greater compatibility" or some such. I mean, really, "dimensions?" Talk about a buzzword, why not just say criteria?
I think the most significant application pyschol
science (Score:2)
I think chemistry.com could be wildly successful just by matching people with their MBTI supplimentals.
Re:science (Score:3, Insightful)
I think it's mainly due to vague or loaded questions like, "do you feel involved when watching TV soaps?". A person could answer "no", because they don't watch TV soaps but that might falsely suggest a lack of empathy.
Another example is, "do you
Re:science (Score:2)
Re:science (Score:2)
Re:programatic (Score:2)
He also didn't really want to pay me, and kept being creepy about it.
Point is, people have been doing this for years, in various forms. With little su
Re:programatic (Score:2)
Programaticaly created/discovered love is meaningless.
Spoken like a true romantic. I do have to wonder though why is "programatically created/discovered" love is any less meaningfull than say finding someone at a bar? You sound like you've bought into the whole hollywood garbage, and I'm not sure I understand what's wrong with the idea of finding out why people are attracted to one another and exploiting that. If you could really take some kind of test measuring brain chemicals, etc and increase your cha
Re:programatic (Score:2)
Re:programatic (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:programatic (Score:3, Informative)
Advertisement? (Score:3, Insightful)
How about this? (Score:3, Informative)
She's an anthropologist who implies that she can tell if you have high levels of serotonin just by asking you 100 questions about your past relationships and such.
From TFA:
Dumb. (Score:4, Insightful)
The concept of "love mapping" is just dumb. I'll tell you what is required - a good looking chick and a good looking guy - preferably with money, power or fame - all three in best of circumstances.
All the other bullshit is just that - bullshit. People can justify their attractions or what they desire in someone all they want, but guys deep down don't want the smart witty girl - unless she also happens to be totally hot. The girl doesn't want the sensitive feminine guy - she wants the hot guy with money or power and charisma.
It's really not that hard to figure out. I guess if you're ugly and have no money, power or charisma, then you try to hope there is some other random element involved, but you know deep down that you're kidding yourselves.
Re:Dumb. (Score:2)
Why didn't you include yourself in that statement? Seriously, judging by the content of your post you have absolutely no idea of what men and women want. I've been with the same woman for six years now and I'll be damned if good-looks kept us alive. And neither of us have money -- we work together for that.
When you have forg
Re:Dumb. (Score:2)
Oh and I suppose 150 pounds is a butter-troll fat-fuck in this contemporary age?
Re:Dumb. (Score:2)
Well, maybe that's true. But that doesn't make everything else bullshit; there are a lot of girls that could be considered "hot"; the subset that is equally outstandingly smart and witty is much smaller. Actually, I've personally found that the two categories do seem to often coincide (as in, the smartest and wittiest ones are also the most attractive), and I think it's the non-physical factors casting an extra f
Re:Dumb. (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Dumb. (Score:2)
Guys who are "hot" in the generic mainstream way that you are probably referring to are pretty boring as far as I'm concerned. Maybe I'm a closeted bisexual or something, but I definitely DO like (and have dated) guys whose femininity and masculinity are relatively balanced.
Then again, this may just be because I'm a geek. I like to stick to my own kind -- ie. nonthreatening intelligent tall skinny geek guys. Dating a "hot guy with money or power and chari
Re:Dumb. (Score:2)
While I appreciate what you're saying, I nevertheless think you'd have made a much better point had you not chosen to explain yourself through labels. :-)
Re:Dumb. (Score:2)
Besides, nobody would ever read my postings if I repeatedly described myself as "A somewhat
Re:Dumb. (Score:2)
There was a book a while back (I think
I've found body language to be fairly significant in my experience.
Mycroft
Re:Dumb. (Score:2, Insightful)
And that's the thing, after all. So many people had it together so many thousands of years ago... Socrates, the Buddhists, and others. Moderation, balance, Yin/Yang, and all of that. Just like in other matters, this philosophy applies equally well to love and relationships, though it seems so few people see it today. As for attraction, without the primal, genetic chemistry stuff going on, can it last? Pr
Re:Dumb. (Score:2)
People grow old, get wrinkly, saggy and less attractive. However, it seems old couples don't divorce each other as soon as they start spotting grey hair in their spouse. There are couples (and families) who have persevered through poverty, and most people don't have any real personal power to speak of.
Whatever fi
Hollywood (Score:5, Insightful)
That's strange... Hollywood actors / actresses seem to have both shared values (a love of money / entertainment) and shared personalities (general arrogance and a belief of personal entitlement). It makes me wonder why it seems like none of their relationships last longer than the milk in my refrigerator.
Re:Hollywood (Score:2)
Re:Hollywood (Score:2)
I wonder how much of corruption and dehumanization the constant bombardement of our youth with the Hollywood lifestyle brings onto the table of everyday relationships.
Re:Hollywood (Score:4, Funny)
Trimethylxanthine (Score:4, Funny)
Shouldn't we just (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Shouldn't we just (Score:2)
Re:Shouldn't we just (Score:2)
Computer called me gay (Score:5, Funny)
Stupid algorithm is full of BS. Says I should be dating men.
I hate you, incompetent Harvard science faculty. M.I.T. is forever!
stinks (Score:2, Insightful)
Hunka hunka burnin' love (Score:3, Funny)
That is, of course, your profiles show that you're both pyromaniacs with uncontrollable lust at the sight of an open flame. In that case, we may be able to arrange something...
Love is bullshit (Score:4, Insightful)
Yeah, yeah... flamebait. You mod me down because you know I speak the hard truth.
Re:Love is bullshit (Score:2)
Buy a dog . . . (Score:2)
Re:Buy a dog . . . (Score:2)
Re:Buy a dog . . . (Score:2)
Feeling bitter, are we? (Score:2)
Re:Love is bullshit (Score:5, Funny)
Am I the only person that sees the irony of this based upon his username?
Re:Love is bullshit (Score:2)
Somebody needs a hug! (Score:2)
Re:Love is bullshit (Score:2)
Re:Love is bullshit (Score:2, Insightful)
Think of what you might describe as "noble" love -- trying to do the right thing by your fellow man because the world would be a better place if you did.
Now approach all of your interactions women the same way. Don't worry about losing the ones who would rather have you "treat them mean", those relationships fail sooner or later anyway.
You don't sound like the sort of person who will be confused by lust, or Hallmark emo
Re:Love is bullshit (Score:2)
I was watching a Star Trek episode yesterday where Wesley Crusher said to people of another planet: "Starfleet people do not lie". The whole Star Trek franchise is based on humans having evolved passed the point of basing their everyday life on deception, something that other r
Love as a Hobby (Score:4, Interesting)
Being in a relationship is like a hobby. Some people enjoy doing it, others not so much. What we call love for another person is really just love for the activities involved in maintaining a relationship with that person.
If you don't enjoy all that stuff, then by all means find something else to do with your spare time. Each to his own.
OK. (Score:2)
Sure, if you want to view it that way. My relationship with my girlfriend keeps me from being lonely, and sure, I might be a bit obsessed with her.
But I do know that we can go ages without getting things like cards and flowers and diamonds for each other and still be fine. We aren't staying together just so that we can "feel better than others" either, it's so we feel better about ourselves and our own lives because we make each other's life better just by being there.
About a year ago, I was a very dar
Re:Love is bullshit (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Love is bullshit (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Love is bullshit (Score:3, Interesting)
I suggest you ask your other friends -- particularly the women -- to tell you, explicitly, when they perceive other people giving you the subtle signals. If you explain the problem to them, they might even surprise you.
Also, if you can harden yourse
Re:Love is bullshit (Score:2)
Re:Love is bullshit (Score:3, Interesting)
Some would guess I'm married. ;-) (Score:2)
Mutual Respect (Score:5, Insightful)
It could be intelligence, knowledge on any of a number of dimensions, social grace, physical strength, affection, aggressiveness, niceness, humor, ambition, earning-power, etc.
Disclaimer: I've been married nearly 22 years so that means I either know what I'm talking about or have an insufficient sample size to comment on this.
Coming up... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Coming up... (Score:2)
chemistry? (Score:5, Insightful)
Hmm. Sounds like a weenie in marketing came up with that. Wonder how long it is until he gets his own daytime TV show, or a website like that wiener with his Men are from Mercury and Women are from Uranus [marsvenus.com] or whatever...
Someone once wisely said that compatibility is really about adaptability. People go into relationships expecting "compatibility". What people really need to do is learn how to adapt to other's personalities. Even if you have met someone with whom you are compatible you will have to constantly adjust your personality so that you can stay in tune with this person. People do change after all.
Also, if people do not have a sense of commitment things will fall apart once times get tough. Our society in general looks down on commitment as being old fashioned. Maybe that's why our divorce rate is 50%. Chemistry.com won't change that and I have to suspect will go the way of webvan.com.
Re:chemistry? (Score:2)
No, no, no!
Women are from Venus.
Farts are from Uranus.
Jeez...
Re:chemistry? (Score:3, Funny)
BE QUIet for Pete's sake!
There are people here with girlfriends and/or wives, including me. It took me ten years of my life to get my girlfriend to the point thinking it's hopeless to change me. Now you come pounding in and ruin it for everyone.
Leaps of Faith (Score:4, Interesting)
Have we not learned from our ventures in weather forecasting, that complex systems, love and relationships, in this case, cannot be predicted through the force of equations.
I prefer more traditional methods, the tea leaves say that I will have a good day tomorrow!
Re:Leaps of Faith (Score:2)
But... (Score:2, Funny)
Chemistry is a physical thing. (Score:2)
But don't confuse: it's not purely looks-based. I've been attracted to ("had chemistry with") plenty of not-Brad-Pitt-looking (who I think is very pre-packaged looking anyway) guys. I personally can't explain what its source is. Instinct? Intuition? Pheromones? But I likewise have difficulty believing that a
Re: (Score:2)
They don't measure any brain chemistry (Score:2)
Re:They don't measure any brain chemistry (Score:2)
In Soviet Russia... (Score:5, Funny)
Sorry, it's the only response I could think of for such an idiotic story.
love formula (Score:5, Funny)
( o )( o )
*ducks*
Find me some supermodels ! (Score:2)
Brain Chemistry (Score:3, Insightful)
A Sure Measure of Love (Score:2)
The REAL problem with all of these approaches... (Score:5, Insightful)
Haven't we already established that people are terrible judges of themselves? Don't something like 80% of people think they are of above average intelligence? looks? etc?
I tire quickly of these questionnaires for another reason too: they are, to my mind, somewhat mood- or life-stage-dependent. I often have a hard time answering the questions because BOTH answers could be true (or all, for the range queries) at any given time. I suspect I'm not alone in this.
Re:The REAL problem with all of these approaches.. (Score:2, Interesting)
But all kidding aside, it's really scary to consider that a majority of the population could, statistically, be below average intelligence, with a minority of extremely smart people holding up the line on the opposite side.
I'm just happy I can forlumate words correctly.
Testdrive (Score:2)
Finding your appropriate girlfriend - *BEEP* Error... error... processor overload... *BOOM*
SWM seeks like (Score:3, Funny)
I like walks in the park, cooking and sitting in front of a roaring fireplace with a nice glass of port.
Oh, and I am also seeking a like minded individual that thought the article was stupid - I mean, come on, BusinessWeek talking about the science of Love. Sheesh.
Already done? (Score:2)
There are similar sites already.. (Score:3, Informative)
What I know: (Score:2)
Most women don't worry about how a car turns gas into a trip to the mall.
It's been my experience that men shouldn't concern themselves with rules or observed phenomena when it comes to love.
Every time I've tried to pick it apart, I can't seem to get the pieces back together to make it work again.
I'm taking my own advice and not addressing the issue.
Not Really New (Score:2, Interesting)
This isn't really new. Internet dating sites have had personality tests backed by actual psychological research for a long time. Instead of referring to the results in terms of personality traits like extroversion and conscientiousness, though, chemistry.com uses serotonin level, testosterone, etc. It's more gimmick than anything. For example, high levels of the neurotransmitter serotonin are theorized to be inversely associated with neuroticism (the personality trait of being prone to anxiety, fearful rea
Human Instinct by Robert Winston (Score:5, Interesting)
I recall seeing an interesting BBC documentary called Human Instinct [bbc.co.uk] by Professor Robert Winston [amazon.co.uk] that explored the science behind attraction. There were heaps of interesting things they uncovered in the research studies he reported on.
They used morphing to create faces and had people rate the attractiveness of these faces. One experiment used faces that were morphed from female faces to male faces. They found that women tended to be more attracted to male faces that exhibited less masculine features generally. But ovulating women found male faces with more masculine features attractive. They also found that people tended to be more attracted to faces that have some similarities to their own. They did this by morphing a little bit of a test subject's face into some of the samples.
Another interesting test had to do with immune systems and scents. In their studies, they found that people with more different immune systems were more attracted to each other. In the example for the documentary, they tested five (or six- I forget) female subjects for certain immune system markers. They rated them from those that had markers more closely resembling Prof. Winston's own immune system to those that were more different. They then had these women sleep in shirts (over a span of nights, I think) so the shirts would smell. These shirts were placed in sealed jars. In the demonstration, Prof. Winston had to smell each jar and rate them from best to worst. Sure enough, the pattern in which he arranged them exactly matched the pattern of how his immune system compared to that of the shirt's owner.
WAITER!!!!!!!! (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Do they tell you if you're a loser? (Score:2)
I'm pretty sure I got that in a fortune cookie once.
Re:Astrology anyone? (Score:2)
Good grief. This text was generated by a robot script, right? It surely wasn't written by a human? It contains slightly less meaning than the average corporate mission statement!